Number of Households

Jan 7, 2010 6:07 pm

Curious to know how many households (not accounts or social security numbers) some of you guys have (feel free to round and/or tweak numbers for the sake of anonyminity).  If you’d like to add AUM and LOS for comparison sake, that would be great too.  Looking for a point of reference on what is truly “manageable.”  Thanks in advance.

   
Jan 7, 2010 6:38 pm

HH = 150 (I had 200, but I gave away about 50 last year when I did a “Partner Plan”)

LOS = 3.5 AUM = 18.5mm   I would like to get rid of about 50 more households (less than $1mm total - lot of SIMPLE accounts).  My mid-term goal is 250 HH @ $200K/HH (within 3-5 yrs.).  I don't really want to go over 250 HH.  In fact, I ultimately would like to be at 150 HH, 350K/HH within 7 years.  But my practice is to service my clients extensively, so it really doesn't make sense to have a ton of small accounts.  I also want to have a very manageable, low-overhead practice, which is tough with 1000 households.
Jan 7, 2010 6:54 pm

A little over 100 HH’s (I used to work at C with 1500 HH’s-- talk about crazy)

LOS-15 yrs AUM- Roughly $500mm (including assets held away such as 401k's annuities etc)((Working on a few deals to hopefully get over the $750mm mark this year :) ))   I would say you should evolve to a point to where you have less than 200 HH's.  It gives you far more time to devote to each person.  I like to use the analogy: You only have so many first class tickets eventually you have to seat people in coach.    The key is to be effective at evolving your book to move up market.  A friend once told me, in order to go after $10mm clients you need to say no to $5mm.....   
Jan 7, 2010 7:10 pm

[quote=iceco1d]

  On a side note...holy sh!t shantom!  You are the MAN![/quote]

+1!  holy sh!t!
Jan 7, 2010 7:23 pm

[quote=shantom1]A little over 100 HH’s (I used to work at C with 1500 HH’s-- talk about crazy)

LOS-15 yrs AUM- Roughly $500mm (including assets held away such as 401k's annuities etc)((Working on a few deals to hopefully get over the $750mm mark this year :) ))   I would say you should evolve to a point to where you have less than 200 HH's.  It gives you far more time to devote to each person.  I like to use the analogy: You only have so many first class tickets eventually you have to seat people in coach.    The key is to be effective at evolving your book to move up market.  A friend once told me, in order to go after $10mm clients you need to say no to $5mm.....   [/quote]   Holy crap - tell us more !!!!  
Jan 7, 2010 7:23 pm

I will be the first to say it is not the assets, its the return on assets (not saying the rev isn’t here, but I’m NOT getting 1% ROA).  If a company gives you $100mm to roll in 30 day tbills you will earn less than doing a decent annuity…

Jan 7, 2010 7:27 pm

Shantom has gone more than 50 posts without mentioning he/she is a whale. Incredible.

  If I were dealing with that sort of cheese, I would probably have the screen name $500mmAUM.
Jan 7, 2010 7:30 pm

And I probably should not have.  There are plenty of fish way bigger than me…

Jan 7, 2010 7:31 pm

If I was shantom I would just have the picture of a middle finger under my screen name !

Jan 7, 2010 7:35 pm

[quote=Ron 14]

If I was shantom I would just have the picture of a middle finger under my screen name !

[/quote] I doubt it. What's the gross on $500mm in CD's?
Jan 7, 2010 7:37 pm

[quote=Ron 14]

If I was shantom I would just have the picture of a middle finger under my screen name !

[/quote] I know your kidding, but seriously....
Jan 7, 2010 7:38 pm

Even if you turn 0.2% on 500mm, that’s $1m in production.

Jan 7, 2010 7:41 pm

I think you guys are taking what I said the wrong way. With 500mil AUM I would venture to say you don't need help from most of the scrubs on this site, me included.

Jan 7, 2010 7:41 pm

B24- FWIW (since I know the question is coming from someone LOL) 44 bps $2.2mm....

Jan 7, 2010 7:43 pm

[quote=Ron 14]

I think you guys are taking what I said the wrong way. With 500mil AUM I would venture to say you don't need help from most of the scrubs on this site, me included.

[/quote] The day you know everything you can only go down....
Jan 7, 2010 7:44 pm

[quote=Ron 14]

I think you guys are taking what I said the wrong way. With 500mil AUM I would venture to say you don't need help from most of the scrubs on this site, me included.

[/quote]   I'm not. I just like making jokes about you working at a bank.
Jan 7, 2010 7:44 pm

I rest my case. He took home 1.4mil last year.

Jan 7, 2010 7:45 pm

[quote=shantom1]

B24- FWIW (since I know the question is coming from someone LOL) 44 bps $2.2mm....

[/quote]   I was close.  What's a million +/- ??  
Jan 7, 2010 7:45 pm

Ron- Nope, I have a partner (but at least it’s not 50/50 :)…

Jan 7, 2010 7:47 pm

I don't get you new Jones guys at all. I work in a bank and you work in your bedroom for the same payout. Just because your mentor who is 5 years in and only produces 250k rips on bank FA's doesn't mean you have to. Have an original thought.

  I thought on the other thread you said 65%. I didnt know you had a partner. Ok. 700k take home, lol. Either way that is something to be proud of shantom.
Jan 7, 2010 7:48 pm

Highjack…

Jan 7, 2010 7:52 pm

[quote=Ron 14]

I don't get you new Jones guys at all. I work in a bank and you work in your bedroom for the same payout. Just because you mentor who is 5 years in and only produces 250k rips on bank FA's doesn't mean you have to. Have an original thought.

  I thought on the other thread you said 65%. I didnt know you had a partner. Ok. 700k take home, lol.[/quote]   Easy Ron, you know I love you. Just getting your goat.   If you want to make fun of the fact that all my portfolios are made of Bond Fund of America, Investment Company of America, and Capital Income Builder, or that my average account size is $10k, or that I am a Jehovah's Witness dressed as an FA, etc/etc/etc, go ahead.
Jan 7, 2010 7:54 pm

[quote=SometimesNowhere][quote=Ron 14]

I don't get you new Jones guys at all. I work in a bank and you work in your bedroom for the same payout. Just because you mentor who is 5 years in and only produces 250k rips on bank FA's doesn't mean you have to. Have an original thought.

  I thought on the other thread you said 65%. I didnt know you had a partner. Ok. 700k take home, lol.[/quote]   Easy Ron, you know I love you. Just getting your goat.   If you want to make fun of the fact that all my portfolios are made of Bond Fund of America, Investment Company of America, and Capital Income Builder, or that my average account size is $10k, or that I am a Jehovah's Witness dressed as an FA, etc/etc/etc, go ahead. [/quote] Oh boy, where shall we start
Jan 7, 2010 8:00 pm

I have to say, these forums are like my family at Christmas.  Can’t get through a fukcing conversation without an argument!

Jan 7, 2010 8:01 pm

Ok. I take it from so many sides ( insert gay joke here ) that I don’t always know who is being sarcastic or not. When you are a 32yr old male teller you can become easily offended !

Jan 7, 2010 8:24 pm
B24:

I have to say, these forums are like my family at Christmas.  Can’t get through a fukcing conversation without an argument!

Screw you B24 and the ship you came in on
Jan 7, 2010 8:33 pm
Ron 14:

Ok. I take it from so many sides ( insert gay joke here ) that I don’t always know who is being sarcastic or not. When you are a 32yr old male teller you can become easily offended !

  No, don't.  I'm easily offended and will report you immediately. 
Jan 7, 2010 8:35 pm
shantom1:

[quote=B24]I have to say, these forums are like my family at Christmas.  Can’t get through a fukcing conversation without an argument!

Screw you B24 and the ship you came in on [/quote]  
Jan 7, 2010 10:17 pm

[quote=shantom1]… I like to use the analogy: You only have so many first class tickets eventually you have to seat people in coach.  

....[/quote]     Great stuff.   At an average household of $5MM (did I get that right? holy crap) ... you know, I don't think there are 100 5MM households in the two counties around my home. That's straight up truth. Staggering.
Jan 7, 2010 11:41 pm

[quote=LockEDJ][quote=shantom1]… I like to use the analogy: You only have so many first class tickets eventually you have to seat people in coach.  

....[/quote]     Great stuff.   At an average household of $5MM (did I get that right? holy crap) ... you know, I don't think there are 100 5MM households in the two counties around my home. That's straight up truth. Staggering.[/quote]

If there are, they are probably Shantom's clients.

BTW, just to unhijack the thread, I have north of 200 households with an average account size of $25k. I know, I know. Many households I inherited over are tiny accounts or people that liquidated and moved elsewhere. If it weren't for the accounts I brought in I think my average account size would be $5k like Ron's.
Jan 8, 2010 1:11 am

[quote=LockEDJ] [quote=shantom1]… I like to use the analogy: You only have so many first class tickets eventually you have to seat people in coach.

…[/quote]







Great stuff.



At an average household of $5MM (did I get that right? holy crap) … you know, I don’t think there are 100 5MM households in the two counties around my home. That’s straight up truth. Staggering.[/quote]



I have a few HH’s that mess with the numbers. Most of my individual clients are between $1mm and $15mm. I also do quite a bit of work with corporate assets- i.e. managing their cash/investments and 401k’s (where I am shifting most of my business).



I do work in metro NY, so we have a high concentration of wealthy clients…
Jan 8, 2010 1:12 am
mlgone:

I have 300 households and 1 billion under mgmt. (Should be 2.5 billion after February)



LOL
Jan 8, 2010 4:04 am

This board has more bullsheet than MLGONE has gay porn.



You pikers getting excited about some fake name bragging about his fake numbers is priceless.

Jan 8, 2010 4:05 am

Wow shantom, that’s impressive!

How long have you been in the business?
Jan 8, 2010 4:56 am

LOS 3 years

AUM 17,000,000   HH 175
Jan 8, 2010 5:09 am

[quote=iceco1d] Thanks for the input guys.DD = Meletio.

[/quote]



icecold = teachers advisor

Jan 8, 2010 1:36 pm

AUM: 14MM

LOS: 30 Months

HH:   200

Obviously, I need to post less and work more.

Jan 8, 2010 1:40 pm

[quote=shantom1]

I have a few HH’s that mess with the numbers. Most of my individual clients are between $1mm and $15mm. I also do quite a bit of work with corporate assets- i.e. managing their cash/investments and 401k’s (where I am shifting most of my business).



I do work in metro NY, so we have a high concentration of wealthy clients…[/quote]

This is actually the business model I am trying to work towards, on a much smaller scale. Handle the 401k for the business, handle the owners money, work closely with key employees. Problem is that there are fewer and fewer firms out there, meaning I have to extend my geographical reach.

Jan 8, 2010 2:56 pm
LockEDJ:

[quote=shantom1]
I have a few HH’s that mess with the numbers. Most of my individual clients are between $1mm and $15mm. I also do quite a bit of work with corporate assets- i.e. managing their cash/investments and 401k’s (where I am shifting most of my business).

I do work in metro NY, so we have a high concentration of wealthy clients…[/quote]
This is actually the business model I am trying to work towards, on a much smaller scale. Handle the 401k for the business, handle the owners money, work closely with key employees. Problem is that there are fewer and fewer firms out there, meaning I have to extend my geographical reach.

In order to be competitive in the 401k market you must differentiate yourself from the pack.  Find a model that no one else is using (that has been my secret) and exploit it with your prospects.  I will give you one hint: pretend you are the decision maker at the company.  What would you want more than anything from a new advisor talking about your plan.  Answer that question and you will close a great deal of the plans you talk to (some do take 1-2 yrs though, that's the nature of the business).  Oh, and you can't just cold call them (not for the real plans), you need a warm lead.  Keep in mind these plans are public knowledge- every rep with 150 miles has tried to get it already....
Jan 10, 2010 3:45 pm

[quote=iceco1d] Curious to know how many households (not accounts or social security numbers) some of you guys have (feel free to round and/or tweak numbers for the sake of anonyminity). If you’d like to add AUM and LOS for comparison sake, that would be great too. Looking for a point of reference on what is truly “manageable.” Thanks in advance.



[/quote]



Households - 78

LOS - 1 Year

AUM - 13M

Average Household - $160,000



Like i’ve said in numerous posts though, I try and keep less households with more manageable assets. It’s easier to manage and easier to keep them happy.
Jan 11, 2010 6:43 pm

God Windy, you’ve always got to make the thread about you.

  To answer your Q, Ice ... my national production reports suggest my AUM are low for my time with Jones (bottom half). I do well enough in other categories (top 25% or better), but I need to work more, type less.
Jan 11, 2010 6:45 pm

[quote=LockEDJ]God Windy, you’ve always got to make the thread about you.

  To answer your Q, Ice ... my national production reports suggest my AUM are low for my time with Jones (bottom half). I do well enough in other categories (top 25% or better), but I need to work more, type less.[/quote]

That's hilarious. I almost typed the same thing but didn't want to hijack the thread.
Jan 11, 2010 7:03 pm

[quote=LockEDJ]God Windy, you’ve always got to make the thread about you.

  To answer your Q, Ice ... my national production reports suggest my AUM are low for my time with Jones (bottom half). I do well enough in other categories (top 25% or better), but I need to work more, type less.[/quote]   It's funny, I am also low on AUM for my segment (seg 3) because there are a lot of long-timers in seg 3, but I am in the top 5% in assets per household (I am like 125K/hh).
Jan 11, 2010 8:24 pm

I just use the last column - Cansell year rank - never my segment. I don't care what other 2s are doing (heck, I don't want to compare myself to Ronnie Dobbs. Life has enough disappointments).

Just my real peers - which are people that fight in my hometown, or have had the same sh!tty environment (ie start date).
Jan 11, 2010 9:32 pm
shantom1:

I have a few HH’s that mess with the numbers. Most of my individual clients are between $1mm and $15mm. I also do quite a bit of work with corporate assets- i.e. managing their cash/investments and 401k’s (where I am shifting most of my business). I do work in metro NY, so we have a high concentration of wealthy clients…

One day you are doing the wine & dine $1mm-$15mm clients - the next, you are the top poster on the registered rep forums; proud to tell everyone how much you make and how you make it. I believe anyone who is motivated to build to $2.2MM in production would find no joy in this forum. I call bs.  
Jan 11, 2010 9:37 pm

[quote=LockEDJ]

I just use the last column - Cansell year rank - never my segment. I don’t care what other 2s are doing (heck, I don’t want to compare myself to Ronnie Dobbs. Life has enough disappointments).

Just my real peers - which are people that fight in my hometown, or have had the same sh!tty environment (ie start date).[/quote]

But Ronnie's a 3, isn't he?
Jan 11, 2010 9:55 pm
Moraen:


But Ronnie’s a 3, isn’t he?

For real? Well, good for him.
Jan 12, 2010 12:33 am

It would be cool if guys reported the assets they raised. Not the ones they were given.



Of course those that were given were ALL CRAP. NONE WORTH ANYTHING. Some people even fire them.

Jan 12, 2010 12:42 am

[quote=LockEDJ] AUM: 14MM

LOS: 30 Months

HH:   200

Obviously, I need to post less and work more. [/quote]



WTF? Your post looks AWFULLY familiar to mine and I’m makin the thread about me? I just answered the question asked.



Moraen - Yes, Seg 3 now.

Jan 12, 2010 12:54 am

DUDE! Stand down … did you not see the smiley face, or, for that matter, the inherent sarcasm, or at least, the fact that I offered props for your performance?



WTF indeed. Never mind, fool.

Jan 12, 2010 12:55 am

Ronnie - quit being so sensitive.  They were joking.  The thread is SUPPOSED to be about you - and everybody else.

Congratulations.

Jan 12, 2010 3:51 am

[quote=LockEDJ] DUDE! Stand down … did you not see the smiley face, or, for that matter, the inherent sarcasm, or at least, the fact that I offered props for your performance?



WTF indeed. Never mind, fool.[/quote]



My bad. It’s a war zone here…I had a flashback…

Jan 12, 2010 6:24 am

-AUM: 150MM
-LOS: 16 years
-HH:   650ish

-'09 gross: 760k -CFP -Masters degree -I love to self-aggrandize
Jan 12, 2010 2:33 pm

[quote=rankstocks]-AUM: 150MM
-LOS: 16 years
-HH:   650ish

-'09 gross: 760k -CFP -Masters degree -I love to self-aggrandize
[/quote]     And you should.
Jan 12, 2010 3:01 pm
Billy Mays:

[quote=shantom1] I have a few HH’s that mess with the numbers. Most of my individual clients are between $1mm and $15mm. I also do quite a bit of work with corporate assets- i.e. managing their cash/investments and 401k’s (where I am shifting most of my business). I do work in metro NY, so we have a high concentration of wealthy clients…

One day you are doing the wine & dine $1mm-$15mm clients - the next, you are the top poster on the registered rep forums; proud to tell everyone how much you make and how you make it.

I believe anyone who is motivated to build to $2.2MM in production would find no joy in this forum.

I call bs.

[/quote]



LOL, believe what you wish. As far as I know it is the only forum available for advisors, if you know of a better advisor dedicated forum then let me know…
Jan 12, 2010 5:51 pm

[quote=iceco1d]FWIW,

  I don't think Shantom was arrogant at all in posting his numbers, and he is typically a very helpful guy.    Thanks again Shantom, and Rank, and everyone else that posted - yes, thank includes you Ronnie.[/quote] Thank you
Jan 12, 2010 6:30 pm
Ronnie Dobbs:


My bad. It’s a war zone here…I had a flashback…

No sweat.
Jan 12, 2010 7:06 pm

[quote=iceco1d]FWIW, I don’t think Shantom was arrogant at all in posting his numbers, and he is typically a very helpful guy. 

  Thanks again Shantom, and Rank, and everyone else that posted - yes, thank includes you Ronnie.[/quote] And, I don't disagree; he has been helpful and his posts are good, just his production numbers are bs. I say, divide by 10.  
Jan 12, 2010 7:10 pm

[quote=Billy Mays][quote=iceco1d]FWIW, I don’t think Shantom was arrogant at all in posting his numbers, and he is typically a very helpful guy. 

  Thanks again Shantom, and Rank, and everyone else that posted - yes, thank includes you Ronnie.[/quote] And, I don't disagree; he has been helpful and his posts are good, just his production numbers are bs. I say, divide by 10.  [/quote]   I don't think so.  If I was producing that much, I would have a staff and screw off half the day. 
Jan 12, 2010 7:20 pm

[quote=snaggletooth][quote=Billy Mays][quote=iceco1d]FWIW, I don’t think Shantom was arrogant at all in posting his numbers, and he is typically a very helpful guy. 

  Thanks again Shantom, and Rank, and everyone else that posted - yes, thank includes you Ronnie.[/quote] And, I don't disagree; he has been helpful and his posts are good, just his production numbers are bs. I say, divide by 10.  [/quote]   I don't think so.  If I was producing that much, I would have a staff and screw off half the day.  [/quote] Ding Ding Ding.  We have a winner (j/k). I for one will never downplay how much a good assistant or two will free up your time.  (once you have built a great business you can cruise control to some degree, just never take your foot completely off the gas).  The first few weeks of a new quarter are usually dead.  Our reports are not published until the third week or so of the month, so reviews are toast for at least another week.  All that is left is trading and referral mongering, both of which can be tedious at times.  I usually pop onto a forum (here or a car one) for a few minutes as a nice reset....  
Jan 12, 2010 7:27 pm

[quote=shantom1][quote=snaggletooth][quote=Billy Mays][quote=iceco1d]FWIW, I don’t think Shantom was arrogant at all in posting his numbers, and he is typically a very helpful guy. 

  Thanks again Shantom, and Rank, and everyone else that posted - yes, thank includes you Ronnie.[/quote] And, I don't disagree; he has been helpful and his posts are good, just his production numbers are bs. I say, divide by 10.  [/quote]   I don't think so.  If I was producing that much, I would have a staff and screw off half the day.  [/quote] Ding Ding Ding.  We have a winner (j/k). I for one will never downplay how much a good assistant or two will free up your time.  (once you have built a great business you can cruise control to some degree, just never take your foot completely off the gas).  The first few weeks of a new quarter are usually dead.  Our reports are not published until the third week or so of the month, so reviews are toast for at least another week.  All that is left is trading and referral mongering, both of which can be tedious at times.  I usually pop onto a forum (here or a car one) for a few minutes as a nice reset....  [/quote]

I agree normally.  But last week I had five people call and set appointments this month.  Freaky.  From web traffic.  I noted in another thread that web traffic increased, but our website sucks.  I wonder how much we'd get from a nice website. 

Who says you can't prospect electronically?
Jan 12, 2010 7:43 pm

Moraen, do you do any proactive web prospecting? (other than just having the site up)

Jan 12, 2010 8:11 pm

[quote=B24]Moraen, do you do any proactive web prospecting? (other than just having the site up)[/quote]

I’m not exactly sure what you mean.

Lauren posts our newsletters and blog posts all over LinkedIn, Facebook and such.  They are also on Twitter.

We are now the “#1” site that pops up on Google when you type, “Financial Advisor, Smalltown, USA” in.  Above Merrill and MSSB.  Which is pretty cool.  A year ago we were on page three.

We also use “webmercials” that are basically education lessons on things like “what is a stock and what does it mean when I own it”, “what are options”, “what the hell is a mortgage-backed security and why is it bad”.  Things like that.  We post them on YouTube and Facebook.

Do you have any ideas?

Jan 12, 2010 9:04 pm

My idea would be to put my email in the contact us link!

Jan 12, 2010 9:07 pm
Moraen:

[quote=B24]Moraen, do you do any proactive web prospecting? (other than just having the site up)[/quote]

I’m not exactly sure what you mean.

Lauren posts our newsletters and blog posts all over LinkedIn, Facebook and such.  They are also on Twitter.

We are now the “#1” site that pops up on Google when you type, “Financial Advisor, Smalltown, USA” in.  Above Merrill and MSSB.  Which is pretty cool.  A year ago we were on page three.

We also use “webmercials” that are basically education lessons on things like “what is a stock and what does it mean when I own it”, “what are options”, “what the hell is a mortgage-backed security and why is it bad”.  Things like that.  We post them on YouTube and Facebook.

Do you have any ideas?

  No, that's exactly what I meant.  Just wasn't sure if you did any of that stuff.  Have you gotten much out of it?
Jan 12, 2010 9:17 pm
Moraen:

[quote=B24]Moraen, do you do any proactive web prospecting? (other than just having the site up)[/quote]

I’m not exactly sure what you mean.

Lauren posts our newsletters and blog posts all over LinkedIn, Facebook and such.  They are also on Twitter.

We are now the “#1” site that pops up on Google when you type, “Financial Advisor, Smalltown, USA” in.  Above Merrill and MSSB.  Which is pretty cool.  A year ago we were on page three.

We also use “webmercials” that are basically education lessons on things like “what is a stock and what does it mean when I own it”, “what are options”, “what the hell is a mortgage-backed security and why is it bad”.  Things like that.  We post them on YouTube and Facebook.

Do you have any ideas?

  Uhh...she comes up when you google that term.    
Jan 13, 2010 3:12 am

Los. 10 years

household 835

aum. 215 mm

c*** size. 9 inches (flaccid)

nationality. Chinese.

Jan 13, 2010 3:15 pm

[quote=skbroker]Los. 10 years

household 835

aum. 215 mm

c*** size. 9 inches (flaccid)

nationality. Chinese.

[/quote]

I believed the first three until this part.

Jan 16, 2010 4:52 am

A little late to this debate.  My situation is a little different b/c I’m Dir of Biz Development at a small BD/RIA, so I keep a manageable book.  Still take new clients, but selective.

LOS = almost 11 yrs
HH = 35
AUM = $23mm
ROA = 1.10%

Mar 2, 2010 2:38 am

HH  500
LOS  4yrs
AUM  40mm

Jun 9, 2010 1:38 am

Interesting discussion, cool to see people from other B/D and where they are with their business.

HH: 275

LOS: 7yrs

AUM: 67mm

Jun 10, 2010 1:30 am

I have around 100 HH and 38MM in assets with a LOS of just under 6.  I just shipped about 40 HH to our call center.