Do you wear a suit?

Maybe you should dress casual on Thursdays, too.

And Mondays might work…



Actually, I’m not a fan of “dressing the part”.  I think the
"real" look works best, at least in my world.  I personally feel
phony when I where a suit.  Actually I have a motto that I can’t
say here for confidentiality purposes that addresses this.



If a client chooses a FA due to what he/she wears… God help them.

You don't wear a suit to impress yourself or your client.  The suit is an outward sign of respect for the client, and the task they may entrust to you--that is, taking care of their life savings.  It's the same reason that you wear a suit to a wedding, funeral, or an Easter church service.  It's about respect.  Wear it every day.  Even Friday.  If yours is not comfortable, find a new tailor. 

Yesterday it was close to 100 degrees in my market.  I had two high level appointments.  One was in the office, the other out of the office.  I put in a 13 hour day, and felt comfortable the entire time.  Quit buying cheap polyester suits, and then you won't be uncomfortable, and neither will your clients.

[quote=Soothsayer]

You don't wear a suit to impress yourself or your client.  The suit is an outward sign of respect for the client, and the task they may entrust to you--that is, taking care of their life savings.  It's the same reason that you wear a suit to a wedding, funeral, or an Easter church service.  It's about respect.  Wear it every day.  Even Friday.  If yours is not comfortable, find a new tailor. 

Yesterday it was close to 100 degrees in my market.  I had two high level appointments.  One was in the office, the other out of the office.  I put in a 13 hour day, and felt comfortable the entire time.  Quit buying cheap polyester suits, and then you won't be uncomfortable, and neither will your clients.

[/quote]

What he said.

[quote=Ready2Jump]And Mondays might work...

Actually, I'm not a fan of "dressing the part".  I think the "real" look works best, at least in my world.  I personally feel phony when I where a suit.  Actually I have a motto that I can't say here for confidentiality purposes that addresses this.

If a client chooses a FA due to what he/she wears... God help them.

[/quote]

A serious question.  How old are you and what type of market do you serve--rural, small town, etc?  What is a state that borders yours?

Sooth is right. Dressing for the seriousness of the occasion whichis handling people's life savings.  I wear either dresses, skirt and jacket combo or pants suit types of outfits. Fabrics that won't wrinkle like rayon or silk blends and a fabric brush at hand to get rid of any dust, cat hair or other fluff. Heels and nylons at all times and tastefully expensive jewelry.  Not bling. Understated make up in neutral colors. It was also over 105 degrees here too...nylons in that heat....ick.  But it must be done.

The only time I dress down is when I go golfing and even then I wear a matching outfit and hat. No jeans or cut offs or ever ever ever a polo shirt in public for me as a woman. 

It is important to look tastefully dressed even when going to the grocery store.  You never know when you are going to run into a client or a prospect. 

Now at home, that's another story.  Bring on the khaki shorts,tank tops and flip flops!!!

[quote=babbling looney]

"...or ever ever ever a polo shirt in public for me as a woman. "

[/quote]

I agree completely, except the above. What's the issue with polo shirts?

[quote=mikebutler222][quote=babbling looney]

"...or ever ever ever a polo shirt in public for me as a woman. "

[/quote]

I agree completely, except the above. What's the issue with polo shirts?

[/quote]

We in our office don like em.  Plus when the vendors show up with them as booby prizes for listening to the schpiel, they are always men-sizes.  Might as well take it home to the hubby for him to wear & advertise on golf course since rep and I don't play.

We second what Babs says about dressing. Suits n heels / dresses n heels. We do casual Friday's because we close at 1pm, but clients know that and usual don't even bother to come in. But casual is capri's and blouses twin sets etc.

[quote=mikebutler222][quote=babbling looney]

"...or ever ever ever a polo shirt in public for me as a woman. "

[/quote]

I agree completely, except the above. What's the issue with polo shirts?

[/quote]

They don't suit my figure and I hate the collars.  Shall we just say they bring too much emphasis to the upper part of my body

How bout the suits those annuity wholesalers wear!!!!! Who are they kidding.  Like $1000 a pop. 

Even my wealthiest clients do not wear suits like that.

I think a nice, well made suit fits most business meetings.  But, you have to be able to make your client feel comfortable (and not like they are underdressed).

[quote=babbling looney]

Sooth is right. Dressing for the seriousness of the occasion whichis handling people's life savings.  I wear either dresses, skirt and jacket combo or pants suit types of outfits. Fabrics that won't wrinkle like rayon or silk blends and a fabric brush at hand to get rid of any dust, cat hair or other fluff. Heels and nylons at all times and tastefully expensive jewelry.  Not bling. Understated make up in neutral colors. It was also over 105 degrees here too...nylons in that heat....ick.  But it must be done.

The only time I dress down is when I go golfing and even then I wear a matching outfit and hat. No jeans or cut offs or ever ever ever a polo shirt in public for me as a woman. 

It is important to look tastefully dressed even when going to the grocery store.  You never know when you are going to run into a client or a prospect. 

Now at home, that's another story.  Bring on the khaki shorts,tank tops and flip flops!!!

[/quote]

Agreed.

But, don't you hate it when you run out of milk and just pop to the store in sweats and a ponytail.  It stinks!!! You always see a great client or prospect.

FAs are human too.  (or most of us)

t

[quote=maybeeeeeeee]

How bout the suits those annuity wholesalers wear!!!!! Who are they kidding.  Like $1000 a pop. 

Even my wealthiest clients do not wear suits like that.

I think a nice, well made suit fits most business meetings.  But, you have to be able to make your client feel comfortable (and not like they are underdressed).

[/quote]

Our VK vendor borrowed his dad's suit. (like 2 times his size) He's got a set of ears on him like a cab drivin down the street with the doors open. Was ALL excited to talk about VK. Rep had to laugh....poor kid had NO idea why.

We've secretly dubbed him Curious George now.

[quote=maybeeeeeeee][quote=babbling looney]

Sooth is right. Dressing for the seriousness of the occasion whichis handling people's life savings.  I wear either dresses, skirt and jacket combo or pants suit types of outfits. Fabrics that won't wrinkle like rayon or silk blends and a fabric brush at hand to get rid of any dust, cat hair or other fluff. Heels and nylons at all times and tastefully expensive jewelry.  Not bling. Understated make up in neutral colors. It was also over 105 degrees here too...nylons in that heat....ick.  But it must be done.

The only time I dress down is when I go golfing and even then I wear a matching outfit and hat. No jeans or cut offs or ever ever ever a polo shirt in public for me as a woman. 

It is important to look tastefully dressed even when going to the grocery store.  You never know when you are going to run into a client or a prospect. 

Now at home, that's another story.  Bring on the khaki shorts,tank tops and flip flops!!!

[/quote]

Agreed.

But, don't you hate it when you run out of milk and just pop to the store in sweats and a ponytail.  It stinks!!! You always see a great client or prospect.

FAs are human too.  (or most of us)

t

[/quote]

LOL ....It never fails!!!  If I leave off from gardening or painting and go to the store for "just a sec" in my grubbies, THAT"S when I see a good client or prospect.   That's also why I press gang my husband to go to the store for those quick trips.  No one cares how he dresses, including him.

[quote=babbling looney][quote=mikebutler222][quote=babbling looney]

"...or ever ever ever a polo shirt in public for me as a woman. "

[/quote]

I agree completely, except the above. What's the issue with polo shirts?

[/quote]

They don't suit my figure and I hate the collars.  Shall we just say they bring too much emphasis to the upper part of my body

[/quote]

"too much emphasis"? There's no such thing 

[quote=Devoted SA][quote=mikebutler222][quote=babbling looney]

"...or ever ever ever a polo shirt in public for me as a woman. "

[/quote]

I agree completely, except the above. What's the issue with polo shirts?

[/quote]

We in our office don like em.

[/quote]

I didn't mean in the office. BL has said "ever in public", but thanks for the input.

I’m sorry -I meant as a consensus. In the office/out of the office.

[/quote]

LOL ....It never fails!!!  If I leave off from gardening or painting and go to the store for "just a sec" in my grubbies, THAT"S when I see a good client or prospect.   That's also why I press gang my husband to go to the store for those quick trips.  No one cares how he dresses, including him.

[/quote]

How about running into client at a bar or restaurant - I've been dressed....but toasting Pancho Villa for Cinco De Mayo at the bar or stuffing your face and client wanders in?  Have to choke down bite of whatever you just shoveled in to stand up shake hands say hello etc.

[quote=Devoted SA]I'm sorry -I meant as a consensus. In the office/out of the office.[/quote]

Well, I agree they're not office wear, but out of the office I think they look smart on most women.

[quote=maybeeeeeeee]

How bout the suits those annuity wholesalers wear!!!!! Who are they kidding.  Like $1000 a pop. 

Even my wealthiest clients do not wear suits like that.

I think a nice, well made suit fits most business meetings.  But, you have to be able to make your client feel comfortable (and not like they are underdressed).

[/quote]

I've never noticed that wholesalers wear expensive suits, but I have noticed some wear suits that are too "contemporary" in their styling.<?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

I am in a rural area in California - small town.  The attornies
and CPA’s don’t wear suits.  I’ve had clients tell me that they
like the way I dress compared to the guy at the bank… and these are
large clients.  I basically dress like your typical golf
professional.  Very nice tailored slacks and a pressed golf shirt.



Again, I have to reiterate, I am going indy so I want to create the
kind of atmosphere and reputation that I want.  I will attract the
kind of client who accepts that.  If a client picks the bank guy
over me simply due to the way we are dressed, I probably don’t want
them as a client.  And I am not trying to become a million dollar
producer either.  I will be happy to get to $30m in the next few
years. 



Before anyone gets hostel, I am NOT putting down someone who wears a
suit everyday by choice.  That’s wonderful too… for you.  I
want my clients to get excited about the Luau theme at my upcoming
seminar.  That’s just me.  Our world is changing thanks to
the RIA option, but not everyone has to embrace it.



Oh, and to answer your question, I am young in THE business, but old in
BUSINESS.   It takes a visionary to look outside the
box.  Thanks for your question NASD.

[quote=Ready2Jump]I am in a rural area in California - small town.  The attornies and CPA's don't wear suits.  I've had clients tell me that they like the way I dress compared to the guy at the bank... and these are large clients.  I basically dress like your typical golf professional.  Very nice tailored slacks and a pressed golf shirt.

Again, I have to reiterate, I am going indy so I want to create the kind of atmosphere and reputation that I want.  I will attract the kind of client who accepts that.  If a client picks the bank guy over me simply due to the way we are dressed, I probably don't want them as a client.  And I am not trying to become a million dollar producer either.  I will be happy to get to $30m in the next few years. 

Before anyone gets hostel, I am NOT putting down someone who wears a suit everyday by choice.  That's wonderful too... for you.  I want my clients to get excited about the Luau theme at my upcoming seminar.  That's just me.  Our world is changing thanks to the RIA option, but not everyone has to embrace it.

Oh, and to answer your question, I am young in THE business, but old in BUSINESS.   It takes a visionary to look outside the box.  Thanks for your question NASD.

[/quote]

Speaking of hostels, at your age you'll find places all over Europe where you can share a bath--and it will be cheap and they won't care what you wear.

A broker wearing a suit will never appear to be overdressed.

Period.

Next topic.

[quote=NASD Newbie]

A broker wearing a suit will never appear to be overdressed.

Period.

Next topic.

Yeah, suits are great…BL can we talk about polo shirts? Pleeeeeease?

[quote=Ready2Jump]

Again, I have to reiterate, I am going indy so I want to create the kind of atmosphere and reputation that I want.  I will attract the kind of client who accepts that.  If a client picks the bank guy over me simply due to the way we are dressed, I probably don't want them as a client.  And I am not trying to become a million dollar producer either.  I will be happy to get to $30m in the next few years.

[/quote]

Sounds like you're a sales manager's wet dream.

Who would not want a salesman working for him who didn't want to make much money, and who figures that clients are not really worth getting anyway.

Practice this phrase.  "May I supersize that for you, sir?"

McDee’s!  Now that would be a great place to setup a remote
office.  One of my clients owns 3 of them.  He and his rich
buddies hang out there every morning for a cheap breakfast.  And
the grandma at the counter can’t figure out how to live on the income
from her $500k in CD’s.  Hmmm… sounds tasty to me. 



You sounded very natural saying that line NASD.  Your insight into
our industry has taught me a lot.  You should do this discussion
board for a living… oh, looks like you might be. 



Oh, and my McDee’s owner client… he hates $1000 suit wearing brokers.

I was walking from my car to a client's office, all of 50 feet, when I felt something pop in one of my shoes. The shoe was not a cheap shoe, nor was I wearing a cheap suit, shirt, tie etc. The client I was visiting is into the finer things and would notice anything amiss. What popped was the thread or whatever it is that holds the sole of the shoe to the upper. it all but completely let go. I was beat. No choice but to walk in with one sole flopping. Very impressive!!!!

We dress country club causal on non meeting days, suits for meetings with clients.

[quote=Ready2Jump]

Oh, and my McDee's owner client... he hates $1000 suit wearing brokers.
[/quote]

No he doesn't.

Nobody forms their opinion of somebody because they are wearing clothes that appropriate for the occasion.

As somebody told you, you wear a suit in this business because it shows respect for the business--the responsibilities you are asking to assume.

Go to the library and find a copy of "Dress for Success"--it applies in rural California as well as it does in New York.

[quote=tjc45]

We dress country club causal on non meeting days, suits for meetings with clients.

[/quote]

Lots of places adopted a "dress down Friday" routine.  The real pros kept a suit, starched shirt, tie, etc. hanging in a closet in the office just in case somebody called to say they were coming over in an hour.

My firm's policy was/is that there is a sign at the receptionist desk that says, "Friday's are dress down day at Acme Brokerage" which is simply trying to get the client to understand that we were serious professionals who let our hair down on Fridays.

If you devour the Wall Street Journal you will recall that a few months ago there was a feature regarding how employers are returning to suits everyday.

Mostly out of self defense.  When you tell the bozo sector of society that it's OK to come to work on Friday in "business casual" attire they, the bozo set, will eventually decide that means Twisted Sister World Tour T-shirt and cut offs.

One can never go broke underestimating the standards or intelligence of the average American.

[quote=NASD Newbie]

No he doesn't.

Nobody forms their opinion of somebody because they are wearing clothes that appropriate for the occasion.

As somebody told you, you wear a suit in this business because it shows respect for the business--the responsibilities you are asking to assume.

Go to the library and find a copy of "Dress for Success"--it applies in rural California as well as it does in New York.

[quote=Ready2Jump]

Get over it... you are really showing your age. 

[/quote]

You know something about being older?  We were once punks too, but you have not yet reached adulthood.

[quote=Ready2Jump]

My clients LOVE me.  LOVE me. 

[/quote]

Every mother and grandmother loves her grandchild--get back with us when you get a client who doesn't love you.

If being an adult means wearing a suit everyday against my choice,
prospecting and trying to get every living person as a client, and …
and this is a biggie, having a personality like you NASD, then
Hallelujah!  Glad to be a youthful thinker in my 40’s. 



I’m done with this discussion so, have a nice day .

BL really wouldn't mind hearing about polo shirts again. Mike B where are you?

[quote=Ready2Jump]

Glad to be a youthful thinker in my 40's. 


[/quote]

Every woman's dream.  A guy in his forties who hopes to have an annual income in the 30s.

You've got those rules of thumb backwards.

Your waist size is suppose to be a smaller number than your age, but your income should be at least three times your age.

[quote=Ready2Jump] [quote=NASD Newbie]

A broker wearing a suit will never appear to be overdressed.

Period.

Next topic.

[/quote]

... are you listening?  I COULD NOT AGREE MORE WITH YOU!!!!  A broker in a suit will never appear overdressed!!!!!!  (well, except at my luau themed seminar that is)
[/quote]

We had a luau client appreciation event at a wacky hawaiian gilligan's island type place. Lord Abbett vendor showed in lovely tailored EXPENSIVE suit all the way from San Fran, even though we asked him for casual. He could not have looked more out of place AND uncomfortable in the 100+ heat with the flower lei we insisted he wear.

[quote=NASD Newbie]

If you devour the Wall Street Journal you will recall that a few months ago there was a feature regarding how employers are returning to suits everyday.

Mostly out of self defense.  When you tell the bozo sector of society that it's OK to come to work on Friday in "business casual" attire they, the bozo set, will eventually decide that means Twisted Sister World Tour T-shirt and cut offs.

One can never go broke underestimating the standards or intelligence of the average American.

[/quote]

So I guess this means the t-shirt I pick up from the Poison/Cinderella concert tomorrow night isn't acceptable to sport Friday morning? Even IF all our clients are hip, hip grannies?

I kinda sit on the fence on this issue.  I currently go with the country club look (after wearing a suit everyday for years) but if certain clients are coming in that day, I will wear a long sleeved dress shirt and suit pants that day and add a tie (and sometimes the suit jacket) if I feel it is necessary.  However, I have had literally have clients that were turned off that I used to always wear a suit.  Ready2Jump is not crazy in what he says.  NASD Newbie, there are people who think anyone in a suit is just trying to sell them something and they will never get past the fact that you are in a suit. 

For myself, I feel that my practice, my office and my work are more than professional and eliviate any concern that would arise from not having on a coat and tie.  If I was in a place that didn't have a good image, I might consider having my image more formal to let them know that everything is not half-class.  When they come in to my office and see everything perfectly neat (I am admittidley anal), organized and professional, they could not care less if I had a tie choking me.  They want someone who has the answer to their problems. 

Maybe this is a generalization, but if you work on a referral only business, you should be fairly safe in whatever your attire has been to be appropriate.  If you are in a heavy prospecting business, you probably should consider wearing a suit since all of your competition will be doing the same as they run around town chasing prospects. 

I had a few spelling typo's, so here is the post with them corrected so I don't have 5 posts pointing them out to me. 

I kinda sit on the fence on this issue.  I currently go with the country club look (after wearing a suit everyday for years) but if certain clients are coming in that day, I will wear a long sleeved dress shirt and suit pants that day and add a tie (and sometimes the suit jacket) if I feel it is necessary.  However, I have had literally have clients that were turned off that I used to always wear a suit.  Ready2Jump is not crazy in what he says.  NASD Newbie, there are people who think anyone in a suit is just trying to sell them something and they will never get past the fact that you are in a suit. <?:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" />

For myself, I feel that my practice, my office and my work are more than professional and alleviate any concern that would arise from not having on a coat and tie.  If I was in a place that didn't have a good image, I might consider having my image more formal to let them know that everything is not half-class.  When they come in to my office and see everything perfectly neat (I am admittedly anal), organized and professional, they could not care less if I had a tie choking me.  They want someone who has the answer to their problems. 

Maybe this is a generalization, but if you work on a referral only business, you should be fairly safe in whatever your attire has been to be appropriate.  If you are in a heavy prospecting business, you probably should consider wearing a suit since all of your competition will be doing the same as they run around town chasing prospects. 

BL, my revised post comment was not directed at you.  I just saw your post, the Google toolbar is a great option that I use all the time.  However I had never used the spellcheck feature (use the auto-fill all the time) since I am usually in Word or program that picks up on the errors as well. 

[quote=baylorjoyce1]

they could not care less if I had a tie choking me. 

[/quote]

Perhaps if you wore a coat and tie every day you would be able to afford new clothes that didn't  choke you.

Are you saying that firms like Lehman Brothers simply doesn't "get it" when they insist that their people wear business suits every day?

How many of the men and women on this year's Registered Reps top ten brokers list do you suppose have an attitude along the lines of, "If a prospect doesn't like the way I dress I don't want them as a client?"

Perhaps if a broker didn't wander around in "country club attire" while on the job they could actually afford to belong to the country club instead of pretending they do.

[quote=baylorjoyce1]BL, my revised post comment was not directed at you.  I just saw your post, the Google toolbar is a great option that I use all the time.  However I had never used the spellcheck feature (use the auto-fill all the time) since I am usually in Word or program that picks up on the errors as well.  [/quote]

Me too, spell check in Word. The beauty of this tool is that it works in forums like this or anything else you type in the internet (Craigslist, etc)

As to the clothing. I dress up when I'm at work. That means in my office, visiting clients at their businesses or homes or giving a presentation at a seminar.  However, I have learned that you need to be flexible when off premises.  At a luau or theme event, then you should of course dress according to the theme. 

Also when visiting a client's business establishment you need to use some common sense. Here is an example.  I had to inspect a large cattle operation to whom we were making a loan. Checking for brands and earmarks, that the breed was the one we were lending on, count the legs and divide by four to make sure the herd was as represented (that's an inside joke), check the barns, equipment etc.  After all this was the collateral.  The only way to do this barring getting on a horse and riding the range was to go to the stock yard when the cattle were gathered before moving them to other pasture/ranges.  They were testing the cows for pregnancy (Don't ask how. You don't want to know.) 

So my attire that day wasn't my usual heels and dress suits. Instead I had on rubber boots, jeans and a long sleeve shirt and leather gloves.  If I had showed up "all gussied up" I would have been a laughing stock, not to mention having ruined permanently my shoes. 

It is ok to get out of uniform occasionally.

Well, Let's see.... Suit or no suit?

Donald Trump is almost always in a suit -but what's with that hair? His suits MUST be expensive- but who really notices while you are trying to figure out where that birds' nest begins and ends?

Actually, NASD EASY/PUT - you keep going back over the same topics. YOU like a suit because of your age.

I grew up on rock & roll, smokin' a little and drinking a lot. So did MOST of my clients.... I love the commercials for Ameriprise because they have it nailed. The generation that grew up with the Stones, Zeplin and CCR aren't going out in rocking chairs. And I believe these are the folks that are going to have all that money we all are after in the financial business.

I wear clean, ironed jeans, collared shirt and jacket. I am also in SoCal. I think the area you live in DOES matter. AND Baylor has it right too- if you are still prospecting maybe you need to look like everybody else out there.

I won't close with an emoticon, I know how you hate those too. Blinking, winking little dots that your glasses can't quite focus on.

Haha.  You've got it so figured out, why do you waste your time on this board.  "Choking" is a figure of speech, and was said in jest.  Did I say that Lehman Bros doesnt get it?  Actually I just sold a private equity offering from Lehman Bros and the client didnt seem to mind my polo shirt. 

And now I can't afford to belong to a Country Club.  You sir, are clueless. 

I have no issue that many chose to wear a suit.  However, Texas isn't the same as NY.  We make fun of them like they make fun of us.  Doesn't mean they're wrong and we're right, just a different way of doing things. 

If I am going out to see a client, I would almost always wear a suit.  When they come to my office for my advice, they'll have to deal with me not being in a suit.  And I don't think that I'm going to any measurable amount of business for doing so. 

I have literally had experiences where I was made fun of for wearing a suit.  It angered me at the time, because I don't think it should ever be considered overdressing.  And I can guarantee it's not because of my choice of suits, shirts, ties, shoes etc...  my suit wardrobe is way more than sufficient. 

The point remains--you cannot offend anybody by showing up in a business suit, or greet them in your office in a business suit.

If you turn off a single prospect because you march to a different drummer that is one prospect too many.

Do you disagree?  Do you think that losing a client because the client was unimpressed with your dress is an uncontrollable risk of the industry?

I personally hate that some planners feel that they can't be human in how they dress.  I think its always good to go in public dressed properly, but some take it so far (including me in the past/beginning) that they have to create this image to their clients. 

I have had many friends tell me that the casual dress makes me more approachable and seem more normal.  After they ask what I do for a living, my resume/experience speaks for itself, not the Brioni suit I am wearing that day. 

I hear people making fun of all the guys running around from the wirehouses & insurance companies in their suits, seeing who can put the slickest combo together.  This is probably due to the area I reside in, but in some places it is reality. 

How many of the nation's top brokers do you suppose would put themselves in a situation where the client just had to deal with the fact that the man or woman who they were entrusting with their money chose to dress like a golfer instead of a banker?

What is the upside of not wearing a business suit?

[quote=NASD Newbie]

The point remains--you cannot offend anybody by showing up in a business suit, or greet them in your office in a business suit.

If you turn off a single prospect because you march to a different drummer that is one prospect too many.

Do you disagree?  Do you think that losing a client because the client was unimpressed with your dress is an uncontrollable risk of the industry?

[/quote]

Yes, I disagree. I don't wear suits every day. If I lose a client because they were unimpressed with my attire, I don't care. A suit every day isn't me. Are you suggesting that we 'fake' a look to get a client? It's not real. It's not who I am. It's not what I believe.

Should I Lie to get a client? To me, it's the same thing.

And anyway, I thought you were getting ready to dance off the back of a Boat while it circled some Island. Tell you what, I'll come up there this weekend and shove you off the back of the ferry while it's circling Alcatraz- how's that? I'll wear a suit.

[quote=baylorjoyce1]

This is probably due to the area I reside in, but in some places it is reality. 

[/quote]

I graduated from Highland Park High School, got my BBA at SMU.  I know Texans as well as anybody.

I am here to tell you that when you handle people's money you should look like a mortician with a smile.

It is a controllable risk that I am willing to retain. 

I have lost a client because I was wearing a suit, so apparently there was some risk on your side as well.  The fact that you refuse to see the other side is simply showing your ignorance.  

I have no problem with someone being in a suit for their profession.  I however look like a golfer and it probably helps that most of my clients are aware that I played golf in college and still play competitively today. 

Now go tighten up your tie and get over yourself.

Congrats on HP, I hope you werent saying that to impress someone.  I have multiple clients in HP and actually buy many of my suits at Pockets Menswear in HP Village. 

I wouldn't try and impress anyone by saying you went to SMU, just like I wouldn't try and impress by saying I went to Baylor.  If that is your stake to fame, that won't get you anywhere in our business.   

[quote=munytalks]

Yes, I disagree. I don't wear suits every day. If I lose a client because they were unimpressed with my attire, I don't care. A suit every day isn't me. Are you suggesting that we 'fake' a look to get a client? It's not real. It's not who I am. It's not what I believe.

[/quote]

A suit every day isn't you?  Would that be because you're a slob, or too lazy to choose ties?

Do you suppose that Stan O'Neal shows up wearing a golf shirt?

For those of you who know who Launny Steffens is, ever see him in a golf shirt?  I didn't and I used to see him around Boca Raton and out in the desert.

How often do you suppose Sandy Weil wanders around without a tie?

How about the top brokers who will hit this year's RR magazine list?

You dress out of respect for your business, your career, and for your client or prospect.

Why in the world would you want to send an image of a golf pro when you're trying to convince a man or woman that you're a serious money manager type?

Why not show up in shorts and pretend to be Andy Roddick as long as you're going to be pretending to be anything but a serious financial advisor?

I am here to tell you that when you handle people's money you should look like a mortician with a smile.

I don't think with a name like NASD Newbie you should be "here to tell" me about anything. 

Thanks Mom, I'll let you know next time I need your approval from my attire. 

[quote=baylorjoyce1]

I wouldn't try and impress anyone by saying you went to SMU

[/quote]

I don't, I mentioned it simply to suggest that I know Texas as well as anybody.

My MBA from Wharton opened a few doors along the way--get one and you won't have to be ashamed that you spent six years in Waco.

Why haven’t you addressed the client I LOST because I wore a suit? Was he not a worthy client?  I think the paycheck I received from an Exec Bonus plan for 80+ employees I sold him after I went to casual would beg to differ. 

6 years?  Wow, now you even have such insight to see how long I lived in Waco!!!

[quote=baylorjoyce1]Why haven't you addressed the client I LOST because I wore a suit? 

  [/quote]

The reason is simple, I don't believe that anybody ever--as in EVER--loses a financial services opportunity because they are dressed in a suit.

If you were wearing a suit and lost a deal it's would probably be because you were wearing white socks.

[quote=baylorjoyce1]6 years?  Wow, now you even have such insight to see how long I lived in Waco!!![/quote]

Not at all, I just know that somebody with your communication skills and thought processes would need six years to get through Baylor.

[quote=baylorjoyce1]

Maybe this is a generalization, but if you work on a referral only business, you should be fairly safe in whatever your attire has been to be appropriate.  If you are in a heavy prospecting business, you probably should consider wearing a suit since all of your competition will be doing the same as they run around town chasing prospects. 

[/quote]

BRAVO!  WELL SAID!

[quote=Ready2Jump][quote=baylorjoyce1]

Maybe this is a generalization, but if you work on a referral only business, you should be fairly safe in whatever your attire has been to be appropriate. 

[/quote]

Where is the upside in being "fairly safe" when the alternative is to be absolutely safe?

[quote=NASD Newbie][quote=munytalks]

Yes, I disagree. I don't wear suits every day. If I lose a client because they were unimpressed with my attire, I don't care. A suit every day isn't me. Are you suggesting that we 'fake' a look to get a client? It's not real. It's not who I am. It's not what I believe.

[/quote]

A suit every day isn't you?  Would that be because you're a slob, or too lazy to choose ties?

Do you suppose that Stan O'Neal shows up wearing a golf shirt?

For those of you who know who Launny Steffens is, ever see him in a golf shirt?  I didn't and I used to see him around Boca Raton and out in the desert.

How often do you suppose Sandy Weil wanders around without a tie?

How about the top brokers who will hit this year's RR magazine list?

You dress out of respect for your business, your career, and for your client or prospect.

Why in the world would you want to send an image of a golf pro when you're trying to convince a man or woman that you're a serious money manager type?

Why not show up in shorts and pretend to be Andy Roddick as long as you're going to be pretending to be anything but a serious financial advisor?

[/quote]

I grew up in Seattle.

When Time Magazine put Bill Gates on the cover the first time in 1986- guess what- He's not wearing a suit & tie.

Is he a slob? Too lazy to pick out ties? 

Bill Gates RARELY wears a suit. Like Me. 

So, if you WERE a Financial Advisor- and you aren't- you can romance Sandy Weil.  Oh and Kenneth Lay always has the nicest suits on. John Gotti was a great dresser too.

[quote=Ready2Jump]

Oh, and my McDee's owner client... he hates $1000 suit wearing brokers.
[/quote]

One of my best clients is an owner/operator with 10 stores.  There's not a week that passes that we don't meet in one of his stores to review the past week activity. As much as I would like to think I can dress down, reflecting back I realize that not even once has he ever seen me without at least a shirt & tie. 

As much as I hate to agree with Put, I must side with him on this issue. I wear professional attire out of respect for the business I'm conducting. Although my client would respect me in a polo and khaki's, It comes down to the image that I have built over the years that I want to preserve.  I doubt you will ever loose a  deal because you woke up that morning and chose to wear a suit instead of khaki's.

[quote=munytalks]

Bill Gates on the cover the first time in 1986- guess what- He's not wearing a suit & tie.

[/quote]

If he were a financial advisor he would wear a business suit.

How often to you see Warren Buffett in anything except a business suit?

[quote=Broker Fee]

One of my best clients is an owner/operator with 10 stores.  There's not a week that passes that we don't meet in one of his stores to review the past week activity. As much as I would like to think I can dress down, reflecting back I realize that not even once has he ever seen me without at least a shirt & tie. 

As much as I hate to agree with Put, I must side with him on this issue. I wear professional attire out of respect for the business I'm conducting. Although my client would respect me in a polo and khaki's, It comes down to the image that I have built over the years that I want to preserve.  I doubt you will ever loose a  deal because you woke up that morning and chose to wear a suit instead of khaki's.

[/quote]

Three comments.  The story rings true because McDonald's owners refer to their units as stores.  One of my biggest, perhaps the biggest, disappoitnments in my life is that I was offered one for $40,000 in 1971 and didn't have the money.

I'm curious what kind of activity a McDonald's operator would be engaging in that required a weekly meeting--was he hedging his expenses or something?

One never needs to feel bad about agreeing me, or Put whoever he might be.

Mr Put Easy Newbie,

I think it would be safe to assume, that most representatives posting on this forum dress in the manner that attracts the clientele they strive to service. (forgive me if I confuse names)

Ready2Jump might spend more time in "business casual" if he/she spends more time in the field calling on folks.  Ready is also currently with EDJ and might have a "less sophisticated" client base a bit put off by an Armani(sp?) suit.

We serve a great deal of engineers who are very mentally organized and detail oriented people and we try to represent that with our attire. (as I said before suits/heels, dresses/heels)

Bottom line? I think Ready, Baylor, and the rest are grownups and know how to atttract the clients they want...suit or no.

Respectfully,

[quote=Devoted SA]

Bottom line? I think Ready, Baylor, and the rest are grownups and know how to atttract the clients they want...suit or no.

[/quote]

So, what is the upside of possibly offending somebody?

Are you too so cocky that you too figure "screw 'em if they don't like the way I dress?"

All I am saying is that this is a business that has expectations--and among those expecatations is that financial planner types are serious as a heart attack.

And as such they should be dressed like morticians--but with a laugh and a twinkle in their eyes.

NASD Newbie, you are retarded. 

Apparently my clients are now liars since they told me DIRECTLY that me wearing a suit was an issue.   

Some of you keep talking about going in to client's offices and needing to look the part.  I like the way I work and my clients come into my office, my turf, my dresscode.  If I wanted to wear a suit everyday and work in a major wirehouse office, I would wear a suit too.  However, having my own firm allows me to run my operation however I see fit, and it seems to be working out for me.  I don't need to walk across a stage in a suit for some large outfit to receive an award for the most MF sales last year.  I reward myself with my own practice built on my own terms. 

I think you resent the fact that I do not have to wear a suit to run the type of practice I want.  There is no other reason you would be running your head into a wall over trying to convince me that I have it all wrong. 

I don't want to jump to conclusions, but did someone say that you aren't even a rep?  So when did you become qualified to tell me how to run my practice and how to properly market myself? 

On the rare occasion that I leave my office for a client, or when a completely new client that I do not know comes in, I do wear a suit.  I have said that I have no problem with people wearing a suit, even if it's everday.  And don't tell me to dress like a banker, I'm not a banker. 

[quote=baylorjoyce1]

Apparently my clients are now liars since they told me DIRECTLY that me wearing a suit was an issue.   

[/quote]

Let me be clear.  I am saying that you are a liar.

I am also asking you where you see the upside in dressing like a golf pro instead of a financial professional?

If you want to be casual why not wear tennis shorts and tell your clients that you're on the way to play doubles with Richard Rainwater?

Perhaps in New York where you come from.

In places like CA, TX etc. clients are a little bit different. I'm not being cocky at all. What I AM saying, is that most FA's, Rep's have a certain "fish" they are fishing for, and as such....you use a certain type of lure/bait/pole etc.

High powered big business types (LA mogul types)...might really need to/want to see the suit.

Small Business Owners (husband and wife machine shop owner w/ simple IRA & 10 employees)....not so much. Can't hurt...might help.

If you don't like the no suit idea, you'll hate this. One of our most HNW guys (has $3.5 mil w/ us) we met at a Home Show we had a booth at. We were dressed nicely, but what I'm saying is different bait is all.

[quote=NASD Newbie][quote=Broker Fee]

[/quote]

Three comments.  The story rings true because McDonald's owners refer to their units as stores.  One of my biggest, perhaps the biggest, disappoitnments in my life is that I was offered one for $40,000 in 1971 and didn't have the money.

I'm curious what kind of activity a McDonald's operator would be engaging in that required a weekly meeting--was he hedging his expenses or something?

One never needs to feel bad about agreeing me, or Put whoever he might be.

[/quote]

The veteran operators will tell you that if you have 1 to 3 stores...then you have a JOB.  The profession does not become lucrative until your debt is paid down over a number of years & even then you are forced to remodel or reinvest so the debt never goes away. My client has been at it for over 10 years and is just now starting to do well. Since I manage all of the company employee executive benefits, cash flow management, and over a dozen qualified & non qulalified accounts for the owner & his family it is certainly worth the time spent. The old 80/20 rule.   

The upside is me running my own firm how I want and not having to worry what other nonreps like you have to say about it. 

I bet since you're a HP & Wharton guy that you and your family have tons of money.  Let me make this clear, if this is your attitude about the way my firm is run, I don't want any of you or your families money.  Is that clear enough?  Does that have any gray area?  What is the upside for me?  That I don't have to have jacka$$ clients that are not worth my time.  That I don't spend my time with my clients making sure that I am giving them the right image. 

It's my firm and I will create the image I desire, not what you think is proper. 

If I had a party, I would hope that your parents were my clients who recently had a divorce, so I could invite them both to my party and them fire them both because they had an issue with the "Austin Golf Club" golfshirt I had on that night. 

It's sad that you feel that we have to please everyone.  I hope you realize that feeling that way will lead you to a unhappy life.  You seem to think I need to prove something to people and that's where we don't see eye to eye. 

[quote=Devoted SA]

Perhaps in New York where you come from.

If you don't like the no suit idea, you'll hate this. One of our most HNW guys (has $3.5 mil w/ us) we met at a Home Show we had a booth at. We were dressed nicely, but what I'm saying is different bait is all.

[/quote]

New York is my adopted hometown--but I grew up in Dallas.  I have lots of wealthy fraternity brothers and friends who sit around in casual clothes.  They are running their own oil companies--one owns about 500 fast food places--I know my way around money.

I also know that while I would probably be fine looking like a golf professional most of the time I would be fine looking like an investment banker ALL OF THE TIME.

Do you suppose there is a career coach out here that would tell a financial services salesperson that it was ever a bad idea to wear a business suit?

Of course not--so why would anybody intentionally choose to do something that might backfire?

The brokeage houses in downtown Dallas have dress codes that require men to be in business suits--it's not because they don't get it.

[quote=NASD Newbie][quote=Devoted SA]

Perhaps in New York where you come from.

If you don't like the no suit idea, you'll hate this. One of our most HNW guys (has $3.5 mil w/ us) we met at a Home Show we had a booth at. We were dressed nicely, but what I'm saying is different bait is all.

[/quote]

New York is my adopted hometown--but I grew up in Dallas.  I have lots of wealthy fraternity brothers and friends who sit around in casual clothes.  They are running their own oil companies--one owns about 500 fast food places--I know my way around money.

I also know that while I would probably be fine looking like a golf professional most of the time I would be fine looking like an investment banker ALL OF THE TIME.

Do you suppose there is a career coach out here that would tell a financial services salesperson that it was ever a bad idea to wear a business suit?

Of course not--so why would anybody intentionally choose to do something that might backfire?

The brokeage houses in downtown Dallas have dress codes that require men to be in business suits--it's not because they don't get it.

[/quote]

The only way you'd know your way around that kind of money is bussing tables at the country club, Monkey Boy.

[quote=NASD Newbie]

[/quote]

Do you suppose there is a career coach out here that would tell a financial services salesperson that it was ever a bad idea to wear a business suit?

No, I don't think so. You are right. I DO think a coach would tell a fss it would be a bad idea to show up to work in your pjs/twister sister t-shirt & flip flops etc.

Of course not--so why would anybody intentionally choose to do something that might backfire?

Well, Baylor is choosing to do something opposite that had backfired previously. He/she (sorry) had lost an account because of the suit. An obvious bad experience, a backfire in the OTHER direction.

Today when we were coming back from lunch we saw a 16 yr old walking into Blockbuster video with what appeared to be a resume/application. This young man had dressed in slacks (not khakis), pressed shirt, and tie. Hardly a requirement for scanning videos on a Friday night, but WHAT an effort. Someone's obviously taught him well. 

I don't think Baylor shows up to work looking like Fluffy Zoeller (wait Fuzzy?). Anyways, I don't guess Baylor needs my help here.

BAYLOR-

NASD Newbie is not a Broker. And he ain't no silver spoon "I grew up in New York, summered in Martha's Vineyard" either.

He's a crusty old dude with nose hairs growing in his ears. He lives in San Francisco. He flunked out of Berkely in the '50's. He's the night janitor in the Merrill Lynch building downtown San Fran. That's why he's always bloggin' at strange hours and that's where he hears these tales of fantastic financial deeds. 

Philo...

I hate your guts, you smart college guys! I've been seeing your kind around since I was ten years old... working as a busboy. "Oh busboy, it seems my friend has thrown up on the table. Clean up that mess, boy, will'ya?" And then when I went to sea as a steward... people poking at you with umbrellas. "Oh, boy!", "You, boy!", "Careful with that luggage, boy!" And I took it. I took it for years! But I don't have to take it any more. There's a war on, and I'm captain of this vessel, and now YOU can take it for a change!

Mister Roberts!

VERY good, Devoted!

 This is Ensign Pulver signing off for the evening.

There have been a couple of comments about when a client may catch you out of your regular business attire.  You don't have to aplogize for that!  You're not in a business situation or environment.  You are who you are on your own time.  But, on business time I'm in a suit.  All the time.  Every day.  It's who I am.  It simply feels like another layer of skin to me.  Nobody does business with me because I wear a suit, nor does anyone shun me because I wear a suit.  It is simply who I am Monday through Friday.

Someone on this board said that annuity wholesalers try to impress him with their $1000 suits.  Are you sh*tting me?  $1000 for a suit?  That's common.... that is if you're having them made and tailored for you.  Again, I'm not trying to get off on how nice my suits or clothes are.  In fact, I'm the first guy to clip coupons out of the paper on Sunday morning.  However, I do view clothing purchases as serious, long-term investments.  First and foremost, I want them to be as comfortable as any pair of sweats that I own, durable, and extremely functional.  They should be classical yet contemporary without being overly stylized.  The latest fashion may in fact show you to have no taste. 

But, if I run into a client at the grocery store in my baseball cap, shorts, and flip flops, I couldn't care less.  I'm a real guy on my own time.  They respect and understand that I am a good family man and husband, too.  That is, if they even recognize me.  Most people I know are so used to seeing me dressed up that they don't even recognize or look out for me when I haven't shaved for 2 days (I have to shave twice a day as it is) and am wearing my spectacles instead of my contacts.  I can literally go undercover when I'm not wearing a suit! 

Good thread BTW.......(for a change)......... 

Note to self:

Soothsayer has to shave twice a day--this dude is seriously macho.

…and seriously southern Mediterranean!

Topic: Do you wear a suit?

Yes, or at least a shirt + tie (coat only when out in public and/or w/clients).

[quote=Cowboy93]

Topic: Do you wear a suit?

Yes, or at least a shirt + tie (coat only when out in public and/or w/clients).

At the risk of taking a verbal beating from my old friend NASD PutEasy, I'll confess to wearing a lot of what you all call country club casual.  When/when not to wear a suit is a judgement call for me.  95% of my clients/prospects don't care either way as long as what I wear looks reasonable (clean and wrinkle-free).  Sure, I wear a nice suit and tie when presenting investment management to a foundation or pension plan, but mostly, my suits sit quietly in the closet.  This is truly a function of "know your customer/prospect".  Those of us in the flyover states/rural areas understand that a suit often doesn't breed trust among the locals.  The Amish business owner with a mil in his money market account at the bank will not trust a "city slicker in a suit" and write the check.  You don't have to believe me, but I know what locals have told me.

Sure, perhaps someday I'll guess wrong and lose a client/prospect because of what I choose to wear, but I don't see that happening often enough to threaten my business, and if a client/prospect is that sensitive about my wardrobe, there's a good chance that they're going to be a fussy, pain in the ass anyway.

So count by vote for some of both, depending on the situation...how's that for riding the fence?

Topic: Do you wear a suit?

Yes, or at least a shirt + tie (coat only when out in public and/or w/clients).

Do you wear pants and shoes too?
-----------------

No pants, but shoes and knee black socks.

But seriously folks....I'm not at a point in my business where I can afford to take any chances, so a suit makes sense.  I like the idea of going to a case-by-case basis down the road when I don't really have to worry about it.  But, then I think I'd always want wear the shirt and tie w/clients--since that's what they're used to and I do believe the seriousness of our capacity does call for a higher standard than the mortgage guy, retail banker, et al.  Plus, what message would I be communicating (subtly, I grant you) by dressing the part until I was big and successful, but then at least appearing to "take it easy" once I'm there?

[quote=joedabrkr] [quote=Cowboy93]

Topic: Do you wear a suit?

Yes, or at least a shirt + tie (coat only when out in public and/or w/clients).

[/quote]

Do you wear pants and shoes too?
[/quote]

Don't forget your super secret adventures of FA comic book hero underoos too!

[quote=Devoted SA][quote=joedabrkr] [quote=Cowboy93]

Topic: Do you wear a suit?

Yes, or at least a shirt + tie (coat only when out in public and/or w/clients).

[/quote]

Do you wear pants and shoes too?
[/quote]

Don't forget your super secret adventures of FA comic book hero underoos too!

I know this subject was dead, but I found this interesting tidbit on the Ric Edelman website regarding his office for his employees.  If you don't know him, you should:

Our No-Tie Zone policy states that traditional business attire is no longer required (for EFSers or clients). Instead, dress code requires EFSers to dress comfortably while maintaining an image that reflects self-imposed standards for quality. The policy was a big hit when it was announced and gained national recognition with coverage by ABC News, The Washington Post, and a front-page article in The Wall Street Journal.

Sorry to bring this up again.....

[quote=Ready2Jump]

Our No-Tie Zone policy states that traditional business attire is no longer required (for EFSers or clients). Instead, dress code requires EFSers to dress comfortably while maintaining an image that reflects self-imposed standards for quality. The policy was a big hit when it was announced and gained national recognition with coverage by ABC News, The Washington Post, and a front-page article in The Wall Street Journal.

[/quote]

It's all part of the coarsening of America--the lowering of standards because of our national frenzy to "diversify."  Who says that white Anglo Saxon standards of behavior and dress are any better than any other society's?  Who are we to judge.

A few years ago it was not uncommon for people to show up at interview for back office personnel in the Wall Street area dressed like they were African kings or queens--those robes and hats, sandals, the whole nine yards.

This set off quite a panic among the HR types--do we have to hire them because if we don't we could appear to be racists?

Nobody has ever said that dressing down is wrong.  The point those of us who understand things were making is that a financial type can never go wrong wearing a business suit.

In a business that is more difficult to negotiate than a mine field it makes no sense to buck the odds by not appearing to be the consumate professional.

There is no upside to financial planner wearing casual clothes while on the job.  Not one.

The trend, by the way, is back to mandatory business suits.  The pendulum deal.  Probably one of these days it will be mandated that a financial planner at a major firm must wear nothing but dark pinstripe suits, white shirts, conservative ties and shoes with laces.

And if it does swing that far it will not be a bad idea.

Why would you meet with a client wearing something you'd never consider wearing to a job interview?  Every meeting with a client is a job interview--they, the client, are always taking their measure of you and your attitude.  Just like an HR vice president would be in an interview.

Ever had a telephone interview?  I've done them from both sides.  When I was interviewing I could tell which of the people I was talking to were wearing a business suit--even though they were at home.  They just sounded more professional and confident.

Here is what is really up;  You guys have been posting to this post about casual dressing and how it is appropriate because you guys can't afford suits.

Work for Edjones.  It will help you out.

Hart Shafter & Marx

Personally, I like dressing up, maybe b/c I look good

oh yeah also, a nice watch is a good addition, i.e., rolex submariner or tag heuer carrera

for the looney maybe a rolex datejust and a low cut blouse

Fake it till you make it....

who really cares.

Hart Shaffner and Mark also Joseph Abboud. Client’s care and notice EZ.

spelling Marx.

Speaking of Rolex.  I gave my wife a gold ladies President for her 40th birthday--which was in 1987.

While we were in Europe it just stopped working so she tucked it away somewhere safe and when we got home she sent it to her brother who has a friend who repairs them.

He called an hour or so ago and told her that he had gotten it back last night.

Damn those things!  A gift that keeps on costing.

fake ones usually need repair.

Au contraire, uninformed ones. I actually have a German language (days) Rolex I purchased while in Germany. Like any other good piece of equipment (cars,etc.) maintenance is required. FYI, a Rolex indicates it is sick by slowing down. Only can be repaired by certified Rolex shop @ 650 beans. Repair cost is more than what is on the wrist of 99% of population.  

[quote=Revealer]Au contraire, uninformed ones. I actually have a German language (days) Rolex I purchased while in Germany. Like any other good piece of equipment (cars,etc.) maintenance is required. FYI, a Rolex indicates it is sick by slowing down. Only can be repaired by certified Rolex shop @ 650 beans. Repair cost is more than what is on the wrist of 99% of population.  [/quote]

He's just a child driven by the green eyes of envy--imagine the minime character.  Pay him no heed.

What I have aways found curious about Rolex and their outrageous cleaning costs is this.  If it's water tight how does it get dirty inside?

they need to be cleaned about every 10 yrs or so, that costs about 300

Morgan Stanley just announced yesterday that effective Sept 5 its business attire for all. Only on Friday's will it allow business casual no resort wear allowed. So take those business suits off ebay.

Yep its helpful for you.you can start your own business.
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