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Any firms/brokers work with CTA's here?

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Jun 28, 2007 3:55 am

[quote=ManagedMoney]

[quote=futurestrader]

Well, I must say… your info may be a tad old. Not sure when you were a CTA, but here is current and correct info:

CTA’s are allowed and able to charge a rip. This is how many make some nice income. CTA’s do not have to charge a management and/or incentive fee. We are considering just a profit sharing fee. You can trade on discretion and as a matter of fact, many of the high performing CTA’s reporting to Barclays are in fact discretionary.
So, like I said, no idea how long ago you were a CTA, but I am working with the NFA, CFTC and 2 of the larger clearing houses at the CME to get things setup properly.

Thanks for the advice, but it is incorrect and outdated. Might want to go check those prospectuses you are handing out too!

[/quote]

CTAs don’t hand out prospectuses.  They hand out Disclosure Documents.  Do you know the difference?

I wasn’t speaking about what was “allowed.”  I was speaking about what actual professional CTAs do.

Any CTA that has to make its money from commissions is a joke.  If you need the commissions, you would be a broker, not a CTA.  By charging commissions you have now created a huge conflict of interest, and you are subjecting yourself to big time risks of claims of churning.

Any CTA that trades simply based on discretion is also a joke. I promise you that you will never have any serious money placed with you, if all you do is trade based on your gut.

You also will never make money trading 5-10 minute moves.  Whatever profits you might make will be eaten up by slippage and commissions. 

If you do not have a actual audited track record of trading serious money for at least 5 years, using a systematic approach, you’re talking nothing but amateur hour.

[/quote]

Wow, hit a nerve with this guy I guess.

I’d love to know how you just know that every ‘professional’ CTA out there does not charge a commission rip. Please share.

Sorry you feel that a CTA that exercises discretion is a joke. You know what’s a joke? Black boxes that always end up failing. I never said that I trade based on my gut either, you said that. We have very specific rules in place that are very difficult to code into computer code. But what’s odd (and you failed to comment on) is why a good majority of the top performing CTA’s classify themselves as DISCRETIONARY… How does that work? Discretionary (which is open to interpretation to smarty) seems to be doing well over at Barclays.

I won’t make money taking trades for 5-10 mins? Ut oh, I better let my bank know that the money I have generated the past 2 years is not really mine apparently. SLIPPAGE ON THE ES? ARE YOU FREAKIN KIDDING ME? You obviously have NO CLUE how the ES trades. Come on now, give me something to work with here. Geeze.

And commission concerns? I’m paying $2.92 ROUND TRIP for personal biz and we are looking at $6 ROUND TRIP for managed… Since ONE lousy tick on the ES is $12.50, you do the math.

Do you even watch the US index futures? I mean really, your comments are totally off based, especially when talking about the most liquid US index e-mini futures contract - the S&P!

Let me ask this almighty CTA - go ahead and post your website and link to the Barclays tracking index. I’d love to see how great and wonderful your performance is since obviously you know everything there is to know about CTA trading. Go ahead… I’ll wait patiently. No excuses either, let’s see the real deal show the amateur how it works.

Anyways, it’s been fun but off to bed here. I did not come here looking for advice on how to run my CTA biz, but thanks anyways misinformed. I appreciate the misinformation. Great chatting.
Jun 28, 2007 10:42 am

[quote=futurestrader]
Anyways, it’s been fun but off to bed here. I did not come here looking for advice on how to run my CTA biz,
[/quote]

…um…you don’t have a CTA biz.  Remember?


Jun 28, 2007 11:01 am

[quote=futurestrader]

And commission concerns? I’m paying $2.92 ROUND TRIP for personal biz and we are looking at $6 ROUND TRIP for managed… Since ONE lousy tick on the ES is $12.50, you do the math.

Do you even watch the US index futures? I mean really, your comments are totally off based, especially when talking about the most liquid US index e-mini futures contract - the S&P!

[/quote]

Yes, I watched every tick in real time of the S&P (and later, the E-mini after it was created) for 15 years.

…and yes…since your trading is going to be based on attempting to scalp 5-10 moves, then you’re going to be a net loser after factoring in your commissions.

You sound like just another self proclaimed hot shot kid, who thinks it’s a big deal to try to scalp pennies out of the market.

Jun 28, 2007 4:08 pm

Managed - well, thanks for ignoring my other questions. I see you just ignore the request to post a link to your CTA biz.

You obviously are not getting this - I’ve traded futures full-time now for over 2 years. Most, as you know, blow out in months. We make money. Hence the reason for considering the CTA.

I did not wake up last week and decide to trade futures for people. Are you that obtuse to understand this? I don’t know how many more times I can try to explain this to you.

The CTA biz is a new thing.
Trading futures for profit is NOT.

Just b/c you cannot trade futures and make money, does not mean others can’t. Just b/c you think you know it all, does not mean you do. Again, let me see your results - give me your CTA website and link to the Barclays rankings for your CTA biz. If you are tearing it up, I will concede. It’s that simple - just show me how good the multi-year, seasoned pro is doing. Hell, you might get some interest from guys here!

Go ahead… I’ll wait for the links so we can all have a look.

If you ignore this request again, that’s all I needed to know (along with everyone else here). You can talk a great game on an anonymous message board and now you’ve been called out - put up or shut up.

Jun 28, 2007 4:39 pm

[quote=futurestrader]Managed - well, thanks for ignoring my other
questions. I see you just ignore the request to post a link to your CTA
biz.

You
obviously are not getting this - I’ve traded futures full-time now for
over 2 years. Most, as you know, blow out in months. We make money.
Hence the reason for considering the CTA. [/quote]



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survival_analysis



Just because you made it this far, doesn’t mean you won’t blow up tommorow.


[quote]I did not wake up last week and decide to trade futures for
people. Are you that obtuse to understand this? I don’t know how many
more times I can try to explain this to you.

The CTA biz is a new thing.
Trading futures for profit is NOT.

Just b/c you cannot trade futures and make money, does not mean others can’t. [/quote]



What if he isn’t as lucky as you are?




[quote]If you are tearing it up, I will concede. It’s that simple -
just show me how good the multi-year, seasoned pro is doing. Hell, you
might get some interest from guys here![/quote]



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias



What ever happened to the records of those who failed and left the business?




[quote]
If you ignore this request again, that’s all I needed to know (along with everyone else here). You can talk a great game on an anonymous message board and now you’ve been called out - put up or shut up.

[/quote]



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Overconfidence_effect




Jun 28, 2007 4:50 pm

All - you are funny guy. Seriously, spend less time over at wiki and get on the phone and sell something.

Everything you said can be said of just about ANY profession, incl brokers. Anyone can fail at any time, even after success initially. That’s part of owning a biz.

Now get on those phones already. Someone needs to watch your internet usage at work!

Jun 30, 2007 2:08 am

[quote=futurestrader]
You obviously are not getting this - I’ve traded futures full-time now for over 2 years. Most, as you know, blow out in months. We make money. Hence the reason for considering the CTA.

[/quote]

You’ve made money (I won’t even bother to ask how much money) for two years and you think that’s a big deal?  You’re still dripping wet behind your ears.  You don’t have a long enough real time track record to even qualify for a Disclosure Document.

Ask any pro if they would be impressed with someone who claims to have been profitable after two years of trading, and see what their reaction would be.

Tell you what…let m know how you’ve done AFTER you’ve completely blown up (and come back) at least twice…then I might take notice.


Jun 30, 2007 2:20 am

HEY FUTURESTRADER.

I've been following these guys bashing your ideas.

Their opinions and criticism are completely irrelevant.  They do not understand the biz, and cannot truly understand how making money IS POSSIBLE.

That is why "Managed Money" lets other people manage it.

That is why AllReit trolls around trying to ask questions like "what makes you better, what seperates you, what makes YOu think you can do it."

By ALL MEANS futurestrader, if you can sling it, sling it.  The second you lose faith and conviction you need to jump ship as Conviction in a trade is 50%. 

But with all do respect, how valueable of feedback do you think you'll get talking with a bunch of Brokers?

I'm smelling what you're stepping in, but quit feeding their OCD.

Jun 30, 2007 2:23 am

[quote=ManagedMoney]

You've made money (I won't even bother to ask how much money) for two years and you think that's a big deal?  You're still dripping wet behind your ears.  You don't have a long enough real time track record to even qualify for a Disclosure Document.

Ask any pro if they would be impressed with someone who claims to have been profitable after two years of trading, and see what their reaction would be.

Tell you what....let m know how you've done AFTER you've completely blown up (and come back) at least twice....then I might take notice.


[/quote]

Hey ManagedMoney,

last time I checked, If he can sell somebody on it then he can do it.  I feel sorry for you if you SPEND all your energy selling on returns.

You are making yourself look ridiculous.  Do you even have confidence in your own abilities?  Or do you wear a mask during appointments.

Jun 30, 2007 3:55 am

[quote=futurestrader]All - you are funny guy. Seriously, spend less time over at wiki and get on the phone and sell something.

Everything
you said can be said of just about ANY profession, incl brokers. Anyone
can fail at any time, even after success initially. That’s part of
owning a biz.

[/quote]



There’s a big difference between the risk of failure of a CTA and just about any other profession.



Look at whats happening to the mortgage desk at BSC. 40 quarters of
profitability for the Basic Credit strategies fund, one bad quarter
(20% drawdown) and they are out on thier asses.