[quote=Spaceman Spiff]

75 years old.  We’ve had 3 meetings in the last 3 months.  The last one he tells me he can’t understand my proposal, can’t figure out how much it costs, and can’t see any reason why he would move to me just to buy different mutual funds.  He wants to do ETFs instead. China, Oil and Gas, Energy, and FTSE.  He read a book on them so now he’s an expert. 

I hate to break this to you, but the client is right. Lets see what your proposing: You should pay me $16,250 for our three meetings and I am going to replace your current mutual funds with the two mutual fund families I am schlepping. For the 16k I get a different allocation from what I had, that has built up to $650,000, which is more money that you have. ALSO, I am 75 so my life expectancy is about 6 years. He should take 1/2 his money and but a portfolio of etf’s.

Spiff, you do seem to be awakening a bit. This is what happened to me.

You will be more competitive with a real fee-based platform (I'm not convinced Jones will give you one). It truly demonstrates that your recommendations are unbiased when you are not paid better to recommend one product over another, and the client will see that.

And Spiked...from what I hear..."it is going to blow the doors off of the industry." (Just like A share annuities did, right?)

Spiff, keep your eyes open. You will be amazed what you start to see if you are just willing to. I am sure glad I did. 

[quote=STL Sucks]You should pay me $16,250 for our three meetings and I
am going to replace your current mutual funds with the two mutual fund
families I am schlepping.[/quote]



An additional issue is very likely that none/few of the funds in the
EDJ lineup are sexy or meet his percieved needs (). Clearly Spiff,
didn’t show that he could deliver more than $16,250 of value to this
client.



() GFA/CIB are the perfect investments for everyone.



Someone in his situation has a set of needs, and needs investments that
will match those needs. In the initial sales call, you want figure out
what the clients explicit needs are (e.g needs that the client verbally
states).



So you ask if his current investments provide enough income, what his
goals are, how his life would be different if he could meet his goals
etc.



Then you match investments (benefits) to explicitly stated needs.



A typical older person needs income oriented investments with strong
diversification to lower portfolio volatilty. Some folks really want
very strong and direct exposure to non-US assets. Other people are
crazy for hard assets/natural resources.



Using just two EDJ Fund families is like trying to paint the Mona Lisa
with only orange and red crayons. I.e in the entire EDJ universe there
is only one TIPS fund, and damn few good value/international offerings.



Then again, the fact that he mentioned the FTSE suggests that he may
have caught the vanguard virus, and is now pretty much immune to your
blandishments. Vanguard offers a FTSE All-world x-US ETF (VEU) for only
25 bps. Or maybe he wanted the FTSE RAFI index funds from powershares.



If the client wants to invest in china, you want to have something
useful to say. If the client wants Oil/Gas you want something useful to
say. If the client wants Gold you want something useful to say.



But if all you can say is “Growth Fund of America!”, then you aren’t
saying anything useful that sophisticated clients want to hear.

I have seen many an EJ brokers $500-$1,000,000 proposals. Most that make

zero to little use of proper breakpoints and suggest A-shares of 7 preferred

fund families.



This screws people so badly on the upront fees that there is no point in

moving it out of Jones.



I’m surprised the SEC doesn’t crack down on EJ’s illegal use of A-shares. I

told one victim what a breakpoint was, and she just about screamed.

Spiff, I could say something sarcastic…but man, I feeeeel your pain.  I took it very personal when something like this happened.  I felt inferior, like a schlump.  It made my calls sound terrible…I was pissed and down on myself.  Started second guessing myself.  I’d go to meetings and some new guy who took over an office would brag about all he was getting and he won his first trip…blah blah blah.  All this crap just built up to the point I didn’t believe ANYTHING coming from my RL, home office, anywhere. It was the end.

[quote=AGE_Inside_Info]I have seen many an EJ brokers $500-$1,000,000 proposals. Most that make
zero to little use of proper breakpoints and suggest A-shares of 7 preferred
fund families.

This screws people so badly on the upront fees that there is no point in
moving it out of Jones.

I'm surprised the SEC doesn't crack down on EJ's illegal use of A-shares. I
told one victim what a breakpoint was, and she just about screamed.[/quote]

This is not normal at EJ. Jones advisors in general use breakpoints to the clients' and their own detriment. You will not convince me otherwise.

And yes, CIB for everyone!

[quote=CIBforeveryone]

[quote=AGE_Inside_Info]I have seen many an EJ brokers $500-$1,000,000 proposals. Most that make
zero to little use of proper breakpoints and suggest A-shares of 7 preferred
fund families.

This screws people so badly on the upront fees that there is no point in
moving it out of Jones.

I'm surprised the SEC doesn't crack down on EJ's illegal use of A-shares. I
told one victim what a breakpoint was, and she just about screamed.[/quote]

This is not normal at EJ. Jones advisors in general use breakpoints to the clients' and their own detriment. You will not convince me otherwise.

And yes, CIB for everyone!

[/quote]

CIB? I know the "In Butt" part, but what does the "C" stand for?

[quote=AGE_Inside_Info]I have seen many an EJ brokers $500-$1,000,000 proposals. Most that make

zero to little use of proper breakpoints and suggest A-shares of 7 preferred

fund families.



This screws people so badly on the upront fees that there is no point in

moving it out of Jones.



I’m surprised the SEC doesn’t crack down on EJ’s illegal use of A-shares. I

told one victim what a breakpoint was, and she just about screamed.[/quote]



The classic presentation is to

[quote=Bobby Hull][quote=CIBforeveryone]

[quote=AGE_Inside_Info]I have seen many an EJ brokers $500-$1,000,000 proposals. Most that make
zero to little use of proper breakpoints and suggest A-shares of 7 preferred
fund families.

This screws people so badly on the upront fees that there is no point in
moving it out of Jones.

I'm surprised the SEC doesn't crack down on EJ's illegal use of A-shares. I
told one victim what a breakpoint was, and she just about screamed.[/quote]

This is not normal at EJ. Jones advisors in general use breakpoints to the clients' and their own detriment. You will not convince me otherwise.

And yes, CIB for everyone!

[/quote]

CIB? I know the "In Butt" part, but what does the "C" stand for?

[/quote]

Rhymes with Rock.

[quote=CIBforeveryone]

[quote=AGE_Inside_Info]I have seen many an EJ brokers $500-$1,000,000 proposals. Most that make
zero to little use of proper breakpoints and suggest A-shares of 7 preferred
fund families.

This screws people so badly on the upront fees that there is no point in
moving it out of Jones.

I'm surprised the SEC doesn't crack down on EJ's illegal use of A-shares. I
told one victim what a breakpoint was, and she just about screamed.[/quote]

This is not normal at EJ. Jones advisors in general use breakpoints to the clients' and their own detriment. You will not convince me otherwise.

And yes, CIB for everyone!

[/quote]

And all this time I though the name meant Combat Infantryman's Badge.....

[quote=Baller][quote=Bobby Hull][quote=CIBforeveryone]

[quote=AGE_Inside_Info]I have seen many an EJ brokers $500-$1,000,000 proposals. Most that make
zero to little use of proper breakpoints and suggest A-shares of 7 preferred
fund families.

This screws people so badly on the upront fees that there is no point in
moving it out of Jones.

I'm surprised the SEC doesn't crack down on EJ's illegal use of A-shares. I
told one victim what a breakpoint was, and she just about screamed.[/quote]

This is not normal at EJ. Jones advisors in general use breakpoints to the clients' and their own detriment. You will not convince me otherwise.

And yes, CIB for everyone!

[/quote]

CIB? I know the "In Butt" part, but what does the "C" stand for?

[/quote]

Rhymes with Rock.

[/quote]

Good. I was afraid that it might rhyme with "rum."

EDJ FEE Based....As I have heard it will resemble R shares for the 8 preferred fund families. (Quite the Platform) 

[quote=AllREIT] [quote=AGE_Inside_Info]I have seen many an EJ brokers $500-$1,000,000 proposals. Most that make
zero to little use of proper breakpoints and suggest A-shares of 7 preferred
fund families.

This screws people so badly on the upront fees that there is no point in
moving it out of Jones.

I'm surprised the SEC doesn't crack down on EJ's illegal use of A-shares. I
told one victim what a breakpoint was, and she just about screamed.[/quote]

The classic presentation is to

1) Use two preferred fund families to split up money, away from the break points.
2) Buy some bonds
3) Buy a Dow stock so you  have something to talk about.

If you play your cards right it would take well over $1M in client assets to hit any break points
[/quote]

Actually from what I've seen we (Jones FAs) tend to use breakpoints much better than anyone else out there.  I can't tell  you how many $250K B share portfolios I've run into.  Most of them coming from Amex, but several others from AGE and even Merrill.  I've always thought that a broker that uses B shares on that dollar amount is just too scared to tell the clients that he gets paid to do his job.  So he hides behind the you don't pay any sales charges on B shares scam.  Or he says he can build a better portfolio by using 9 different fund families.  However, he wants to get paid better than C shares. 

AGE you're, well...lying.  Sorry, I know it's harsh, but too bad. First, compliance wouldn't let an account like that fly. They freak when you get above 2.  Second, it would be incredibly rare for any of us to use all 8 fund families.  Most of us have 3, maybe 4, that we use most of the time.  Maybe you've seen it once, but not frequently.  The "illegal use of A shares" comment is just flat wrong.  Maybe you were thinking about our illegal use of revenue sharing.

AllREIT is pretty close to standard at Jones.  We have a pattern, just like everywhere else.  B shares at AMEX, C shares at AGE, wrap everything at Merrill.  Bobby does annuities.  Doesn't make ours a bad presentation.  As long as we can make the returns our clients are looking for I don't see why it matters how many fund families we use or if we use options or ETFs or gold.  Where do they want to be and how much risk/return will it take to get there.  Manage the portfolio to meet the goals. 

Spiff-

You wrote...

Maybe you were thinking about our illegal use of revenue sharing.

It sounds like you are finally getting it.

No, just a little attempt at humor.  Revenue sharing isn't illegal.  We certainly know how to use it to our benefit.  Evidently the regulators felt that our lack of disclosure (and of everyone else who didn't hurry up and put some disclaimer on their website) wasn't up to par.  If it was illegal, we couldn't do it anymore.  Let's not rehash this again, please. 

Trust me people, I get it.  I know there are things I'm giving up by staying at Jones.  I like it here.  A lot of you didn't.  I'm hoping that there are some changes in the near future that make my job easier and better for my current and future clients.

Spiff,

I was on the leadership team in my region and past advisor of Jones, one thing I didn't enjoy was having to prospect new people every month because of no reaccuring revenue (I had 12 gross monthly in A share trails).  This ultimatley took time away from my best clients so insurance planning and estate issues were out the window due to the required hunting each month.  I just cant believe EDJ is using the term financial advisor, I think asset gatherer is more appropriate.  Just a thought...if you and your clients are happy then all is well.

Correction to last reply $9,200 monthly trails 

Spiff-

Were you around when we were encouraged to NAV to Hartford because of revenue sharing and how it impacted our bonuses?

And were you around when we found out some 6-7 years later that the GP's owned an income interest (sounds like LP) in the Hartford Mutual Funds. And how did we find out...when they were forced to disclose it on the website! When revenue sharing issues came out, Jones management deserved to pay every penny of the SEC settlement.

Dude...The conflict is so glaring you have been blinded. While maybe not illegal since everyone else does it (NOT), probably one of the most unethical tactics ever used in the industry to manipulate brokers.

I was a successful Jones broker who left and I did it to mainitain my integrity. The stench of management was more than I could take. I was sick every time I represented the firm in public, because I knew the truth. I worked for a bunch of hypocrites. Don't tell me never to rehash the truth.

The reason...is you can't handle the truth.

Spiff is getting wooosy with all the blows. Take one on the chin for your friends the GP's and maybe, just maybe, they'll bring you aboard the gravy train. 

OR NOT!!