Leaving Edward Jones
Need some help from anyone who can answer a couple questions...
I'm looking at leaving Edward Jones in a week or so and I have been there for 28 months. When I started they mentioned that if I left before 36 months I would have to pay them back for training costs. Do they truly come at you for this?
Also if I leave BEFORE I get my final check has anyone heard of Edward Jones withholding that final check from anyone?
Thanks for your help!!!!
This is certainly not what you might want to hear, but if you could tough it
out for another 8 month the question will become moot.
When I left, it was after the 3 year window. However, I did receive my paycheck after I had left. In fact, I left around the 6th of the month, and my paycheck included my trails for that month (which hit when I was no longer employed). I was pretty surprised. I am assuming it was trails, as I had no access to a commission report, but it was about the same number as my monthly trails, and I obviously did no other business (yes, this is a run-on sentence).
I understand that if I wait then this question is irrevelant but I cannot wait.
Also does anyone know if the 3 years is from your hire date or from your can-sell date?
They define 3 years as from your can-sell date (that is when you are registered with the NASD/NYSE).
See my previous post on your other thread for other details.
To answer your question, no, they won’t come after you, as long as you don’t go work for another brokerage firm. If you do, be prepared for a bill. Yes, they send a bill. <!–
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It’s stated in the contract you signed.
A fellow indy in my town left Jones after 35 months (he signed a 36 month non-compete contract) anf they came after him for $10,000. He settled with them for $2,000.
I'm quite familiary with this, as I have 2 friends who left Jones under the 36 month contract.
One - Jones settled with Morgan Stanley for about 1/2 of what was left on the contract (over $30,000).
Two - this guy did not have a big firm backing him. he received a bill for over $10,000. He sent a rebuttal letter...the attys for Jones offered to settle for 1/2 of what was owed. He didn't reply. Failure to reply to any of their letters (or sending a cease and desist letter to them) results in automatic arbitration proceedings being initiated (a suit is filed against you) with the NASD.
Take the contract seriously, as they do. Btw...vegabond is right...it is 3 years from your licensing with NASD and SEC...whichever registration date is later is the one they use.
ManDate How long did # 2 have left on his contract? What was his result?
Anyone else hear any stories like this? What where the results? Currently thinking of leaving Jones 6 months prior to my contract expiration and I'd like to get a feel for how much I'd be able to settle for.
[quote=ManDate]Two - this guy did not have a big firm backing him. he received a bill for over $10,000. He sent a rebuttal letter...the attys for Jones offered to settle for 1/2 of what was owed. He didn't reply. Failure to reply to any of their letters (or sending a cease and desist letter to them) results in automatic arbitration proceedings being initiated (a suit is filed against you) with the NASD.[/quote]
Well that was stupid. For those of you unschooled in arbitration, know this...that joker will have at least $5,000 worth of heartburn and attorney fees, PLUS, he'll probably still owe the $5K. Settling for five grand would have been an easy decision for me...what's your freedom worth?!!
MD, if/when the outcome is known, assuming there is no gag order, a post of the results would be appreciated. A friend of mine settled pre-arbitration, but before he signed the settlement agreement, which included a mutual confidentiality clause, he told me all about it...
[quote=gad12]
ManDate How long did # 2 have left on his contract? What was his result?
Anyone else hear any stories like this? What where the results? Currently thinking of leaving Jones 6 months prior to my contract expiration and I'd like to get a feel for how much I'd be able to settle for.
[/quote]
If you only have 6 months left, why can you stay and then go? Seems to me 6 mths is nothing versus fighting with EJ in the end.
I left Edward Jones after 10 months. I already had my Series 7. My first day was day one at KYC. And did not do the months of studying for the Series 7 like most others. Now I am very concerned about training costs being charged back to me! Something I did not even consider! Finance is all I know, of course I need to go work for another broker/dealer. Any advice?
[quote=Broker64]I left Edward Jones after 10 months. I already had my Series 7. My first day was day one at KYC. And did not do the months of studying for the Series 7 like most others. Now I am very concerned about training costs being charged back to me! Something I did not even consider! Finance is all I know, of course I need to go work for another broker/dealer. Any advice?[/quote]
This is a matter of contract law. You need to look carefully at you various employment related contracts to determine if you may have agreed to repay training costs. If you came to them already licensed you should not have had to sign that, but only you can be sure on what you did agree to.
If there is nothing about repaying, you should be fine (at least on that point). If your contract includes the typical training costs clause, you have trouble. No one made you sign a contract, and you’re (presumably) a big boy. I’m not saying I LIKE the training costs clauses, but EDJ is far from alone in using these, and acting to collect on them.
If you’re not sure and you intend to continue working in the industry, get proper legal counsel. You should have done that BEFORE you left, to protect yourself and to plan an orderly exit so you can bring most of your book with you to a new B/D. That’s probably your biggest challenge - bringing your book with you if you have a significant delay between leaving and starting with a new B/D, especially if you just changed B/D’ers 10 months ago. This all sounds very odd to me.
Anyway, if you are on the line for repaying training costs, your best bet is to find a B/D who is willing to absorb those costs as part of the cost of hiring you, which could be hard if you have no prospect of bringing over an existing book of business.
And in the future look FIRST, jump SECOND!
Another bit of advice. Call EJ HR and have them fax you a copy of your employment agreement. It is fairly short and to the point. Let us know if the training costs are in the contract.
10 months=75k
Now that is edward jones’s 2nd profit center.
He may have signed a different contract since he was already licensed....This topic has to be shared with everyone interested in Jones!
I agree with Broker7 this is nice little profit center for the Cult![quote=Greenbacks]This topic has to be shared with everyone interested in Jones!
I agree with Broker7 this is nice little profit center for the Cult! [/quote] Most firms make you sign these, and will come after you if you leave for another firm within a certain period. Not sure where anyone got the idea it was just a Jones thing (well I guess since it is the "thing to do" on this board).Can you name me one other firm that will bill you $75,000 for training if you quit and go to another firm?
of course they bill you!! c’mon, it is just good business. They flew me to Tempe several times and it was very well done compared to other corporate sales training that I have been in. I was on “salary plus” the entire time, to boot.
After 2 years the bill is half, after 3 years it is zero. Makes sense, and it's not just Jones. Find a LEGITIMATE beef to bash jones with; there are plenty.Most, if not all, larger B/D’ers who pay for training and/or a salary during your early months will come after you to recoup training costs if you leave in the defined period. They may differ on how much and how long, and whether they prorate the recapture based on how much time you served. But coming after you is not limited to EDJ.
LOL…did the other corporate training “bill” you for the trips?
No....because it is illegal.[quote=Broker7]LOL…did the other corporate training “bill” you for the trips?
No....because it is illegal.[/quote]If you signed a contract agreeing to repay money during a defined period, it is certainly not illegal to be pursued to enforce that contract. It may suck, but it's both legal and common practice in our industry.
no kidding…I know the EJ contract well.
I was asking newnew if the other companies he worked for billed him for corporate training. I think not. I have also been told the EJ contract could be contestable in right to work states.exactly…if you disagree, don’t sign it and train yourself! (good luck)
[quote=Broker7]no kidding…I know the EJ contract well.
I was asking newnew if the other companies he worked for billed him for corporate training. I think not. I have also been told the EJ contract could be contestable in right to work states. [/quote]That is likely referring to the non-compete or non-solicit portion, but not the training costs, which is subject to contract law not employment laws.
$75K is VERY out of the ordinary… for the second time…give me another comparable example.
[quote=Broker7]$75K is VERY out of the ordinary… for the second time…give me another comparable example.[/quote]
I don’t know why you seem so amazed at this, unless you haven’t been tuned into this for a while. I’m sure there are many comparables, but I’ll cite one: AGE’s training contract is even worse: $75K for 5 years, but prorated so one fifth is forgiven at the conclusion of each year.
Having just come from Arbitration with EDJ, I can tell you what the Arbitrators in my case said about some of the objections by EDJ Legal Team:
1) When Jones tried to point out that I had no prior Securities Industry training and therefore 'owed' them for the training and experience which resulted in my success at Jones and continued success afterward, the Arbitrators dismissed the argument. Their view was that I maintained above standard % performance throughout my career from the begining, therefore though Jones trained me, my success was my own. Further, my branch was profitable after less than two years, so I 'owed' the firm nothing. 2) EDJ second argument was that a study done on my branch revealed that 12 months after I left Jones, 76.5% of the assets had transferred to me. The Arbitrators also dismissed this argument stating that while Jones might be able to track that the assets left EDJ, they could not prove they had acutally come to me. EDJ agreed. 3) EDJ third argument was that the assets I took belonged to EDJ and I had signed a non-compete clause. This was also dismissed- the Head Panelist informed EDJ that the 'assets' do not belong to EDJ- they belong to the client and ulitmately it is the clients' decision on where they want them to go. I was not a transfer broker, so I can only guess based on what I experienced and what I have read- BUT if a transfer broker comes to EDJ and is encouraged and instructed/ assisted in bringing clients with them from their previous firm, EDJ cannot cry foul when that broker leave EDJ and invites clients to join them. So for what it's worth, I would fight them.Thank you munytalks and everyone else with your answers! It is truly appreciated!
[quote=munytalks]
Having just come from Arbitration with EDJ, I can tell you what the Arbitrators in my case said about some of the objections by EDJ Legal Team:
1) When Jones tried to point out that I had no prior Securities Industry training and therefore 'owed' them for the training and experience which resulted in my success at Jones and continued success afterward, the Arbitrators dismissed the argument. Their view was that I maintained above standard % performance throughout my career from the begining, therefore though Jones trained me, my success was my own. Further, my branch was profitable after less than two years, so I 'owed' the firm nothing. 2) EDJ second argument was that a study done on my branch revealed that 12 months after I left Jones, 76.5% of the assets had transferred to me. The Arbitrators also dismissed this argument stating that while Jones might be able to track that the assets left EDJ, they could not prove they had acutally come to me. EDJ agreed. 3) EDJ third argument was that the assets I took belonged to EDJ and I had signed a non-compete clause. This was also dismissed- the Head Panelist informed EDJ that the 'assets' do not belong to EDJ- they belong to the client and ulitmately it is the clients' decision on where they want them to go. I was not a transfer broker, so I can only guess based on what I experienced and what I have read- BUT if a transfer broker comes to EDJ and is encouraged and instructed/ assisted in bringing clients with them from their previous firm, EDJ cannot cry foul when that broker leave EDJ and invites clients to join them.So for what it's worth, I would fight them. [/quote]
That's good. Too bad not all arbitrators would necessarily feel the same way. I am sure tehre are some out there who would say "you signed a contract, kid, now live with it". Although I hope to never be in this situation, I think there are legitimate points for both sides. Jones should not have to absorb the cost of training, paying salary, bonuses, etc. for an advisor that is just a drain on the firm, just to watch them walk across the street (and get paid to bring their book!), watch their assets leave, and have nothing to show for it in the first few years. On the other hand, is that just the cost of doing business?? One final thought.....I think Jones is less concerned about the money, and more concerned about discouraging people from leaving. It costs them much more to recruit and develop a new FA replacement, rather than developing a current FA to profitability. I am willing to bet Jones recoups less than $1mm per year in training costs - and I bet that's even a long shot.
Hello,
I am looking to become an Internal Wholesaler at a Mutual Fund Company where I would need my licenses. I've been with Jones since 11/2009. This side of the business is not for me. At the mutual fund company, I wouldn't be engaged in solicitation of clients, nor would I be a Financial Advisor.
Will Jones come after me for training costs?
I figure that it's not engaged in selling securities or insurance, so I would assume no. Please let me know either way as soon as you can.
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