H&r block

The only negative thing I can offer is that in our area, at least, H&R Block does not work with what I would consider high-end prospects.  Typically, higher-income/more complex clients go to local CPAs and shun H&R Block for tax prep, as our H&R Block offices do not have a good reputation for quality tax advice (no CPAs there).  My guess is that most of your leads would be $4,000 IRA deposits, at best.

Good Point Indy Thanks for your feedback. I am licensed and have about 5 years of industry experience. Looking to start somewhere. I talked to EDJ and I have gotten to the point where they have asked me to start the door knocking and look for a market area but I can’t overcome the A OR b shares that they push, or any of their 

Well, beyond what I just told you, I know pretty much nothing about the HRB platform or operating structure.  I know a bit more about Jones after taking a look at them a few years back.  I too, didn't see anything appealing about a Jones office...just wasn't a good fit for how I do business at all.  Good to see that Block has a fee-based platform and gives you some freedom in recommending product.

Whether I'm a "pro" is debatable, at least in some minds, but the best advice I can give you is to resist signing any restrictive non-compete contract.  A non-solicit is bad enough, but a non-compete is almost a death sentence in my view.  Assuming you don't have to sign a non-compete, if things end up not being what you imagined, at least you have the opportunity to move on to other (greener?) pastures.

If you're lucky, someone with some H&R Block experience will spy this post and clue you in on the finer points of their business model...good luck...

Do yourself a favor and stay away form HRB. Demographically it will be a loser for you.

Do yourself a favor and stay away form HRB. Demographically it will be a loser for you.

EZ,

Not to call you out, this is not my intent(seriously). Can you tell me a little how you have come to this conclusion? Have you interviewed with them? What value can you add that would  able me formulate an opinion?

Thanks,

Danny

most on here are like ez. ill-informed about HRBFA. he thinks HRB only does business with the eic crowd or people who need their tax refund.  that enough shows how little he knows. what he doesn’t know and most advisors don’t know is what you have already heard from HRBFA. my advice to you is a. not come here for advice. this place is a mostly a bunch of clowns b. trust your instinct.   Good luck with your decision!!

HRB took over Olde, a somewhat discount broker, a few years ago.  Now they've been doing some heavy duty recruiting and apparently had some success bringing over some bigger producers.

That being said, I sorta doubt they're going to really help you get to the prospects you want.  I think it'll be like the low-end part of the bank crowd.

"most on here are like ez. ill-informed about HRBFA. he thinks HRB only does business with the eic crowd or people who need their tax refund.  that enough shows how little he knows. what he doesn't know and most advisors don't know is what you have already heard from HRBFA. my advice to you is a. not come here for advice. this place is a mostly a bunch of clowns b. trust your instinct.   Good luck with your decision!"

What an intelligent response. Care to enlighten the clowns on why H&R is so wonderful????

I was w/EJ for 3+ years and talked to HRB about 2 years in.  My sense was that you could certainly build a decent income, albeit likely with more of a higher volume business than elsewhere (somewhat true at EJ also).  My feeling is that clients generated on my own were more valuable than those leads handed to me...that system certainly has potential, but I wasn't enough of a risk-taker to be towards the leading edge of exploiting the opportunity.  However, if you're willing to give up some long-term upside, one could argue it's as good a place as any to start out.

I can tell that you EJ would give you good prospecting training, which I don't hear much of anywhere else....I moved to a wirehouse w/a nice transition package, so it worked out well for me (HRB also had/has an incentive of sorts to move).  The beauty of being able to prospect is that if all my clients left me tomorrow, I could get more--that's a nice, secure feeling (although I don't plan to lose all my clients!).  Although I agree you should listen to your instincts, I also think you're wise to try and do some homework before you sign on somewhere.

The main challenge when you're new--wherever you are--is to get enough people to trust you w/their hard earned (or luckily inherited, etc) money so you can survive long enough to be viable...it's a tough road.  Can be done, but requires intestinal fortitude, patience, ideally a second household income (even if modest) for a few years, etc etc.  I believe anyone that tells you otherwise is playing the victim (those that don't make it) or IS a victim of tunnel vision (ex: "I made it at ML, so this MUST be the ONLY place to be!").  Substitue any firm for ML and you get the picture.

There's my ten cents...keep the change!

HRB aint a big player at the moment (and may never be), but I contend that doesn’t mean much for a newbie…plenty of lazy ex “big name” firm brokers out there who prove it’s easy to fail no matter how good the name is.  I think the commoditization of products makes that less of an issue though.  And if you know what you’re doing, you can build relationships despite a “lower end” name…yeah, all your $5mil prospects might prefer ML or SB to HRB or a bank branch, but oh well if that’s the problem you’re facing.  When you actually HAVE some clients, it’s a helluva lot easier to explain to them why ML has begged you to come on board (and leave HRB) than it is to develop the relationship in the first place.  To borrow an old phrase, “the first $10m AUM is the hardest”…and by a couple orders of magnitude.

I made a move to HRBFA this past year and can’t be happier.

Here, I feel like a member of the growing team and not some

wirehouse schlep. I’ve been growing my business through

referrals from my tax partners. When I call their clients, they

know why I am calling. Yes, you will find a bunch of smaller

accounts but there are big ones too! So far this year, I’ve done

two 500k+ rollovers, 2 100k annuities, several life insurance

policies and I’m in the mix on a huuuggggee 1031 real estate

exchange.

In a whole year all you have to brag about is 2 500K rollovers and 2 100K VA??? Wow you must be knocking the cover off the ball… I sure am glad I don’t compete with you.

I also advise you to take what these people say here with a grain of salt. So far there has not been one solid reason given to you as to why HRBFA is a solid place to be. For one, they have a great range of products to offer, non preferred, and highly competitive with the likes of wachovia and morgan stanley.

Second, you get paid on every dollar of your business. None of this " you won't see a dime if the account is lower than 30k". I see people make A LOT of money and HRBFA and in the two eyars I've known them, I've only seen the top producers in wachovia leave to go there as well as MS.

Back office is awesome. Have a problem, there's a direct line there for you. Need to talk to someone on the higher chain of command to share your thoughts ideas etc? Done. You are not another number.

What truly boggles my brain is this generalization that people with money do not have money. Suggestion: read "the millionaire next door" Not everyone in this country flashes their money around and is looking for instant gratification of spending their money when they do not have to. HRBFA FA's have access to w2 forms to know how much money a prospect has. It is important for you to have the manager interviewing you to show you some examples of some of the leads they've worked in their area.

Look, in the end, I can guarantee you there are million dollar teams at HRBFA. I know a lot of them. Call these folks and ask them what it is they're doing. Truly, no matter where you go, it's ultimately up to you how successful your business is. IT is the people that make the company, not vice versa. In my opinion, I don't remember seeing an abundance of negative press the likes of which ML recieve nor have I heard of HRBFA cutting their payouts to their workers (see smith barney).

Any other questions?

sorry, meant to say: What truly boggles my brain is this generalization that people who ahve their taxes done at hrb offices do not have money.

[quote=anabuhabkuss]

 Suggestion: read "the millionaire next door" Not everyone in this country flashes their money around and is looking for instant gratification of spending their money when they do not have to. [/quote]

Actually the book you reference says that people who have money are usually willing to pay for good advice vs people who go to the cheapest place in town to have their taxes done. It goes into detail about how many educated high income households invest online or with a discount broker, and do their own taxes or pay a chop shop to do them cheaply.

  Second, a W-2 tells you how much money people make, not how much they have. Big difference there.  If anything, the Millionaire Next Door makes a stronger case for staying away from HRB than moving to it.

[quote=anabuhabkuss]

.

What truly boggles my brain is this generalization that people with money do not have money. Suggestion: read "the millionaire next door" Not everyone in this country flashes their money around and is looking for instant gratification of spending their money when they do not have to. HRBFA FA's have access to w2 forms to know how much money a prospect has. It is important for you to have the manager interviewing you to show you some examples of some of the leads they've worked in their area.

Any other questions?

[/quote]

Sorry I just had to continue.  I never considered going to my CPA to be flashing my money around.  I just consider it a small price to pay to keep as much of my money as I can.

Millionaire, also says that the largest percentage of millionaires are business owners.  How many business owners have HRB do their taxes?

[quote=anabuhabkuss]sorry, meant to say: What truly boggles my brain is this generalization that people who ahve their taxes done at hrb offices do not have money. [/quote]

Having lived here all my life and being a CPA myself, and knowing pretty much all the successful ones in town, I can say without any hesitation that the local H&R block offices don't do much (if any) in the way of what I would consider high-end returns.  I have yet to com across an A client or prospect that has H&R block for a tax preparer.  It could certainly be different in your community, but that is one thing I would want to know more about before I made a move...

exdrone, no offense or anything, but stiop analyzing a small point of a bigger topic. The guy was asking about HRBFA, and while you might have brought some of the points made in that book in thto the open, it does not help with the topic on hand.

but to comment:

Your quote: "I never considered going to my CPA to be flashing my money around.  I just consider it a small price to pay to keep as much of my money as I can. "

that's fine. That's you. how does that stay on topic and help this poor guy out?

I know people with so much money that it boggles my mind when they start taking in coupons to eat at McDonald's. What's your point? Not everyone spends money the way You DO. That was mine. And granted, while that is a nice way to look at it, go and tell that to brokers at Morgan Stanley and Wachovia who get hit with penalty fees. Reputation can only go so far, and in this day in age, when people don't trust other people with their hard earned cash, i find it hard to believe (and prove) that ML can do a better job than a HRBFA can.

Here's an idea, how about stop chasing all these old cronies who are about to die (since every fa on the street is chasing them)with huge accounts and start working on their beneficiaries. We can scream "DIVERSIFICATION" to our customers all day until their faces turn blue, yet everyone is chasing these huge accounts. I believe reputation plays an integral role at some point. I also believe in a fine balance in volume and quantity. That's just me. and because of my standpoint, i would say that hrbfa is a decent place to be.

oh well, either way, best of luck to you all.

Generalization - H&R Block clients are small fries.  Reality -
to some extent this is true.  I know H&R Block tax preparers
who do some higher end stuff.  H&R Block DOES have some
knowledgeable employees.  Are they all?  HECK NO!  It
would be important to see what sort of operation H&R Block runs in
your area.  It may be they are the joke of tax prep, in some areas
they aren’t considered all that bad.  Do your own research. 
There is a major difference between franchises and company owned
locations.



My problem with H&R Block Financial is that they aren’t very
profitable as an organization.  Review the company itself and see
if you think they will continue in this area or sell it off.  I
read last year that they were considering closing it down.  This
may have been 100% rumor and false so don’t count on it.



I took an H&R Block tax course a few years ago and was asked twice
to interview for an open branch management position.  I took the
EA exam 10 months later and was asked by 2 H&R Block people to
interview for the opening as they were still desperate.  Rather
scary to me that they would be desperate to fill a position for almost
an entire year.



Whatever you chose and wherever you chose to hang up your shingle,
success is your responsibility and not that of your firms.  It’s
what you make of it and H&R Block may very well be the perfect fit
for you.

A lot of what you’re seeing here about HRBFA is correct.  You will spend a lot of time with low income earners that is 90% of the tax office referrals you will get.  I have a buddy who went there (2 actually) and they regret it, sure they have a higher payout but they lost 25% of their book going over, plus most people you talk to WILL think you prepare taxes, WILL have very small IRA's they are talked into at the tax offices and WILL need to get the money back within the year of investing it due to the economical climate they are in.  Best bet; ask around in person, I was advised strongly NOT to go there.  Bottom line, I was told a lot of up front (as per usual) when I talked to them but when I asked around, found out your nothing but a cash register once you get there.

Also, I bet those who are the HRBFA cheerleaders are some of the recruiters for the company.

Let's take the whole "tax leads" out of it.

What you still have is a firm that offers almost everything else on the street.  PMA, WMA, equities, mutual funds, etfs, fixed income, Insurance(on your own or with Capitas) and Annuities, 1031 exchanges if that's your thing, no proprietary stuff, solid in-house research department that you can actually talk to, managed futures, trust services, third party research, technical analysis tools(dorsey wright), tax research department, a program that's sole purpose is to take feedback and suggestions from the reps to help make the firm advisor friendly and easy to do business at, BETA is trading platform, higher payout, not a number, etc....  Their also showing signs of a turnaround from the last couple quarters.  Lot's of this is due to long overdue new leadership overHRBFA. 

To join HRBFA only for the tax leads would be a mistake for a rep. It's the partnering with tax pros that are formed, not the tax leads themselves, that offer a very nice "additional" channel for a rep to prospect and build centers of influence.  You will not spend 90% of the time with low income earners if you go out and partner and tell the tax pros what you're looking for. Also, the "general" tax leads have to meet a certain criteria to even go over to HRBFA. They don't just send over every HRB client.  Bullbear is talking about the Express IRA product that isn't even a part of HRBFA, it's a product on the tax side to help lower income folks start saving.  HRBFA is simply custodian, but no reps are assigned to them and reps don't have to spend any time with them.  I think Bullbears buddies just didn't get. Lost 25% of their book? I think that speaks more about your buddies.

Again, HRBFA is not saying you have to work HRB alone.  It's your business in the end. Build your own business/marketing plan and make it work.  However, the cross servicing with HRB is a very attractive channel for anyone looking to find additional ways to build their book.  Look at the add in November's Register Rep, those guys have a woman who deals with small businesses and it's helping grow their business.  There are tons of relationships like those being formed. The great thing is you have a tax expert who cares just as much about the client as you do.  Client wins by getting solid tax & financial advice.

Lastly, this discussion has only involved HRB Tax. The firm is still young, but let's not forget about the other cross servicing opportunities out there. HRB Small Business Tax (just bought Amex's unit) and RSM McGladery.  There may not be "formal" programs yet like with tax, but there is still lot's of opportunities to build relationships with those folks if you get out and do it.

Did I mention client retention through cross servicing yet???

Oh and perhaps Bullbear is a recruiter for another firm? Me? Not a recruiter, just a cheerleader.

I would agree in general but the name of the company tells everyone you
are with H&R Block.  If you are wanting to build a client base
of high net worth clients, the H&R Block affiliation is probably
going to be a problem for you.  They generally speaking do not
have the best reputation in the tax world and that reputation will be
placed upon your services by most people.  They have good tax
preparers but 90% have only been doing it 1-3 years and don’t have much
training so I’m not sure that’s the best public relations.  If you
are looking at the company, you would be a moron not to at least
consider the ramifications of being affiliated with the “cheap” tax
prep service in town.



On the other hand it doesn’t make them a poor choice.  H&R
Block is a huge company and a lot of people are already comfortable
using their services.  Some of their tax planners handle 400+ tax
clients each year so the pool of warm prospects is HUGE. 

Dan,

It looks like you are getting some constructive information.  If I were in your shoes based on what I was reading, I would investigate the local reputation of H&R Block...ask some business owners and/or successful locals that you know, what they thing of the local HRB operation.  Also, if you have an opportunity to meet with the tax people that might be providing you leads, that could also be very enlightening...asking them what a typical client looks like income-, portfolio-, and net-worth-wise and who these clients invest with now.

As you can probably see, as with any firm, there is goo and bad.  Just because the firm doesn't hav a stellar reputation in one community doesn't mean that it is bad all over.  Once you get som questions answered aout the quality of the office you would be potentially working in, I think you'll have your answer as to whether or not the opportunity is right for you...good luck!

I have been w/HRBFA for two years. The clientele I brought to Block was middle to upper middle class. (Avg assets 100k per household) The platform is great. All kinds of products and services. No micro-management. The ability to run your business how you like, fee-based, commission, or both. Since coming over, I have brought my avg assets to 200k/household. I realize this is not affluent wealth mgmt, but you can build a good business with this size of household. The clients aren't giving me more $ because of my relationship with H&R Block, it is because of MY relationship with the client. It doesn't matter if you work for Merrill or HRBFA (for the middle class), it matters if You have a good relationship with your clients.  The tax leads are OK but seem to be getting better. It is tough to build a biz from scratch anywhere but here might be better than a wirehouse.

fwiw, there is an article about HRBFA on the front page of this week’s Investment News.

Here's an update: Thank you all who have responded. I have read each and every one of them. Thank you all so much..even the idiots!

Update

I have been dealing with HRB for a few weeks, back and forth, emailing, phone tag..the whole nine. To make a long story short, they did not make me an offer because I currently do not have any trailing revenue. Here's my situation: I'm worked at SCH for about 6 years have 7,63,9 & 10. Good experience, I feel I know my stuff..looking to get back in the business on my OWN. Here are the oppoutunities that I have been working with:

HRB: Pro's:Great Client Platform: Free to make recs,fee or commision based. Cons: Low Client Assets, and of course they shot me down. Oh well, life goes on with out them for now. I love when people tell me "no", it makes "yes" sound so much sweeter. Thank you HRB.

EDJ: looking @ EDJ as my backup. There is one in my neighborhood and a second one is getting ready to open up in a week. Is it possible for me to saturate this market? I live in a small sleepy Florida town, Population 25-30k. Also, I do not like their platform. (Loaded proprietary products. How does this benefit the average investor?) I have been hearing rumors that they are going to a fee based platform. Is there any validity to this?

BAC- They like me and I think an offer is coming: Drawback: It's a bank job. Can the tellers really help me build a book there? How do you prospect working for a bank?  It's also 9-5..can someone say POOPY? 

What would you do? My plan go with EDJ, build a book gain some more experience and who knows from there.  

Other factors to consider and my thoughts:  most important: Married, 32, 2 kids-some savings: Think I should take the risk with EDJ while I'm young before I get stuck in 9-5 gear for the rest of my life!

Well, that's the landscape... all laid out for you to chew and tear at.

Enjoy, and of course Thanks in Advance(Even the idiots) for your responses.

Danny 

In case you havn’t been to the Edward Jones recriuiting site, here you go:



http://www.jonesopportunity.com/ir/en_US/index.html



Ask yourself, regardless of platforms, where am I going to get the best training? Platforms may not make or break your success or failure in the early stages of building a business, but training sure will. Good luck.



BPD

Danboy. I have been both places. Bank platform and EDJ and now independent.  You might want to reconsider making your decision JUST on a 9-5 hour schedule.  When I was at the bank, I was free to come and go as I wished since I was a salaried and not an hourly employee.  That meant that I was actually working many more hours than just 9-5 and the bank didn't have to pay me any overtime.  As long as you produced they were happy with you no matter how many hours you worked.  We didn't have to punch a time clock.  You might ask them about that option.

The tellers can be very valuable, but you need to work to get their trust and explain to them what you do and how you do it.  They want to be sure you aren't going to take their customers and churn them into oblivion. 

One thing to consider about Jones, besides the fact that you may end up in a saturated market (which can happen in any firm) or that you may have to move to a completely new town to start is the fact that you will use up most if not all of your savings in the first year or two.  Can your family handle this stress?

BL,



What would DanBoy be spending his money on at Jones that he wouldn’t be spending his money on at the bank?

Dan,

I don't see the drawback in the BAC platform...you'll have a broader product array and be spoon-fed leads.  My guess is that the benefits package will be stronger there also.  Frankly, that sounds like a lot easier road to success than knocking on strangers' doors...

I left a bank platform to independently affiliate with a group of CPAs.  That was a step up for me as the CPA referrals are fewer, but the quality is considerably better than average.  My last three referrals from my CPAs were $200K fee-based, $1.5 million fee-based and $1.1 million in a 401(K).

Danboy,

BAC is not 9-5. I know, I work for them. You can come and go as you like and you'll build your business faster than any place else. If they're offering upfront money, take it. It's a good deal. Not perfect by any means but a good gig, and outstanding benies.

Jones will teach you how to sell, sell, sell, and ask for the order,
but you will pay thru the nose on expenses and medical benefits (brace
yourself if you have not investigated that yet). Also BIG
pressure to produce immediately. I guarantee BAC will give you
outstanding benefits and you will get leads no question about it. If
you already have a 7, 9,10, etc, you shld know how to sell already - I
wld take the bank job for sure in your community of 25k in FL it wld be
easier to get to know everyone. You have a wife and kids, make your
life eaiser and go BAC - good products and research, and you won’t have
to pay huge expenses out of your own pocket like you WILL
at Eddy and Co. (and did I mention horrible medical, etc?). You will
build a book in about a 1/3 time you wld at EDJ. Tell your spouse about
the benefits and watch the look on his/her face. Go for it and Good
luck!

What would DanBoy be spending his money on at Jones that he wouldn't be spending his money on at the bank?

Things you don't have to pay for at the bank platform: Postage, advertising, pencils, paper, business cards, letterhead, envelopes, toilet paper , office cleaning costs, affiliation fees, dues to clubs like rotary etc., 100% of the cost of medical coverage. It may have changed since I was there, but the cost of seminars and customer appreciation was 100% reimbursed by a combination of Bank and wholesalers cost sharing. Continuing education costs were also covered.

Don't hold me to this since it has been many years since I was at a bank.  Perhaps someone who is there can confirm.

BL



Postage: So are you saying that at a bank you can mail as many marketing pieces as you want and the bank pays for it all? Printing and stamps? I doubt this is the case.

Advertising: I can’t remember the last time I saw a local bank rep’s ad. There is not a company I am aware of that does a better job marketing themselves on a local level than EJ. The opportunity to co-op advertise with other local EJ IRs is huge.

Pencils: 10 for $1.00 at Office Depot.

Business Cards: at EJ first set of 1,000 cards free. Next set $26 at Jones.

Letterhead: Available right of your color printer.

Envelopes: EJ supplies.

Toilet Paper: 10 rolls about $5.00 at Costco. The good stuff too.

Office Cleaning costs: $80 a month is what I pay a service to come in four times a month. Do it yourself for free.

Affiliation fees: Not sure what you mean here.

Rotary Dues: Mine is $100 iniation fee. $50 annual dues.

Medical Coverage: EJ subsidises medical care costs for new IRs. There is a POS plan or a high deductible plan with an HSA.

Seminars: For new IRs Jones covers 75%. Normally you can get a mutual fund wholesaler to pick up the rest.



Does the bank:

Have your name on the door? No.

Provide you with your own dedicated sales assistant? No.

Provide live CE video conferences to bring in CPA and attorneys for networking opportunities? No.

Allow you to keep your services fees? Maybe.

Allow you to work just in one branch? Maybe.

Is the payout 40% at the bank? Bank grids are usually the lowest in the industry.

Are the tellers and new account people becoming series 6 licensed at the bank so they can take business away from the investment reps? Yes.

Does the bank have appless annuity orders. Probably not.



BL, come on you have got to be kidding recommending someone to go to a bank platform.

Payday,

Technically, your payout is not 40%. Net Jones payout is close to what the bank payout is after you pay all the expenses. I know, I was with Jones. Benefits are better. 10% employer contribution to 401k and pension and very good other benies. Great flexabiliy throughout the day. Yes I have my name on the door. All those msc. expense add up, and you know it.

BL, come on you have got to be kidding recommending someone to go to a bank platform.

You really must brush up on your reading skills.  I never recommended that he/she go to a bank platform. I recommended that he not make a decision based on the idea that it would be a 9-5  punch the time clock position.

You are the one who asked about costs.  And yes, I did have my name on the door and a dedicated assistant, could invite CPAs and Attorneys to network. And no, the tellers were not licensed, too expensive and too much liability for oversight.  It has been many years, about 7, since I worked in a bank, so I am going from my own experience then, but I doubt much has changed.  Each bank platform is different. Some are owned by the bank and others are subcontracted (so to speak) to independent brokerages.  Even though the payout is low, no argument here, sometimes it is offset by a guaranteed base salary.  Naturally, if the rep doesn't produce, they won't be allowed to coast on that base salary for long.   As to the medical insurance;at Jones it is subsidized for only one year.  At the bank, at least, there was no discrimination between the investment platform and the teller platform.  As EZ says, all those "little" costs add up.

Each investment platform will appeal to different people.  You will take note that I am no longer at a bank or at Jones and am now Independent and very happy. I didn't like the limitations at the Bank, and while I thought I would be running my own office at Jones, I soon found out that that wasn't the case. 

You Jones guys really need to get off of your high horse with the idea that you are the be all- end all of investment platforms.  If it works for you fine. It didn't work for me.

I can't believe what I'm seeing.  H&R Block and banks touting their firms.  Unbelievable. Let's be honest....both are chop shops.

Let's pretend you work for H&R block or for a bank.  You go to a party and find out there are a ton of brokers there.  People start introducing themselves and they let you know they are from Merrill, Smith Barney, AG Edwards, Ed Jones, or UBS.  Your turn.....are you proud to say where you work?  Probably not....that's the best litmus test there can possibly be.

I have seen two brokers leave for HRBF in the last two years.  Both had production that a monkey could match.  One of the brokers was morbidly obese and I swear he sweated grease.  He looked like a sleaze.  I even met a regional manager on a plane from HRB.  I almost fell out of my seat and laughed when he told me where he was from.  It's like the recruiting phone call I got from Allstate the other day.

HRB and bank brokers, keep looking in the mirror each morning and tell yourself you are the cream of the crop.  Maybe someday you might just believe it.

PS. We call H&R Block by its other name H&R _ock.

Youcanhatemenow,

Cream of what crop.  Are you more knowledgable?  Do you make more money?  Have a nicer office?  Does your firms reputation give you a woody?

I work for a financial institution and my smile goes ear to ear. I am making myself the cream of the crop, not relying on some firms reputation to try and do it for me.  Merril, SB, UBS all would take me in a heartbeat just based on my credentials (which don't mean jack, but I am educated and they like smart people).

Before you sound off, rookie... What makes anyone the cream of the crop.  Designations? AUM?  Production? You scream inexperience, now get back on the phone, before I ACAT what you've managed to scrape up.

Actually the bank I work for wld be an easy sell at a party. And even
if you were associated with a community bank, you can still name your
B/D (like LPL or RJFS), you’d fit right in at a party. Frankly this
sounds like something a misinformed rookie wld say.



No fool wld license a teller by the way, licensed bankers are a
different story. But this benefits the broker at most places. Also in
most instances, you do not pay for expenses (unless you are doing
something unusual - like huge mailings - then you wld prob chip in).



As with any b/d, bank or not, the success is because of the rep, not
the name. You cld make it at HRB if you stuck with it and worked hard
as well as anywhere else.

[quote=Joe the Broker]Actually the bank I work for wld be an easy sell at a party. And even if you were associated with a community bank, you can still name your B/D (like LPL or RJFS), you'd fit right in at a party. Frankly this sounds like something a misinformed rookie wld say.

No fool wld license a teller by the way, licensed bankers are a different story. But this benefits the broker at most places. Also in most instances, you do not pay for expenses (unless you are doing something unusual - like huge mailings - then you wld prob chip in).

As with any b/d, bank or not, the success is because of the rep, not the name. You cld make it at HRB if you stuck with it and worked hard as well as anywhere else.


[/quote]

What's up with this guy's name anyway? Tryin' to pimp my rep?

Who would want to do that???

I've been in my bank program and I'm completing my first full year of production.

I would say a bank is a very good place to start and possibly finish someday.

You have a built in audience, low/no overhead, and a chance to cultivate a good referral source in your bank partners.

Everyone's situation is different of course so I would say just find your niche, be nice to your biz partners and clients, and enjoy what you do everyday and success has a very good chance to follow!

scrim

Bankrep,

     You're nothing more than a poster child for what's wrong with this industry.  Let me fill you in on something.  H&R Block and Banks get their clients primarily from people walking in and handing the business to you.  That's why when you leave or the clients get reassigned to a new broker, their affinity to you as their broker is almost non-existent.  Who do you think will care for the client more....someone that gets a clients business or someone that earns it?

    When you go into a room of advisors and you have a grin ear to ear from working at a bank, the real advisors will think you are an absolute joke.  How on earth can you be proud of working for a third tier firm?  If the real brokers don't laugh in your face, the'll be making references about you and the similarities to Primerica behind your back.

    When we think of quality, do we think about all those that failed as real advisors and ended up at a bank, credit union, or discount broker, or do we think of someone that had to earn their way in the business, develop great relationships, and actually prospect for a living.

    Keep looking in the mirror and telling yourself what you want to hear.

Youcan,

you're so great. Actually you're an ass for sharing your absolutly idiot remarks.

You can,

You're a complete moron.  If I wanted to spend my time prospecting I would go get a job at Smith Barney or Merrill or worse yet EDJ.  I prefer to spend my time helping people fufill their goals (Not that I don't have repsect for some advisors at those firms because I might). 

I can't count the number of people who tell me thier former advisors harass them for referrals, I say Mr. X If I do a good job for you tell your friends if you'd like if you prefer to keep me a secret I'm ok with that too then I stop and they appreciate that.

I have never failed at anything in my life.  Nowhere is turnover higher than in bank programs even the failed brokers can't make it here.  My third tier firm works just fine for me. Go watch boiler room and beat off you loser.

YOU CAN Said:

"Bankrep,

     You're nothing more than a poster child for what's wrong with this industry.  Let me fill you in on something."

Please go into to detail.  I have taken the time to educate myself I have a masters, the CFP certification and a handful of other designations.  I create a financial plan with every client, please tell me how I am a poster child for what's wrong.

As far as caring more for a client one who earns the business or gets handed it.  The answer could be either.  I by nature am an ethical person, I try to do whats best because I believe what goes around comes around and that if you do a good job for people you'll be rewarded.  I have seen the worst investments, pure sh*t from people who had attened some seminars or had some guy call them, please elaborate on how earning it makes you more ethical?  I just don't see the connection.  I responded now it's your turn, please explain or do you always make decisions without knowing all the details?  I hope this is not how you invest your clients money.  Are you even an advisor, probably not.

bankrep,

    Masters Degree?  CFP? why on earth are you at a bank?  Banks can't even manage people's checking account correctly.  What makes a person think they can manage money?  Prioprietary funds, bait and switch annuities, index annuities sold by a broker with a weekend course to be a Senior Advisor Specialist.  You are truly a joke.  I have my masters degree and CFP as well.  What I have that you don't is the ability to take accounts with very little effort from banks, credit unions, H&R Block, and the sort.  The clients I EARN stay with me as well.

     What happens the next time one of your 8 banks gets reasigned to someone else?  How about when regulators go after your bait and switch annuity sales that you put the 80 year old in at 3%.  How about that client that you put that 2% wrap account that you haven't talked to in 4 years?  Let's see where you are in another 10 years after the bank screws you.....and they will.  I'll be laughing at you just like if I met you at a party and you told me where you work.

[quote=youcanhatemenow]

I can't believe what I'm seeing.  H&R Block and banks touting their firms.  Unbelievable. Let's be honest....both are chop shops.

Let's pretend you work for H&R block or for a bank.  You go to a party and find out there are a ton of brokers there.  People start introducing themselves and they let you know they are from Merrill, Smith Barney, AG Edwards, Ed Jones, or UBS.  Your turn.....are you proud to say where you work?  Probably not....that's the best litmus test there can possibly be.

I have seen two brokers leave for HRBF in the last two years.  Both had production that a monkey could match.  One of the brokers was morbidly obese and I swear he sweated grease.  He looked like a sleaze.  I even met a regional manager on a plane from HRB.  I almost fell out of my seat and laughed when he told me where he was from.  It's like the recruiting phone call I got from Allstate the other day.

HRB and bank brokers, keep looking in the mirror each morning and tell yourself you are the cream of the crop.  Maybe someday you might just believe it.

PS. We call H&R Block by its other name H&R _ock.

[/quote]

I have to say I don't like how he puts it, but this guy is 100% right. OTOH, why should you care what the other guys think? If you're happy doing what you're doing, working where you work, have the strength of character to not care what others think.

To me it's like owning a Miata in a parking lot of Porsches. Personally, I'm going to own a Porsche, otoh, I'd like to think I'm a big enough guy not to feel the need to pick on the Miata driver who's happy with this car. 

My client base is 40-65 year old executives, I work for a credit union (no proprietary BS) who is strongly aligned with a fortune 500 company.  I take almost all of my money from Fidelity, Merril, UBS, Smith Barney AMEX etc. rather than from the bank, I use the institution as a means to meet people.  No one is going to reassign my book, take my clients etc. because my clients won't accept that (maybe a few), working for a smaller institution has it's advantages.

I have never switched anything besides a few fixed annuitties whose rate was low.  Can't Merrill screw you in the same way?  Please elaborate on why you think they can't.

Yes I love my job, it is a job.  Not building my own business nor do I have a desire to right now. Like I said if I wanted to work at Merril UBS, etc they would hire me based on my CFP/masters and magnetic personality

I don't know.  Maybe I see everything thru rose tinted bifocals but I believe once my clients have been with me for a few years they would follow me no matter what firm I went to.

I know this is not 100% the case but hopefully my best clients would.

scrim

I worked at ML, was busting a** and hitting my hurdles, and I decided it would be much easier and quicker to build a book at a bank (and since I was being recruited anyway it was an easy decision). 

To say a bank is 3rd tier...in what respect?  I know what ML offers, and I can offer the same MLUA account (fee based brokerage), the same MFA Selects account (wrap mutual funds), stocks, bonds, and I even have my futures license (easiest test ever) so I can offer managed futures.

So YouCan HateMeNow, beyond the obscure "structured" product (and actually can offer some structured notes through Rabobank and HSBC) what can my buddies downtown at ML or UBS do that I can't???

I'll help you out...

Not very much at all.

BankFC,

Alot of people think.  It was like that 20 years ago so thats the way it is.  They refuse to see the bank is a better place to build a business because they're set in their ways.

Yes, there are some, maybe even alot of crappy bank programs that rely on 100% annutties for their business model.  I said it and No I wouldn't consider working for one of them.

The banks serve the mass market and alot of people only have 20 or 50K maybe 100K as their life savings at age 65.  These are not folks that are going to invest in a mutual fund for growth at Merril Lynch.  That does not mean someone can't help them, a bank brokers book is huge in terms of # of clients.  I know indys who say 100 clients is to many for one advisor, a bank advisor will have 2000+ clients after a 5 or 10 years.  Yes alot of them will be small 5K in a roth, 25K in funds, but these folks deserve help too, create a team, move your way up the food chain so your seeing accounts over 500K, but still getting a piece of the 50K biz by mentoring the next generation.

[quote=BankFC]

I worked at ML, was busting a** and hitting my hurdles, and I decided it would be much easier and quicker to build a book at a bank (and since I was being recruited anyway it was an easy decision). 

To say a bank is 3rd tier...in what respect?  I know what ML offers, and I can offer the same MLUA account (fee based brokerage), the same MFA Selects account (wrap mutual funds), stocks, bonds, and I even have my futures license (easiest test ever) so I can offer managed futures.

So YouCan HateMeNow, beyond the obscure "structured" product (and actually can offer some structured notes through Rabobank and HSBC) what can my buddies downtown at ML or UBS do that I can't???

[/quote]

Come on, the youcan guy, while obnoxious, is correct. Wirehouse guys think banks and insurance companies are third tier, and most often rightfully so. They're playing with the Yankees and some guy playing for the single A farm team thinks he's a peer.

The question YOU should be asking yourself is why do you care?

I used to work for a bank and have worked at a top tier wall street firm and a high quality super regional firm.  some of my biggest and best clients came from the bank.  Built in trust being reffered from the teller they have seen working there for 15 years.  I won accounts from the competition (sh*t Barney, Morgan StanFee, Merrill Stench: don't take it personally guys) a lot of client's didn't give a damn that I didn't have the biggest d*ck (platform, ***reputation***) around. 

In fact I saw more millionaires in my first month at the bank than I did my entire 2 years cold calling for one of the brokerages I poked fun at.  At my previous "wirehouse" employer we had marble floors, brushed steel walls: all the trappings of "success" (more like a silverback gorilla pounding it's chest when no one cares).  It didn't help me land more affluent clients or make my job easier even though we had a household name. 

I moved to a bank in some remote town (county had 15,000 people!) in the sticks and I'm doing $200,000 to $600,000 transactions, my smallest accounts being about $150k. 

I now work for a big brokerage again because the bank dropped my payout by 30% and I like a more sophisticated platform (my clients could care less) as well as having more control over my accounts, oh and less compliance headache.

People don't give much of a crap about your firm as long as it's a reputable place.  Get over it.......dude.

[quote=dude]

In fact I saw more millionaires in my first month at the bank than I did my entire 2 years cold calling for one of the brokerages I poked fun at.  [/quote]

Yeah, but how many of them worked with YOU instead of the Private Bank or Trust Department (where bank execs think all their really smart investment guys work)?

I work with many and the longer I stay the more will come

[quote=bankrep1]I work with many and the longer I stay the more will come[/quote]

You're happy with where you are and what you're doing. You're doing clean, honest business,  why should you care what others think?

Mike,

It's called a forum...people post.  I don't think your opinion or anyone else's is going to shatter anybody's world.  So why do you keep asking why should he care?

What basis is their for anyone to think banks are third tier to wirehouses.

99.9 percent of the products at wirehouses are available at banks...and if you're pushing the .1% proprietery crap...well that says enough about you.

Tell me how by clearing through ML it makes you a better broker than clearing through National Financial or Pershing?

Sorry for the poor grammer…already home today and posting as i am watching TV.

[quote=BankFC]

Mike,

It's called a forum...people post. I don't think your opinion or anyone else's is going to shatter anybody's world. So why do you keep asking why should he care?

[/quote]

I thought the point was pretty obvious, but, if you need to hear it again; If you’re happy where you work and with what you do, why should you get wrapped around the axel if someone in some other firm looks down on your place of business? IOW, if that sort of thing gets under your skin, you might want to examine just what makes you so lacking in self confidence. Why should someone need that sort of external, anonymous approval? Do what makes you happy.

[quote=BankFC]

What basis is their for anyone to think banks are third tier to wirehouses.

[/quote]

You need me to spell it out for you like “youcan” did? It really sounds obnoxious to point out the obvious, like the Porsche owner explaining to the Miata owner that the two cars aren’t in the same caliber. Didn’t I tell you I’m a Porsche owner who’s a big enough guy to not need to spoil the Miata owner’s fun? But, since you asked…..

[quote=BankFC]

99.9 percent of the products at wirehouses are available at banks.

[/quote]

Sorry, I’m just not buying that. The best you can claim is you have everything a wirehouse offered five years ago. Ask yourself if any washouts at ML end up in bank programs. Now, ask yourself if any bank washouts end up at ML.

Of the two types ask yourself; Who gets handed leads? Who NEEDS to have leads handed to them (didn‘t they prove they needed it handed to them when they washed out at ML)? Who isn’t trusted by their employers to handle big money (and send that money instead to the Trust/Private Bank section of the bank). Who can lose an account because their client got poor treatment from a teller or got bad news from the mortgage department? Who works in a lobby, or worse yet, has to work between a number of lobbies? Who gets better training? Who has to show up at cheerleading sessions for the bank side? Who has “call nights” where they have to monitor the calling skills of the series 6 employees? Who’s looked down on not only by their own private bank “peers” by the bank’s outside, freestanding brokerage channel? Who spends their days relegated to selling fixed annuities to people unhappy with CD rates? Who‘s a “player“ (even if only in their little minds) and who‘s following $2k teller leads?*

* Every item on this list is a feature of at least one large bank brokerage.

[quote=BankFC]

Tell me how by clearing through ML it makes you a better broker than clearing through National Financial or Pershing?

[/quote]

If you think this is about “clearing” you’re hopeless. Just let it go, a Miata is a fun car and that’s all that should matter to you.

Mike

Ever see a client with Merril Lynch Funds, UBS Fuds, AMEX Funds how is that for proprietary BS.

Pershings platform offers SMA's, UMA's a number of fee based and fixed income options.

What's the difference for getting turned down for a mortgage at the bank and getting turned down for a mortgage from a wirehouse?  NOTHING

Lobbies have potential clients in them. THAT'S GOOD (I would never accept a position where they have your desk in the lobby, your important and need an office).  We don't have call nights or series 6 employees although I don't see the problem with coaching people who add to your paycheck/production.  Do you spend time with your junior broker same thing.  Oh wait your not there yet.

Haven't sold a fixed annuity in a while.  Hopefully the MYG rates go up because at times annuitties pay darn good rates for clients.  I locked some people in at 7% five years ago in an ING product those are coming due now and those people are estatic about what were going to do next.

I would definately agree there is a perception that Merril may be more of a porsche environment, however, it is often filled with wannabees.  Build a business and everything falls into place.  You keep working with your A clients they introduce you to more A clients and you keep moving up the food chain. 

If it helps you as a person to work for a firm that has a porsche rep, if that is an environment you will thrive in good for you.  I just don't get why you would want to start with no book, no potential customers and have a firm take half your production for their nice office and fancy name.  If I were going to do that I would find an indy with a nice office and tell him I'll give him 10% for a desk and go with LPL or rayjay or whoever he uses you'll get 80-90%.

2K accounts are for junior, however, I can't tell you how many Roth IRA's I have opened that are now A relationships the number is over 35.

Sonny,

Have you been drinking?

[quote=SonnyClips]Butler

Bear with me for a minute, maybe it is more like Porsche vs. Mazda but remember an RX-7 would hand most Porsches there ass on the track and still have room for the family and save you a sh*tload in upkeep and insurance. And with the RX you get a rotary engine.

[/quote]

You're really out of your depth here. The Rx7 was a fun car, it was no Porsche killer. It was cheaper to own, but not any bigger than a 911 and with the need for replacement engines so common with the latter (93 and later, the only really competitive Rx7s) it wasn’t cheaper over all.

BTW, you're inviting when ever you like come join us at our local track. I think the pink group would be just find for you. We can loan you an approved helmet, assuming your head isn't as big as it comes off sounding like it is here.

[quote=SonnyClips]

"....drive both a 911 or a Boxster with your limited ability behind the wheel and see which is more fun. I can't imagine that you could handle a reverse lock slide in either of the Porsche's without winding up in a guardrail, both of the cars engine positions make for a rather complicated high performance driving experience. "

[/quote]

sigh... it's boring when people blather about things they know nothing about.... the 911 has a rear engine, the Boxster is almost completely negative with its mid-engine set-up. The two handle extremely differently on the track. These days, with 996s and 997s equipped with driving aids like PASM the old polar movement of the rear engine is vastly reduced. If you find the classic, unaided 911 too complicated to drive, stay home. The others on the track will thank you for it. Otoh, even the old hands chuckle about how great it is take a 930 out for a “spin”. ;)

[quote=SonnyClips]
I remember one time about ten years ago taking a Carrera for some hot laps at St Louis international and getting the inside front wheel off the ground.

[/quote]

Yawn... you and everyone else who's ever driving a stock suspension car around a track.... Lifting the inside wheel is a big deal to you? Geezze, I see that every time we run an AutoX or a DE in the parking lot of the local mall.

[quote=SonnyClips]Made for some interesting photos but I have to say I have seen more RX's just eat up a 911 because of their idiosyncratic handling, of course this is not true with the right driver but are you sure your him Mike?

[/quote]

That "idiosyncratic handling" has won more prestigious endurnace races than you’ve closed accounts over $100k. Perhaps you should move on to a subject you know something about.

BTW, I could only smile as I walked by my 993 on the way to the daily driver this morning after this little post of your. Now, Sonny, go knock on some poor unsuspecting middle income person’s door and get to work. ;)

[quote=SonnyClips]That is the 911 Carrera not the supercar.
[/quote]

The "super car"? You mean the Cup Car? Have you any idea what you're talking about?

[quote=SonnyClips]Nah, just wanted to take the bad metaphor to its conclusion. Porsche vs Miata Wha? I hate it when people use car metaphors. If you'll read closely I illustrate how the right environment can suit people differently. A bank for instance ...

[/quote]

With his vast experience, Sonny wants to explain the brokerage business and its many levels to us.

Go open a $2k IRA and sell an American Fund, will ya?

Ok. I can't help myself because the thread has evolved into car analogies.   Comparing one brokerage to another, ML to Banks and Indy brokers and so on , and comparing what a car looks like, how good the driver is and what kind of engine is in the car is somewhat applicable.

I have a mechanic client who has a little piece of crap dented and paint scratched Chevy Luv pickup.  (Lets compare that to the low bells and whistles of a Bank brokerage)

Because he is a master mechanic, he has loaded the truck up with a 425 hp chevy small block with a 700 R4 transmission and relocated the fuel tank to redistribute the weight to enhance the  performance.  Plus the car sounds sweet with the Flowmaster muffler. (Compare this to the back office support and product selections that are available to practically all of us on some level or another.  Some brokerages offer more managed account options than others. Some limit their mutual funds selections...BPD are you there?  But basically we have pretty much the same options to choose from. It what you choose to use and how you use it.) 

Because he is also a super driver, he knows how to handle his little piece of crap looking LUV and when he goes to the drags he blows the doors off of the slicker looking cars.  The crowd comes to their feet when he wins because his car just looks so bad but smokes them all.  Don't we love the underdog     (Compare this to the ability of the broker to be able to choose the products to get the performance out of the portfolio....driving the portfolio to success if you will) 

He has basically built a bullet proof combination that is all go and no show.   Isn't that what our customers would like from us.

Wait a sec, BL not only works finance, she plays games online, drinks G&Ts, is a self-professed MILF and knows cars (even if they're dragsters and not sports cars ;)  )?

That set of facst is far more important than anything else we've discussed in my memory here.

Cheers to BL and women like her

Mikey,

You continue to use the "car" metaphor because you can't make a REAL valid argument as to why a wirehouse is SO MUCH BETTER than a bank.

News flash there Mikey...I've been in both.  I worked at ML.  I made my goals.  I left not because I NEEDED to be handed accounts, but because it is MUCH more efficent to gather assets WHERE ASSETS ARE HELD.  You think you're a better broker by being at a wirehouse?  Nope, you are just in a less efficent model for gathering assets.  I know that might be a hard concept for you to fathom, but try. 

Yes, people do go from bank to brokerage...  Just ask Rightway.

I can do the same accounts you can.  Name ONE common account type available ina wirehouse TODAY (not 5 years ago) that isn't available through a bank brokerage structure.  I named all of ML's, or all the common ones anyway.  WE EVEN HAVE THE EQUIVALENT OF MERRILLS ALL MIGHTY CMA.  Everybody does.

I have a $50,000 account minimum and an "implicit" (I told my brach folks) referral minimum of $100,000.  I don't chase $2,000 IRAs...those people do bankside IRAs.

Here's a fact for you.  BANKS DON'T TRAIN.  You know what that means?  It means they hire experienced reps.  I would rather have, all else being equal, a rep that's been in the business at the bank than some kid right out of college with ML being his first job, and the only thing he's ever invested in is a checking account!!!

Don't tell me wires don't hire 22 year olds right out of college...I know better.  Banks have a higher standard in WHO they hire to be brokers...rookies don'y get hired in bank brokerages TYPICALLY.

Fact is, you can't make ANY valid agrument why a wirehouse is vastly superior to the bank...because it isn't.  All you can do is make obscure car comparisions.  I WELCOME you to try to make a coherent argument.

[quote=mikebutler222]

Wait a sec, BL not only works finance, she plays games online, drinks G&Ts, is a self-professed MILF and knows cars (even if they're dragsters and not sports cars ;)  )?

That set of facst is far more important than anything else we've discussed in my memory here.

Cheers to BL and women like her

[/quote]

Maybe it's just me, but BL sounds hot.

Wirehouse vs Bank...

Let's see who has a better deal, bank brokers vs wirehouse brokers.

Referrals: 

Inherently part of the bank structure from both retail, commercial lending, and mortgage.  Zero in wirehouse.  Referral sources can be cultivated by both.

Account Types/Offerings:

Products and accounts have become a commodity therefore virtually a tie.  I CAN and Do offer just as much as I did while at ML.  Note:  Wirehouses may have niche offerings useful/attractive only in the ultra high net worth arena. 

Payout:

Wirehouses seem to range from 40-50%.  My payout is from 30-40%, and is usually around 35%.  Take note however that my payout is not based on a "haircut."  Ex.  ML credits upfront annuity business at 4.5% gross.  I sell the same contract and it pays me 7% gross.

$100,000*4.5%=4,500   4,500*50%= $2,250 to the wire broker

$100,000*7%=$7,000    $7,000*35%=$2,450 to the bank broker

I make more money on my AVG payout than wire do on their HIGHEST payout on annuity business.  PLUS I am paid currently 44.5 cents per mile, 6 percent into 401K, expense account, office and all supplies, seminars paid for and hosted by bank, VERY good bene...

Work environment:

Speaking in my experience only, bank is more laid back, less formal, and more family oriented.

I think I have made my case.  

[quote=BankFC]

$100,000*4.5%=4,500   4,500*50%= $2,250 to the wire broker

[/quote]

ML has a 4.50% cap on Annuity comp? 

It's long, but you asked for it.

[quote=bankrep1] <?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

Mike

Ever see a client with Merril Lynch Funds, UBS Fuds, AMEX Funds how is that for proprietary BS.

[/quote]

Sure, and I’ve seen clients with Evergreen (Wachovia) and Marsico Funds (Banc of America). Did you have a point in this?

[quote=bankrep1]

What's the difference for getting turned down for a mortgage at the bank and getting turned down for a mortgage from a wirehouse?  NOTHING

[/quote]

Wrong, the difference is the way it’s delivered. Your bank customer found out from a mortgage rep who treated him the way he treats every shlub. The wirehouse client was told by the broker, the only guy the client coems in contact with in the firm. The quarterback of the whole process. I noticed you left out the teller example. Oh, and your guy may well have found out via a letter ot an automated phone call. Ouch, that's gotta hurt.

[quote=bankrep1]

Lobbies have potential clients in them.

[/quote]

They also have the vast majority of traffic which ISN’T potential customer material. We call them "time wasters".

[quote=bankrep1]

We don't have call nights or series 6 employees although I don't see the problem with coaching people who add to your paycheck/production. 

[/quote]

Coaching them for free, after hours? Still no problem with that? BTW, they don’t just “add” to your paycheck, they subtract from it too. They compete with you for potential customers and only invite you in after they’ve failed to sell the limited menu of things they can sell, or decided not to send the customer to the Trust Department for the referral money.

. Who knows how many potential customers they drive off with unsophisticated approached with poor products, or send to your betters at Trust.

[quote=bankrep1]

 Do you spend time with your junior broker same thing.  Oh wait your not there yet.

[/quote]

Jr brokers are 100% profit  AND you don’t have call nights with them, much less ones directed and dictated by others. And YOU get to pick your Jr brokers.

[quote=bankrep1]

Haven't sold a fixed annuity in a while. 

[/quote]

Sure you haven’t….

[quote=bankrep1]

Hopefully the MYG rates go up because at times annuitties pay darn good rates for clients.  I locked some people in at 7% five years ago in an ING product those are coming due now and those people are estatic about what were going to do next.

[/quote]

ROFLMAO, sure you did. 7%, just 5 years ago. And that was a better rate than they could have earned outside of a fixed annuity.

[quote=bankrep1]

If it helps you as a person to work for a firm that has a porsche rep, if that is an environment you will thrive in good for you.  I just don't get why you would want to start with no book, no potential customers and have a firm take half your production for their nice office and fancy name. 

[/quote]

No, you’d rather have a bank hand you business and let them take 60%, not to mention the real money they keep from you by sending it to a bank profit center, like Trust.

 [quote=bankrep1]

News flash there Mikey...I've been in both.  I worked at ML.  I made my goals.  I left not because I NEEDED to be handed accounts, .... 

[/quote]

Yeah, that’s the ticket. You were well on your way to success and decided a bank lobby fit you better. You know what? I bet most Division II college football players that played Division I FIRST, make the same claims.

 [quote=bankrep1]

Yes, people do go from bank to brokerage...  Just ask Rightway.

[/quote]

He’s the one. Now account for the vast majority that move the other way.

[quote=bankrep1]

I can do the same accounts you can. 

[/quote]

Sure you can, and the Trust Department doesn’t take the REAL money from you. Oh, wait, it does.

 [quote=bankrep1]

I have a $50,000 account minimum and an "implicit" (I told my brach folks) referral minimum of $100,000. 

[/quote]

Of course you do, and the bank (or your manager) doesn’t have any problem with the money left on the table from accounts you refuse to handle. I bet they never say anything like, “Wait a sec, pal, the reason WE GIVE YOU ACCOUNTS is because we want you to take them all, no refusals. BTW, we’ve just hired Bob and he’s taking three of your four branches.”.

And I have no doubt you handle Exchange Funds, buy/sell agreements, trusts, endowments, private placements, option strategies to off-set large positions, sophisticated estate planning, etc.. Oh, no, wait, the bank makes far more with the Trust Department and/or Private Banking doing that AND they can, by law, pay other bank employees  MONEY to refer, that you can’t. Sorry….

 [quote=bankrep1]

Here's a fact for you.  BANKS DON'T TRAIN.  You know what that means? 

[/quote]

Sure, it means there’s always a good supply of washouts who couldn’t build a business and are happy to work anywhere where they can keep their licenses.

[quote=bankrep1]

Don't tell me wires don't hire 22 year olds right out of college...I know better.  Banks have a higher standard in WHO they hire to be brokers...rookies don'y get hired in bank brokerages TYPICALLY.

[/quote]

Banks hire that 22 yr old (I’ve never seen a major wirehouse hire one, but I’m sure it happens, somehere) six months later when he’s washed out.

[quote=bankrep1]

Fact is, you can't make ANY valid agrument why a wirehouse is vastly superior to the bank...because it isn't.  All you can do is make obscure car comparisions.  I WELCOME you to try to make a coherent argument.

[/quote]

Hey, if you’re happy in the lobby (or the glass cubical just off of it) servicing scrapes that the Trust Department doesn’t want, attending cheerleading sessions with tellers, hanging with the guys with the ill-fitting suits driving Tauruses, by all means. In fact, I’d say BE HAPPY, just don’t try the “Oh, yeah, well I can do anything you can do” stuff. See, I didn't want to point out the obvious, but you made me do it. 

[quote=Mike Damone][quote=mikebutler222]

Wait a sec, BL not only works finance, she plays games online, drinks G&Ts, is a self-professed MILF and knows cars (even if they're dragsters and not sports cars ;)  )?

That set of facst is far more important than anything else we've discussed in my memory here.

Cheers to BL and women like her

[/quote]

Maybe it's just me, but BL sounds hot.

[/quote]

No, it isn't just you 

Gotta admit she sounds hot to me as well.

[quote=SonnyClips]Just brought in an account from MS with a disabled guy whos holdings consisted of five tech stocks and a high yield bond fund.

[/quote]

And people are never mishandled with touchdown bonds and such where you are. Sorry, no sale.

OTOH, if you're serious, you should help that guy recover what he lost via the mishandling he got.

[quote=SonnyClips]

Butler, you say your into sports cars? What do you drive one of those big old ass 928 german corvettes to match your gold chains and your gaudy silk suit. Punk [/quote]

You really are poorly informed, aren't you.

1) I don't own a 928, but they were kick-ass GT cars with great power and comfort. They priced well above the 911 of it's day.  Nothing like a Corvette.

2) Not being anything like a Corvette, 928 owners don't wear the gold chains and suits (leisure, btw, not silk. Silk suits in pastel colors are worn by drivers of Italian sports cars) issued to Corvette owners. 

[quote=BankFC]

Wirehouse vs Bank...

Let's see who has a better deal, bank brokers vs wirehouse brokers.

[/quote]

Here we go again, sports fans. They guy playing single A is going to explain how life is better for him than a guy wearing a Yankees uniform. 

[quote=BankFC]

Referrals: 

[/quote]

Well, they can give you business if you can't do it yourself. OTOH, it may not be the business you want. Can you say 2000 $2k IRAs?

[quote=BankFC]

  Note:  Wirehouses may have niche offerings useful/attractive only in the ultra high net worth arena. 

[/quote]

IOW, they only things I haven't got are things I can't use since REAL money gets taken from me and given to the Trust Department.

[quote=BankFC]

Wirehouses seem to range from 40-50%.  My payout is from 30-40%, and is usually around 35%. 

[/quote]

"In exchange for 2000 $2k IRAs and having the real money taken from me, I get a lower payout. OTOH, I COULD go back to a wirehouse and starve.

Oh, and the big payout on annuities doesn't cause me to push them, nope, not at all. 

[quote=BankFC]

Work environment:

Speaking in my experience only, bank is more laid back, less formal, and more family oriented.

[/quote]

IOW, we don't have to wear the good, expensive stuff I did at ML, and besides, most of the guys look better in the logo shirts that match what the tellers wear.   

Seriously, BankFC, give it a rest. You stop the "but I AM a bigtime broker" and I'll stop needling you. If you're happy where you are, for crying out loud, BE HAPPY. Life's to short to dwell on the fact that the big fellas don't welcome you to belly up to the bar with them. 

Hey. Sonny, on a serious note, open all the $2k IRAs you can. We all did as new guys. There's nothing wrong with it as a new guy, even if I do haze your chubby butt about it.

OTOH, you don't know squat about sports cars

I’ve never read a mikebutler post until about 2 weeks ago.  Are you always like this Mikey?

[quote=Mike Damone]I've never read a mikebutler post until about 2 weeks ago.  Are you always like this Mikey?[/quote]

Depends on my mood. 'Taking it pretty lightly today. It's Friday, the holidays are coming, I've got a grin I can't get rid of.... and I'm having fun with Sonny and the BankFC. All in good fun 

Wow....  I'm at a loss for words (not really..... I never run out).  Thanks guys.   BTW: its Scotch not G&T.

It is a light Friday for me too and I have writers cramp from the stupid  (oops did I say that) Christmas cards. 

Mikey,

Does your boyfriend work for a Trust Department.  Lol, that's all I hear you talking about...

You and the "big boys" go belly up to the bar...just take it easy, I know that AMEX is probably just about maxed out by now.

[quote=SonnyClips]I know that Porsche stopped making the 928 because it was a big fat pig that really didn't fit what Ferry Porsche had in mind when he said that... [/quote]

I suggest you read "Excellent Was Expected". You'll find the 928 wasn't discontinued for any reason like that.

[quote=SonnyClips]

 That and in all honesty the 928 was built for people who didn't have the chops to drive a 911.

[/quote]

ROFLMAO, no, Sonny, it was made to be a high speed GT car (perhaps you don't know what that it).

[quote=SonnyClips]The 944 on the other hand did handle beautifully in any drivers hands with its 50/50 weight distro and Weisach rear camber changing geometry but still who would want a 944 instead of a boxster or a 928 instead of a 911. "

Wow, so many errors in such a short paragraph. The 944 (and 924 before it) were only produced because Porsche feared they would not much longer be able to produce the aircooled 911 with changing US emmission law. (The US is 50% of Porsche's market). Both the 924 and 944 models, while not bad, sell for far less than a 911 of equal age. That tells you something about what history says of them.

BTW, the Boxster and 944 were not sold the same years and even had they been, they were for different buyers. The Boxster is a 2 seat roadster, the 944 a coupe.

The 928 and 911 were not expected to appeal to the same buyers. The 928 was a mega high speed GT (Grand Touring), the 911 a sports car.

[quote=SonnyClips]

 Gotta love that Elise though would you say its the Seven of its time? Hats off to GM the Elise is the best thing to come out of that company since sh*t I don't when.

[/quote]

ROFLMAO, you just get better. FIRST, the Elise is NOT MADE BY GM. It's a LOTUS, owned by an Indoneasian maker, Proton.

SECOND, it's a fine car but far, far too tiny to be both a track AND reasonable street car. After the first blush on what great car Lotus was bring to the US, sales fell like a stone when people found it was really a track car you could take to the road, not equal parts of the two.

[quote=SonnyClips]

As far as the ribbing Its nice to see your good humored. Have you ever taken a rear engine Porsche to the edge?[/quote]

Thanks, and yes, of course (didn't I mention my 933? Know what that is?). BTW, if you're a doubter of how great the 911 is, perhaps it's because you're not up to the task.

That could explain how you found yourself with a reverse-lock slide. That's not something you'd do on purpose. Perhaps the Boxster with its mid-engine or the new Cayman, a Boxster-based coupe is more your sytle.

[quote=BankFC]

Mikey,

Does your boyfriend work for a Trust Department.  Lol, that's all I hear you talking about...

[/quote]

Awww, ain't that funny. It's also funny that you NEVER mentioned the Trust Department. I bet it's because you realize what a small-account broker mentioning what they do to you makes you. 

[quote=SonnyClips]

You and the "big boys" go belly up to the bar...just take it easy, I know that AMEX is probably just about maxed out by now.

[/quote]

See, you just had to go off and talk like that. And right after the big boys were about you buy you a drink (true, it was going to be just bar brand) in the holiday spirit.

BTW, my AMEX HAS no limit. Does yours? 

Lol, I actually have one credit card that never comes out...can't even remember the limit.  Don't buy much on credit.

LOL, btw, credit limits are hardly a measure of net worth...my ex-girlfriend worked at a high end apartment complex, and guys would come in driving Hummers and Beemers, even Porsche...and couldn't even qualify for a apartment.

But I'm sure you impressed SOMEONE here..

Not to ignore your question though Mikey.  Our Trust department only does Trust business, they don't compete with us for non trust accounts.  They hardly enter my mind.  If I send them business (ex I have a client with about 15 million in real estate), they collect the Trust fee, and I collect any of the commissions generated from securities.  So there is NO conflict of interest. 

Hard for you to swallow that someone might have a better deal out there than you???  You seem awfully jealous  ; )

No trust dept. in my institution.  That's me I guess.

[quote=BankFC]

Not to ignore your question though Mikey.  Our Trust department only does Trust business, they don't compete with us for non trust accounts.  [/quote]

What's the phrase I'm looking for, uh, er, ROFLMAO.

Be serious, pal, everyone who knows anything about bank programs and understands how bank brokerages profit know that "Trust Departments" do much more than trusts, even if they haven't rebranded themselves "Private Bank" they act as one and they're a far better profit center for each customer dollar than you are or could ever be. THUS, the bank places a high priority on getting HNW people to Trust/PB and away from you. You know this, I know this. Thsi leaves you with crumbs.

[quote=SonnyClips]Look back at my earlier posts I never said I disliked 911's, in fact I think they are design classics. I said that they were challenging in regard to handling, an aspect that has been addressed in newer models but sometimes at risk in harming what makes this car really unique and wonderful.

[/quote]

It's the rear engine set-up that they've used for better than 40 yrs that makes them unique and the legend that they are. It sounds like you’re just another driver unable to get the most out of the 911.

[quote=SonnyClips]

I have had quite a time behind the wheel of a number of rear and mid engine Porsche's and find them to be excellent.

[/quote]

Sure you have. Your knowledge of the model line is, well, a joke. How about telling us about all the mid-engined models from Porsche you're driven?

[quote=SonnyClips]

Though I doubt you have really enjoyed them at the limit given your statement about reverse lock slides.

[/quote]

A reverse lock slide is what you do when you've screwed up badly, entered a corner too fast, cut in too quick and need to reduce over-steer. By then you've missed the apex, you've lost speed and you're just trying to save the car.

[quote=SonnyClips]

The Mid engine car can be just as treacherous at the limit ...

[/quote]

Every car is dangerous at its limit. The beauty of the mid-engine chassis is its neutral feel.

[quote=SonnyClips]

Have you ever got the inside front wheel to lift in hard cornering its not as difficult as it sounds. Try it and get back to me.

[/quote]

Gee, I'll have to do that, again, just for you, lamer. I don't know where you get the idea that lifting the front inside is a big deal, you can do it in low speed autocross.

[quote=SonnyClips]
I believe lotus is owned by GM ...

[/quote]

It isn't. Just another of the many items that made it clear you're just a poseur on this subject. Lotus is owned by Proton, has been for more than a decade.

http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns00832.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lotus_Cars

http://www.sandsmuseum.com/cars/elise/information/press/maga zine/magazine1996/autowk.html

You'll notice that GM is CUSTOMER of Lotus engineering. It was Lotus engineering that designed the Vauxhall roadster (VX 220) you're talking about.

[quote=SonnyClips]
As far as super fast the 928 never completely eclipsed the 911..

[/quote]

I don't know how many times I have to explain this to you, but the 928 was never meant to replace the 911. It was a GT car (look up the term), not a competitor of the 911.

[quote=SonnyClips]

The values on 928's don't hold up worth sh*t either but at least the 944 was a 1G car.

[/quote]

Ugh.... the only Porsche that's had values hold up strong has been the 911. The 928 was accepted by Porsche lovers for what it was. The 944, like the 924 before it and the 914 and 968 have never achieved universal acceptance. The last two years of production, when the 944 was produced with massive turbo assisted power (not the less powerful, earlier 944 turbo), now that was a beast.

[quote=SonnyClips]

One f**king G. It wasn't until they replaced the 944 with the Boxster..

[/quote]

No, they replaced the 944 with the 968. Like the 944 it was front engined, and 4 cyl. Man, you know nothing of Porsches.

[quote=SonnyClips]
As far as 933 it is just a lux variant of a 911 no?

[/quote]

No, it's the internal designation [just like 916 isn’t a model number, it’s the internal designation for the 6 cyl version of the 914) for the 911 produced between 1995 and 1998. The last, and best of the air-cooled 911s. If you knew anything of 911s, you’d know that.

http://www.993faq.com/

[quote=SonnyClips] I would rather have the stripped down club racer model

[/quote]

You're really a joy to chat with about Porsches. Say, Porsche expert, just when were "club racer" Porsches made?

[quote=SonnyClips]
Don't be hatin' on other makes of cars ..

[/quote]

Don't confuse "hatin‘" with knowing.

[quote=mikebutler222] [quote=BankFC]

Not to ignore your question though Mikey. Our Trust

department only does Trust business, they don’t compete

with us for non trust accounts. [/quote]

What’s the phrase I’m looking for, uh, er, ROFLMAO.

Be serious, pal, everyone who knows anything about

bank programs and understands how bank brokerages

profit know that “Trust Departments” do much more than

trusts, even if they haven’t rebranded themselves

"Private Bank" they act as one and they’re a far better

profit center for each customer dollar than you are or

could ever be. THUS, the bank places a high priority on

getting HNW people to Trust/PB and away from you. You

know this, I know this. Thsi leaves you with crumbs.

[quote=SonnyClips]All cars are unpredictable at the limit?

[/quote]

I didn't say "unpredictable", I said dangerous. If your assertion is that the 911 is "unpredictable" 40 years of racing history says you're flat wrong. "Unpredictable" cars don't have a winning streak that extends that long. Just because it's too much car for you doesn't mean it's unpredictable.

[quote=SonnyClips]

. As far as club racer, bud your right I don't know the internal designation from internal medicine.

[/quote]

You mean as far as Porsches, period, go. Don't tell you're an experinced driver if you can't tell a Targa from a Cab.

[quote=SonnyClips]

I believe the GT3 is a club racer. [/quote]

Almost every year that the 911 has been produced they have offered a variant that’s at least tried to trim some weight and perhaps added hp. The 993 years offered the RS and RSR versions. The GT3 is in keeping with that thread. It’s funny you should mention the GT3 as a fav, though, because it’s the one 911 that doesn’t come with driver assists that make the car more “predictable”, something you said was needed.

[quote=SonnyClips]
At the track we used to call guys like you "magazine readers." The guys who new all the weenie information about cars but were not really so balls out when it came to driving. Your the kind of guy who likes to use the traction control.

[/quote]

“Your” the kind of guy who knows nothing of the car OR of them guy “your” discussing it with. It’s clear to me based on your “unpredictable” and “reverse lock slide” comments that you know less about racing than you do investing. The “get the inside front wheel up” comment is especially comical considering you can do that at less than 55 mph at any traffic cone marked autocross.

Seriously, no one who’s ever driven a 911 “to the limit” would be unfamiliar with the last and best of the air-cooled heritage, the 993.

[quote=SonnyClips]

The 914-6 was actually the designation for the flat six variation but so what you understood what I meant. Do you turn your nose up at these cars too?
[/quote]

I knew there was never such a thing as a 916 and I knew you didn’t know that. And, no, I like the 914s and even owned one.

Say, given how far off topic this is and how you’ve embarrassed yourself repeatedly on it, do you really want to continue?

[quote=BankFC]

Poor sap. You actually can't handle the fact that I
have completely proved you wrong can you??? [/quote]

You "proved" what again? The fact that your mysterious bank brokerage is nothing like every other bank brokerage in the business? Hardly.

I suppose as long as you don't disclose WHICH bank program you're with you can deny every aspect of the program that doesn't fit the fantasy you which to project. 

I don't remember you disclosing what firm your with?  What city are you in?  What's your name, telephone number, and social security?

Mike, i don't care about your opinion.  i have been NOTHING but honest on this board, and when you don't like it, you say its untrue.

That's what makes you pitiful.

Even if I did tell you my bank, what would you do, try to call and confirm the structure of the trust dept, the benefits, and the payout grid...who would you call Mikey???

see how crazy you sound?

Mike, see my previous post on YouCanHateMeNow.

You lose.

[quote=BankFC]

I don't remember you disclosing what firm your with?  What city are you in?  What's your name, telephone number, and social security?

[/quote]

Since you feel the need to run this discussion on three threads... the majors are all fairly interchangable, you don't need the name of my specific wirehouse to understand, much less other other info you now need. You, otoh, hide behind some mystery bank that's unlike every other bank program....

[quote=BankFC]

Mike, i don't care about your opinion.  i have been NOTHING but honest on this board, and when you don't like it, you say its untrue.

[/quote]

Of course, everything you've said is true, and we can just take your word on that. AND, based on your word, well, life is far better in the bank lobby (or in the cubicle if you're a real hotshot). Say, your word wasn't good on the features of that Hartford annuity you mentioned...

[quote=BankFC]

Even if I did tell you my bank, what would you do, try to call and confirm the structure of the trust dept, the benefits, and the payout grid...who would you call Mikey???

[/quote]

"Call"? Why would I "call" anyone. There's no doubt most everything you've said could be verified or disproved with a little online research.

See how uninformed you sound?

[quote=SonnyClips]I didn't say driver assists were needed, I said you needed them. [/quote]

Of course, the guy who doesn't know me, and doesn't know the first thing about Porsches has made a pronouncement.

BTW, the 993 doesn't have any of the driver's aides, either. I hope you've read the links I've given you. I's hate to think you learned nothing from all the hard work I put into educating you 

Mikey, see how uninformed YOU sound.  Where are you going to go online????  Our benefits aren't online.  The only thing online is where folks can see their accounts etc.  YOU DON"T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT MY BANK, yet you act as if you do. 

Why?

YOU ARE AN IDIOT!!!  That's why 

and I didn't make an error you fool...i used the term living benefit which is a general term for various riders on VA's.

Sorry, I don't have time to copy and paste from Hartford's website and link to the prospectus.  what a dork you are, lol...

oh my god the argument is spreading!!!!!

look kids, if you can't play nice you won't be allowed to play together at all.  now let's all go to the kitchen and make some pbj sandwhiches for a snack while you two calm down.....

::rolls eyes::

And don't either of you dare say to me "HE started it!"

gladly.  i’ve owned mikey long enough

[quote=BankFC]

Mikey, see how uninformed YOU sound.  Where are you going to go online???? 

[/quote]

The services your bank offers will be available there, the number of branches, the existance of the Trust/PB you say doesn't exist. Plenty of things are online. I bet they even have an informative "careers" section.

[quote=BankFC]

Our benefits aren't online.

[/quote]

I couldn't care less about your bennies, they weren't impressive to start with.

[quote=BankFC]YOU DON"T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT MY BANK, yet you act as if you do. 

Why?

[/quote]

Why? Because much like the fact that the majors are very much the same, bank brokerages share many features. You might not have them all, but you'll have many. The way you tell the fantasy there are NONE of the drawbacks. 

[quote=BankFC]

and I didn't make an error you fool...i used the term living benefit which is a general term for various riders on VA's.

[/quote]

It isn't that you used the wrong name, I couldn't care less about that. It's that you incorrectly explained what it does.

[quote=BankFC]

Sorry, I don't have time to copy and paste from Hartford's website and link to the prospectus. 

[/quote]

You mean you don't have the time to learn about the product you're incorrectly flogging. All those people you told that they could have a guaranteed 5% income stream for life w/o annuitizing sure will be mad at the guy that replaces you. (We know you won't be there).

[quote=joedabrkr]

oh my god the argument is spreading!!!!!

look kids, if you can't play nice you won't be allowed to play together at all.  now let's all go to the kitchen and make some pbj sandwhiches for a snack while you two calm down.....

::rolls eyes::

And don't either of you dare say to me "HE started it!"

[/quote]

LOL. You'd think at the very least we could limit the foodfight to a single thread 

[quote=SonnyClips]Mike tell me about some of your stories of driving sports cars instead of giving me tech articles. What are you a mechanic? or just another magazine reader?[/quote]<?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

I never gave you a tech article. I simply pointed out things people who are involved with sports cars (beyond your obvious source of experience, some video game) know. It’s called common knowledge.

If my only choices are “mechanic” or “magazine reader” I’d have to say yes and no to both. Of course I’ve been an avid reader of sport car mags since I caught the bug over 25 years old. As to being a mechanic, well, that’s how everyone I know started out with an interest. We bought junky cars as kids (Dad wasn’t buy and we couldn’t afford better) and had to learn the skills. The next thing you know you have the bug. Then you’re doomed.

I grew up with friends of my father owning (usually British) sports cars. TR4s and TR6s, Spitfires and MG Bs. Learned a little wrenching there and how to double clutch (pre-working synchros). My friends and I owned things like Datsun 510s, Bluebirds and Corvairs and the like. Muscle cars were passé with the gas shortages of the 1970s, so we had econoboxes that we tried to tweak for power and handling. A friend’s father found us back road racing one night and after the lectured us to death, he took us to a proper venue. I started on go carts, moved from there to DE and autocrosses with the aforementioned econoboxes and when I could afford a 914, open tracks. I’ve owned 911s, a Boxster S, the 914 I mentioned, a couple of Jags, a Mustang a BMW 2002 and I’m sure a few I’ve left out. I’ve worked on cars friends own and race.

Since then I’ve raced on tracks in Europe and the <?:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" />US at the club level. I have my little pieces of silver, but nothing to write home about. I currently get involved with a DE or track event once a quarter with my local PCA club and sneak in with other clubs when I get a chance. My most white knuckle experience was in a friend’s 930 (more precious to him than his kids) when the turbo lag caught me off-guard exiting the first turn and I found myself 180 degrees off, looking straight into oncoming race traffic. Loads of fun and besides, underwear isn’t really that expensive.

[quote=SonnyClips]Now your talking. My first car was a Datsun 510.

[/quote]

A fun, cheap car with a racing heritage. I loved mine.

[quote=SonnyClips]

 and one of those Renault Le Car like Homologation mid engine cars (wow a very cool car).

[/quote]

To my undying shame I once owned a LeCar. Worse yet, it was not my only Renault.

[quote=SonnyClips]
Had a few early z cars, GTI, miata..

[/quote]

I owned a 240Z (great car) and a Miata when thy first came out and it was the only roadster sold in the US.

[quote=SonnyClips]

What's a Bluebird sounds like a Datsun but I don't know?

[/quote]

A Datsun roadster. On second thought it might have been called a Fairlady. Either way it was victim to the Japanese weird habit of using English in a strange fashion.

[quote=SonnyClips]

Believe it or not my mother used to race a Corvair spyder with the turbo ..

[/quote]

Another great car. Nader, btw, is a jerk.

[quote=SonnyClips]

 He had both kneecaps ripped off in a car wreck, we were hit by a Drunk Driver.

[/quote]

Sorry to hear that.

[quote=SonnyClips]

I've got a Mini now that even though it is front wheel drive handles great and drifts nicely without plowing, hey I like to drive and I'm a lib.

[/quote]

I like the Mini and see nothing "Lib" about any BMW ;)

[quote=SonnyClips]

You know earlier I meant four wheel drift when I wrote revearse lock slide ...

[/quote]

No, I figured you meant reverse lock slide, a really bad idea. I get you now.

[quote=SonnyClips]

You follow F1 this year? Best season in ten years.[/quote]

This is going to sound strange from a car nut, but I have really limited interest in open wheel racing. I like racing where the cars look like production models. When I lived in Europe I felt the same about F-1 hysteria (and man, is it real) as I do NASCAR hysteria, I just don't get it. I'd rather watch some obscure German Touring Car race or Australian sports car racing.

[quote=SonnyClips]Thanks for the stories though. I wish they would make a big long documentary about late sixties LeMans, CanAm and F1 racing. Or if they have share the title.[/quote]

The closest thing I can think of off the top of my head would be Steve McQueen in "LeMans". Almost 40 some odd minutes of racing before someone ruins it with dialogue.

I'm dating myself, but.... my first car was an Olds Cutlass 442, manual transmission of course.  I loved that car.

Phooey on those little rinngggg dinnnng dinnnng cars.  Just kidding.

Recently sold a 68 Galaxie fast back and made a nice profit. My latest project car is a 72 K5 Blazer.. think I'll keep this one for a while and have some fun with it.  Unless I score the 49 Buick. 

Now isn't this more fun than arguing about variable annuities?

K5 is a full sized Blazer more like a Tahoe or Suburban.  The entire fiberglass top can come off and the truck is fully convertable, over the entire vechile not just the back area.  A lot of fun in the summer.  I think 1975 was the last year of fully convertable tops.

Yep, portholes.

[quote=babbling looney]

I'm dating myself, but.... my first car was an Olds Cutlass 442, manual transmission of course.  I loved that car.

Phooey on those little rinngggg dinnnng dinnnng cars.  Just kidding.

Recently sold a 68 Galaxie fast back and made a nice profit. My latest project car is a 72 K5 Blazer.. think I'll keep this one for a while and have some fun with it.  Unless I score the 49 Buick. 

Now isn't this more fun than arguing about variable annuities?

[/quote]

You have a project car? I wouldn't ordinarily say this to a married woman, but, I think I'm in love 

I do not read posts related to metaphors about cars or stupid posts that quote someone line by line when having a conversation please it goes back and forth

http://www.forbes.com/management/2006/03/15/handr-block-tax- suits-cz_cc_0315block.html?partner=rss

msnbc article, enough said

Reviving this old thread made me long to revive another.  Sorry, but I couldn’t contain my gloating…