[quote=Juiced6]I know what Clinton said however, I never brought up
Clinton - once again you are rehashing typical republican nonsense - it
is fun to mess with you guys because it is the same answer out of all
of your mouths - you have yet to deny any of what I said but are quick
to point out my faults of history that I never mentioned.[/quote]



What did you say?  Ah yes:  BUSH LIED.  The same old, tired, worn-out tripe.



It is not non-sense in the least.  What it is is a shared view
held by two different presidents from two different political parties.



You lie by saying that Bush lied.  Then, to cover up YOUR lies,
you say “well Clinton must have lied, too.”  The odds of two
presidents from opposing parties conspiring together to spread the same
lie–for whatever reason your delusional mind wishes to invent–is
highly unlikely.



Could it be that YOU are the liar?  Could it be that both Clinton
and Bush Jr. relied on intelligence gathered by the US, UN, and other
international intelligence agenicies and formulated opinions on Iraq’s
WMDs based on that intelligence?



Bush did not lie.  Bush took the view–an appropriate view–that was held by his predecessor.



EVERYONE believed Saddam had WMDs.  I suggest you read the ENTIRE
text of UN Resolution 1441.  You act as if the United States acted
alone with respect to Iraq.  Nothing could be further from the
truth.  Just ask Britain, Australia, Japan, and plenty of others
if they believed Iraq had WMDs.



The ball is in your court.

[quote=Juiced6]

[quote]Did Peter Arnett wear a gas mask back in
1991?  Did Iraq invade Kuwait?  Was the only condition of
averting war to simply leave?[/quote]

all three are correct - i never challenged that
[/quote]
Ahhhhhhhh, Peter Arnett lied, TOO.  Ahhh, I see.  So Bush Jr, Clinton, and Peter Arnet all got together and said, "let's make up some lies about Iraq having WMDs just for the hell of it.  Then well place trade restrictions on Iraq's oil and instead of lowering those trade restrictions to get that oil, we'll invade instead.  Because we don't buy oil cheaply on the world market when we can spend billions and billions and risk lives to take it."

What color is the sky in your world?

[quote=Juiced6]

Who was from afghanistan?  I thought they were Saudis?
[/quote]
Were they?  Hmmm.  And Al-Zarqawi, the terrorist ring-leader in Iraq, is Jordanian...Hmmm.  Let's see, foreign fighters entering a land without being invited and they must then represent the official views of that land?

[quote=Juiced6]

In 91 yes Saddam did have SCUDs I did not deny that but I obviously did so sorry.  Hell he may even had them all through the Clinton years I even said that However, over 3 years ago two of Bush's top aids said he did not have them

[/quote]
Nope.  They never said any such thing.  And besided, advisors are advisors and not the president. 

[quote=Juiced6]

and they had proof then!  So how did this poor country go about getting them after?  That is all I want to know.
[/quote]
I think you already know:  Peter Arnett, George Bush, and Bill Clinton made up LIES about Iraq having WMDs so they could erect oil embargos and, instead of buying the oil cheaply on the world market, invade to steal that oil.  BWAAAAHAHAHAHAHA!  Them evil presidents!

Don't forget the Kurds were in on it to:  They gassed themselves in the 1980s and framed innocent Saddam for it.  Kuwaitis invaded themselves, too.

[quote=Juiced6]

Answer to my history question - Germany had to pay reperations -

[/quote]
Because they caused much harm and loss of life.

[quote=Juiced6]

 Japan and Italy also helped the Allies in WW1 and they were screwed over and got little if anything - this planted the seeds for them to align with Hitler!
[/quote]
Nope.  The only thing those nations shared was a desire for power.  That and they were run by ruthless dictators.  You know, dictators...like Saddam.  Or your buddy Kim Jong Ill (or whatever his name is) in North Korea that Clinton GAVE a nuclear reactor to.

[quote=Juiced6]

Im not making up facts - I just read the back pages of the newspapers with the little font - you know where the article was about Iraq had no weapons and the search was being called off.
[/quote]
You are very selective in your reading of world events.

[quote=Juiced6]

What is funny now is that more Americans are starting to think like me now - have you seen a latest approval rating of Bush - lowest he has ever had and it is all because of this war.
[/quote]
Uh huh.  And Bush's approval went up after the elections, too.  You know why?  Because the media feeds mind-numbed robots like you with lies and you go out and parrot those lies word for word.

A smear campaign, and nothing more.

Oh, by the way, Dan Rather STILL insists that the fake military records story CBS News did was legitimate.  And he still holds the view that those forged documents have not been conclusively proven to be forgeries!  Hahahaha.

[quote=Juiced6]

and Ann Coulter is the biggest moron to ever get into media - hell she even wanted to cut off relations to Canada because they did not back this war. 

[/quote]

Good.   Canada sucks.

[quote=Juiced6] 

Yeah to quote Ann Coulter - wow talk about embarassing yourself.

You must still have nightmares of all the latrines your Capt. made you clean during the Gulf War while the real soldiers were chasing the Republican Guard while they were dropping their rifles and running away.

Served in a line infantry unit.  Please don't mock my service, or anyone else's for that matter.  I was there, you weren't, enough said.

Germany NEVER attacked the United States.  Or did anything else against the United States. 

Germans U-Boats were attacking US merchant ships off the Atlantic coast as early as 1940.  Their attacks were passive, must like the radical Arab world's attacks against the US that started with the bombing of the Marine barracks in Lebanon in 1982. 

 90% (from what I've read) of our war effort in WWII was focused on the European theater

With all due respect, go read something else.  Check out the dead and wounded numbers from the Pacific and European theaters.  Also, there is a reason two atomic bombs were dropped on Japan and not Germany.  The Germans were developing V-2 rockets near the end of the war that were reaching Great Britain and were working on their own atomic bomb.  The United States wanted nothing to do with invading the Japanese homeland.  The bombs were meant as a way of escalating the level of destruction and human cruelty to the Japanese masses to get them to surrender--on our terms. 

[quote=Visigoth]
“In aggregate, the map of the territory Bush won was mostly the land

owned by the tax-paying citizens of this great country.

Gore’s territory encompassed those citizens living in government-owned

tenements and living off government welfare…” [/quote]



Nothing could be more true!



Looking at the election map:



http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/



One can clearly see that in most of the states won by Kerry, Kerry won
the welfare-dependent, crime-ridden inner cities and Bush won most of
the rest of the counties.



Kerry got 90% of the Washington DC vote.  Do you know how high the crime rate is in DC?

[quote=inquisitive] [quote=Visigoth]
"In aggregate, the map of the territory Bush won was mostly the land
owned by the tax-paying citizens of this great country.
Gore's territory encompassed those citizens living in government-owned
tenements and living off government welfare..." [/quote]

Nothing could be more true!

Looking at the election map:

http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2004/pages/results/

One can clearly see that in most of the states won by Kerry, Kerry won the welfare-dependent, crime-ridden inner cities and Bush won most of the rest of the counties.

Kerry got 90% of the Washington DC vote.  Do you know how high the crime rate is in DC?
[/quote]

Exactly! 

http://www.princeton.edu/~rvdb/JAVA/election2004/

there is a more accurate voter turnout - purple.

When only 5% of this country in unemployed that means 95% must be working.

So how is 50% of this lands population in jail and on welfare if they are working - your voter theory just died.

I get my media from all sorts of places - from CNN and Fox to Internet and indy news sources - say what you want about any of them but it goes from far right to far left and I make my own decisions.

Also the French put all their faith in the Maginot Line - however, Germany had scouts and bombers to easily get by it.  France never cared because they thought this defense system would keep the Germans at bay - must be that your history reading is selective.

Bush did lie -

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/10/06/iraq.wmd.report/

so what did we go to war for?

Also I never did mention Dan Rather - so where did that come from?

What is funny is have you cornered so you are throwing out typical Right wing responses to make me look like some die hard liberal.

The truth is I vote for more republicans than democrats however, I do not agree with Bush. 

You on the other hand cannot even comprehend what I am saying just tossing up your own drivel so you feel smarter or better?  So does it?  Do you feel much smarter or a better class person because I have looked into this and have made my own independent conclusions? Well if it does -

Well whatever - I had fun but this is not a political page - lets just bury this right now and get back to talking about our careers.

[quote]Canada sucks.
[/quote]

Yeah but Hockey is always fun and its a great place to snowmobile and fish.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axis_Powers

[quote=Starka]

I'm curious, VfK.

Why would you think that cleaning latrines (or "heads" in the Navy and Marine Corps) is somehow a dishonorable duty?  (On that subject, those duties are assigned by NCOs, not officers.)  Why is pride in one's service a negative in your eyes?  Why is it perfectly acceptable to vote for the candidate of your choice, yet citizens voting for other candidates are not worthy of the same right, yet seem to be fair game for personal, ad hominem attacks?  Is there no room in your political philosophy for dissent?  Doesn't that seem narrow-minded and smack of totalitarianism to you?

If you want to make a case for your point of view, fine!  I'll listen.  Respectfully, so far your case doesn't hold water.

Shame on you Sooth, having your sister, Starka, write that post.  But I will once again apologize, cleaning latrines is not dishonorable, God forbid the battlefield should smell like crap it's bad enough with decomposing bodies littered about.  But this will be my last post on this subject.  Your post has convinced me how narrow minded I really am.  I will leave the Democratic Party and become the Pro Iraq War, Evangelical Christian, Pro-Life, Republican that I should be.  Whoa. I feel great now.  You've changed my life.  GO BUSH!!! Thanks again Sooth and Starka. 

VfK, the earmark of ignorance is intolerance of other points of view.

“When a stupid man is doing something he is ashamed of, he always declares that it is his duty.”
- George Bernard Shaw
Caesar and Cleopatra

"As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool to his folly."

                                                   --God

“A man must be both stupid and uncharitable who believes there is no virtue or truth but on his own side.”
- Joseph Addison (1672-1719)
English writer, statesman, publisher, essayist & poet

“The genius of you Americans is that you never make clear-cut stupid moves, only complicated stupid moves which make us wonder at the possibility that there may be something to them we are missing.”
- Gamel Abdel Nasser

“Stupidity is not a handicap in politics.”
- Napoleon Bonaparte (1769-1821)
French statesman and soldier

“I hate war as only a soldier who has lived it can, only as one who has seen its brutality, its futility, its stupidity.”
- Dwight D. Eisenhower (1890-1969)
Soldier, statesman, President

[quote=Starka]

"As a dog returneth to his vomit, so a fool to his folly."

                                                   --God

[/quote]