I think I'm in a great region too.  Although I can't say that for sure, since I've never been in another one. 

I've never been forced to do anything.  I've always had answers to whatever questions I asked.  My RL has never called me for my referrals to the Growth Team.  Nobody has ever called and asked what I'm doing or looked over my shoulder (as is evidenced by the number of posts I have on this forum.)  Maybe they should.  While I like the payout, I know where we stand vs other firms.  Indy is better, but with a lot of other issues. 

Babs is right.  I'm 35, and just about to finish up my 5th year in production.  Until I outgrow Jones and I can't find any additional value in staying, I'll stay. 

Thanks for the conversation Babs.  I like a good debate.  Especially when the both sides can walk away without holding a grudge.

Spiff,

You will eventually outgrow the transaction model....I did at the end of year 5.  Let me ask you this if you care to respond and I hope you do.  How many accounts/households do you want to have? How do you have time to continue to service these households with your vast array of planning services when you need to open more to make a living? A share trails are minimal at best.  Are you really giving your clients what they need if your time is constantly spent on opening the next $3,000 Roth IRA. This will start to affect you more at $40+ under management. 

My goal with my office is 100 households with $1 mil AUM.  Once I hit that I'll establish a new goal based on my age, personal goals and service expectations.  Along the way I'll also pick up a lot of the Roth IRA type accounts you mentioned, so the $100 Mil AUM with just those 100 people won't be all there is and there will be some additional $$s.  I'll do some GKN's and pare the list down.  I haven't figured out yet what it will take to outgrow Jones.

Your service question is one that I find interesting.  First, my time isn't spent trying to find the next $3000 Roth acct.  They happen, but I don't actively look for them.  Eventually I'll set account  minimums so that the $3000 acct is almost an accident.  How much service does a $3000 acct need in a year? 5 minutes?  10 minutes?  Definitely not much.  Do I honestly care if they leave me?  Not really.  I hate to lose clients, but if it's money that I can bring in with one or two more phone calls, no big deal. 

Even my $1 mil accts don't need to be touched as often as I do right now.  Once you get the plan in place, which can be time intensive, how much time do you really need to spend on each account every month?  Let's say 15 minutes, just to look over everything and make sure nothing drastic has happened in the last month.  It doesn't take all that long to take care of those people.  There are plenty of hours in the day, you just have to use them wisely. 

I'm going to respectfully disagree with your comments about outgrowing the transaction based model at a mere $40 million.  Most successful Jones guys are just hitting their stride at $40 million.  You can probably make that a better arguement at the $100 million mark.  

My question for you is what kind of planning needs did your clients require of you at $40 million that took so much of your time that you felt you had to go fee based in order to get it done properly?  Or was the real arguement if I've got $40 mil, wrapped at 1% with a bigger payout, how much more do I really need?    

Ok, this whole P/L thing. I just don't understand it?

Can someone please explain and use real world, actual what you made?

Not to start an arguement, but I have heard veterans call Ed Jones a "rep sweatshop". Is that really true? Are the office costs so much that you don't make any money?

This thread has some interesting arguments for both sides, and judging from the past histories witnessed here, it is easy to see why the points of view are as they appear.

[quote=lady_trader]

Ok, this whole P/L thing. I just don't understand it?

Can someone please explain and use real world, actual what you made?

Not to start an arguement, but I have heard veterans call Ed Jones a "rep sweatshop". Is that really true? Are the office costs so much that you don't make any money?

[/quote]

It really depends where you are in the business.  It's great for Newbies (Jones loses money while bankrolling them), it's great for big producers (say, $500K and up), as your capture goes up due to profit sharing & office profitability bonus.  However, it really sucks for the guys in the middle (most of the advisors).  You aren't really making much of a bonus due to the overhead, and the office costs are rather fixed.  The underlying problem with the Jones model is that the overhead structure is pretty much the same for a $200K producer as for a $750K producer (some things go up, but by and large this is the case).  They have to keep the structure uniform, otherwise it gets out of control.  As an example, I know a $650K producer in my region, and his net, after office expenses, including bonus & profit sharing, is around $350K.  I know a $500K producer that takes home about $250K.  The incremental take-home at that level is very high.  Once you hit the highest bonus bracket, your incremental payout is around 75%.  Much lower than an Indy, but not slave wages. 

Keep in mind, I believe there are only about 500 advisors in the firm (maybe just U.S. based) that gross over $500K, so by and large, most advisors are falling somewhere in the middle.

I left Jones after three years.  That was three years ago.  Since that time I've become:

Happy

Out of Debt

The first three years at Jones I was like a frog being slow boiled.  I didn't realize til I jumped out of the pot how much cooler it is outside.  I do a bit more annuity business than I did at Jones, other than that I do things much as I did them before.  Oh yea, my first year out I made four times my best year at Jones.  That was the result of increasing my payout and having more clients.  I can't imagine why anyone would stay at Jones.  Life is SO much better now that I'm gone.

[quote=Broker24]

As an example, I know a $650K producer in my region, and his net, after office expenses, including bonus & profit sharing, is around $350K.  I know a $500K producer that takes home about $250K.  The incremental take-home at that level is very high.  Once you hit the highest bonus bracket, your incremental payout is around 75%.  Much lower than an Indy, but not slave wages. 

Keep in mind, I believe there are only about 500 advisors in the firm (maybe just U.S. based) that gross over $500K, so by and large, most advisors are falling somewhere in the middle.

[quote=haidesu]

have yet to be answered.  Is all you anti-EJ simply based on the relatively low 40% payout?  It can't be due to our FA or client satisfaction... [/quote]

As a 16 year ex partner of Jones, let us try research or lack there of, the communication system or lack there of ,or placing ten offices in my town that I was told that was my own.  I left when Douggie Hill started running things and 170 Million later the rest of the street saw what I saw.   Everyday as an INDY is a picnic compared to my last days at Jones.

broker24-

Thanks for the explaination. I understand better, but are some of these fees monthly fees, one time charges, what?

[quote=lady_trader]

broker24-

Thanks for the explaination. I understand better, but are some of these

fees monthly fees, one time charges, what?

Broker24-

Let's see-In a year, what do you pay for ticket charges, office fees, client appreciation events, etc?

Broker24 has been at Jones less than 2 years, so he wouldn’t be able to answer. The answer is that you’re paying for just about everything, except your rent and assistant, and you’re only getting 38% payout. So not a good deal.

[quote=lady_trader]

Broker24-

Let's see-In a year, what do you pay for ticket charges, office fees, client appreciation events, etc?

[/quote]

I am a few years post Jones and these fees are minimal. My clients don't care. What they care about and I care about is that I have the full arsenal of products to use now. Not the case before. And for the naysayers, I'm still EXTREMELY happy with my decision to leave.

[quote=lady_trader]

Broker24-

Let’s see-In a year, what do you pay for ticket charges, office fees,

client appreciation events, etc?

[quote=farotech] Broker24 has been at Jones less than 2 years, so he

wouldn’t be able to answer. The answer is that you’re paying for just

about everything, except your rent and assistant, and you’re only getting

38% payout. So not a good deal.[/quote]



You don’t pay rent: utilities, CAM charges, property insurance, RE taxes,

1/2 phone, 1/2 postage, all technology related items, ticket charges,

yellow pages listing, copy paper, assistant wages & benefits, FICA and

payroll taxes, and some other little things.



They also pay for all of your state licensing fees (every year), insurance

licensing fees, exam costs, continuing education requirements, AAMS

course, CFP course and exam, etc.



Yes, you pay for toilet paper, coffee, toner, office supplies (other than

copy paper), any local advertising/seminars (Jones will reimburse up to

$300 per event for seminars, home shows, etc.).



There are other thins they pay for, and other things you pay for, but that

is pretty much the major items. Beyond that we are just splitting hairs.



Faro - maybe you were just plain stupid, but it didn’t take me 2 years to

figure out the cost structure here. I figured that out, uhmm, before I

accepted the job.

Broker24 has been at Jones less than 2 years. He doesn’t know his a$$hole from his earhole.

Uh, Mr 24?  If you haven't figured it out yet... you are paying for everything on the P&L.  That's where the other 60% of your gross goes. 

Don't even pretend that after 2 years you really understand the P&L.  You may have gone through the training, but can you really off the top of your head make sense of the variable numbers?  As the gross goes up, so do the expenses.  

And really, how valuable is that stupid big humming box in your back room?  Is it really worth the $1000+ you pay for it?  Considering that it isn't necessary anymore, why are you still paying for it?

Not trying to be a jerk, I'm just saying... with the amount of time you (and I) have spent at Jones you don't even know what you don't know.

Broker24 answered my question thoughtfully and with detail, which shows class and maturity.

Thank you, Broker24.

[quote=farotech] Broker24 has been at Jones less than 2 years. He

doesn’t know his a$$hole from his earhole.[/quote]



That was actually kinda funny. Never heard that one before.