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Sep 27, 2009 1:44 pm

Gaddock, you are missing the fact that calling on F&F has nothing to do with getting them as clients.  It’s about building a referral based business.   Many people have quick success by selling stuff to family, but the one who survive are the ones who can learn to get referrals from F&F.

  It's almost impossible to succeed in the beginning using referrals if one makes their money by being an asset gatherer.  Yet, getting referrals almost guarantees success if one is working with an insurance company.
Sep 27, 2009 3:36 pm

I hear you, I’m sure that helps just something I didn’t do.

Sep 27, 2009 3:41 pm
anonymous:

It’s almost impossible to succeed in the beginning using referrals if one makes their money by being an asset gatherer.  Yet, getting referrals almost guarantees success if one is working with an insurance company.

  I'm sure this is correct in your personal situation, but I have a tough time imagining that someone would definitely get more referrals by selling insurance than investments.  Stuff like life insurance and disability insurance is more personal to most people, and I wouldn't think people are more likely to bring that up in conversation w/their friends than they would their 401(k) and other investments.  Everyone knows someone that is unhappy w/their current investments, but how many people have a friend who has complained that they don't have enough disability coverage?  I'm probably off base, but this is just how I would see reality playing out.
Sep 27, 2009 4:01 pm

It’s not the product.  It’s the minimum requirements set up by firms.

  Most wirehouses have a firm minimum of $100k to open an investment account.   Life insurance and disability have no such requirements.  All they have to do is be able to pay the premium.   This opens the doors to more people who may want to own such insurance products.
Sep 27, 2009 4:20 pm

[quote=Gordon Ramsey]It’s not the product.  It’s the minimum requirements set up by firms.

  Most wirehouses have a firm minimum of $100k to open an investment account.   Life insurance and disability have no such requirements.  All they have to do is be able to pay the premium.   This opens the doors to more people who may want to own such insurance products.[/quote]   If I have a client that has $500,000 with me, chances are if they give me a referral it will be someone of relatively similar stature.  People with money hang out with people with money. 
Sep 27, 2009 5:57 pm
3rdyrp2:

[quote=anonymous]It’s almost impossible to succeed in the beginning using referrals if one makes their money by being an asset gatherer.  Yet, getting referrals almost guarantees success if one is working with an insurance company.

  I'm sure this is correct in your personal situation, but I have a tough time imagining that someone would definitely get more referrals by selling insurance than investments.  Stuff like life insurance and disability insurance is more personal to most people, and I wouldn't think people are more likely to bring that up in conversation w/their friends than they would their 401(k) and other investments.  Everyone knows someone that is unhappy w/their current investments, but how many people have a friend who has complained that they don't have enough disability coverage?  I'm probably off base, but this is just how I would see reality playing out.[/quote]   I don't think that I'm succeeding in getting my point across.  Chef Ramsey gets it.   I am not saying that someone would get more referrals selling insurance than selling investments.  Whoever asks the most will get the most referrals.  I am saying that a newby can run a referral business when they are new in the insurance business, but can't in the investment business.   Let me try to give an example.  Joe is a new rep with ML.  He is 25 years old.  He does not come from money.  His manager wants him opening accounts that are $100,000 +.    He calls on F&F.  None of them are qualified prospects.  He gets 5 referrals from all of them.  The vast majority of these also won't be qualified prospects.  By this time he realizes that he's better off cold calling and qualifying for assets before setting up meetings. He has wasted tons of time talking to unqualified prospects.   Jim is a new rep with Big Company Mutual.  He calls on F&F.  The majority of them will be qualified prospects.  They don't do business with him because they know he is new.  He gets 5 referrals from all of them.  The vast majority of these will be qualified prospects and many will become clients and they will refer him to others.  He has the start of a great referral based practice.   It simply comes down to the fact that with insurance one doesn't need a lot of investable assets to be a decent prospect.  A young attorney/CPA/etc. makes an excellent prospect despite not having any real money to invest.   People don't complain about things like not having enough disability coverage.  They don't know that they don't have enough coverage.   For instance, I'd be willing to bet that 3/4ths of the people on this board would be financially screwed if they got sick tomorrow and couldn't work again.   Here's a rough guess for you.  Ride the elevator tomorrow and look at the 5 people on it with you.  If all 5 of them were willing to have an open and honest conversation, 4 of them would generate a commission of at least $1,000 for someone who sells insurance.  At most, 1 of them would be a decent client for an asset gatherer.  More likely, none of them would be.   A referral business is easier for insurance simply because the majority of people are qualified prospects.  I'm not trying to make a point that this is a better way to go.  It's just different. 
Sep 27, 2009 8:27 pm

Anonymous: “Iceco1d, thanks for meeting with me today.  I completely understand and can appreciate that you’ve been doing business with your friend for the last 20 years.  I have no desire to get in the way of your relationship with him.   As I said on the phone, I was looking for nothing more than a quick introduction today.”

  Iceco1d: "It was my pleasure."   Anonymous: "There are three people in your firm whom I will be trying to get together with in the next few weeks.   How well do you know 3rdyrp2?"   Iceco1d:  "I know him pretty well.  I was just at his baby naming.  He's a good guy.  blah blah blah."   Anonymous: "When I call him, do you have any objection to me mentioning that we spoke?"   Iceco1d: "That's fine."   Anyway, the way to get referrals from someone who is almost a complete stranger is to drop names.  The best part about this is that some of those people will become clients which makes it much easier to turn the original person into a client.
Sep 27, 2009 8:49 pm

The one thing that strikes me when getting a referral from a family member just out of the gate is the person knowing/finding out that you are right out of training. Seems to me to be a double edged sword.

Sep 27, 2009 9:00 pm

I’d have to agree with you Gaddock.  I personally have a hard time thinking that I’d have to rely on referrals from friends and family who they are willing to let me “experiment” on them for my income.

  It's not something that I've ever felt comfortable about.   Now, once I have my own practice being built and it's beginning to sustain itself and my family... THAT is the time to ask those I know.   Why?  We've always been told not to "sell" to our friends and family - to use them for money.   I'd rather offer my help because I know that they need my help MORE than I need them to buy something.
Sep 27, 2009 9:36 pm

[quote=anonymous]Anonymous: “Iceco1d, thanks for meeting with me today.  I completely understand and can appreciate that you’ve been doing business with your friend for the last 20 years.  I have no desire to get in the way of your relationship with him.   As I said on the phone, I was looking for nothing more than a quick introduction today.”

  Iceco1d: "It was my pleasure."   Anonymous: "There are three people in your firm whom I will be trying to get together with in the next few weeks.   How well do you know 3rdyrp2?"   Iceco1d:  "I know him pretty well.  I was just at his baby naming.  He's a good guy.  blah blah blah."   Anonymous: "When I call him, do you have any objection to me mentioning that we spoke?"   Iceco1d: "That's fine."   Anyway, the way to get referrals from someone who is almost a complete stranger is to drop names.  The best part about this is that some of those people will become clients which makes it much easier to turn the original person into a client.[/quote]   That would be considered a referral?  I'm not trying to seem critical, its just everything I've learned about gathering referrals and considering something a referral has never included mentioning to someone who I was already planning on meeting or talking to that I spoke with one of their colleagues.
Sep 27, 2009 10:36 pm

True, it is a lot easier to get a referral through a friend/family member that you have already sold/helped. But it isn't necessarily a requirement for them to give you referrals. For example, if you are competent, professional and position yourself correctly, your friends/family will send you referrals (as they want to see you succeed).

When I first got into production, I approached a couple of my family members that I knew needed something I was offering. I either got them into a better program or saved them some money. I went over what I did with all my friends (with no intention of selling them) and asked them "who do you know might need my services?" or "who do you know that just got married?" Selling your natural market and getting referrals from them is key to succeeding in this business because it will generate immediate income. In the meantime, I was also doing cold prospecting (cold calling and cold walking) so that by month 2-3, I was making sales off the cold market. After a while, your friends/family will see that you're doing well with your warm AND cold market and begin trusting you more by having you to review their entire plans (insurance and investments).   Sometimes it's okay to be new at this industry as long as people like and trust you enough. I work as an insurance rep for a mutual company because I knew I wasn't going to rollover the $1million assets due to my youth and lack of experience in the industry. However, I built and established trust over time and presented myself in a manner where they would feel comfortable investing with me.    By the way, it is MUCH easier getting a referral for an insurance case versus a wirehouse case. For example, "who do you know that just got married?"..."who do you know that just had a baby?" versus "who do you know has over $100k in assets saved up?"
Sep 27, 2009 10:44 pm
3rdyrp2:

[quote=anonymous]It’s almost impossible to succeed in the beginning using referrals if one makes their money by being an asset gatherer.  Yet, getting referrals almost guarantees success if one is working with an insurance company.

  I'm sure this is correct in your personal situation, but I have a tough time imagining that someone would definitely get more referrals by selling insurance than investments.  Stuff like life insurance and disability insurance is more personal to most people, and I wouldn't think people are more likely to bring that up in conversation w/their friends than they would their 401(k) and other investments.  Everyone knows someone that is unhappy w/their current investments, but how many people have a friend who has complained that they don't have enough disability coverage?  I'm probably off base, but this is just how I would see reality playing out.[/quote]   Good point, people definitely like talking about returns on investments a lot more than how their insurance product is so awesome. However, that doesn't necessarily mean that it is harder to get referrals from the insurance side versus the wirehouse side. The insurance prospects would be limitless while only so much of the population have over $100k in investable assets. I have bumped into many households that gross over $200k without even $100k in their retirement accounts. Try thinking about how many referrals can be generated in the insurance world...   To get referrals for life insurance, one has to ask "Who do you know that just had a baby?" "Who do you know that just got married?" "Who do you know has young children?"   For disability, it can be "Who do you know that is a young CPA?" "Who do you know that is a young attorney?" "Who do you know that just graduated medical school?" "Who do you know is a key player in their business/company/job?"
Sep 28, 2009 12:07 am
anonymous:

NYL is a good company, but, like all the insurance companies, your success is much more dependent upon the local agency than the company.

  I second that.  I interviewed with NYL before accepting an offer from another "mutual company" but basically it all boils down to the quote above. 
Sep 28, 2009 12:47 am
"That would be considered a referral?  I'm not trying to seem critical, its just everything I've learned about gathering referrals and considering something a referral has never included mentioning to someone who I was already planning on meeting or talking to that I spoke with one of their colleagues."   Yes.  It would be considered a referral.  Let's keep a few things in mind.  1) Some referrals are stronger than others. 2) We're talking about getting a referral from somebody who barely knows you and has no idea if you are referrable. 3) I would love for all of my referrals to be the type like I just closed: "Anonymous, can you please call my mom.  She just got laid off from her job and has no idea what to do with her 401(k)."  This doesn't happen with a cold call who is not a client and barely gives me 5 minutes of time. 4) Because almost any professional is a decent prospect, I don't need the person doing the referring to have any clue as to whether the person has any interest in meeting with me or have any need for what I sell. 5)I'm only planning on meeting that person who I am asking about because I saw their name on the directory or saw their name on the office door, etc.   Let's look at two scenarios.  Scenario One: I have a quick meeting with Jim.  He tells me to call Bob.  He says that Bob just had a baby and is a good guy.  Scenario Two:  I have a quick meeting with Jim.  I ask him about Bob.  He says that Bob just had a baby and is a good guy.   When I call Bob, I am going to say that I spoke to Jim and Jim spoke very highly of him and mentioned that he just had a baby.  It simply doesn't matter if Jim mentioned Bob to me or I mentioned Bob to Jim.  Either way, I have the exact same chance of meeting with Bob.   The difference is that since Jim doesn't know me well the odds are very slim that he would have told me about Bob without me proactively bringing up his name.   Keep in mind that this stuff only works because I can make enough money on insurance to make pre-qualifying unnecessary.  I would never do this with a more investment focused practice.  The only people who I cold call are attorneys, cpas, and business owners.  The only name feeding referrals that I go after are also attorneys, cpas, and business owners.
Sep 28, 2009 12:50 am

The only prospects for life insurance are those people who care about what happens when they die.

  The only prospects for disability insurance are those people who work because they need income.   This makes for a slightly larger prospect pool than "people with $100,000 to invest today".
Sep 28, 2009 11:23 pm
Leverage:

[quote=anonymous]NYL is a good company, but, like all the insurance companies, your success is much more dependent upon the local agency than the company.

  I second that.  I interviewed with NYL before accepting an offer from another "mutual company" but basically it all boils down to the quote above.  [/quote]   Again, you will only have yourself to blame for failure and yourself to thank for success.
Oct 13, 2009 3:55 am

My wife and I have just begun to look into NY Life as a possible career, mainly for her. She's held several sales positions in the past, her last being in real estate so I'm sure she would be fine.

Couple of questions: 1.  I understand there's a six month training program. Where does this take place, how many hours per week, etc.? 2.  I'm an airline pilot with a pretty flexible schedule and wouldn't mind being qualified in this field along with her. Is this possible with NY Life, or do they want you to be completely devoted to them and do nothing esle? Thanks.
Oct 13, 2009 5:30 pm

The training depends on the specific branch, about twice a week for an hour or so, Regarding you joining as pilot in the first 3 years they do not allow you to have outside business activities, However you can still prospect for your wife and have your wife write the policy, good luck.

Jun 27, 2017 8:41 am

amitheonlywoman wrote:

Does anyone have any experience with the [url=https://www.starresults.com/sales-management-training-program/]sales training[/url] program at New York Life, specifically compensation structure, attrition rate, average production etc.



How successful are college grads with this program.

Hello,

Yes , expeirnced but in different category.