How is Jones' Technology?

Someone will respond as soon as they implement their technology.  They said Summer but failed to mention the year.  That was January '99.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHA!!!!  Wait a minute, wait a minute... BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Wait a minute, I had to come back and see if the original post asked what I thought it did… BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHA… It did!!! Someone else please take this one…

Several of the reps told me that the platform was pretty solid. The recruiter told me it was good too.

Let’s just say that your recruiter may be something more than a little guilty of stretching the truth.  Why don’t you e-mail one of the reps in your area?  Oh, that’s right you can’t!  You’ll have to “wire” him!

Sad to say, they are dead on right about this one - Jones technology is a joke.  Rumor has it that we will be getting DSL and email by the end of the year in all branches, but me has me doubts.

newbie,

I joined in '98 and heard email was coming. then Y2K took over for 1999. Then I heard email was coming in 2000, 2001 and was to be delievered in 2002 when I left.

DSL has been promised since 2000

Can you see a pattern here?

They have email at the Home office.  Jones technology is way behind, but don't ask RR Report Card....that survey says different.  Hmmm, but if it's in a survey it must be true?

ANSWER:  Jones technology is weak.

Jones technology was purported to be the leader in '98 when I started with the firm. Lost our communication entirely for a few days due to our never to be found, satelite. We had to be repointed to a new satelite which was a monumental effort to accomplish firmwide. We were told to go to the firm website for instructions. The problem was we did not have alternate web access at the office (DSL or dialup). That was December of last year.

When the highest paid executive in the firm is the MIS manager (4.3M),you would hope it would be based on merit, not tenure. Still waiting for remote access and email. The RTA in our region says this summer. Hopefully the next managing partner will take on this challenge. It is pitiful.

Ashton--  Thats what the recruiter told me as well…  Once I received the laptop for training, and read the instructions for sending a wire, I knew I was only in it for the training.  It seemed to me that if Jones was not on the cutting edge of “email” then what are the odds they they are doing the right things right in terms of their clients.  That was my perception of their tech based on actually using it. 

Why change the technology if you are one of the powers that be at Jones?  They don't need it.  Push the VAs, the 2-3 fund companies and receive the wires on a few 30 year bonds and you are in business.  Nothing is going to change at that place as long as the GPs are getting 60%+ on their returns.  What is so hard to understand about this?

"Push the VAs"

Jones doesn't push VAs and you know it.  Repeatedly saying so won't make it true.

"the 2-3 fund companies and receive the wires on a few 30 year bonds"

To show that I'm not a complete kool aid drinker, this is a fair criticism.

There are plenty of reasons to criticize Jones if (as seems to be the case) doing so gives your life meaning.  All I ask is that you stick to "The Truth."

so newbie,

what's your assessment on what you've read about your firm's technology.

We haven't even gotten into financial modeling or asset allocation programs. (figure if you can't support email how can you support asset allocation ?????)

[quote=jonesnewbie]

"Push the VAs"

Jones doesn't push VAs and you know it.  Repeatedly saying so won't make it true.

"the 2-3 fund companies and receive the wires on a few 30 year bonds"

To show that I'm not a complete kool aid drinker, this is a fair criticism.

There are plenty of reasons to criticize Jones if (as seems to be the case) doing so gives your life meaning.  All I ask is that you stick to "The Truth."

[/quote]

Newbie, I don't know how new you are, but as late as 5 years ago, my region did most assuredly push VAs (naturally, with the "Where Appropriate" caveat).  Denying it, of course, does not make it not so.

If that's changed, it is to Edward D. Jones' credit.

Starka says 5 years and I say 2 years.  I have a hard time believing they quit pushing VAs over this short of a time frame.  You should have access to the numbers.  What percent of revenue comes from VAs? 

"as late as 5 years ago, my region did most assuredly push VAs"

I don't know if this was a regional thing or if the firm was really that different back then, but I can tell you that Jones is not pushing annuities today. 

First, there is no financial incentive for a broker to sell one.  Our B-share pays 4% gross, just like a B-share mutual fund.  And we sell A-share annuities that have the same commission/break point scale as A-share mutual funds. 

Second, placing an annuity order frequently generates an automatic fspend requesting an explanation of the purchase.  I don't know what the specific parameters are but I know from personal experince that a $50k order for someone in their 50's is enough to kick one out.

Why would a broker sell a product that doesn't pay him anything extra and will likely require him to justify the purchase in writing?  Unless the client really wants it or you think they need it, you won't.

"I have a hard time believing they quit pushing VAs"

You have a hard time believing Jones is anything but pure evil.  It's almost pathological.

"You should have access to the numbers.  What percent of revenue comes from VAs? "

Tell me where to get them and I'll post them.

According to the branch quarterly report, 9% of firm assets are in annuities. Can't break down how many are transferred in versus purchased. For some IR's, it is a considerable revenue source. My branch assets are 3% including both fixed and variable. Most are A share.

Jones is certainly been taking its licks lately but when it comes to annuities and compliance problems, I think this is one are where Jones actually did it right. We have enough problems elsewhere...

Unfortunately, the number would be skewed and would work against you, Newbie.  Now if you could find the number with the recurring revenues dropped out, that might be a different story.

You see Newbie, Jones reps take an hellacious haircut on an annuity ticket.  You get, what, 4.5% on an annuity, with a 25 bp trail (or service fee, if you prefer) starting in the 15th month?  In the civilized world, the identical annuity pays anywhere from 5.5% to 6.5% with 100bp trail.  The difference, you understand, goes to the GP undiluted!  Until the recent cries for full disclosure, this was one of the closely guarded little secrets of the Jones structure.  Can you possibly imagine what a cash cow this could be if, for example, annuities accounted for say 30% of Jones revenue?  Trust me, if the juggernaut of regulatory scrutiny was not rolling right down the hill towards Maryland Heights, nothing would have been done to upset that particular applecart.

In closing, understand that it is NOT my intention to denigrate your employer.  But please, keep your head out of the sand and don't attach any high and lofty motives to the actions of St. Louis. 

additionally your EDJ payout is 40% of gross on the annuity.  Mine is 50%.

Jones pushing VA’s???   Hmmm, Can’t possibly be, that’s not why there was a broadcast explaining the reasons why someone would want to have them inside their IRA.

newbie,

Have your technology questions been answered?

As far as pushing VA's where is that EJ vixen sapphire who was pushing muni's in an IRA?

Sapphire was a man, first of all, that thought it was fun to have a fem alter ego.  Secondly, I believe that individual is out of the biz.

I left Jones six months to go independant.  The technolog is week
at Jones in most respects.  I will say that I think JOnes did an
excellent job with handling paperwork and making the administrative
part of the job easier.  Unfortunatley, that is due in large part
to the lack of product choices.  We you only deal with a small
group of vendors its easier.  Try looking at cost basis on your
non preferred mutual funds for instance.



The real area that Jones is lacking in technology is on the financial
planning and asset management side.  You dont know what your
missing.

Indy Boy,



Tell me, what technology is Jones missing that you have at your current firm?

BPD--

Read the first sentence of the final paragraph of the post previous to yours.  Your answer is there.

[quote=BigPayDay]Indy Boy,

Tell me, what technology is Jones missing that you have at your current firm?[/quote]

Email capablities not only with client but also with suppliers.  I can't begin to tell you how convenient the ability is to have forms that I may be missing sent to me in an immediate email instead of waiting days.  Getting immediate quotes from insurance providers, hypothetical illustrations, prospectuses and being able to download the latest fact sheets or performance figures at DSL speed instead of the snail paced satellite system at EDJ is a huge bonus.

Access to multiple programs for true and complete financial planning. Monte-Carlo illustrations.  Access to more sources of research and market information. Morningstar. As an independant my own data base for customer contacts and maintenance that I can customize to my own liking.  The ability to build bond ladders from a much much wider range of bonds than were ever offered from EDJ.  There is probably more, but I can't think of it right now.

Down-side it that many of these services as an independant are paid for out of my own pocket.  Up-side is that I can pick and choose what services I want to use.

It is probably easier to talk about what technology Jones does have as opposed to the differences at other firms.  Does Jones have real time quotes yet?

JONESNEWBIE-  you mentioned getting inquiries on every annuity ticket you run.  I did what I am about to do with you to someone else and sort of embarrassed them, so be careful.  On all of those inquiries you received how many tickets did you or the firm cancel?  My point is maybe those inquiries really don’t do a thing.  It is all about % of revenue and if you want to really compare yourselves with the majors, then you will find out that you all do a healthy amount of annuity business.

I finally figured out who truth is…





…drum roll please…





Suzie orman!



Who else bashes annuities so much!

hey "candy" bar,

Why can't you stay on topic ....does your firm have "technology" envy along with your own "other" envy     (a little small in that department are we??? nudge nudge wink wink.... say no more!)

Now I got the correct forum

x ej in 1984



Truth brough up annuties, not I.



BPD



P.S. Can’t believe you left Jones in 1984 and still get them out of you mind.

candy bar,

As I previously posted over the weekend, no I didn't leave in 84.  The 1984 is in reference to the George Orwell book.

Great that Truth brought up VAs.

Please explain how your firm's technology and communications system is so much better than others. Bearing in mind the snafu from this past November and of course bad weather in St.L or anyplace inbetwen St.L and a branch.

xej,



So why don’t you and suzie like VA’s?

Suze doesn’t dislike VAs.  She worked a deal with GE Financial a few years ago to come out with a VA that she endorsed.

Starka,



Does the VA suzie endorse come with an up front cost and lower internal costs or is it the standard B share pricing with a CDSC?



BPD



P.S. Havn’t heard from Truth in awhile. Maybe he and Zacko were the same person.

It was the standard boilerplate B share.  I don't know if they even sell it any more.

FYI...Truth and Zacko are two different people.

How do you know this for sure?



Maybe Starka and Soothsayer are one person?

[quote=BigPayDay]Indy Boy,



Tell me, what technology is Jones missing that you have at your current firm?[/quote]



Sorry this is so late in replying.  I’ve been so busy enjoying my new technology I haven’t had time to respond.



They are missing:

1.  Morningstar Workstation Advisor - a very robust tool for mutual funds, stocks, closed end funds and va.

2.  A REAL financial planning program.  The stuff Jones has is pathetic.  I am a CFP and want to do planning

3.  Advanced trading platform.  I can do 10 trades at once in multiple accounts

4.  I use Forefield Advisor that has a ton of information that I can access quickly on many different topics

5.  Email.  I cant believe how great it is.  You have to have it

6.  My own web site

7.  Scanning documents

8.  Digital tape recorder I can link to my computer and save wav files

9.  High Speed Internet



Theres probably more.  Its ok to stay at Jones but dont stay for the technology.

Not to mention:

10. Only being allowed to sell out of an inventory

11. Being able to buy and run prospecting lists

12. Portability of laptops, if you so choose

13. Access just about any research firm on the street

Big Pay Day-  been working on some big VA business that might just hit close to home for you.  I love how you and your Jones friends endorse the A share annuity.  But problem is this A share annuity pricing structure will factor in very little when your firm goes through the "exam" for annuities by the regulators.  The fact your firm sells an enormous amount of annuities inside of retirement accounts will be what you will need to defend.  Good luck!

On the tech side do you have real time quotes yet?  I assume e-mail is still a no-no.  Bottom line is due to the one man, one office setting many of the liberties others enjoy will never be available for your Jones clowns.  Well, at least that is what the GPs will say.  Truth be known it probably has more to do with the 60% they are taking from you.

"your firm sells an enormous amount of annuities inside of retirement accounts"

Saw some numbers recently that showed about 10% of revenue coming from annuities.  Don't know how much of that is sitting in an IRA, but the total is not much. 

There are plenty of things to rip on Jones for, pushing annuities is not one of them. 

Most major wirehouses are running 1-3%, so if your 10% is right, which I highly question, then you are still on the high end.  Or at least the regulators will see it that way. 

Truth-

You haven't a clue. If you think EDJ has to justify an A share annuity inside an IRA, to the regulators, then the regulators are on a mission to hurt EDJ. They have too many other opportunities that are alot easier to prosecute elsewhere This firm always made us prove the case for the annuity inside an IRA.

If you have been alive during the last five years, insurance companies have been paying benefits with riders that actually worked for the client when the market fluctuated (fell!). For the majority breadwinner with the huge retirement account especially where the spouse has little or no retirement nestegg, and A share maybe a piece of the puzzle. And when you can hit breakpoints its tough not to consider.

You need to de-sharpen your axe with EDJ. I'll admit the last 6 months have been trying, but the firm will survive despite the constant diatribes from reps on this forum.

BTW- In keeping with this thread EDJ does need to improve their technology now. Still hoping for email and remote access. Someday soon, actually sometime this summer I have been told. Truth- If you want to look for a wound inside EDJ.....it's the technology.

It not Truth (or any other poster here, for that matter) or the regulators who’s “wounding” EDJ…it’s the management at Jones itself that’s done the damage.  Look nowhere else.

Truth (a.k.a. False, Suzie Orman),



[quote=The Truth]

Big Pay Day- been working on some big VA business that might just hit close to home for you. I love how you and your Jones friends endorse the A share annuity. But problem is this A share annuity pricing structure will factor in very little when your firm goes through the “exam” for annuities by the regulators. The fact your firm sells an enormous amount of annuities inside of retirement accounts will be what you will need to defend. Good luck! [/quote]



Do you agree that A share pricing on an annuity is better over the long term than B share pricing especially when working with more than $100,000? Of course you do, unless you really are Suzie Orman. OK, then why is Jones the ONLY firm on the street to have A shares? The exam for annuities has been going for quite some time. Jones has and will do just fine.



[quote=The Truth]On the tech side do you have real time quotes yet? I assume e-mail is still a no-no. Bottom line is due to the one man, one office setting many of the liberties others enjoy will never be available for your Jones clowns. Well, at least that is what the GPs will say. Truth be known it probably has more to do with the 60% they are taking from you.[/quote]



Real time quotes - yes, had for more than 10 years at least

Email - soon

Do to the one man / one office model Jones is very much different than our competitors and very hard to duplicate. Differences sell, and differences make our competitor’s jealous.

My pay out last year when you include commissions, bonus, profit sharing, trips, LP return and Goodknight plan reimbursement was over 60%.



BPD



P.S. Ever wonder why Jones is talked about so much on this board? Probably more than 60% of the posts. It’s the same reason the Yankees or Cowboys get the highest ratings when they are on TV. They’re the best. And when you’re the best either you’re loved or hated. There is no middle ground. Either you’re one of us or you want to be one of us and you’re jealous.



Ask yourself this question: Why is it year after year JD Power ranks the Lexus the best atumobile and Edward Jones the best brokerage firm in customer service? Why? They’re the best. Period.

hey candy bar (I see some else thinks you're nutty),

email response is the same one that has been given out for the last ten years.  It's got nothing to do with Compliance as FS already has a program that reviews ALL incoming emails sent to ir via their webpage. There is more than enough storage space in AZ, it's strictly because your firm embraced (or is that embrassed) an old and cheap technology ..... say where is that satellite that went dead last Thanksgiving (talk about a turkey!)

Cowboys and Yankees the best??? I guess you must be talking about the Yankees payroll as they last won the Series in 2000. As for the Cowboys, they last won the SuperBowl in 1996 and now have two quaterbacks named Drew (one is a Buffalo Bills reject .... go figure) and had a better record than 5 other teams last year. Or are you talking about the 2003 season?

And you still don't understand about your own firm.  It's not the firm that gives good customer service, it's the individual ir.

It not Truth (or any other poster here, for that matter) or the regulators who’s “wounding” EDJ…it’s the management at Jones itself that’s done the damage. Look nowhere else.

candy bar,

What does your post have to do with answering tech questions?  How where the 41 Hawaiian irs affected by your firms "leading edge" communications system outage around Thanksgiving? At least these irs don't have to climb up on a roof to brush the snow off a dish. 

Check with your Legal department how many job related injury lawsuits your firm has settled on regarding slipping off a ladder or roof to keep your "leading edge" technology working?   

Ted Jones was a good and just man.

Please don't associate those other two pikers in with him.

Wait a sec, these people don't even have EMAIL???????

When did they get telephones in their offices, or are they still waiting on that too?

Stan, judging by the thorough knowledge in evidence, quality and intellectual content of the posts submitted here by Edward Jones people, I’m not sure that they have opposable thumbs over there.  And you want to give them technology???

candy bar,

I heard EJ Canada branches still used Burrough's (sorry about the spellin) machines up to around 1996 or 97 and thermal paper fax machines until 2002. Is this part of that "leading edge" technology?

candy bar could you also explain what a "wire" is at your firm?    

Could you also describe what programs your firm provides for asset allocation reviews?

[quote=Starka]

Ted Jones was a good and just man.

Please don’t associate those other two pikers in with him.

I know when Ted died.

Bachman is everything that Ted was not.

Hill is nothing but a fall guy...a cipher and nothing more.

Pikers.  Both of them.

Imagaine how strong Jones would be with some good leaders? Huh?

YES!!!  FINALLY YOU GET IT!!!!!

Edward Jones could be a leader in the industry with the right leadership!!!

Starka,



It’s a shame you left. You could have been our saviour?



Not!



Just think, if you stayed with Jones you wouldn’t spend so much time on this board. Just think how much stronger the relationships with your spouse and children would be if you spent all the time on this booard insted with them!



No, that wouldn’t be worth it, would it?



Dude, get a life.

[quote=xej1984]

candy bar,

I heard EJ Canada branches still used Burrough's (sorry about the spellin) machines up to around 1996 or 97 and thermal paper fax machines until 2002. Is this part of that "leading edge" technology?

candy bar could you also explain what a "wire" is at your firm?    

Could you also describe what programs your firm provides for asset allocation reviews?

[/quote]

bpd,

why you ducking my questions?

So I guess Jones isn’t going to fail because of the revenue sharing settlement so its back to bashing our technology? At top producers last month a vote was taken and of the reps that were there 80% said they did NOT want email for client use. Wonder why? We don’t want to be bothered. Our technology is just fine. We have had internal email before there was an internet. It’s called an intranet. And we’ve had it since the early 90’s.



BPD

Why is everyone so bothered about our technology anyway? I personally am excited that next week I get an indoor bathroom and a tin can with a string on it to make calls. BTW, that’s called sarcasm. I point that out for the benefit of one person Stanwbrown.

Of course I wouldn’t want to email clients. I’d rather send client correspondence through the Pony Express.



Those damn other firms can email their clients, but we shouldn’t, since other firms are evil and Jones isn’t.



Sorry, gotta go. I have to watch a Mandatory CE broadcast, the Gospel According to Doug…

In all honesty, I agree about the e-mail thing.  With the regualtory environment being what it is, the record keeping on e-mail is going to become a boondoggle.  I’d just as soon not have it.

bpd,

Most firms had intranets, I had use of it in 1987. Unfortunately your firm was still using teletypes not too long ago.

As far as revenue sharing being closed issue, that swirling blue water in your toilet is not only effecting your comprehension but your memory as well. There is the matter of the $300 million that the California AG has filed, not to mention the Class Action suits are still pending.  Oh by the way have you heard the NASD is investigating the sales of VAs .... something about revenue sharing concerns

bpd, you better concentrate on the blue water while you flush as it doesn't look as your pristine firm (you know the one that always does what's in the client's best interest) is out of the regulatory woods just yet!

[quote=noggin]Why is everyone so bothered about our technology anyway? I personally am excited that next week I get an indoor bathroom and a tin can with a string on it to make calls. BTW, that's called sarcasm. I point that out for the benefit of one person Stanwbrown.[/quote]

Why, tahnks, Noggin, for filling me in...

Just two questions for you; are you with Jones,  and is it fact or sarcasm on the issue of Jones not having email?

Since I would never have guessed how far behind Jones is on other tech issues, so I have to ask; does Jones have cost basis on client statements?

Yes we’ve had cost basis for many years. For securities bought at Jones it’s automatic, for transferred in positions you can manually add cost basis. One of my two full time Jones’ paid BOAs usually enters in the data for transferred in securities. Thanks for asking.



The debate must be close to coming to an end. The Jones Bashers have resorted to bashing Jones technology.

In all honesty, I agree about the e-mail thing. With the regualtory environment being what it is, the record keeping on e-mail is going to become a boondoggle. I’d just as soon not have it.

What a crock.

I am ex-jones... but it is a good firm.  I chose to go independent, and have no regrets, but jones provided a great start for me personally.  As far as technology, yea there is room for improvement, but if you think that e-mail is going to make or break your business you've got a problem.

to bash the leaders of jones is wrong too... well maybe you can bash Hill, but other than that Ed, Ted, and John B. were all good leaders and grew the business, and created a great opportunity for many of us.

Jones tends to be on the leading edge of technology (really) for 2-3 years then they are obselete for 7-8, and it's a cycle.  They invest alot in tech. just not often.

for what its worth

Well said.

the big reason ej doesn't use email is that it crash its "leading edge technology" down loads from satellite communications systems are fast but it's the uploads that are killers. Thats why the UK and Canada head offices are connected to STL via high speed land lines. The UK is strictly email between office and Canary Wharf.

If email is not necessary or to difficult to control why do all the wire houses have it and are able to cope?????

Stan- To answer your questions.

1. yes

2. no

If there's one thing you can count on Edward Jones to do, it's make the worst possible telechnological decisions, and pay the most money to do it!

They hire people who specialize in making good decisions in these areas, and spend tons of money on "user reseach", focus groups, survery, and usability testing.  Unfortunately, the "powers-that-be" (GPs) completely ignore the people they've hired to advise them and the data they collect, and pretty much design by whim.  Expensive, hard-to-use, long-time-to-rollout whims, but whims, nonetheless.

Of course, this is the company where at the Division Meeting for all IS associates, the key message last year was "it doesn't need to be perfect, it just has to be good enough".  Deciding what is "good enough" has been somewhat problematical.

One thing that confuses me is the amount Jones charges on the P&L for technology and the level we actually receive. Last time I looked it was close to $1500 per month LPL charges about $200 a month for more than we have at Jones. Add to that the cost of a high speed internet connection at $80 and it is still 1/5 the cost of jones.

I guess those vacuum tubes are pretty spendy these days.

[quote=gpwanabe]

One
thing that confuses me is the amount Jones charges on the P&L for
technology and the level we actually receive. Last time I looked it was
close to $1500 per month LPL charges about $200 a month for more than
we have at Jones. Add to that the cost of a high speed internet
connection at $80 and it is still 1/5 the cost of jones.

I guess those vacuum tubes are pretty spendy these days.

Not to belabor a point Joe but that is an apples vs oranges type discussion.

[quote=noggin]Not to belabor a point Joe but that is an apples vs oranges type discussion. [/quote]



yah apples and oranges in that my lowest payout is 76% versus what…around 40% at EDJ…?

[quote=7yrvet]

Jones technology was purported to be the leader in '98 when I started with the firm. Lost our communication entirely for a few days due to our never to be found, satelite. We had to be repointed to a new satelite which was a monumental effort to accomplish firmwide. We were told to go to the firm website for instructions. The problem was we did not have alternate web access at the office (DSL or dialup). That was December of last year.

When the highest paid executive in the firm is the MIS manager (4.3M),you would hope it would be based on merit, not tenure. Still waiting for remote access and email. The RTA in our region says this summer. Hopefully the next managing partner will take on this challenge. It is pitiful.

[/quote]

gpwanabe, candybar et al.

There is no comparison to EJ technology, most everybody on this forum has newer, faster technology on their kids PCs at home. Most Crackberries are more versatile/robust than what you have access to!

To claim your firm's technology is the best please explain why "prey" tell is your firm converting to what every other firm currently has???  DSL is what most if not all sub branches have while branches have T3 or even faster.  Has St.L finally converted to MS Office components or are they still on Applix (you know that phenominal robust UNIX office package?)

What about the trips that Maritz books for you? Ever wonder why you can book yourself cheaper flights & better accommodations ..... can you say kick-backs not to mention EJ GP(s)on the BOD of Maritz???

[quote=joedabrkr]

I don't have my paperwork in front of me, and I'm new w/LPL, but I seem to recall my total monthly costs to LPL are about 1000/mo.  This includes my monthly contract fee, technology subscriptions including a financial planning program, and access to S&P & CS First Boston research.  So....it's still less than EJ, and with access to substantially more information, plus a much higher payout!  This, and I get to pick and choose what I pay for.....
[/quote]

I was specifically referring to tech fees. Jones itemizes licensing fees in another place on. Jones does not have CS First research avail, just S&P. So I only included that in my very rough estimate of LPL tech fees. Of course if you have a website it is an extra 100 bucks or so.

Hey bpd, could you run me an annuity hypo on your Jones terminal.

Nevermind.....one of the GP's didn't pay the bill for that.  I guess they will have to sqeeze more money out of Putnam to cover the cost.

Joe- You missed my point. You are dead wrong on the annuity hypo quip btw. My point was that the technology question is not simply a matter of comparing what do I pay each month to see who gets the best deal. Then you always go back to payout, the real reason that you are at LPL is that the payout is higher not that the technology is better…

noggin,

And your point is what, that you have the more antiquiated technology in the branch system (Head Office is a different matter) of most firms????

My point was that the technology question is not simply a matter of comparing what do I pay each month to see who gets the best deal. Then you always go back to payout, the real reason that you are at LPL is that the payout is higher not that the technology is better.....

I think the point is that the technology at Jones, as compared to that available to an independent, makes it much harder to do a comprable job.  In addition the fees that Jones charged (as I remember it was a sattelite connection fee of $1200 a month) were exorbitant compared to the value received.   And yes, I know those fees were not directly taken out of my pocket, but they were charged against the profit and loss* of the office, making it that much more difficult to achieve profitablility.  

I can't speak for Joe, or anyone else, but for me it was a combination of both factors that helped me decide to become indy.  First the payout is much much, did I mention much, higher. Second "I" can control my expenses by deciding what technology platforms and other expenditures I want to subscribe to....or not.  And last; I can actually figure out what my profit and loss is. Whereas at Jones the P&L was a joke. 

 *  I  was a commercial lending officer for some years and I have NEVER seen such a farcical way of determining a P&L of an office.  After the first few months of trying to figure it out: I did.  The P&L is structured in a way to make it most difficult to actually achieve profit in the first few years and to minimize the profit in future years at the branch level.  The company as a whole makes profit, but the mathematical formulas used at the branch level are a joke.....on the IR.

Babbling looney,

I have to agree with you on your last post, I just had a 20k gross month, and my P&L said I was profitable by $183.00. I do find that a little hard to belive. The more you make the more they take!

[quote=SA_Jim]

I have to agree with you on your last post, I just had a 20k gross month, and my P&L said I was profitable by $183.00. I do find that a little hard to belive. The more you make the more they take!

[/quote]

SA_Jim,

You are missing the point.  You get to keep Part of that 183 bucks as your bonus.  Idependant reps dont get a bonus.

gonna be a GP,

I just didn't like the fact that if I grossed 8k my direct expenses were 10K, but if I grossed 20k then my direct expenses were 14k. And the direct expense also included my pay. Like I said the more you make the more they take. Total to run my office is only $2788 plus what I pay my BOA and her benefits.

If I grossed $20K and my profit was $183, you can bet I'd be looking around to see what I could get rid of.  And if the elephant on my back was my B/D, they'd be gone in a heartbeat.

What is there to think about?

Philo,

The $183 was above all the P&L (expesis) and would have gone for bonis. I was paid about 39% of gross (pretax).

typo “expenses”  

You are missing the point.  You get to keep Part of that 183 bucks as your bonus.  Idependant reps dont get a bonus

YOU are missing the point.  Independent reps don't need to get a bonus.   On my 20K gross month it works like this.  BTW I just had a 32K month

20,000 less 20% override to B/D =$16,000 to me pre tax

Less monthly deductible expenses of lease $500 (I know really cheap ), E&O insurance $200, Phone and DSL $140, Utlitiies $50, Liability Insurance $45, Advertising budget $150, Affiliation fee and software production subscriptions Morningstar etc $220 = $1305 bare bones base overhead.  No assistant as yet as I don't need one so far. So ok lets round it up to $1500 so I can buy sodas, pens, toilet paper and take clients to lunch.   Remember this is bare bones, I can choose to spend more on advertising, software, what have you.

16,000 - 1500 = $14,500 net/gross pre tax.   Compare to SA_Jim's 39%  or $7,800 pre tax     From which he also gets to pay for the sodas, pens, toilet paper, advertising and lunches and a really really expensive health insurance plan.    So why would I give a rat's behind about a crappy $183 going into a bonus?

I figured out that the P&L was a racket or catch 22 trick.  As Jim says the more you make the more they take out.  It made no sense.

Update to my previous post.  The B/D deducts the ticket costs before the 80% pay out.  Ticket costs are minimal on most trades and for those clients who are doing small mutual fund buys, we go directly to the fund family to avoid ticket costs of any kind.  When I do insurance, long term care, health insurance or fixed annuity business, the payout is 100%.    Believe me, after being hosed by EDJ I made sure to crunch the numbers and get all the costs of doing business up front before deciding to make a move.  

(Never mess with a prior loan officer when it comes to checking the numbers  )

My comment was a little tounge and cheek.

But to add to you comment on the P&L being a racket. It gets even better on the bonus payout system.  They talk about the 40% bunus bracket, but it is graduated. In Jims case, he would keep $14.00 of his profit. The impact on his payout would be noteworthy.

7800+14=7814

7814/20000=.3907 or a payout of 39.07%

Take that to the bank baby!

Do I understand that the referenced payout is 39% before incidental office expenses and and then rent, salaries, utilities, etc. are folded back in and charged to your personal P&L?  So that means that your personal cut is added to your expense, and is weighted against you to the tune of 61%?  Then your tech charges ($1400????) are on a sliding scale, increasing as your gross goes up????  Then you ultimately get your head above water after that and they want to take a portion of the amount that you make over that larceny???

Who are you with????  I'd run from those bandits at the speed of light!

My comment was a little tounge and cheek.

But to add to you comment on the P&L being a racket. It gets even better on the bonus payout system.  They talk about the 40% bunus bracket, but it is graduated. In Jims case, he would keep $14.00 of his profit. The impact on his payout would be noteworthy.

7800+14=7814

7814/20000=.3907 or a payout of 39.07%

Take that to the bank baby!

  My mistake. I thought you were serious. Many of the current EDJ posters on this board are so deluded that they would think this is a good deal.

This is about Edward Jones?

No wonder there's so much anger generated towards the firm.

That's thievery, bordering on being a Ponzi scheme.

And to think I thought this thread was about Jones technology. Why is it every Jones thread comes down to payout no matter what subject it starts on?

[quote=noggin]And to think I thought this thread was about Jones
technology. Why is it every Jones thread comes down to payout no matter
what subject it starts on? [/quote]



hmmmmm…maybe becoz their payout REALLY REALLY SUCKS!  And when
folks stop and do the math they realize they’re getting screwed?

Joe- After being courted by AGE lately, I got to tell you that all payouts outside of independents is far less than what the independent’s are. AGE’s isn’t a great improvement on Jones and as a matter of fact depending where you are on production could be higher at Jones. You build your business with the help of a name and THEN you transition to an independent…

The underlying truth on technology is that although it does make life easier, it’s no substitute for knowing our craft, which is meeting people and asking for an order.  One can spend all day every day looking a computer screen and accomplishing nothing with a great deal of efficiency.  People have been raging successes in our business with nothing more than a pencil and paper. 

Long, long, long time ago in a far away Galaxy called Jonesville, self proclaimed Leaders named  J.B  & Doug "3" Mil Hill decided that Edward Jones should forget about the INTERNET, and go to a satellite system!  Wow, it was a no brainier, wasn't it!

It worked fine until one day the satellite fell from the sky....Then "3" Mil Hill said, we are going to Hardwire all of our offices!

We want to keep or identity as being different.....and guess who has paid for all of this changes, and bad decisions?  Could it be the Drones and the Clones, yes it was!  But they still love their Truthful leaders.......

And even now Edward Jones is still not on the net, still can't communicate on the net......yes Doug "3" Mil Hill it is time to forget about the string and your empty can of beans, it just doesn't cut it anymore....you need to get into the 21st century and get on the net .....

While all this was going on they forgot about full disclosure for their beloved clients in fact they still haven't told them about the 75 Million, mostly paid by the Drones & the Clones and since they all love Doug "3" Mil Hill who had to pay 3 Million in SEC Fines or go to jail for FRAUD, but the Drones  and the Clones still defend him..........could they really be that stupid..read their postings and you will know it's true........some say it's the Kool Aid, some say it's the brainwashing....who knows for sure?

That is the story of Edward Jones Technology Saga, by the Player

Signing off on the net.....................

Communications charges agains P&L: $1425

Quote from guy in region in charge of disseminating the latest technology propoganda:

"The firm wants to increase the number of offices so we can spread our tech costs over a wider base"

For that much money I should be able to place trades via voice command in my car while driving past the regional meeting to a real resort for some R&R.

I repeat,

"Communications charges agains P&L: $1425 "

10,000 offices and shrinking every day.... how's that bigger base coming Dougy.  Do you think the tech charges will go up or down from here.  How about PDA support and those tablet PC's I heard about. Sh*t how about DSL.

Out.

[quote=gpwanabe]

"The firm wants to increase the number of offices so we can spread our tech costs over a wider base"

[/quote]

Believe it or not, that's the same thing they were telling us back in 1997!  What are they thinking?  "Build it and they will come"?

interesting description of my former firm. Although trying to enter the technology age my former colleagues still can't email clients like I can.

Have a read a ZDNet article

http://blogs.zdnet.com/ip-telephony/

Even Luddites can change - gradually

I remember reading a Wall Street Journal article a few years ago examining broker Edward Jones' then-apparent resistance to technology innovation. The piece mentioned that - in contrast to the sweeping momentum of online investing and ubiquitous broker contact options of most other investment services firms, Edward Jones brokers preferred customer contact through phone and in-person visits to one of their 6,000 retail locations. Some brokers didn't have email addresses.

Old phones, and no email. So "90s"- 1890s.

Yet even Luddites can change- at least somewhat. Today, Edward Jones and 3Com announced that the broker would be purchasing the 3Com Convergence Applications Suite. The core of the solution is the 3Com VCX IP Telephony module, which includes IP telephones, 3Com 4400-PWR enterprise switches, and the3COM Router 5000.

Combined, The Suite offers IP Telephony,IP Messaging, IP Mobility and IP Contact Center services.

First on board for the retrofit: conversion of Jones' St. Louis coroporate HQ to a 3Com-based IP telephony solution.

Oh, but still no email, at least not overtly on the Edward Jones website. Their agents have contact forms. Understandable in the age of spam, but …

This just keeps getting better and better.......................

Notice how all of the Jones defenders have left the building?

Could it be the TRUTH hurts?

Also they all got busted for slamming instead of stating facts

By the way that $ 1,425 was about what I paid all last year including new Programs and upgrades..........Those GP's do know how to cook the books, don't they?

Just maybe it's needed in St. Louis to pay those $75 Million in Fines, oh they said it wouldn't cost the IR in the field, but they also said the field was it's only source of revenue, didn't they? 

Doug "3" Mil Hill to the Greatest Sales Force in the world...suckers, oh that was a miss print or was it?

Now we should talk about what we are paying for. I’m suprised nobody has mentioned that antiquated order by number portfolio system yet.



"I’ll take one number 3 and super size it please"



Translation: Person coming in with large rollover that falls into the "High Income and Savings Years"



The best is when they tried to add color to it and couln’t get the graphs to print out right. So ot looks no better than black and white (now its yellow and green or something) and the bar graphs overlap each other.

I can access my office from PC...I can access my office email from any PC so I can send messages to clients and my office staff from any PC.

The technology is light years ahead at most firms when compared to Jones.   Why then do the IR's rate it so highly in RR annual survey?  That's how isolated the typical IR is from the truth and how much they buy into management's spin. 

Everything I thought about going indy has come true--in fact, it's even better than I envisioned.  But, hey--we can't really compare Jones and Indy, can we? 

port,sample,3,p-all



breathtaking.

So the way I figure it 1400 times ~9000 offices equals roughly $13 million per month in revenue that they do not have to pay bonuses on.



I’m sure that covers the fees to the suppliers of Portfolio, JCMS, Jones Link, the great new Quotes and Research and of course "Intercom"



Actually I’m quite sure those were all cooked up in house so there are no licensing fees.



At this rate 6 months of tech fees pays the 75 million fine and then some. Maybe enough extra for a golden parachute for the fallen hero D3MH.

How do you think we pay our unamed partner in charge of technology all that money.

D3MH

By the hard work, sweat and tears of the poor basterd who calls themself "IR".

By the way, there used to be a cartoon called "I R Baboon"

SA_Jim

Whatr happen to all the Jones Drones and Clones telling us how good it is?

The TRUTH....BITES!

Talking technology with Jones IRs is like fighting a one legged man in an a** kicking contest. It just ain’t fair.

smoke N mirrors,

Can't add to that!   Well said...................

According to the "Uptick" Rich Malone just won the Computerworld 100 award for leadership and innovation as a corporate IT leader.

If you go to the Computerworld website, it says that the award was for Jones being one of the top 100 places to work.

Now, being a great place to work is fantastic for Jones, but I bring it up here because it is another example of Jones twisting the truth to make one of their weak points look better.

[quote=brokerbob]

According to the "Uptick" Rich Malone just won the Computerworld 100 award for leadership and innovation as a corporate IT leader.

If you go to the Computerworld website, it says that the award was for Jones being one of the top 100 places to work.

Now, being a great place to work is fantastic for Jones, but I bring it up here because it is another example of Jones twisting the truth to make one of their weak points look better.

[/quote]

Brokerbob,

Well said, it's just like Edawrd Jones wins another JD Power award, they are all over the local papers, bragging about it, and at the same time they have failed to level with their clients about revenue sharing...........I don't understand how any honest IR  can stand to stay there any longer..............