Edward Jones # 1 again
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BPD,
For 500k: We use fee based accounts for that size or we use A shares providing we can do it with just a few families to reach signifigant breakpoints. But I'd tend to opt for fee based as you gain more flexibility. I guess you could go either way in an IRA since cap gains wouldn't be an issue. I also don't use American Funds either.
100k in an A share is 3.75% so....if a C shares is 75bps more expensive than an A share it comes close to 5 years on the breakeven. Many clients will hold a fund five years...many will not. Most will want those funds invested in the market for longer than five years so having the flexibility to move makes sense.
Example..lets say that you were in Lord Abbett Affiliated....and you were looking for an alternative for it since it has been performing poorly for the last few years...where you gonna go in Lord Abbett? But, in a C share--the sales charge is a non-issue when moving to another family.
I'm not saying that C shares are the only way to go--what I AM saying is that at Jones--the payout is so low at 30% that it's not a viable option for you to use (C shares) EVEN IF happens to best suit your particluar client. So, you force yourself to fall in love with the A share for all clients. That's not fair to the IR nor is it fair to the client. Fainess would be the same payout on ALL share classes so you--the advisor can choose what best suits your client without influence. That's independence.
Are we really supposed to take a survey seriously when Jones’ reps rate their 1970s (are they still on Colecos or is it Windows 95 now?) high and claim they have little pressure to sell specific products (perhaps there’s no pressure to not going on the Amway trip?)?
MikeButler,
Just one question for you.
Then why are you so jealous of Edward Jones?
BPD
[quote=BigPayDay]MikeButler,
Just one question for you.
Then why are you so jealous of Edward Jones?
BPD[/quote]
Looks like that's going to be the lame response to every post that knocks the legs out from under Jones' propaganda
EdJones654,
The company cult that is part of your screan name, you mean?
And what great firm are you affiliated with?
BPD
BPD,
One can despise the firm without being jealous of it. One thing that seems to irritate many is the sef righteous attitude many Jones brokers have about their firm vs the rest of firms in our industry. Any one with a brain knows that there are good advisers at all firms just as there are bad ones. However, I remember the regional meetings where the message that other firms are evil and the brokers there are basically out to screw the client over through the excessive use of B shares or VA's or you name it.
I know there is a lot more scrutiny of a VA or B share order here at LPL than there was at EDJ. The self righteous, pious attitude at Jonesis totally unfounded.
Congrats on the reward. But the animosity toward Jones is not out of jealousy, but a backlash from the attitude expressed by people like your friend Oracle.
On that note, if A shares and breakpoints are the only answer, than every Jones broker should eat their own cooking and put all their personal money into one fund family. If I wasn't in the industry I would gladly pay a little extra to have a diversified portfolio that wasn't all fished out of the same pot.
[quote=The Answer]
Ex,
So can you sell A share annuities?No.
Why not?
[/quote]
No, TA my b/d does not have A share annuities. I honestly couldn't tell you why.
My clients however do have access to a no-load annuity with an M&E of 65pbs. Of course there is also an advisory fee. But here, the advisor gets to determine that fee. It can be as low as 50pbs so you can decide how much service you offer and what your advice is worth.
Now I'm no math genius but I do know that the total fees for the no-load annuity are more than the M&E of the typical A share annuity, buy my client did not pay a load to aquire this annuity. So in a few years when those darn insurance companies come up with some new feature, that may benefit my client, they will pay nothing to 1035 into a new contract. Yours on the other hand will pay another load.
Now Mr A share, why dont you tell me how many diff fund families you have money with in your 401k?
Arguing product with a Jones broker is getting more like a college grad teaching a 1st grader to read.
[quote=exdrone]
BPD,
One can despise the firm without being jealous of it. One thing that seems to irritate many is the sef righteous attitude many Jones brokers have about their firm vs the rest of firms in our industry. Any one with a brain knows that there are good advisers at all firms just as there are bad ones. However, I remember the regional meetings where the message that other firms are evil and the brokers there are basically out to screw the client over through the excessive use of B shares or VA's or you name it.
I know there is a lot more scrutiny of a VA or B share order here at LPL than there was at EDJ. The self righteous, pious attitude at Jonesis totally unfounded.
Congrats on the reward. But the animosity toward Jones is not out of jealousy, but a backlash from the attitude expressed by people like your friend Oracle.
On that note, if A shares and breakpoints are the only answer, than every Jones broker should eat their own cooking and put all their personal money into one fund family. If I wasn't in the industry I would gladly pay a little extra to have a diversified portfolio that wasn't all fished out of the same pot.
[/quote]
WELL SAID..........
As for BFD, maybe we should all call you: HE HATE ME understand this is not personal, it's the self righteous attitude projected from Edward Jones the FIRM thru Drones, like you guest1, Oracle, etc that can NEVER ADMIT, your Firm has screwed-up, everyone does, but Jones just never admits it..........
[quote=exdrone] [quote=The Answer]
Ex,
So can you sell A share annuities?No.
Why not?
[/quote]
No, TA my b/d does not have A share annuities. I honestly couldn’t tell you why.
My clients however do have access to a no-load annuity with an M&E of 65pbs. Of course there is also an advisory fee. But here, the advisor gets to determine that fee. It can be as low as 50pbs so you can decide how much service you offer and what your advice is worth.
Now I’m no math genius but I do know that the total fees for the no-load annuity are more than the M&E of the typical A share annuity, buy my client did not pay a load to aquire this annuity. So in a few years when those darn insurance companies come up with some new feature, that may benefit my client, they will pay nothing to 1035 into a new contract. Yours on the other hand will pay another load.
Now Mr A share, why dont you tell me how many diff fund families you have money with in your 401k?
[/quote]Ex,
Sunamerica Polaris A share has over 12 different managers:
https://www.sunamerica.com/PerformanceReview/FPpdfs/A_ClassQ uarterlyBooklet.pdf
Hartford Leaders A share has 4:
http://www.hartfordinvestor.com/servlet/Satellite?pagename=I nvestor/HLI01Product/HI_Product&cid=1072188777780&p=11271088 23350&c=HLI01Product&hig_tab=historyperform&noindex=true
Both have American funds. My typical VA client is investing $100k+ and can also be combined with mutual funds to hit breakpoints, so typical up front costs are in the 2.5% range. ALOT less expensive than the annuity you described with a management fee 0f .5% - 2.5% annually. The reason your firm doesn’t have A share annuities is beacuse if you did it would be a compliance conflict with your B share annuities and annuities that you described in wrap accounts. In otherwards you and your firm wouldn’t make as much if you had A shares. That’s why.
You said: "But here, the advisor gets to determine that fee. It can be as low as 50pbs so you can decide how much service you offer and what your advice is worth."
What you meant to say: "But here, the advisor gets to determine that fee. What ever we can get away with. You’d be silly to do it at .5% and the bluer the hair the higher the fee. We don’t really service these accounts any differently than a non-wrap account."
BPD
P.S. More new money was put into the The Hartford Leaders Annuity (All versions) than any other annuity so far this year.
BPD,
I am aware of muti manager VA's. These are the kind of comments that cause animosity toward you and your ilk
"But here, the advisor gets to determine that fee. What ever we can get away with. You'd be silly to do it at .5% and the bluer the hair the higher the fee. We don't really service these accounts any differently than a non-wrap account."
I has nothing to do with jealousy. Believe me I am not jealous. Now why don't you or your cronies answer my question:
How many different fund families to you have money with inside your 401k?
If A shares and break points are the only answer, every client with less than 1 mill should only own funds from one family. If it is good enough for them it should be good enough for you too.
I'll tell you how I do it, when you tell me how many different fund familes you own.
Ex, don't be surprised if he eats his own cooking...his 401(K) is probably all in American Funds...
Ex,
Call me a simpleton if you want to. Here’s my mix in my 401k as well as deferred compensation plan:
20% CIB
20% AMF
20% CWGI
20% GFA
10% NPF
10% New World
If it ain’t broke, why should I fix it.
Now, answer the question.
Wow...think I'll go buy a lottery ticket...
BPD...AMF?!! WOOF! Third Avenue Value might be an appropriate replacement...that's all the help I'm giving you...you want any more assistance, you'll have to pay me for it. I would let GFA stand, but that's about it...
BPD,
I have clients keep fixed income and cash in a brokerage acct where no annual fee is charged. I have the m hold equities and funds in an advisory acct where I charge from 1.25 -.9% per year. I'm still pretty new at thea advisory side of the business but have been building it up over the last couple of months.
As far as service I provide for the fee. I am doing quarterly reviews and financial plans updated annually. Next quarter I am flying 3000 miles to meet with client to complete a comprehensive fin plan and meet with his estate planning attny. That will end up costing me a few bucks as well as cost me 3 days of production. I never could have delivered that level of service at Jones. I guess if I were just selling American Funds they could just as easlily do business with their local Jones broker, but that is not my thing.
If your book of business looks anything like your 401(k), how can your firm possibly reward you with a "diversification" trip twice a year?
P.S. I know reps at Jones that use VA's because they are the only multi manager platform at Jones. What are your thoughts on that?