Sooth - it seems really pathetic to me to read that five years after the fact you are still thinking about Jones enough that it gives you some sort of motivation.  Pikers and wannabes?  Really?  Puppy mill?  Again, really?  

  And you know what you do with pimples?  You pop them and they go away.  It's time to stop looking in the mirror at your butt.      Glass man - you wanna "be the man"?  Do it where it makes you happy.   If it's at Jones, stop worrying about what the other guy got and go make something happen for yourself.  This whining about the other people in your region getting something that you didn't isn't helping you succeed long term.  YOU are what will make you successful.  You could inherit a $50 mil office, do nothing with it, and still fail.    Now, if you think you can "be the man" better at LPL, go right ahead.  Knock yourself out.  But you'll probably find other things to whine about over there.  It's not a perfect world and you can find excuses for failure all over the place.   

This is an entertaining thread guys…

Someone might of said it earllier but here's my .02..having never worked at Jones I can tell you glass man that what you're experiencing happens all the time in the wirehouse environment. Doesn't make any diff wheather you're at ML, WB, Morgan Stanley or Jones they all have one thing in common & that is there is a branch manger or equivalent type guy who decides who he's going to feed & who he's not going to feed. Often the person whom he feeds first is his own book if he a producing bom. Keep in mind that if you're struggling with this concept at Jones try working in a wirehouse in this environment when a big hitter resigns & the bom drops $60 mill in one of his boys lap. It happens every day & it's just something you live with.

Thanks guys.  Good advice all the way around.

  I'm not sure what I'm going to do.  I'm going to regroup a little bit.  Part of what's going on is old fashioned burn out.  I haven't taken a week off in two years.  With my numbers weak I'm afraid to take a week off.   I see both sides of the issue.  It's not good to be a grumbler.  It's not my style.  On the other hand, I've found once a situation starts to turn bad it's hard to turn it around.   I've got to get energized again.  I hate to admit it - but I wasn't ready for bear market two (who was).  I was just starting to get to where the job was getting good and then I was thrust back into the bad old days.  I thought maybe we'd have a down 5% or a down 8% this year.  Who expected this apocalyptic end of the world stuff.   Realistically, I know the market will survive.  Will my branch?   What I may do is buy a leads list.  With a fresh list I can turn my brain off, start pounding the phone, and see what happens.  I door knock as well but I live in a rural town.  I have to burn miles to doorknock.  It's real spread out.   I got to get back to where I'm enjoying the job.  My mind has been racing with what else I would do if I were to leave.  I have two degrees.  I have a BS in Business and I have an MBA.  I do enjoy sales but I'm not a fanatic.  I get tired of chasing people around sometimes.   I've done a lot of client retention this week.  I've made a lot of phones calls.  Hand holding isn't very profitable though - at least not in the short term.    I went into production in 01 and switched firms in 03.  I did about 2 and a half years at Merrill.  Too be honest I really enjoyed my time at Merrill.  I came close to getting over the top there but got divorced in 03.  The divorce plus the bad market took me out.  At Merrill you knew where you stood.  They didn't have this group "mythology" about everyone starting from scratch.  Actually that clarity was a good thing.  If you were a pion - you clearly knew it.  Clarity is good I think.    I really appreciate the feedback.  I still would prefer my branch to survive and I know to do that I need to get energized.  What I have is this high stress and sluggishness.  The job hasn't been fun for a while.   If I were to leave - at least I made it to the five year point.  I notice in the brokerage industry alot of people have an "all or nothing" mentallity.  With five years in I couldn't call it a complete failure if I left.  It would be a move in another direction.   The part of the business I like best is my clients.  Sorry for the long ramble.  It helps to vent.   Glass Man

Hey Ice,

  When I switched firms I botched my switch.  I lost some assets and it set me back a year.   No, I'm not on drugs.      The job would probably be easier if I were.   My office is located in a town that's been rocked by the sub-prime mortgage crisis.  I know I can't use that as an excuse but the largest city next to me has the highest rate of foreclosure in California.  The largest industries in my town are Real Estate and Construction.  The economy here is not diversified.   I know the dogmatic idea that all towns are equal.  Jones has a religious zeal about pretending that all towns are equal.  This isn't religion though and nobody at Jones is going to save my soul.  My town for all intents and purposes is shut down right now.   I think overall Jones rural and small town strategy work pretty good.  I think the town my office is in is a marginal town.  It's a very spread out commuter town.  I'm working on sinking my teeth into the town but it's been hard to get it over the hump.  Also, I work hard to network my out of town clients for referrals.   I'm actually quite happy to have the new feee based format at Jones.  It hasn't been around long enough to do me any good.  Overall the long haul it should be another quiver in my arrowcase.   I have no illusions.  I'm not a natural salesman.  I must have done something right to survive five years but I need to re-evaluate my game plan to keep surviving.  Actually, I pay my bills fine.  It's the quota I'm struggling with.   Last year I was smoking the quota.  This year has been a literal nightmare.  I haven't thrown in the towel but it's almost like the job is completely different.  I think the burnout is caused by this prolonged struggle.  You get tired of being in a state of "perpetual emergency".  I don't mind stress.  I normally work quite well under pressure.  At points this year has been so tough sometimes changing jobs does seem like the solution.   Going back to the asset inheritors, I was holding my own with them before they struck inherited asset gold.  I know I got to forget about them now because they have nothing to do with my business.    Hopefully this bailout will go through and it will be easier to prospect with conviction.  I am sure some of the increased stress is just the result of the unique market phenominon that we are witnessing.  I hope that this is just like all the other pullbacks and that in two years we are back to normal.   Later.   Glass    

Glass,

  As an outsider looking in, you seem much too focused on outside forces ("JONES'S religious zeal about all towns being equal", or what someone else inherited has NOTHING to do with your business.  Another firm will not solve either of those problems.  Instead of focusing on that stuff, pretend you ARE independant.  What would you do then?  Other than the financial structure, nothing would change.  You would still haev to prospect, you would still have to find new clients, you would still have to convince people to work with you.   Honestly, I virtually ignore the fact that I am with Jones.  To me, they are a platform.  But I don't expect a single thing from them other than their platform (and the services that go with it).  And despite what anyone says, a different platform will not make me more successful with what I am doing RIGHT NOW.  Maybe some day if my client base shifts, or I need something different I would need a different platform.  But today, I am the only thing standing in the way of my success.   Point is, just make sure you aer focusing on the right things.

B24

  That's good advice.   I'm going to try to simplify my business and get back to basics.   G

[quote=glass man]Thanks guys.  Good advice all the way around.

  I'm not sure what I'm going to do.  I'm going to regroup a little bit.  Part of what's going on is old fashioned burn out.  I haven't taken a week off in two years.  With my numbers weak I'm afraid to take a week off.   I see both sides of the issue.  It's not good to be a grumbler.  It's not my style.  On the other hand, I've found once a situation starts to turn bad it's hard to turn it around.   I've got to get energized again.  I hate to admit it - but I wasn't ready for bear market two (who was).  I was just starting to get to where the job was getting good and then I was thrust back into the bad old days.  I thought maybe we'd have a down 5% or a down 8% this year.  Who expected this apocalyptic end of the world stuff.   Realistically, I know the market will survive.  Will my branch?   What I may do is buy a leads list.  With a fresh list I can turn my brain off, start pounding the phone, and see what happens.  I door knock as well but I live in a rural town.  I have to burn miles to doorknock.  It's real spread out.   I got to get back to where I'm enjoying the job.  My mind has been racing with what else I would do if I were to leave.  I have two degrees.  I have a BS in Business and I have an MBA.  I do enjoy sales but I'm not a fanatic.  I get tired of chasing people around sometimes.   I've done a lot of client retention this week.  I've made a lot of phones calls.  Hand holding isn't very profitable though - at least not in the short term.    I went into production in 01 and switched firms in 03.  I did about 2 and a half years at Merrill.  Too be honest I really enjoyed my time at Merrill.  I came close to getting over the top there but got divorced in 03.  The divorce plus the bad market took me out.  At Merrill you knew where you stood.  They didn't have this group "mythology" about everyone starting from scratch.  Actually that clarity was a good thing.  If you were a pion - you clearly knew it.  Clarity is good I think.    I really appreciate the feedback.  I still would prefer my branch to survive and I know to do that I need to get energized.  What I have is this high stress and sluggishness.  The job hasn't been fun for a while.   If I were to leave - at least I made it to the five year point.  I notice in the brokerage industry alot of people have an "all or nothing" mentallity.  With five years in I couldn't call it a complete failure if I left.  It would be a move in another direction.   The part of the business I like best is my clients.  Sorry for the long ramble.  It helps to vent.   Glass Man[/quote]   As I mentioned earlier, the fact that a broker can just slowly wither away is terrifying. I've always taken solace in the often-repeated Jones quote that says "if you'll work harder than most will for five years, you can live better than most can for the rest of your life." Obviously, there should have been a disclaimer attatched to that quote.    There are a few five-year plus folks in my region who are sucking serious pond water and fighting to keep their jobs right now.  I guess it proves that you must never quit prospecting...the part of the job that is most distasteful.    During a conference call yesterday afternoon, one of the GP's made a great suggestion to run a list of our most used funds in the branch and then run a hypo from 01/14/2000 until now. I ran Investment Company of America. $10,000 is now $12,809 with a 2.91% average annual return. Uh oh. How about Growth Fund? $10,000 is now $12,831 with a 2.93% average annual return. Oops.   I had to move way down the list and grab good ol' CAIBX and CWGIX to find something that has actually beaten CD's over that period--and CDs are 100% risk free.   Just how long is long term?   I agree with Glass Man. It's very difficult to sell with conviction right now. Especially when your father- and mother-in-law are yelling at you over the decline in their portfolio. They want to know just how flippin' long is long term? Anyone? Anyone?    Common guys, let's go ahead and push that bailout package through. Who cares what four generations from now have to pay back?

I think if I look back at my first 5 years, I will be honest and say I didn’t work every evening, every Saturday, hand a card to anyone who would take it.  I didn’t knock on every door I could have or called every prospect at least 7 times.  I trully believe if you do make the total, 110% comittment to this industry, you can hit the ball out of the park.  Most of us think we work that hard, but in reality, if we did, or if I did, I would be making 300-400k at my 7 year in the business. 

My goal, starting next week, is to work at least 2 nights a week and every Saturday possible, just to see what the real potential is in this industry. Most of us don't know what the real potential is, because we won't or can't in some cases, put the needed time and focus in. My wife, for example,  is a medical professional with two practices.  SHE is completely focused on her chosen career and after 10 years has 7000 client files, 9 staff members and 1.4mil in production. She puts in 110%. She is in the office by 7am and is rarely home by 6pm. She then makes calls patients at night to review there progress after a procedure.  Goes to 4 or 5 seminars a year in her field.  She is part of two associations which meets quarterly. She eats, drinks and dreams about her profession. Even on her occasional day off, like today, she is in the office talking with our accountant, reviewing ytd production vs goals.  If I had half her dedication, I would no doubt be pushing 500k in production or more. But, SHE SUCKS AT GOLF AND I DON'T.

[quote=iceco1d]Borker,

  You need to clear your head and find a new mindset soon or you are probably going to fail out.  Your negativity lately towards the industry, your job, and your firm are getting pretty overwhelming.  Maybe you need to explore other options/firms, or rethink your business plan?  I dunno.   A few points:   1.  CDs are NOT "risk free." 2.  "Long Term" to me means at least 10 years. 3.  Considering a "long term" time frame is not the end-all, be-all for a flawed portfolio design or poor investment strategy. 4.  Fee-based business should allow anyone who makes it 5 years at a wire, or EDJ, to never fail. 5.  After 5 years in the biz, you should have enough referrals to keep you fairly busy...if you aren't getting them, you are probably doing something wrong.  I have less than 2 years in the biz and they are already keeping me pretty busy.  As Spears mentioned above, he could have done plenty more as well, but yet, he is pretty successful.[/quote]   My production's fine. I haven't had one in a while, but I just came off a net $10,000 month.   It's not about the money; it's about the stress that comes from having folks I've been friends with for years yelling at me.   It's about calling people and telling them they will not be getting back the $21,000 they put with Lehman Brothers that was providing income for them to pay their bills.    It's about dealing with people sitting in my office who are retired and living off their investments and trying to figure out if they should go back to work: while they have their heads in their faces and are crying.     I'm paying my bills. I just didn't realize that my quality of life and close relationships would be so strained in this business.    We have so little control over the things we sell people, it's terrifying.

One of the things I tell people, especially the DIY types, is that one of the things I offer is the ability to separate the emotion from the investing.  It appears you are having a difficult time with that.  It’s great to have those relationships, but it makes it more difficult to go through times like this with them. 

  "We have so little control over the things we sell people, it's terrifying." - Once you convince yourself of this and learn to control what you can control, like diversification, then your life gets that much easier.  

[quote=bspears]I think if I look back at my first 5 years, I will be honest and say I didn’t work every evening, every Saturday, hand a card to anyone who would take it.  I didn’t knock on every door I could have or called every prospect at least 7 times.  I trully believe if you do make the total, 110% comittment to this industry, you can hit the ball out of the park.  Most of us think we work that hard, but in reality, if we did, or if I did, I would be making 300-400k at my 7 year in the business. 

My goal, starting next week, is to work at least 2 nights a week and every Saturday possible, just to see what the real potential is in this industry. Most of us don't know what the real potential is, because we won't or can't in some cases, put the needed time and focus in. My wife, for example,  is a medical professional with two practices.  SHE is completely focused on her chosen career and after 10 years has 7000 client files, 9 staff members and 1.4mil in production. She puts in 110%. She is in the office by 7am and is rarely home by 6pm. She then makes calls patients at night to review there progress after a procedure.  Goes to 4 or 5 seminars a year in her field.  She is part of two associations which meets quarterly. She eats, drinks and dreams about her profession. Even on her occasional day off, like today, she is in the office talking with our accountant, reviewing ytd production vs goals.  If I had half her dedication, I would no doubt be pushing 500k in production or more. But, SHE SUCKS AT GOLF AND I DON'T. [/quote]   Bspears...does that mean the EDJ guy who is doing 110% will make as much as the indy guy putting in about 75% of the effort?

[quote=Borker Boy][quote=iceco1d]Borker,

  You need to clear your head and find a new mindset soon or you are probably going to fail out.  Your negativity lately towards the industry, your job, and your firm are getting pretty overwhelming.  Maybe you need to explore other options/firms, or rethink your business plan?  I dunno.   A few points:   1.  CDs are NOT "risk free." 2.  "Long Term" to me means at least 10 years. 3.  Considering a "long term" time frame is not the end-all, be-all for a flawed portfolio design or poor investment strategy. 4.  Fee-based business should allow anyone who makes it 5 years at a wire, or EDJ, to never fail. 5.  After 5 years in the biz, you should have enough referrals to keep you fairly busy...if you aren't getting them, you are probably doing something wrong.  I have less than 2 years in the biz and they are already keeping me pretty busy.  As Spears mentioned above, he could have done plenty more as well, but yet, he is pretty successful.[/quote]   My production's fine. I haven't had one in a while, but I just came off a net $10,000 month.   It's not about the money; it's about the stress that comes from having folks I've been friends with for years yelling at me.   It's about calling people and telling them they will not be getting back the $21,000 they put with Lehman Brothers that was providing income for them to pay their bills.    It's about dealing with people sitting in my office who are retired and living off their investments and trying to figure out if they should go back to work: while they have their heads in their faces and are crying.     I'm paying my bills. I just didn't realize that my quality of life and close relationships would be so strained in this business.    We have so little control over the things we sell people, it's terrifying.[/quote]   Borker,   You don't want to hear this...There is NOTHING you can do to remedy the current situation.  Reality is sometimes we have to accept things as they are.  Clients DO know that.  Of course they blame you but you're simply the drive thru operator at McDonalds that takes the abuse when the order is screwed up.  As long as you've done your "job", take it for what it is.  Your business dictates that you personally extract as much money from your practice as is humanly possible in the most ethical and responible manner.  You want friends, get a dog.  I'm no EDJ cheerleader but do what they tell you to do - you'll be fine

Rock solid post.

  I'm having similar thoughts about ways to revitalize my branch.

[quote=Borker Boy] [quote=iceco1d]Borker,

You need to clear your head and find a new mindset soon or you are probably going to fail out. Your negativity lately towards the industry, your job, and your firm are getting pretty overwhelming. Maybe you need to explore other options/firms, or rethink your business plan? I dunno.



A few points:



1. CDs are NOT "risk free."

2. “Long Term” to me means at least 10 years.

3. Considering a “long term” time frame is not the end-all, be-all for a flawed portfolio design or poor investment strategy.

4. Fee-based business should allow anyone who makes it 5 years at a wire, or EDJ, to never fail.

5. After 5 years in the biz, you should have enough referrals to keep you fairly busy…if you aren’t getting them, you are probably doing something wrong. I have less than 2 years in the biz and they are already keeping me pretty busy. As Spears mentioned above, he could have done plenty more as well, but yet, he is pretty successful.[/quote]



My production’s fine. I haven’t had one in a while, but I just came off a net $10,000 month.



It’s not about the money; it’s about the stress that comes from having folks I’ve been friends with for years yelling at me.



It’s about calling people and telling them they will not be getting back the $21,000 they put with Lehman Brothers that was providing income for them to pay their bills.



It’s about dealing with people sitting in my office who are retired and living off their investments and trying to figure out if they should go back to work: while they have their heads in their faces and are crying.



I’m paying my bills. I just didn’t realize that my quality of life and close relationships would be so strained in this business.



We have so little control over the things we sell people, it’s terrifying.[/quote]



Borker, this is one weird post.



This is not nearly the worst it’s ever been (have you LOOKED at a chart of 2000-2002?). If you have lost THAT much money for clients, then you may be doing something wrong with your asset allocations. How could retired folks have lost so much money that they have to go back to work? Granted, bonds have not been stellar, but a conservastive balance of investments might be off 10% from peak to trough right now. Yes, an all-equity portfolio will be off more-or-less double that, but a retired person??



Are things really that bad for you?

Borkerboy, you have to find a way to add value.  You are down in the dumps because you aren’t adding value.  If all that you do is get someone to go from fund XYZ to fund ABC, you’ve added no value.  If all that you do is get someone to move from CD’s to fund ABC, it’s the market that is determining whether you have added value and not your advice.

  You need to find ways in which you add value...even if you do absolutely nothing to change one's rate of return.  Picking the "correct" mutual fund is not how we add value.  I'm going to start another thread on this.