[quote=Bill Fakkland]

Thanks for sharing. What a COMPLETE breach of confidentiality. I would take the little old lady by the hand, guide her to a computer, and show her how her "new" advisor just vomited the prospective clients personal financial information over the world-wide web. Maybe I would show her son or daughter this post as well. If you don't like the portfolio, which sounds like it was designed to provide maximum income for her, then deal with is in a professional, confidential manner.

[/quote]

Bill F-upped

Is that what you would really do, you sound like  a disciple of Doug "3 Mil" Hill and you would do another cover up?

I would take her by the hand and call her children and have a meeting with a very good Securities Attorney, and have her and them file a complaint with the following:

1) NASD         &n bsp;         &n bsp;         &n bsp;         &n bsp;         &n bsp;         &n bsp;         &n bsp;     2) SEC         &nb sp;         &nb sp;         &nb sp;         &nb sp;         &nb sp;         &nb sp;         &nb sp;        3) State Securities Department

Have the Attorney file a suit against another fraudulent act by Edward Jones,  and take your answer that you put over the world wide web to tell what a sleaze bag you and how Edward Jones IR's really are..............

Anyone that condones that kinda of treatment to a client should not be in our business, and you call your self and Edward Jones ETHICAL?

Bill F-upped you are a DISGRACE...to our INDUSTRY

I think the comment that poor decisions are made at all firms is a good one, though in this case we have limited information as we were not with the woman when she first came in, to hear her needs and risk tolerance.

Jones allows its' IR's to comment here.

No question there are bad brokers at every place.  The difference is that Jones does not provide industry or product education.  So called great sales training and no need to argue this.  But with a watered down product mix, low overall industry experience with the brokers and no product training, well it is easy to see why something like this would happen.  And this is not an isolated event by any means.  Go and talk to some of your biggest hitters and find out that 75% of their product mix is in variable annuities.

Guys/Ladies, I hear your comments that one bad broker doesn not make a bad firm and to a degree, I buy into that.  The disappointing thing here is that this is far from the first time I've seen this kind of crap from this "advisor" (which is why I doubt if he'll even be able to figure out which of his clients I'm talking about...if he even reads this and recognizes himself).  I struggle with the question of why the EDJ compliance folks aren't taking a much harder look at these practices in his client base, as they are common from the statements I've seen and the folks I've spoken with.  My guess is that they like the production and are willing to overlook the suitability issues.  And before y'all point it out, yes, I'm sure that other firms have been guilty of the same.  As has been pointed out here before, it's the self-righteous "we're not like all those other bad firms" that really gives the haters heartburn.  And yes, I know there are good, honest, competent reps at EDJ, as I do have friends there.

As far as posting confidential information, I'm still puzzled by this accusation.  I think most of us know that Jones sells these kind of products and many of us have seen them in little old ladies' portfolios before, so pray tell me, where is the "confidential" information here?

OH NO!!!  I think I just figured it out!!!  I just exposed EDJ's only million dollar producer!!!  At any rate, even that is sheer speculation based on what a competing broker told me several years back, so I'm not even sure that it's true & correct, although this joker seems to be successful and well though of.

The bottom line is, I posted this thread to serve as a learning experience for those on both sides of the issue.  If my disgust showed through, I'm not apologizing, as I truly believe that this "advisor" is putting his income ahead of his clients' welfare (assuming he's not just stupid), and after seeing this pattern again and again, I guess my frustration got the better of me...

Indyone. I agree with you 100%.   First of all the information you disclosed wasn't specific to any named person and is more of a hypothetical example.  Therefore NOT confidential.

Second. Portfolios like this are common throughout the Jones system and this is why.  Most of their IR trainees are people who have literally no experience in investing or in the financial area at all.  They train them to sell product without any real consideration of more detailed considerations that are needed to be an effective advisor.  Estate planning, insurance coverage issues, tax ramifications, not to mention basic portfolio construction theory (alpha, beta, efficient frontier etc) are not taught or even discussed.   When I was a transfer broker and going to the training at Jones, I was appalled to say the least.  I had completed the CFP training and had been in the business for almost 10 years by then and was shocked at how little real information they gave the trainees and how much was on pushing the products.  

Don't get me wrong.  This is a sales job and we must get our clients to invest in "product".  I have always hated calling investment "product"... but I digress again.   The issue came to a head for me when they were pushing the IRs to "sell" 30 bonds in the lowest interest rate environment in the last 50 years.  The newbie brokers would sell these thinking that they had done a good thing without any real understanding of the effects of interest rates and market dynamics on holding these types of investments.    YES YES Bill Falkland, they did provide an income stream BUT there are many other issues to be considered besides the immediate gratification of the client and of course the immediate income to the Rep.  Long term issues are not considered at Jones because it is all about meeting the GP expectations today and not about deferring for the longer term good (of the client)

There ARE good reps at Jones, but it is despite the training at Jones and are few and far between.  Most of the people I met there are good people and well meaning.  But we all know the phrase about paving the highway with good intentions and where it leads.

I too, got the same crap about moving, lies about the costs of transferring, scare tactics on my clients, lies and innuendos about why I was not at Jones, inferences that I wasn't stable and would be moving again etc etc.  Not to mention the immediate churning of clients accounts by the Jones Rep from St Louis. 

I heard that Edward Jones had a sell rating on GM & Ford stock for maybe a 1 or 2 yrs and at the same time they continued to offer millions of dollars worth of new issue GMAC bonds.

I think Jones stopped offering GMAC bonds in early 2005.

I have 2 questions I will toss out.

1.  When did other firms stop offering GMAC bonds?

2.  Am I the only one who is bothered by the research dept having a sell recommendation on the stock, while the bond dept offerd GMAC bonds to the broker?

DT

[quote=Bill Fakkland]

Thanks for sharing. What a COMPLETE breach of confidentiality. I would take the little old lady by the hand, guide her to a computer, and show her how her "new" advisor just vomitted the prospective clients personal financial information over the world-wide web. Maybe I would show her son or daughter this post as well. If you don't like the portfolio, which sounds like it was designed to provide maximum income for her, then deal with is in a professional, confidential manner.

[/quote]

Oh please Bill.  ::rolls eyes::

Yes of course he's betrayed the secrets and we're all able to figure out who Jane Doe is so we can link the portfolio information to her identity.

Dude, I know far more than you about Indy One's location, and there is no farging way I will ever figure out who this lady is.  (Not to mention I have far more constructive things to do.)

Good try.  Go drink some more Kool Aid and brush up on your spelling.  It occurs to me, too, that extremely poor spelling and grammar seems to be a common denominator with you KoolAid boys.  Hmmmmmmm........interesting. 

[quote=Bill Fakkland]

Thanks for sharing. What a COMPLETE breach of confidentiality. I would take the little old lady by the hand, guide her to a computer, and show her how her "new" advisor just vomitted the prospective clients personal financial information over the world-wide web. Maybe I would show her son or daughter this post as well. If you don't like the portfolio, which sounds like it was designed to provide maximum income for her, then deal with is in a professional, confidential manner.

[/quote]

One more issue with F up's quote. Calling Indyone her "new" advisor implies that the Jones clown she worked with before was an advisor.  I know this is splitting hairs  but,THERE ARE NO ADVISORS AT JONES only IR's who peddle product and do "Portfolio" reviews.

I know, I know... soon you will have some new financial planning software that requires a 65 to use or something.  You will also have email in every branch, a terrestrial network, tablet PC's for every IR....whatever

The only people who called me an advisor at Jones were the butkissing wholesalers who would write "advisor copy" on some piece of sales lit they had written all over.

Bab,looney - I think you make some outstanding points on this thread.  It underscores why I laugh when I hear “the best sales force” - this is a great example of the results of that mindset.  I agree w/ you whole heartedly on this, which is another frustration I have as people talk about Jones having the best training program.  I think that needs to be a bit more qualified; that is, training you for what - which I believe you exposed perfectly.  Like I said before on another thread, I learned more in 3 days about this business at LPL’s National Conference than I did at 5 years w/ Jones!

Posted on Fri, Dec. 16, 2005

ST. LOUIS - The investment firm Edward Jones will pay about $2.5 million to customers for failing to file their claims on time in a class-action lawsuit, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch reported Friday.

U.S. District Judge John Nangle last week dismissed an effort by suburban St. Louis-based Edward Jones to file the customers' claims after a deadline had passed in the class-action shareholder lawsuit against Bank of America.

"Edward Jones admits that the failure to file the claims resulted from its own negligence. Such behavior does not warrant an extension of the claims filing deadline," Nangle wrote in an order Dec. 9.

"We messed up," Edward Jones spokesman John Boul said. "We're trying to do what's right for the customers." The company will make the payments to customers who owned 5 million shares of the old NationsBank, which merged into Bank of America in 1998.

Shareholders alleged in the lawsuit that Bank of America failed to disclose large financial losses stemming from an investment in a hedge fund. The bank settled the case for $490 million in 2002 - one of the largest shareholder class-action settlements in U.S. history.

Nangle said he initially set a deadline of July 15, 2002, for claims to be filed, but later extended the deadline to May 1, 2004. Edward Jones missed the last deadline, Nangle said.

About 8,500 Edward Jones customers own the shares involved. Boul said the company filed claims in the suit in a timely fashion on behalf of three classes of shareholders, but erred in failing to file on behalf of a fourth.

"We have decided to contact the affected clients and pay them the amount of their claim that they would have received, had they been included with the rest of the class, plus interest," he said.

Am I the only one who is bothered by the research dept having a sell recommendation on the stock, while the bond dept offered GMAC bonds to the broker?

I can sell GMAC bonds.  I haven't done much in them lately with the exception of very short term to aggressive investors who want a big bang for their buck on short term (1  to 1/2 yr) and are able to handle the risk.   GMAC and GM, even though they are attached at the hip, are two different animals.  If GMAC is spun off or sold the credit rating on that paper will go up. 

The fact that there is a sell rating on a stock, doesn't always mean the company is in trouble (although that does seem to be the case for GM) or that people shouldn't look at their bonds.   A sell could be for many reasons.  The stock is oversold, reached target price and looks to trend downward; the fundamentals of the industry that the company is in may have changed making the entire industry a sell and so on.  So, no I don't have a problem with a sell as long as I know why it is recommended.  Plus there is always the opportunity to make some money in options without holding the actual stock for those really daring clients who don't mind flying without a net 

[quote=Indyone]

I was just handed an Edward Jones statement from an elderly lady (approximately 70) who was concerned about the recent losses in her account. Here are the facts as I read them off the statement. $500,000 account with $350,000 in ten bonds ranging in maturity from 2019 to 2034. Included in this total are two GMAC bonds bought at $50,000 face that are now worth about $30,000 each.

Beyond that, this lady has a mortgage REIT (under water) and $120,000 in junk bond mutuals. For some unknown reason, the cost basis on the Putnam junk fund isn’t showing (my, isn’t THAT convenient?!!!)

This lady’s rep has been here with Jones since around 1980, I believe, and has the whole town believing that he is a saint and a genius. I was told about five years ago that he was grossing about $800,000/year, so he may be cracking a million in annual production by now, so by financial measures, he is a successful advisor.

Where to start!!! By my moral and mental compass, he is a complete sleazeball and/or idiot, take your pick. When I made my move to independence this summer, he an all the other Jones reps pooled together and ran an ad about advisors leaving their firms and suggested that it was a good time to look at Edward Jones. Thus far, according to friends at my old firm, it netted the Jonsers one account of about $80,000. I talked to the guy who moved, who was by this time having doubts and regrets and he told me that the Jonser told him that their was no need to move to me and pay a wrap fee…he could hold many of the same funds at Jones for free. He also indicated to my client that I may decide to move again in 3-4 years and he wouldn’t want to go through the hassle of transferring his account all over again.

I’m not going to waste time here defendin why my wrap program is better in my eyes…I think it is sufficiently sleazy to tell a client that unlike the other guy, I work for free! Nor will I go into detail as to all the reasons why the afore-described portfolio is inappropriate for this lady as I am sure that many of you can see some fatal flaws from what I’ve described. The bottom line is, this rep is a closet sleazeball and it is a real shame that so many folks have trusted him over the years just because he had the good fotune to be first here setting up shop and was here during a long bull market where a monkey could have made people money.

I’m off my soapbox…got to go and work on fix recommendations for this poor Jones victim…

BP,

I don't know the duration of the relationship (assume more than ten years), although most of these bonds were purchased fairly recently, hence the fact that maturities are still a long way off and the relatively low coupons.  I would guess that the Putnam fund was a conversion since this advisor has sold the same funds many times.  The cost basis crack was due to an elderly client taking a 40% hit on the same fund earlier this year, almost at the peak of the junk bond market, when other junk funds had done considerably better.  I'm certainly considering the death put option on the GMACs since they are so far down...I'm just concerned about possible bankrupcy before she dies or the bonds mature.

...and yes, I've always assumed that there were a few million dollar producers at EDJ, but if this guy is one, he's not doing it the right way in my opinion...

Thank you to everyone for helping me to decide not to make the move to become an Edward Jones IR. Their opportunity is obviously a simple high pressure sales position to push their products and has nothing to do with truly looking out for the client as their literature states.

[quote=davidrends]

Thank you to everyone for helping me to decide not to make the move to become an Edward Jones IR. Their opportunity is obviously a simple high pressure sales position to push their products and has nothing to do with truly looking out for the client as their literature states.

[/quote]

Yes, BigPayDay has that effect on many people, just read his bullsh48 he spreads on here, he can justify screwing little old ladies, or not telling your clients the TRUTH, what they don't know won't hurt them, much 

He doesn't know that there is no such thing at Edward Jones as Advisors, there are only IR's, LP's, GP's and he can't even find his PP's  If he has one

Davidrends, you have seen the light.............

Player aren’t you the one that lied about having a client with a free switch letter in your office when they hadn’t even been mailed out yet?

[quote=Maxstud]Player aren't you the one that lied about having a client with a free switch letter in your office when they hadn't even been mailed out yet?[/quote]

Max,

Have a definition for you:

ad hominem: marked by an attack on an opponent's character rather than by an answer to the contentions made

So, what does the discussion have to do with switch letters?  Are you an advisor? Do you have a series 65 or 66 license? Would you try to defend a Jones guy who appeared to makes some mistakes in his asset allocation for an elderly client, just because he works for Jones?  Or can you accept that you may have a screwball or two over there?

I think davidrends has seen the light too.  Care to attack my character?  Or will you just run away and hide, throwing up a smug jab every three months without revealing anything about your character?

When someone is making accusations I think it’s fair to question his character.       

How does player know that BigPay screws old ladies?  Are you concerned with Players attack on his character?  Or are you like a schoolyard bully that jumps to defend his buddies but loves to watch them knock around someone else?     

Did Player post an obvious lie on the forum?  Cant find it but I do remember it.

BTW I choose smug jab every 3 months.

I think what Player had seen was the internal memo that had gone out to IRs explaining how the free switch would be handled, and how to respond to certain client questions should they arise.  I saw a copy of the same memo.  I think that he did not understand exactly what he was looking at.  Therefore, I do not think that he out and out lied intentionally, he simply prematurely jumped to conclusion without having all the facts.

And, I would bet my right arm that BPD hasn't allocated a client's account in years.  He is a home office GP somehow affiliated with Jones' training program.  See you in April, jackass!

[quote=Maxstud]Player aren't you the one that lied about having a client with a free switch letter in your office when they hadn't even been mailed out yet?[/quote]

Maxstud

THAT IS A TOTAL FALSE STATEMENT!

This is the PERFECT example of no accountability of you Jones Drones  you make up false statements and swear they are the TRUTH........... 

How about you posting your PROOF?

By the way were you the IR that bent his BOA over the desk, or were you under his desk...........