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Sep 21, 2005 4:10 pm

Hmm they let a few people go in my town. And today, I get a recruiting call from them. Did not get details as I am not interested but the recruiter said deals are being made up to 125% of payout. That must sting those that were let go a little to know they are now paying others to come over.

Sep 21, 2005 4:15 pm

I've seen FAs join since the day they were letting people go.  There have only been a few that I've noticed, but they do have the best deal on the street. 


I think once they get everything under control and "fixed" (not the right word, but close enough), they will be solid, but it will depend on which direction they go - as would be the case with any firm in the same situation (ML, UBS, SSB, etc.).


If someone is sold on MWD, now is the time to go because the deals will shrink back to normal as things calm down. 


Just my thoughts.  Could be wrong.  It's bound to happen.

Sep 21, 2005 11:44 pm

They better put some effort into keeping the rest of us who are left or there's gonna be more people leaving.  I've seen SEVERAL $1,000,000+ teams leave to go to SSB, ML, & Wachovia over the past year. 


I'm furious, that MS is sucking up to the recruits and blowing off the rest of the advisors who have stuck with them through this past year of B.S. and lost clients over the bad national press.


Sep 22, 2005 8:18 am
iconsult100:

I'm furious, that MS is sucking up to the recruits and blowing off the rest of the advisors who have stuck with them through this past year of B.S. and lost clients over the bad national press.




Come on, MS got rid of pathetic producers and went out to recruit strong ones. If you're a shareholder you have to seen the commonsense in that move.

Sep 22, 2005 9:21 am

It makes sense, but at the same time, I completely agree with inconsult here.  You have to suck up to the recruits, but, at the same time, do what you need to do to retain the heavy hitters, otherwise you're going to see many leaving and the average production will drop again.  It's a double-edged sword.

Sep 22, 2005 9:30 am

If you aint doing over 500m, you are always welcome to leave.

Sep 22, 2005 10:02 am
BrokerRecruit:

It makes sense, but at the same time, I completely agree with inconsult here.  You have to suck up to the recruits, but, at the same time, do what you need to do to retain the heavy hitters, otherwise you're going to see many leaving and the average production will drop again.  It's a double-edged sword.



Big hitters come and go all the time in this aggressive recruiting environment. With all the attention MS has been getting the last nine months some guys felt it was a great reason to give clients as to why they moved and took the big check. The brokers knew it was nothing but a cover story. The same has happened to other firms and will happen again.


What would you suggest they do to retain big producers that they (and every other firm) isn't already doing?

Sep 22, 2005 10:05 am

I'm not saying they need to necessarily do anything else.  However, given the recent changes within the firm (and changes that any firm could realistically see at some point), they have to be cautious, or they will see a large defaction. 

Sep 22, 2005 10:09 am
BrokerRecruit:

I'm not saying they need to necessarily do anything else.  However, given the recent changes within the firm (and changes that any firm could realistically see at some point), they have to be cautious, or they will see a large defaction. 


Mack's doing all he can to promise changes for the better (which benefit big producers most of all) in the retail arm. From what I hear big producers were pretty happy about the cuts and the changes.


I think what you're seeing is, like I said above, some guys taking advantage of the situation to have a story as to why they moved and some remaining, lower producers whining that new, big recruits are getting checks. You'd think those smaller producers would be happy with the accounts they gained from the cuts.

Sep 22, 2005 12:23 pm

I got sh*t when two were cut in this office.  Granted b/w the 2 of them they maybe had 20mm in assets.

Sep 23, 2005 1:29 am
mikebutler222:
iconsult100:

I'm furious, that MS is sucking up to the recruits and blowing off the rest of the advisors who have stuck with them through this past year of B.S. and lost clients over the bad national press.




Come on, MS got rid of pathetic producers and went out to recruit strong ones. If you're a shareholder you have to seen the commonsense in that move.



I'm not saying anything about the layoffs... Yes, they need to replace those people, but don't suck up to a new 400k recruit, and neglect the 950k veterans who lost clients over the media storm earlier this year.  Do some things that will actually help or motivate those big producers continue to grow their business and stay at MS.


As a shareholder, I really didn't like seeing over $100,000,000 in annual revenue disappear last month, but that's a totally separate issue.

Sep 23, 2005 9:39 am
iconsult100:
mikebutler222:
iconsult100:

I'm furious, that MS is sucking up to the recruits and blowing off the rest of the advisors who have stuck with them through this past year of B.S. and lost clients over the bad national press.




Come on, MS got rid of pathetic producers and went out to recruit strong ones. If you're a shareholder you have to seen the commonsense in that move.



I'm not saying anything about the layoffs... Yes, they need to replace those people, but don't suck up to a new 400k recruit, and neglect the 950k veterans who lost clients over the media storm earlier this year.  Do some things that will actually help or motivate those big producers continue to grow their business and stay at MS.



Besides the check (and who's recruiting $400k producers? That's too low for MS right now) how are they "sucking up" to recruits and aside from what Mack's already done by replacing unpopular upper-tier management, bringing in new technology systems and products would you recommend.


Again, I hear nothing but happy talk from big producers. They're happy that deadwood that hurt the firm's image are gone and that Phil's left the building.


iconsult100:

As a shareholder, I really didn't like seeing over $100,000,000 in annual revenue disappear last month, but that's a totally separate issue.



One-time charges from discontinued operations, comp packages for departing managment types and fines. So long as they don't make a habit of these it amounts to the cost of doing business.

Sep 26, 2005 5:34 pm

Why do Reps work for these large wirehouses can't they see no matter how big they are as producers in the firm they are still nothing to a huge corporation! You are all replaceable to a firm and a client! As an Indy I can take out one of those threats!

Sep 26, 2005 5:52 pm
Greenbacks:

Why do Reps work for these large wirehouses can't they see no matter how big they are as producers in the firm they are still nothing to a huge corporation! You are all replaceable to a firm and a client! As an Indy I can take out one of those threats!



Your right, and the thousands of people in the wirehouse systems are blind...........could happen.


Green - I am at Merrill, I don't know if there is a better job in the entire world, than to be a million dollar producer here!! At that level, management is your best bud, and they are well aware, that you as a producer can walk with  a large portion of assetts. Wires do not make a habit of throwing there "corporate" weight around. What happened at Morgan is a result of a lot of things. I have not heard of any other brokerages laying people off, in fact Merrill just committed to increase highering.

Sep 26, 2005 7:22 pm

(and who's recruiting $400k producers? That's too low for MS right now)



I agree that the larger producers w/ MS think that Mack is moving things in the right direction.  However, I know a recruit came over from another wire 8 mos. ago to my office.  He is 12yrs. in the business and has never hit 300k.  I think it's foolish to be firing someone doing $200k and giving a sizeable upfront check to someone else doing $260. 

Sep 26, 2005 10:56 pm

[quote=mikebutler222

One-time charges from discontinued operations, comp packages for departing managment types and fines. So long as they don't make a habit of these it amounts to the cost of doing business.


[/quote]


Well, since the brokers are paid on what they produce.... what is the savings there?  You still have operations people, CSAs, and rent to pay.  I would really like someone to tell me the actual cost of 1 wirehouse broker.

Sep 27, 2005 7:29 am
iconsult100:

[quote=mikebutler222

One-time charges from discontinued operations, comp packages for departing managment types and fines. So long as they don't make a habit of these it amounts to the cost of doing business.



Well, since the brokers are paid on what they produce.... what is the savings there?  You still have operations people, CSAs, and rent to pay.  I would really like someone to tell me the actual cost of 1 wirehouse broker.


[/quote]


You mean the "cost" aside from having deadwood occupy an office and infect it wth low standards? BTW, what's a "CSA"?

Sep 27, 2005 7:30 am
MWD123:

(and who's recruiting $400k producers? That's too low for MS right now)



I agree that the larger producers w/ MS think that Mack is moving things in the right direction.  However, I know a recruit came over from another wire 8 mos. ago to my office.  He is 12yrs. in the business and has never hit 300k.  I think it's foolish to be firing someone doing $200k and giving a sizeable upfront check to someone else doing $260. 



Either you don't have his production numbers right or your manager is brain dead. I hear from friends in MS management that they never recruited people with numbers that low.

Sep 27, 2005 1:16 pm

I started the thread and my numbers are significantly over 400k (almost 3x's). Other firms ARE recruiting IRs doing less than 400k like mad right now in our area. 125% of trailing is the going rate I am hearing from several houses.

Sep 27, 2005 2:17 pm

I've found that MWD has one of the best deals out there.  SSB, ML are all offering, roughly, 100%.  There are exceptions, though.