Skip navigation

New respect for new hires that survive!

or Register to post new content in the forum

38 RepliesJump to last post

 

Comments

  • Allowed HTML tags: <em> <strong> <blockquote> <br> <p>

Plain text

  • No HTML tags allowed.
  • Web page addresses and e-mail addresses turn into links automatically.
  • Lines and paragraphs break automatically.
Sep 24, 2008 5:53 pm

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]

Just so we're making this as clear as possible for you, this business is difficult to start anytime.  Now might actually be an easier time than an up market.  People are really pissed off at the markets right now, which translates to some of them being really pissed off at their current advisor.  Those feeling typically make them more open to talking to someone else.     [/quote]   Spiff,   It is much harder to earn new clients whom you've never met before in a market like this. That's not an opinion.   I am sick to death with statements like those which I have underlined. When are we going to stop feeding new folks this baloney? What makes you think clients will fault advisors for current market conditions? Likewise, what makes you think smart clients would wait for a market like this to second guess their advisor? How do you know clients are peeved at their advisors? Have you contacted each and everyone of your competitor's book and solicited your services to them? A smart client can second guess their advisor just as easily in a good market as they can with today's situation. Emotions and bad makets are not mutually exclusive.   Second, what we're going through right now is unique from any other recession we have been through though the panic remains the same. Having said that, the reality is people do not want to make changes to their investments period and if they do it's to liquidate not DCA into their current portfolio (which we know they should). They don't want to talk toa  stranger  nor hear from the current advisor how they should play contrarian.  I warm call 150 folks a day and service 10 of my existing clients a day and this has always proven to be the case.   The reality is, clients are staying put and do not want to talk to advisors in times like these, period. They want to liquidate, not hear some BS story from you about how they're advisor is responsible for the drop in the account value. Fascinating everyone on this site has the guts to talk to their clients but somehow they assume no one else does. Wtf. Seriously, wtf.   So, to the TC. Here's the best answer you'll get. Come into this business when you have a network of people who trust and will do business with you. This industry works better as a second career rather a first. When you have that set, it won't matter what the market is doing because clients are going to be emotional in good and bad times.
Sep 24, 2008 6:15 pm

"It is much harder to earn new clients whom you’ve never met before in a market like this. That’s not an opinion. "

  The thing about statements like that is if you believe it, it becomes reality.   My experience has been that markets like this make it easier.  That is an opinion.  Maybe it's just true for me because I believe it.    
Sep 24, 2008 6:50 pm

[quote=anabuhabkuss][/quote]

  Spiff,   It is much harder to earn new clients whom you've never met before in a market like this. That's not an opinion. - No it's not, and yes it is.  Show me the research that leads you to believe that it is an empircal fact and I'll retract my statement.      I am sick to death with statements like those which I have underlined. When are we going to stop feeding new folks this baloney? What makes you think clients will fault advisors for current market conditions? - Because it's human nature.  I didn't do anything personally to my client's accounts, but I'm still getting the phone calls asking what I'm going to do about it.  I promise you that if you were to call those people right after they hung up with me, they'd at least entertain the idea of meeting with you.  Likewise, what makes you think smart clients would wait for a market like this to second guess their advisor? - Client's generally aren't smart.  If they were, we wouldn't have the time to post here because we'd be spending all of our time meeting with them trying to figure out where to put some cash.   How do you know clients are peeved at their advisors? - Because I've been talking to people.   Have you contacted each and everyone of your competitor's book and solicited your services to them? -  No.  If you'll supply me with yours I'll start there.  I'll let you know with the ACATs how it goes.   A smart client can second guess their advisor just as easily in a good market as they can with today's situation. Emotions and bad makets are not mutually exclusive. - True, they are not.  People are generally clueless in every market.  But right now, people have been more willing to talk to me.  Maybe they figure I'm smarter than you (or whoever they are using as their advisor), maybe not.  But they'll listen, hoping to hear some majic answer to their portfolio's problems.    Second, what we're going through right now is unique from any other recession we have been through though the panic remains the same. - No it's not.  The catalyst is different, but the situation has repeated itself over and over again.   Having said that, the reality is people do not want to make changes to their investments period and if they do it's to liquidate not DCA into their current portfolio (which we know they should). They don't want to talk toa  stranger  nor hear from the current advisor how they should play contrarian.  I warm call 150 folks a day and service 10 of my existing clients a day and this has always proven to be the case.   The reality is, clients are staying put and do not want to talk to advisors in times like these, period. They want to liquidate, not hear some BS story from you about how they're advisor is responsible for the drop in the account value. Fascinating everyone on this site has the guts to talk to their clients but somehow they assume no one else does. Wtf. Seriously, wtf. - I don't tell people that their advisor is to blame for their portfolio problems.  Unless he is buying stupid things that are not appropriate for the client.  And I can only tell them that after a risk tolerance assessment.  My experience is that there are advisors at every firm that are very good at contacting their clients.  Others aren't.  It's those that aren't who are going to lose assets right now.  I spoke with the daughter of a client this morning who has about $100K at American funds with a guy from AG/WB.  She told me he never ever calls her.  Good times or bad.  Guess who's going to be getting that transfer?    So, to the TC. Here's the best answer you'll get. Come into this business when you have a network of people who trust and will do business with you. This industry works better as a second career rather a first. When you have that set, it won't matter what the market is doing because clients are going to be emotional in good and bad times. - Finally we agree on something.  [/quote]   I'm going to stand by what I posted before.  You can disagree with me, that's cool.  You have a right to be wrong just like I do. 
Sep 24, 2008 7:22 pm

I've been at this for about a month, half-time (I work for my previous employer to make some cash during the transition, while I'm making a ton of mistakes at it out of the gates), and here's what I'm finding and questioning with my VERY limited experience. 

1.) Holy crap it's a tough gig.  The rejection is a killer.  Sometimes it motivates me because I get mad, sometimes it completely takes the wind out of my sales.  I have to read The Common Denominator piece a lot more.   2.)  I find it hard going door-to-door in that you have to go to a lot of houses like a paper boy, but get on the doorstep and be a pro.  Is it me or am I the only one that finds switching rolls hard, maintaining your businessman attitude, while doing something that paper boys and girl scouts do to sell subscriptions and cookies?   3.)  When I got my first and only client so far, it was a great feeling to set-up the account.  The next day I was all pumped-up feeling huge, and the rejection brought me back down to being a paper boy again.  ;D   Are there stages to getting clients?  Initially I felt great that I got out there in front of people and handled some of the rejection.  But now I look back and think, a lot of that is worthless if I don't get appointments.  When I get to the stage where I'm getting better at getting appointments, I feel like I'll look back and think.  That was nothing until I'm closing.    Do you take it one step at a time, not consciously but subconsciously?  Should I be going further with my first contacts, like trying to set-up a meeting?  Right now I'm going for the meeting on my second contact.   Lastly, I always feel like I'm intruding, which isn't helping my pitch any.    Any input would be appreciated!   Thanks,   Boone
Sep 24, 2008 7:33 pm

Boone, in some ways I find door knocking to be the easiest part of the job. My approach is to be low key, just introduce myself and ask maybe one open ended question. My mind set is that I’m there to qualify them. So while some of them reject me, in my mind I’m there to pass or fail them as good prospects.

Some prospects really respond to the doorknocking approach. Focus on those. The rejection gets tougher. You probably haven't even gotten to the part where the appointments don't show up or the husband calls to say that his wife says he can't open an account or the 100k rollover that goes to another firm. You'll get your share of people who say yes, though.        
Sep 24, 2008 7:42 pm

buyandhold,

Thanks for the feedback.  I appreciate it.  Yeah, the appointments aren't happening yet.  Well, I'm not making them happen yet I should say.    Are you building your book through all residential walking? I'm doing a combo of residential and business walking so far.  How long have you been at it?
Sep 24, 2008 11:16 pm

As you move along, the rejection becomes less frequent, but more severe. Instead of losing out on that 28 year-old $100/mo. DCA client, because he need the money to make a credit card payment instead, you are losing a major estate-planning life insurance case due to underwriting issues, or a “change of heart”.



But it takes a long time to get traction in this business. If you can’t stand the pressure for at LEAST 3 years, you should not bother (and more realistically 5).

Sep 25, 2008 12:50 am

Spiff,

Yes, investors, in general, probably aren’t smart but that doesn’t mean we have to take advantage of them for a quick buck to pay desperate bills. I do not have BS empirical facts to back this up but I still put my foot to the ground and filter who I bring on as clients by making sure expectations are laid out before hand so I don’t have to deal with people that will force me one day to type stuff like

People are really pissed off at the markets right now, which
translates to some of them being really pissed off at their current
advisor.

If you seriously have clients that think their advisor is at fault for shady loan practices that has put our markets in one of the worst volatile states since the Great Depression, you have another problem altogether. My clients know that I can not control what the market does. If you’re having success gathering these types of clientele, you have zero assurance they won’t crap all over you for the same reason down the line. It’s like the person that thinks that breaking up with their partner and going to a new relationship will make things fresh, exciting and better when, in fact, that person repeats the same pattern.

However, the fact that you earned a $100k client because they weren’t getting attention is very well deserved. Great job and kudos to you.

Personally, I spend my time not speaking to people who fault others for their mishaps and jump in glee when they become your clients.  I have told prospects they’re getting great services from their current relationship because I’m not desperate to bring onboard someone who is dull enough to think they’re advisor is doing a poor job when in reality their portfolio hasn’t even lost half of what the market has. I will solicit their business if there’s a gap I can fill in (insurance, 529, whatever)

Sep 25, 2008 1:07 am

What is the realistic average for the first three years at EDJ?

Sep 25, 2008 1:09 am

The realistic average for the first three years is to survive and build a network so you can start making a living in years four and five and then make real money after that, imo.

Sep 25, 2008 2:57 am
Boone:

…sometimes it completely takes the wind out of my sales.

  ...I'm sure you didn't mean it that way, but
Sep 25, 2008 8:56 pm
Indyone:

[quote=Boone]…sometimes it completely takes the wind out of my sales.

  ...I'm sure you didn't mean it that way, but [/quote]   I didn't.  Funny catch!!!!!
Sep 25, 2008 10:25 pm

ana - how new are you?  Of course your clients think it’s your fault that they’re losing money.  Just like they think they made brilliant moves when they make money.  It’s a stupid way to look at it, but that’s the way they do.  They know that you didn’t have anything to do with the mortgage crisis, or that he market has gone down, but they absolutely blame you for not moving all their money to cash twelve months ago, or telling them to sell those LEH bonds or Pfds before it tanked.  That’s why they hired you.  You’re a much better advisor than me if you have trained your clients so that they don’t think that way.  

  Times like this simply put the service issue in better focus for clients.  In an up market clients don't really pay that much attention to how much contact they get from their advisor.  But when your clients get their September statement, you can bet that one thought that will run through their mind is what the heck is going on and why hasn't you called them about it.  If I just happen to ring their doorbell or call them right then,  you can bet I'm gonna ask them when they spoke with you last.  So, in their mind they'll be thinking about how much money they've lost, they'll associate you with that loss, and for just a split second consider meeting with me.  They might not do it today, but I've put that knife point into your relationship.  Everytime I call back I can push it in a little deeper.    So, stop reading this and go call your clients before I do. 
Sep 25, 2008 10:34 pm

When I interviewed at Jones, the FA told me to take the amount of years (2-3) that Jones claims you have to work hard to build a sustainable business…and then double it (3-5).

Sep 26, 2008 12:13 am
spaceman spiff:

It’s a stupid way to look at it, but that’s the way they do. 

  Correction, it's what your clients do! Because you choose them and do not educate them on the error of their ways despite your fiduicary responsibility. You haven't told me anything I am not aware of in your last post. Reread mine as you obviously missed my point. You recruit these clients because their mad that they weren't "cashed" out when they probably shouldn't be to begin with. That's messed up to the nth degree.    I have to ask, do you tell them: "Mr client, choose me and I'll cash you out when necessary?" I means eriously, I do not understand how you justified a prospect to become your client because their current advisor doesn't cash them out. Do you conform to the pressure of their emotions and do anything they ask when you yourself are the professional, the know-it-all? This is a different issue altogether than have an advisor who never calls period. That's justified.   [quote=spaceman spiff]So, in their mind they'll be thinking about how much money they've lost, they'll associate you with that loss, and for just a split second consider meeting with me.[/quote]   Again, speak for your own clients. If I have clients who crap themselves because I did not take the initiative of cashing them out when their portfolio is only down 4% thanks to intellgent use of managed futures, energy and gold positions mixed in with whatever else is suitable based on their risk tolerance and needs, you can have 'em! The joke's on them when they find out your american funds lose them more. Once again, you're hiring whiners. Whiners stop whining when they become educated, not when they switch brokers. What makes you think if they switch to you, their values won;t drop. Please do not tell me you sell your services on performance!   I had a guy once, when I first began, I laid out a portfolio for him based ona  recommendation of my mentor. After one down market day, his portfolio is down less than 0.5%. I'm not lying to you. This guy was not an experienced investor but we were working on $130,000 account for him. So he complains "I'm losing money, can you liquidate everything because I have got a guy telling me he can do better!". I blantantly told him that when he gets the urge to call me back to not even bother. This was May '07. He called back 2 months ago. Account value $82,000. Crying. Asking me for help. I told him I wasn't accepting new clients at the moment and kindly refused his business.   That's the kind of client you're bragging about bringing over Spiff.   The saying goes that you attract the type of client that best describes you. I have a right to filter my clients. By taking advantage of clients who make irresponsible emotional decisions you risk them dropping you just as quick as the last guy.   And you ask me about my tenure? How f'n cute.
Sep 26, 2008 1:24 am

Ana, I think that you are missing the key to what Spiff is saying, "Times like this simply put the service issue in better focus for clients."

A client who is making 20% won't be in a hurry to leave if they aren't getting good service.  A client who is losing 5% will have no problem leaving if they aren't getting good service.  Paying money to lose money and get no service is not a good combination.

Sep 26, 2008 11:51 am

Maybe so and perhaps I have a reading comprehension problem, but I did not get that from his post at all. I’m reading him getting clients because a previous advisor didn’t cash out in time. That’s not good service. All I read is having dumb clients and how that’s “just the way it is”.

If it were about service, I would have read “A call to status the account and go into what the markets are doing and how that affects their short term/long term goals for their portfolio.” not “I associate you with the loss of my account” and “why didn’t you cash me out?”

Sep 26, 2008 1:25 pm

It's the combination of the two things.  Good results and little proactive client contact is fine.  Bad results and lots of proactive client contact is fine.  Bad results and little proactive client contact is a recipe to take clients from their existing advisor.