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Jan 3, 2006 1:19 pm

Man, I think Edward Jones needs it's own board.  I can't believe the proliferation of Ed Jones threads.  I didn't realize they caused so much animosity among brokers. 

Jan 3, 2006 2:06 pm

I agree completely!

Jan 3, 2006 2:15 pm

I've been very impressed by the intensity of it. It's also been very educational.

Jan 3, 2006 8:54 pm

The Edward Jones stuff is overboard.  I have never worked for them and I never will.


I don't see why those guys bitch and moan about everything.  AXA, Waddell & Reed, and Prudential folks have a lot more to bitch about and they don't clog up the board with their superfluous bullsh*t.  I simply avoid any topic that has "Jones", "EDJ", "Kool-Aid", etc...


It is like posting about your ex-girlfriend or ex-wife.  Nobody gives a sh*t about your personal problems...especially when they are in the past, like many of the posters.  Further, every week some idiot comes on board asking "How can I leave Jones?" and "Will they come after me?"  Much like many of the ex-Joners on the board...they don't have the balls to make a decision for themselves.


(steps off soapbox)

Jan 3, 2006 10:30 pm

I have been with EDJ for over five years.  I drink the kool-aid and am very happy here.  I realize that the are other places a broker can be happy and successful.  What I don't understand is the passion many of you have against EDJ.  Did we steal your lunch money?  Take liberties with your daughter?  Can't we all agree that there are many place a broker can work and have a good career and stop the EDJ hating?

Jan 4, 2006 1:35 am
BigLew:

I have been with EDJ for over five years.  I drink the kool-aid and am very happy here.  I realize that the are other places a broker can be happy and successful.  What I don't understand is the passion many of you have against EDJ.  Did we steal your lunch money?  Take liberties with your daughter?  Can't we all agree that there are many place a broker can work and have a good career and stop the EDJ hating?


Good for you.  If you're happy being a salesman, just stick with it and try not to screw your clients too badly.


Look, Jones ain't the worst firm in the world.....I think it's the holier than thou attitude of some IR's that makes people a little nuts....

Jan 4, 2006 1:29 pm

You know, I have found it just as hard to take accounts from Jones as any firm (maybe one of you ex jonesers can give me a few pointers and make it a little easier ).  As far as I'm aware clients don't know the difference or care too much. 


As far as the problems they've had, who hasn't had problems the last 5 years?


Menotellname, for once I agree with you completely .  These Jones guys make MikeButler the Bull Dog look passive (not intended as an insult).  It's like a skipping record on steroids with some of the most intense and pathetic banter I've ever come across.  It's hard to wade through this particular board without stepping in some Jones sh*t or at least getting it on your clothes.


Everyone who thinks that the people running their firms wake up in the morning with a big Beaver the Cleaver humanitarian smile and go to work prepared to fight the battle to save their clients from the big bad brokerage industry is an ignorant fool.


HEADLINE NEWS:  ALL BROKERAGE FIRMS ARE IN THE BUSINESS OF MAKING MONEY, YOU ARE NOT EMPLOYED IN A PHILANTHROPIC ENTERPISE.  NO BROKERAGE FIRM IS EXEMPT FROM THE FORCES WHICH DRIVE CAPITALISM.  ALL BROKERAGE FIRMS (AND BROKERS, INDEPENDENT OR NOT) ARE MIDDLE MEN WHO SKIM DOLLARS FROM THE CLIENT BY TAKING ADVANTAGE OF THE CLIENTS LACK OF KNOWLEDGE  (just like any profession) AND CHARGING THEM AS MUCH AS THEY CAN WHILE LETTING THE MARKET SET PRICES.  ALL BROKERAGE FIRMS HAVE SINNED IN SOME WAY SINCE THEY ARE MOTIVATED TO INCREASE PROFITS IN EVERY CREATIVE WAY THEY CAN, WHICH ULTIMATELY MEANS THAT THEY ARE GOING TO TRY AND "SKIM" MORE MONEY FROM THE CLIENT (OR BROKER) IF THE OPPPORTUNITY ARISES AND IS PERCIEVED AS LEGAL OR "GREY" ENOUGH OF AN ISSUE THAT THE LEGAL COSTS WILL BE LESS THAN THE PROFITS GENERATED.  REMEMBER THAT IT'S BETTER TO BEG FORGIVENESS THAN TO ASK PERMISSION.  THIS IS THE NATURE OF A CAPITALIST SYSTEM (AND ANY NATURAL BIOLOGICAL SYSTEM FOR THAT MATTER): TO EXPLOIT EVERY CONCEIVABLE ASSET, RESOURCE AND INEFFICIENCY FOR IT'S BENEFIT.


IN ADDITION, EVERY FIRM HAS IT'S OWN CULTURE AND PROPAGANDA (KOOL AID) DESIGNED TO KEEP IT'S EMPOYEES CONVINCED THAT IT'S SH*T IS AS SWEET AS CAROLINA HONEY AND THAT EVERY MORNING ONE SHOULD GIVE OFFERINGS AT IT'S ALTAR WITH A GRATEFUL HEART.  SOME FIRMS ARE BETTER AT IT THAN OTHERS, AND IT SEEMS THAT ED JONES IS PRETTY GOOD AT IT.  GOOD FOR THEM, MOVE ON......


(stepping of soapbox)

Jan 4, 2006 1:35 pm

I just noticed that all of the most recent posts on this particular board (except one) are jones posts.  C'mon guys give it a f*cking rest!!!!!!

Jan 4, 2006 1:35 pm

love that...... lets all make apact and forgo the company bashing for ONE month and help eachother with IDEAS to have a productive 06.

Jan 4, 2006 1:42 pm
menotellname:

The Edward Jones stuff is overboard.  I have never worked for them and I never will.


I don't see why those guys bitch and moan about everything.  AXA, Waddell & Reed, and Prudential folks have a lot more to bitch about and they don't clog up the board with their superfluous bullsh*t.  I simply avoid any topic that has "Jones", "EDJ", "Kool-Aid", etc...


It is like posting about your ex-girlfriend or ex-wife.  Nobody gives a sh*t about your personal problems...especially when they are in the past, like many of the posters.  Further, every week some idiot comes on board asking "How can I leave Jones?" and "Will they come after me?"  Much like many of the ex-Joners on the board...they don't have the balls to make a decision for themselves.


(steps off soapbox)



Jan 4, 2006 1:57 pm
dude:

 These Jones guys make MikeButler the Bull Dog look passive (not intended as an insult). 


Jan 4, 2006 2:30 pm

Blarm said:


love that...... lets all make apact and forgo the company bashing for ONE month and help eachother with IDEAS to have a productive 06.


Reply:


Jan 6, 2006 10:28 pm

Dude,


It's really a question of degree that drives the Jones emotions. You start with a firm that engineers it's hires in a very specific way to avoid a professional expectation and invent it's own culture that would never pass the "street" test. This is far beyond what banks and wirehouses try to do simply by dictating to their employees. At Jones it's about mind and mood manipulations 24/7.


I was dumb enough to transfer into this company for about a year. I really liked the GP who recruited me and still do but the level of corporate BS was appalling. It was very clear they were encouraging trainees into bankruptcy simply to recapture "training cost". Like so many real abuses that are much greater than the many headline customer abuses (wrong as many as these may be) there is little focus of the NASD/SEC on the real harm done not only to the brokers impacted but the public as well when firms promote the draconian culture of lying, hyping and encouraging financial suicide for so many in their camps. Could firms lie to the public so directly as they do to their sales staff?


I'm not surprised Jones is a prime target of this type of venting. There really are so many there who are in denial, confused and misinformed who only later backlash when the cult effect fades. Most are green and on there first firm and have a very thin concept about ownership of ones own efforts or what the real standard decline Jones represents. New business culture lows on restrictive and illegal contract concepts are pioneered everyday by these industry "leaders". What is the effect on the public of these practices? The NASD could have a simple site that reports how many employer-broker disputes that are pending and historically recorded for the firms, what the real rate of turnover and production numbers might be or how many bankruptcy events are associated with reaching a positive production result. Think about what the real trickle down of this is to clients. Do you think it more or less than say the issues of mutual fund market timing, revenue sharing and product steering (not that I'm making excuses for these excesses)?? What doesn't the consumer have a disclosure here?


Jones creates big problems in the cracks that the NASD puts it's head in the sand on. Then again the NASD is a trade association first and so many of the focus points like the EIA power move or other regulatory "supervisory" increases are self-serving for dealers by increasing dealers mediation position (their profits as well) while ignoring the entire underlying culture that creates clients with cut-throats at every turn and poison for the business image for all. There are entire segments (the "Fee-Only" group to name one) that make and entire subset living by attacking, smearing the broader industry due in part to the NASD failed approach of scapegoating brokers to cover the much greater sins of firms like Jones that burn and churn through thousands to maintain the needed  "culture" to grow themselves at the publics and employee expense.


The problem in the industry starts with the people who run and regulate it; the firm interests. There should be more disclosure and focus and brokers should have greater license freedom away from dealers. Frankly a new class of dealers without compliance functions should emerge for a new separate class of adviser. Trading, product creation and profits should be removed from the compliance function that should be apart from traditional firms. In short the regulatory cartel of the NASD should be deregulated and advisor's should shop for services and compliance on separate platforms. Only excess government and obsolete traditions maintain the overly complicated, inconsistent standards and conflicts of the current system.


15% industry turnover of advisors and all the abuses that come with it are clearly reflected in the Jones posts. The distortions, mind game culture should be replaced. Sadly this is all going the other way, firms now want to capitalize on the "Spitzer culture" to enhance their roles and burden the consumer and broker with even more red-tape to make up for the obvious savings that should have been passed on to both consumers of advice as well as reductions of wholesale transaction cost that technology should have created.


So the nimrod class of advisor is only likely to keep growing and the advice market share will continue to decline as the image of the business declines further. Thank the big firms and the likes of Jones but don't forget those NASD folks who care so much for the public that any systematic abuse of a broker is o.k. as long as they can keep isolating actions of brokers to blame to prove what a good job they are doing.











dude:

You know, I have found it just as hard to take accounts from Jones as any firm (maybe one of you ex jonesers can give me a few pointers and make it a little easier ).  As far as I'm aware clients don't know the difference or care too much. 


As far as the problems they've had, who hasn't had problems the last 5 years?


Menotellname, for once I agree with you completely .  These Jones guys make MikeButler the Bull Dog look passive (not intended as an insult).  It's like a skipping record on steroids with some of the most intense and pathetic banter I've ever come across.  It's hard to wade through this particular board without stepping in some Jones sh*t or at least getting it on your clothes.


Everyone who thinks that the people running their firms wake up in the morning with a big Beaver the Cleaver humanitarian smile and go to work prepared to fight the battle to save their clients from the big bad brokerage industry is an ignorant fool.


HEADLINE NEWS:  ALL BROKERAGE FIRMS ARE IN THE BUSINESS OF MAKING MONEY, YOU ARE NOT EMPLOYED IN A PHILANTHROPIC ENTERPISE.  NO BROKERAGE FIRM IS EXEMPT FROM THE FORCES WHICH DRIVE CAPITALISM.  ALL BROKERAGE FIRMS (AND BROKERS, INDEPENDENT OR NOT) ARE MIDDLE MEN WHO SKIM DOLLARS FROM THE CLIENT BY TAKING ADVANTAGE OF THE CLIENTS LACK OF KNOWLEDGE  (just like any profession) AND CHARGING THEM AS MUCH AS THEY CAN WHILE LETTING THE MARKET SET PRICES.  ALL BROKERAGE FIRMS HAVE SINNED IN SOME WAY SINCE THEY ARE MOTIVATED TO INCREASE PROFITS IN EVERY CREATIVE WAY THEY CAN, WHICH ULTIMATELY MEANS THAT THEY ARE GOING TO TRY AND "SKIM" MORE MONEY FROM THE CLIENT (OR BROKER) IF THE OPPPORTUNITY ARISES AND IS PERCIEVED AS LEGAL OR "GREY" ENOUGH OF AN ISSUE THAT THE LEGAL COSTS WILL BE LESS THAN THE PROFITS GENERATED.  REMEMBER THAT IT'S BETTER TO BEG FORGIVENESS THAN TO ASK PERMISSION.  THIS IS THE NATURE OF A CAPITALIST SYSTEM (AND ANY NATURAL BIOLOGICAL SYSTEM FOR THAT MATTER): TO EXPLOIT EVERY CONCEIVABLE ASSET, RESOURCE AND INEFFICIENCY FOR IT'S BENEFIT.


IN ADDITION, EVERY FIRM HAS IT'S OWN CULTURE AND PROPAGANDA (KOOL AID) DESIGNED TO KEEP IT'S EMPOYEES CONVINCED THAT IT'S SH*T IS AS SWEET AS CAROLINA HONEY AND THAT EVERY MORNING ONE SHOULD GIVE OFFERINGS AT IT'S ALTAR WITH A GRATEFUL HEART.  SOME FIRMS ARE BETTER AT IT THAN OTHERS, AND IT SEEMS THAT ED JONES IS PRETTY GOOD AT IT.  GOOD FOR THEM, MOVE ON......


(stepping of soapbox)

Jan 6, 2006 11:09 pm

I'm all about the Jones haters getting their own board.  Hopefully it will lead to more hating.  Better watch what you call it though or the Jones lawyers will stop their assault on exbrokers to go after the forum.  What ever happened to that website by the person who detested Jones.  What was it called? IhateEdwardJones.com, EdwardJonessucks.com... something like that.