Wachovia vs. Merrill
Hey folks,
I am currently at Wachovia and am being agressively recruited by Merrill Lynch. Anybody have any insight as to the pros and cons of one vs the other...? ThanksIMO Merrill is the very best brand and culture in existence.
After 25 yrs at regional, indy, ria, and extensive interviews and research I joined Merrill. Although there are negative aspects at any co., the strenghs simply overwelm them. Only those who either cant cut it or dont want to step up to the plate with the best of the best will find a way to disagree. When all the dust settles there will be certain folks still standing, and that will be Merrill. Do yourself a favor.SOUTH makes a good point there, Ferris. Sure, Wachovia is a fine firm, but I think his point is that ML is an INSTANTLY recognizable brand with the people we want to be doing business with. The firm's brand recognition is higher than that of Pepsi.
I happen to work for ML myself, so I hate to sound biased; I will say this, I really don't have to say much more to people when they ask what I do, other than, "I work at Merrill Lynch." They almost always respond with one of the following: - "... in retail?!" - "Oh! You're an advisor?" - "They're a great firm - we have OUR money with Merrill Lynch!"[quote=Wildcat_02]
- “They’re a great firm - we have OUR money with Merrill Lynch!”[/quote]A great argument on why not to go there…think of how many prospects you will run accross that already have their accts there…
Ferris the ML brokers who went to Wach soon to not be producin so much
At Merrill as soon as I show a prospect (that I want) our service they cant wait to be catered to by the best....there is no way anyone other than a few boutiques can show HNW clients the range of 1st class services at ML and Im not sure they can do more than what they specialize in."I work for Merrill Lynch" Oh you work for those crooks. What a bunch of snake oil salesmen.
I wouldn't be caught dead working for Merrill Lynch. More people think bad of them then good.[quote=south1451]
Ferris the ML brokers who went to Wach soon to not be producin so much
At Merrill as soon as I show a prospect (that I want) our service they cant wait to be catered to by the best....there is no way anyone other than a few boutiques can show HNW clients the range of 1st class services at ML and Im not sure they can do more than what they specialize in.[/quote]Boy, did YOU ever drink the kool aid, south! You just keep telling yourself that. I'm sure the entire world will be bustin' down your doors any second now ... "can't wait to be catered to!"
Dream on.
I started at Merrill and jointed AGE a few years ago. Now Merrill is been trying to get me to come back. Never going to happen.
Merrill guys in my building can’t walk to the coffee cart without putting on their jackets. We have been CA casual for years…absolutely laugh at those clowns walking around in 85 degree weather with their suit on in the summer time. Could not pay me enough to work for that shop.
Wis…
I am in your exact position. I current work at WS, legacy AGE, and ML is hitting me hard with money, deferred comp, etc. I have looked very hard at them, WS, and going Indy. In all honesty I have not made a decision yet, but in here are a few takes from ad nasuem research on them. Merrill as has been stated about is INSTANT recognition. Some of that will be good and some bad. I have taken the pulse of some folks who are very learned about investing and when I say Merrill about half say "great firm" and about half say "wouldnt trust them." No one ever says "Merrill who?" Being in the southeast Wachovia is very good recognition but in no way is it the brand of a Merrill (again either good or bad). Another take is that IMHO, Merrill does not want clients under say $1,000,000 of investible assets. Again, I'm betting those Merrill guys on the board will probably disagree or whatever but it has been emphasized to me by some of the ML guys I have talked to that in this business size does matter. My book has a few good $1MM clients, but no where on the level they want and they want to help me utilize their brand to bring more of those guys on, which I think can be done. Coming from AGE I would have to probably leave a good deal of my clients behind because there are quite a few less than $100,000 (they definately dont want any of those). Merrill's research is top notch. I have had access to their research during this recruitment process and must say that even though WS has C/Suisse, Bern, and others it in no way compares to Merrill's. If I ever went Indy I would give up some of my % just to get my hands on Merrill's stuff ,its that good (yea i know thats a dream LOL). The cash payout at Merrill is less than what you are used to at AGE or WS. But their deferred comp. which some vests in 5 years and some in 8 does actually increase your payout from AGE or WS if you are doing production of about $300k or greater. Their grid is pretty tough to get a handle on, but their is one posted on another site. GOOGLE ML payout grid. One other thing, if you are doing $500k or less they are really going to be on you to produce, as they should by giving you a good check upfront. Again, IMHO, ML does not consider you a player until you are at least doing something like $800k or more. Finally, ML is big, really, really, really big on teams. They really like you to get in and get your production rolling and then try to team up with someone. It was said to me on more than one occasion that they would like me to hook up with another broker at a later date, after I prove myself. There are a lot of individual brokers, just appears to me they love doing the team thing. Do a lot of research on Merrill and you will find both pros and cons. The upfront money is incredible, but there are no free lunches.why do people take offense to those who want to look professional? i am not saying NOT wearing a suit is bad. why do those who choose not to get so irritated at those of us who prefer the more formal look. never had a client i really wanted comment that he/she thought my suit was a deal breaker. just don’t see why it is such a bad thing.
I think a lot of the Indy guys, which I am strongly considering, frown upon the suit thingy. I think it does make you look more professional, but hey its an individual thing and thats one of the benefits of indy, run your shop the way you want it. Hell if a guy can wear cutoffs and make money doing this job more power to him LOL.
2 of ML’s finest invaded our small town in the late 90’s. They advised 100+ employees of a local biz to take early retirement, promising 15+% returns by investing in high tech and aggressive growth. Then they churned them from A share mf’s to b shares,then took big cdsc charges from b’s to a bonus VA. One of the ML fa’s had clients make checks payable to him to be invested in a “special cd account.” Most ee’s lost 50-75% of their retirement. Many that quit their jobs are either working at lower paying jobs or unemployed. Arbitration and a good legal team helped many. It was a sobering experience for me to have some of these employees actually weep on my desk. They probably don’t share the lofty impression of ML that many in our industry do. btw, ML fired the creative fa with the “special cd account” but the other ML fa is still a star at ML.
You’re right it could have. Even EDJ reportedly had a GP steal 14mil over the last 20 years. But I doubt that any of those firms would have kept him on like ML did. This guy belongs in a bucket shop, not selling for a great company. Also, the point that I probably didn’t make very well is that if ML is our leader as mentioned before…the compliance and OSJ systems certainly aren’t cutting edge or industry leading.
What do you think of my tagline, Joe?
Regarding prospects with account at ML:
That seems true on the surface, but ML demographic intelligence in my area (large suburban/metro) shows less than 20% market share in HH over $250K in many zip codes. They list zip codes we should focus on. Does you firm provides you with that research?
EZ Money:
Doubt you could even if you wanted to.
“More people think bad of them then good.” = Based on what? Your opinion?
Hyundai vs. Lexus?
A couple of my own thoughts:
1. It really depends on what your business style is. If you are primarily going after corporate execs and HNW business owners with complex situation, then ML is probably a very good bet. If you specialize in $500K 401K rollovers and retirees, then pretty much any firm will be fine. Those people neither need all the "specialized" services of a ML, nor do they really care. They really just need someone that will help them, give them attention, and someone they can trust. 2. As far as the thiefs you came across at one branch....we all know that this has happened at pretty much every firm at one time or another. And whether they get caught or not, every firm hires a few scheisters here and there that move from slimy to criminal once they taste wealth. 3. If you are younger, and have many years ahead of you in this business, it often makes sense to nurture some less-wealthy/younger clients that have potential down the road. I actually have several 50-something clients that have 7 figure 401K balances, but only a few hundred grand (or less) with me, since ALL their money is tied into their 401K. Some of them also have high 6 figure defined benefit balances that they can take lumps sums from once they retire. I certainly wouldn't want to turn those people away simply because they don't have much right now. I will stick with someone for 10 years to get a $2mm rollover when they retire. Also, think of the referral potential they may represent. 4. Business dress: I find that most of the indy guys in my area are business casual. I notice two things about them; they are either wirehouse castoffs that couldn't produce so they went indy (and still aren't producing much), or they are very well established with good reputations, so people aren't concerned with business casual dress. There are two "ensemble" firms in my area that are VERY large (as in $700mm+ books), and they are ALL in suits. So I think it comes down to style, time in position, client base, etc. Personally, I always wear suits. I feel awkward if a client is more formally dressed than me. I also look on the younger side, so I need every "edge" I can get. 5. It is true that many people have negative opinions of ML (not sure exactly why). In my specific area, that opinion is shared VERY strongly by the prominent CPA's in town. Not good. But I think at one time our ML office had a few guys that used a lot of alternative and aggressive investments with very middle of the road clients, and they ended up losing a lot. But then, more recently, a couple of guys came over to ML from UBS that are very good, ethical, above-board guys. And the CPA's respect them, so voila! Now the ML office has their reputation back. My opinion - it all comes down to individual experiences with specific branches and specific reps.I work at EDJ, and they provide HH and investible assets by zip code, along with our market share. I am certain all firms have that data (they probably all buy it from the same place), it's just a matter of whether they share it with reps.Regarding prospects with account at ML:
That seems true on the surface, but ML demographic intelligence in my area (large suburban/metro) shows less than 20% market share in HH over $250K in many zip codes. They list zip codes we should focus on. Does you firm provides you with that research?
Does anyone think it is better to lose the suit coat and tie when you are doing cold walking? Perhaps just wear your pants and a nice shirt? It seems like the only people who regularly wear suits in my area are people in sales. Perhaps then you can sneak attack the gate keeper before she has time to put up her defenses.
i wore a suit when i doorknocked. i knew several who did not. it is all individual. your dress will not matter in the end anyway.
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