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Nov 14, 2009 6:13 pm
Ron 14:

Curious to know how many of you view what we do for a living. Is it a job in which your earnings will provide for other avenues? Is it your career that you want to do for 40 years? Is it your calling and you feel you are on earth to help people with their investments, etc?

  I would say I have mixed feelings and go back and forth thinking about it.  Somedays I think I want to build a large practice and do it for 40 years, eventually only working with larger clients.  Other times I think maybe 15-20 years and do other things to build wealth like real estate development.  I would say it will be a combination of both.  I would like to think I am making a difference but a year like 2008 really makes it tough because you are viewed as the bad guy by clients, media, everyone.  You give a recommendation to a guy and he looks at you like you are trying to screw him, that gets old sometimes.  I think the next 10 years and how our industry changes will determine a lot.  If the Gov leaves things as they are and the market performs ok, things could be really nice if you keep adding assets in managed accounts.  But if we are regulated in fees even more and the market has another big bear not sure if it would be worth it. 
Nov 14, 2009 6:20 pm
LA Broker:

[quote=Ron 14]Curious to know how many of you view what we do for a living. Is it a job in which your earnings will provide for other avenues? Is it your career that you want to do for 40 years? Is it your calling and you feel you are on earth to help people with their investments, etc?

  I would say I have mixed feelings and go back and forth thinking about it.  Somedays I think I want to build a large practice and do it for 40 years, eventually only working with larger clients.  Other times I think maybe 15-20 years and do other things to build wealth like real estate development.  I would say it will be a combination of both.  I would like to think I am making a difference but a year like 2008 really makes it tough because you are viewed as the bad guy by clients, media, everyone.  You give a recommendation to a guy and he looks at you like you are trying to screw him, that gets old sometimes.  I think the next 10 years and how our industry changes will determine a lot.  If the Gov leaves things as they are and the market performs ok, things could be really nice if you keep adding assets in managed accounts.  But if we are regulated in fees even more and the market has another big bear not sure if it would be worth it.  [/quote]   What if you learned to make money yourself in the market without having to use a "money manager"?   BD's seem to have mentally castrated brokers into believing they can't do it themselves.   Why would they do that?  hmmmmmmmmmmm I wonder?
Nov 14, 2009 6:28 pm

You aren’t making money for yourself dipsh*t. You are making it for clients. I have agreed with you that what you are doing is great in terms of generating profits from options market inefficiencies. Problem is it cant be done on a large scale, like on a 100 million dollar book. You should be doing it FOR YOURSELF and you would be working half the hours and making 5 times the money.

Nov 14, 2009 7:01 pm

Gaddock

Can you give a short description of how you consistently make money for your clients? Without giving away your proprietary secrets of course. I think you did so once before, but you've posted 943 times, so please dont say roogle, i'll never find it. (serious post, no disrespect intended, really, i'm interested.)
Nov 14, 2009 7:09 pm

100Mil ??? sorry dude but that is a spec of a spec in this market. And yes I’m making money for my clients. Isn’t that what we are supposed to do? I am a stock broker. I love me job my clients are my best friends and I’m making serious cash for myself. I know my limitations even though you may think they are absurd they are what they are. I cant trade my own money as my emotions distort what I see, so I do it for others.

  A lawyer that represents himself has a fool for a client.
Nov 14, 2009 7:16 pm

[quote=Sportsfreakbob]Gaddock

Can you give a short description of how you consistently make money for your clients? Without giving away your proprietary secrets of course. I think you did so once before, but you've posted 943 times, so please dont say roogle, i'll never find it. (serious post, no disrespect intended, really, i'm interested.)[/quote]   In short, I've developed some software that helps me find certain inefficiencies and other very high probability trades using options. At first I considered them anomalies but now I call them distortions as they occur to frequently to be anomalous.
Nov 14, 2009 7:19 pm

[quote=Gaddock]100Mil ??? sorry dude but that is a spec of a spec in this market. And yes I’m making money for my clients. Isn’t that what we are supposed to do? I am a stock broker. I love me job my clients are my best friends and I’m making serious cash for myself. I know my limitations even though you may think they are absurd they are what they are. I cant trade my own money as my emotions distort what I see, so I do it for others.

  A lawyer that represents himself has a fool for a client.[/quote]   Keep going to that even though it is a terrible analogy.
Nov 14, 2009 7:22 pm

[quote=Gaddock]100Mil ??? sorry dude but that is a spec of a spec in this market. And yes I’m making money for my clients. Isn’t that what we are supposed to do? I am a stock broker. I love me job my clients are my best friends and I’m making serious cash for myself. I know my limitations even though you may think they are absurd they are what they are. I cant trade my own money as my emotions distort what I see, so I do it for others.

  A lawyer that represents himself has a fool for a client.[/quote]   Not the options market, the distortions you see and are able to act on. If there were inefficiencies that you could act on to place 100million on one trade it would be gobbled up much quicker. If they were there on that scale you should be doing it for yourself and then be on a beach.
Nov 14, 2009 7:41 pm

[quote=Ron 14][quote=Gaddock]100Mil ??? sorry dude but that is a spec of a spec in this market. And yes I’m making money for my clients. Isn’t that what we are supposed to do? I am a stock broker. I love me job my clients are my best friends and I’m making serious cash for myself. I know my limitations even though you may think they are absurd they are what they are. I cant trade my own money as my emotions distort what I see, so I do it for others.

  A lawyer that represents himself has a fool for a client.[/quote]   Not the options market, the distortions you see and are able to act on. If there were inefficiencies that you could act on to place 100million on one trade it would be gobbled up much quicker. If they were there on that scale you should be doing it for yourself and then be on a beach. [/quote]   Ron cmon man .... IF I were to place 100 mil on one trade I would have to have a billion dollar book. Risk first my fine fellow. I dont put on more than a couple of points on any one trade in any one account.    
Nov 14, 2009 7:44 pm

I know this. So when you book gets extremely large and you see a trade to make, how do you decide who gets it since every account can’t be on the same trade? If I were to give you my money I would want a piece of every good trade you see.

Nov 14, 2009 8:14 pm

I wont let it get to that point. As it stands I’m going to stop taking clients when I have 60 mil wrapped at 1.5%. That will be enough to keep the managers off my heels and then my goal will be to spend as little time at work as possible. Pretty much market hours.

  End game for me. Prob see that in the next three years. Even if it takes five who cares.
Nov 15, 2009 11:31 pm
Ron 14:

Curious to know how many of you view what we do for a living. Is it a job in which your earnings will provide for other avenues? Is it your career that you want to do for 40 years? Is it your calling and you feel you are on earth to help people with their investments, etc?

Great question - I've realized more and more lately that the big hitters on Wall Street as well as your everyday brokers do us (this industry) and out reputation no favors. The longer I'm in this business, the more I recognize the blatant conflicts of interest. From the wirehouses and banks, to the fund companies and money managers, the client's best interest are primary only on the surface.   I'm sure this will be met with the typical RR forums cynicism and revolt but its my opinion, my experience.   So no, this isn't the answer for me long term. I do the absolute best everyday for clients who I am fortunate enough to work with. And when I leave in a few years, I will go to great lengths to make sure they are taken care of by an advisor that is as qualified and caring as I've strived to be in this capacity.   In the meantime I'll continue to use every meeting to instill as much knowledge and insight as possible so that these clients are empowered with the information needed to make good decisions. Thats the least I can do and in many cases, what really propels me from one day to the next.
Nov 16, 2009 9:47 am

first post does it for me

Nov 18, 2009 5:55 pm

"the client’s best interest are primary only on the surface.

 I'm sure this will be met with the typical RR forums cynicism and revolt but its my opinion, my experience."   Your opinion and experience? I hate it for you and your clients.   I've not one time put a client in any product or trade unless I thought it was the very best there was. Must be hard to sleep if you feel like a cheat.  
Nov 18, 2009 6:27 pm

[quote=Gaddock]"the client’s best interest are primary only on the surface.

 I'm sure this will be met with the typical RR forums cynicism and revolt but its my opinion, my experience."   Your opinion and experience? I hate it for you and your clients.   I've not one time put a client in any product or trade unless I thought it was the very best there was. Must be hard to sleep if you feel like a cheat.  [/quote]   He wasn't saying that he does things as an advisor that isn't in his clients best interest. He is saying the way the industry is set up doesn't always reflect fairness.   You say that you have never put a client in any product or trade unless you thought it was the very best there was. Well if you find a trade that is a good one, what determines what account it goes into? If you do a great conversion that locks in a great gain in stock XYZ, but you only do 500 of them, how do you split them up? The guy with 200k deserves a fair percentage of that trade as much as the guy with 2mil.
Nov 18, 2009 6:58 pm

“my experience”  bobo  what does that mean? Sounds like participation to me.

  They are apportioned out per the size and exposure of the account.
Nov 18, 2009 7:08 pm

Doesn’t sound like participation to me at all. Just because you are in an industry doesn’t mean you participate in what you see from firms and from other advisors in terms of conflicts of interest.

  So every trade you do gets divided into all accounts ?
Nov 21, 2009 11:35 pm

[quote=Ron 14][quote=Gaddock]"the client’s best interest are primary only on the surface.

 I'm sure this will be met with the typical RR forums cynicism and revolt but its my opinion, my experience."   Your opinion and experience? I hate it for you and your clients.   I've not one time put a client in any product or trade unless I thought it was the very best there was. Must be hard to sleep if you feel like a cheat.  [/quote]   He wasn't saying that he does things as an advisor that isn't in his clients best interest. He is saying the way the industry is set up doesn't always reflect fairness.   You say that you have never put a client in any product or trade unless you thought it was the very best there was. Well if you find a trade that is a good one, what determines what account it goes into? If you do a great conversion that locks in a great gain in stock XYZ, but you only do 500 of them, how do you split them up? The guy with 200k deserves a fair percentage of that trade as much as the guy with 2mil.[/quote]   Gaddock, where the hell are you? I am losing MILLIONS! You got me into this stock and you sure as hell better get me out or the only job you'll ever have on the Street is SWEEPING IT! You hear me, Gaddock?
Nov 22, 2009 9:01 am

[quote=LA Broker][quote=Ron 14][quote=Gaddock]"the client’s best interest are primary only on the surface.

 I'm sure this will be met with the typical RR forums cynicism and revolt but its my opinion, my experience."   Your opinion and experience? I hate it for you and your clients.   I've not one time put a client in any product or trade unless I thought it was the very best there was. Must be hard to sleep if you feel like a cheat.  [/quote]   He wasn't saying that he does things as an advisor that isn't in his clients best interest. He is saying the way the industry is set up doesn't always reflect fairness.   You say that you have never put a client in any product or trade unless you thought it was the very best there was. Well if you find a trade that is a good one, what determines what account it goes into? If you do a great conversion that locks in a great gain in stock XYZ, but you only do 500 of them, how do you split them up? The guy with 200k deserves a fair percentage of that trade as much as the guy with 2mil.[/quote]   Gaddock, where the hell are you? I am losing MILLIONS! You got me into this stock and you sure as hell better get me out or the only job you'll ever have on the Street is SWEEPING IT! You hear me, Gaddock?[/quote]