ML PMD Program PCs
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[quote=BACFA]
Paradigm: Again, I don't know how many times someone is allowed to take the 7. PMD hiring is inflated now because B of A would love a higher head count than Morgan Stanley. Most PMD candidates claim they have an amazing network they can call so Managers tend to discount that unless it's someone on their second career. If they were an accountant for 10 years prior to coming to ML, then they would consider that a good network.
100% agree. Unless your network is ready to view you as an investment or insurance authority right away your network is worth diddly as a PMD. PMD recruits fool themselves every day that they are different. You are not different.
ZwingDing: I think even if someone drops out of PMD, having Merrill on their resume helps to get the next job. And I know plenty of people that have left Merrill and are making a fantastic living. Merrill has a way of brainwashing their advisors into thinking they are the only worthwhile company in town.
This is good to hear. Did the people to whom you are referring stay in financial services?
FADavo: I know the PMD program very well and I have studied the PMD documents. I know some of the PMD trainers down in Charlotte (from my B of A days) and in Hopewell. I've run the various permutations of the PC vs. annuitized assets ratio and compared it with money that experienced advisors raise. if you look at the $500k producers (across all channels, wire, indy, bank), their goals are generally $10mm/year in new assets. This is coming from national training classes and confirmed even by Merrill's SPA awards. I'm not saying that you can't or shouldn't be in the PMD program personally. Nor am I telling you to give up. I was just alluding to your original posts about PCs and raising money. $10mm/year is a huge number for someone starting in the business. And the fact that you are asking these questions on this forum, tells me that you want real answers from people that won't give you the canned answer from your PMD Coach.
Once you are in the PMD program there is no need to quit unless/until a better gig comes your way or you are told that your services are no longer required. My boss told me that I NEED to bring in $1M in assets a month. When I asked him if he could help me/coach me/mentor me to that end he said a flat: "No." That is not my strength.
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FADavo,
You are correct that there is a huge difference between 22 yo and 30 yo, especially if this is your 2nd career. And in my opinion, a JD/FA is the best combination in our business (followed by a CPA/FA). I and others have said that older, 2nd career advisors do much better than PMDs coming from the college job fair.
However, $10mm is still a big number. A $3mm team can, and should be raising $30mm in new annuitized assets/year. The fact that they're doing $3mm means that all of their clients have over $1 million to invest. But a sub-$500k producer does not have a book full of millionaires that can refer their wealthy friends. Now, if a 2nd career PMD has access those people, than yes, the $10mm is feasible. However, most PMDs do not have that type of referral stream.
[quote=FADavo]
[quote=BACFA]
Paradigm: Again, I don't know how many times someone is allowed to take the 7. PMD hiring is inflated now because B of A would love a higher head count than Morgan Stanley. Most PMD candidates claim they have an amazing network they can call so Managers tend to discount that unless it's someone on their second career. If they were an accountant for 10 years prior to coming to ML, then they would consider that a good network.
ZwingDing: I think even if someone drops out of PMD, having Merrill on their resume helps to get the next job. And I know plenty of people that have left Merrill and are making a fantastic living. Merrill has a way of brainwashing their advisors into thinking they are the only worthwhile company in town.
FADavo: I know the PMD program very well and I have studied the PMD documents. I know some of the PMD trainers down in Charlotte (from my B of A days) and in Hopewell. I've run the various permutations of the PC vs. annuitized assets ratio and compared it with money that experienced advisors raise. if you look at the $500k producers (across all channels, wire, indy, bank), their goals are generally $10mm/year in new assets. This is coming from national training classes and confirmed even by Merrill's SPA awards. I'm not saying that you can't or shouldn't be in the PMD program personally. Nor am I telling you to give up. I was just alluding to your original posts about PCs and raising money. $10mm/year is a huge number for someone starting in the business. And the fact that you are asking these questions on this forum, tells me that you want real answers from people that won't give you the canned answer from your PMD Coach.
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The Branch Manager didn't even really talk numbers. My numbers come from other FAs from all corners. I am a career changer so I did a bunch of research and had access, prior to making the decision, to lots of top end guys.
While I know none of what I am saying is the "norm" I also disagree that 10 a year is some sort of miracle. As I stated earlier in the thread, I think the reason the guys at my particular branch or successful is because they tend to ONLY hire second career people. I am the youngest PMD person there and I am 2 months from 30.
I practiced law for 5 years first. I can see how selling something when you are baby faced and 22 would be more difficult than when you have actually done something and are 30.
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I don't know you from Adam and I mean absolutely no disrespect of any kind. That being said here is my view:
Being 29 is still very young. You are going to be dealing with people who are in their 50's, 60's, and 70's and age is still going to be an issue. I'm not saying that you said it was not going to be an issue but I'm putting it out there because it is going to be an issue. You mention baby faced and 22. I'm in my 50's and people in their 30's are all baby faced to me when it comes to my hard earned savings. People your age make it. People my age make it. People of all ages make it. But youth is not an asset in this business.
Having practiced law for 5 years is a huge advantage IF you have a network of people with assets who will see you as a financial advisor right out of the gate. I'm a career changer too and I was a competent professional (sales professional) in technical sales. No one that I knew in my former life is, so far, seeing me as an FA. I think they will someday but someday does me zero good for hurdles today.
I'm not trying to be negative and I'm not trying to persuade you to not jump in. My point is this: everyone, including myself, thinks that they know what to expect. People often believe that they sold in the course of their last job even if they were selling themselves as a lawyer for instance. Unless you have done this exact job you are clueless as to what you are going to face.
I wish you well and I wish you tremendous success. Having a JD can be a tremendous asset. But, I'm pretty sure that you, like me and everyone else I've ever known, has no real idea what is in store.
Please keep us informed, and best wishes to you.
[quote=ZwingDing]
[quote=Paradigm]So is it safe to say that any PMD who fails the Series 7 will not be allowed to retest?[/quote]
It's up to the local manager. If he/she/it decides you are worth it they have to convince their boss and their bosses of the same thing. The more typical thing, I think, is if you do not pass you 7 your stuff is sent home to you in a box. It's kind of way to show you MIGHT be a good hire.
I'm not saying it is right or wrong, but it's what I hear. I know that a person in an office of which I have personal knowledge did not pass and was not allowed back in the building.
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Unless you score within 1-2 points of passing AND have a huge extenuating circumstance (house burned down, illness, death in family, etc.), you are done if you cannot pass the Series 7 the first time at ML.
Good luck
A few questions on ML PMD--
Are PC's/NNH/NNA cumulative or Trailing 12 numbers?
NNA = Net New Annuitized (ie: fee based only counts) or Net New Assets? Also, do annuities/C shares/ etc count towards Annutized?
How long is pre-production?
sorry for duping -- wasn't sure which forum was best for this post
FB:
I'm copying my response from the other forum. Great question but in the future, you may get better responses by starting a new topic than piggybacking on an old thread. These forums used to be a lot more active but some bad apples (that RR finally banned) chased a lot of posters away.
I would check out the Rookies Forum on this site, there are some good threads about ML PMD.
I don't have the Plan in front of me but I believe the following answers are correct:
1. Hurdles are all cumulative.
2. NNA is Net New Annuitized. Currently, ML is counting annuities and C shares as annuitized for the PMD program. However, this may change because starting this year on the FA side, they no longer count them. Only Managed Products are considered annuitized assets. This is something that Bank of America did with their program before Merrill (and they only paid 22%-28% on those annuity and C share trails; yes, that was painful).
3. Pre-production varies based on the tests needed and when you start, generally a month or two. Then you have an LOS "0" for 3 months before the hurdles start counting (and you become Length of Service "1" for the first month).
BACFA --
Thank you for your prompt and helpful response! So please correct me if I am wrong, but from your post, I gather that after a month of pre-production (if you are full licensed), you have a three month head start to hit your hurdles? If you generate any PC's during the three months at LOS "0", are you paid out on them?
I am not absolutely sure on the answer but because all the goals are cumulative, I don't think they will pay you until you finish your first quarter, in essence, finishing LOS 3. Your LOS "0" production would go towards those hurdles.
The PMD grid is not a traditional grid. Kind of long to explain here but Merrill factors in previous quarterly bonuses and the salary (forgiveable draw) for the monthly incentive check.
By any chance do you have a comp guide you could attach? (if it is compliant that is -- something they give to candidates)
[quote=FB 41]
BACFA --
Thank you for your prompt and helpful response! So please correct me if I am wrong, but from your post, I gather that after a month of pre-production (if you are full licensed), you have a three month head start to hit your hurdles?
Yes.
If you generate any PC's during the three months at LOS "0", are you paid out on them?
No. The income you receive in the PMD program is not a salary. It is a non-recoverable draw against commissions.
[/quote]
[quote=FADavo]
[quote=BACFA]
I am not absolutely sure on the answer but because all the goals are cumulative, I don't think they will pay you until you finish your first quarter, in essence, finishing LOS 3. Your LOS "0" production would go towards those hurdles.
The PMD grid is not a traditional grid. Kind of long to explain here but Merrill factors in previous quarterly bonuses and the salary (forgiveable draw) for the monthly incentive check.
[/quote]
The "grid" is super low paying but that is because the compensation is really structured completely differently while in the program.
First, you get your salary. Then you have quarterly bonuses based on meeting the quarterly hurdle numbers. You only have to MEET or exceed the numbers to get the bonus. The bonus is 15% of production. I addition, you get an annual bonus (so a total of 5 bonus possibilities a year) if you meet the annual numbers. I cannot remember off hand what the annual bonus is, but its pretty good.
What this does is sort of kill your chances at making some huge payday month because your % is low (15), but you are also making a salary that is probably bumping you over what you would be making on a 40% grid anyway, at least for the first 2 years.
I did the numbers and at, say, a 50K salary, You can make about 22% (of salary) bonus by LOS 12, 60% bonus (over 80K) by LOS 24 and over 6 figures total by LOS 36 if you just hit the hurdles. You can make more if you are killing the hurdles, specifically the PCs.
If you start the interview process, they will usually tell you this. I had a 45 minute conversation with one of the phone interview people about scenarios and what I would make if "so and so" happened. She gave me exact numbers.
I have told everyone I have spoken with so far that I found the ML interview process refreshing in that they really didn't blow a bunch of smoke. They tell you its hard, they tell you what people struggle with and they tell you why people fail (and that they do, in fact, fail).
[/quote]
It is difficult to make monthly commissions. I don't know anyone who is getting them. It is less difficult to make the quarterly bonus.
Ok, I think I'm on the same page, but just to confirm. Say you have a $60K Annual Salary, thus $5k per month in salary. If you exceed your monthly salary in commissions (say you produce $6k in PC's in a given month), then you take home the difference after payout (at 15% in the case it would be $150). So total monthly pre-tax income in this case is $5k + $150 = $5,150. In addition, you get a bonus if you exceed your goals by the end of any given quarter and a stock bonus if you exceed your annual goals by the end of LOS month 12, 24, and 36.
In addition, with a three month head start at LOS= "0", you have more time to generate PC's from fee based accounts, since as we know, they are great for a recurring revenue stream, but don't pay as much up front as say an A share or Annuity or Hard Dollar Commission.
If any of this is incorrect, please let me know. Also, does salary end at month 24 or 36 (at which point payout goes from 15% to 40%?. Thanks for your help.
Ok, I think I'm on the same page, but just to confirm. Say you have a $60K Annual Salary, thus $5k per month in salary. If you exceed your monthly salary in commissions (say you produce $6k in PC's in a given month), then you take home the difference after payout (at 15% in the case it would be $150). So total monthly pre-tax income in this case is $5k + $150 = $5,150. In addition, you get a bonus if you exceed your goals by the end of any given quarter and a stock bonus if you exceed your annual goals by the end of LOS month 12, 24, and 36.
In addition, with a three month head start at LOS= "0", you have more time to generate PC's from fee based accounts, since as we know, they are great for a recurring revenue stream, but don't pay as much up front as say an A share or Annuity or Hard Dollar Commission.
If any of this is incorrect, please let me know. Also, does salary end at month 24 or 36 (at which point payout goes from 15% to 40%?). Thanks for your help.
That sounds a lot more reasonable. However your net commissions have to exceed your monthly salary in order for you to take the difference, not gross? I thought the whole point of trainee salary was to give you enough to support yourself while also rewarding you for outperforming your goals? If you are on 5k salary per month, and you produce 6k, the firm still takes 100% payout on the first 5k, so I would think that there would be a normal payout grid for the remainder, similar to the comp structure that the Veteran FA's are on. I could be wrong, but I can't imagine they would expect 25-30k Monthly Gross from a trainee in his/her first year.