Edward Jones Performance Exception

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Jan 21, 2009 4:17 pm

It makes perfect sense if you combine it with the xfer bonuses from your other post... They are replacing "maybe" producers, with "proven" producers at a level 2-3x that of a normal seg 2-3.

 
 
The exception is with whether your RL vouches for you, prospects in system, and how well you are liked in the region..
Jan 21, 2009 7:45 pm

It even makes perfect sense if you exchange a "Not" producer with a "Maybe" producer.  No offense to paulie but 40% of what everyone already agrees are very low industry standards to begin with?  It is also a rolling 4 month average, not a rolling 4 day average.  It may be "tough" but it did not sneek up at night while you were sleeping.  It took a third of a year to hit 40%.  Plus Spiff don't we have to pay a "minimum" wage now not to mention all the variable costs?  No matter how you do the math paulie costs more than $0.

Jan 21, 2009 8:01 pm

Maybe you might recognize my photo.  It's the CEO of Raymond James.

Jan 21, 2009 9:25 pm
rankstocks:

Should have worked harder.  Let me guess how your typical day went.....Get in around 10am, read periodicals for an hour, take a 2 hour lunch, make a couple calls, shuffle paperwork, pick up dry cleaning, stop at craft store for wife, wonder why you got fired.

What a wiseacre.. You know nothing of the situation yet you feel compelled to slam the person who asked a reasonable question. You are truly a mentor!!!
Jan 21, 2009 10:08 pm

It is a tough situation.  But, we have to be honest with ourselves as well.  Sometimes it just isn't going to work.  In regard to replacement with a eval/grad - no different that substituting in the back-up quarterback - same team (clients) maybe different attitude and fresh legs (for doorknocking.)

 
If you are meant to be in this industry - you will succeed.  I know some big producers that were released from their first companies.
Jan 22, 2009 11:27 am

They did you a favor, bud... I would agree with calling an LPL recruiter to see if that is an option... I left EDJ on my own Seg 3 after 3 years and have had a much easier time now that I am not selling commissions.  I just netted more than my best gross year every at EDJ in my second year of indy... it is a different world over here...

Jan 22, 2009 2:01 pm

Yo Paulie:

 
There is some silver lining involved in being fired.  You can talk to another firm without paying back your training costs.  Check out the independents and banks to see if you can become a Junior Broker.
 
I am sad to say that this is going to be more common in this industry as I have had many conversations with brokers who are going to be looking for work in 2009 and they are doing 300 grand a year.  All I can say it thank God I am self employed and working for a good firm.
 
IndyEDJ
Jan 22, 2009 2:03 pm
iceco1d:

Who's this James fellow you speak of?!?!?!

 
Jessie James
 
 
Jan 22, 2009 2:46 pm
IndyEDJ:

Yo Paulie:

 
There is some silver lining involved in being fired.  You can talk to another firm without paying back your training costs.  Check out the independents and banks to see if you can become a Junior Broker.
 
IndyEDJ
 
Junior broker? What is that and how do you find one of those seats?
 
 
Jan 22, 2009 3:10 pm
Spaceman Spiff:

In order for you to be terminated by Jones for performance issues you have to be put on goals, like someone else said before, and then hit your bogey every month until you get your butt off of goals.  I realize that's a difficult task, but if you were only out 3 years or so, your monthly goal would have been somewhere between $12K and $13K GROSS to be hitting the minimum expectation.  To be put on goals you have to be at 40% of that number, so that would mean that you were producing about $5200 GROSS or less a month. 








 
I am presently considering an offer from Jones so naturally this conversation is of interest to me.  Will you indulge me a few questions, please?
 
Is gross production 1% of new assets brought in that month?  Does that $12k figure include fees generated by AUM from prior clients as well?
 
Can anyone explain what the 'goals' are?  Number of new contacts, etc?  Goals and production aren't the same thing?  What is a bogey, in this sense?
 
Yo, Paulie, my sympathy.  I hear its pretty brutal out there right now.  I'm presently contemplating trying it myself, so your tale makes me nervous.
Jan 22, 2009 3:35 pm
Spaceman Spiff:

I You might also be the victim of a prick of an area partner.  Some of them will work with you, some won't.  Ultimately they're the ones who get to cut the strings on your Jones life.  Fortunately for me, mine called me when I hit 50%. 

 


See, these are the things they don't explain to you in the interview process.  So an area partner decides if struggling guys get the boot or not?  Do they pick up Paulie's clients when he leaves?
 
Can you explain what you meant by that 50% statement?
 
My apologies, I'm on the outside looking in, some of the shop talk goes right over my head.
Jan 22, 2009 4:46 pm
Potential:
Spaceman Spiff:

In order for you to be terminated by Jones for performance issues you have to be put on goals, like someone else said before, and then hit your bogey every month until you get your butt off of goals.  I realize that's a difficult task, but if you were only out 3 years or so, your monthly goal would have been somewhere between $12K and $13K GROSS to be hitting the minimum expectation.  To be put on goals you have to be at 40% of that number, so that would mean that you were producing about $5200 GROSS or less a month. 








 
I am presently considering an offer from Jones so naturally this conversation is of interest to me.  Will you indulge me a few questions, please? Sure.
 
Is gross production 1% of new assets brought in that month? Bringing in new assets doesn't mean squat. You've gotta sell them something.  Does that $12k figure include fees generated by AUM from prior clients as well? Yes.
 
Can anyone explain what the 'goals' are?  Number of new contacts, etc? That's part of it.  Goals and production aren't the same thing? All that really matters is whether you're selling and generating commissions, aka, hitting your goals.  What is a bogey, in this sense? Your goals.
 
Yo, Paulie, my sympathy.  I hear its pretty brutal out there right now.  I'm presently contemplating trying it myself, so your tale makes me nervous.
Jan 22, 2009 4:55 pm
Potential:
Spaceman Spiff:

I You might also be the victim of a prick of an area partner.  Some of them will work with you, some won't.  Ultimately they're the ones who get to cut the strings on your Jones life.  Fortunately for me, mine called me when I hit 50%. 

 


See, these are the things they don't explain to you in the interview process.  So an area partner decides if struggling guys get the boot or not?  Apparently so. Do they pick up Paulie's clients when he leaves? They'll usually promise them to the next guy who takes over the office, but many of them will leave or be poached by the other Jones guys in town.
 
Can you explain what you meant by that 50% statement? He was only hitting 50% of his monthly production goal and was about to get his walking papers. 
 
My apologies, I'm on the outside looking in, some of the shop talk goes right over my head.
Jan 22, 2009 4:57 pm

Thing is if you're getting in right now, it may be interesting for the first couple of years, but you've missed the big downturn (he says while crossing fingers and knocking on wooden desk).  I hit the field in Oct 02.  My clients didn't know they could lose money for almost 5 years. 

 
To explain the shop talk is difficult, but I'll give it a shot.  Jones expects you to generate a certain number of dollars each month in commissions.  When you start, it's pretty small.  The farther along you get the bigger the number becomes.  Any commissions you make count towards those goals.  New clients, existing clients, doesn't matter.  Jones tracks it two ways.  First on a monthly basis, then on a 4 month rolling average.  It's that 4 month rolling average that they pay attention to the most.  My 4 month rolling average right now includes what commissions I generated in Sept, Oct, Nov, and Dec.  When I finish up Jan next week, Sept will fall off (thankfully) and my little dot on my performance chart will move up. 
 
What happened with Paulie is that he kept his 4 month rolling average above the level Jones said he needed to for a long time.  But then for some reason it fell to at least 40% below where they said it needed to be.  So while Jones was saying he needed to be making $12K or $13K gross a month, he was making like $5000.  Once you get to that point Jones puts you on what they call "goals".  It's a nice term for your production sucks and it needs to get up to where we say right now or you're fired.  Well, for Paulie he didn't get it back on track in time and they fired him. 
 
Area partners are General Partners who work in the home office.  They, along with the Regional Leader, have the job of being the hatchet man.  I wasn't aware that they were making exceptions these days for people.  I always thought goals were pretty much cut and dried.  Either you hit them or you didn't. 
 
Finally, what I meant by the 50% statement was when my 4 month rolling average got to 50% of what Jones expected, I got a call from my Area Leader to tell me if I didn't pick it up I was in danger of going on goals. 
 
It is a bunch of shop talk.  Don't worry too much about it right now.  One good round of drinks after you've passed the S7 is enough to explain in fully to you.
Jan 22, 2009 7:35 pm

Message to Yo Paulie:



Don't be passive. If you think you can switch firms and fight for your clients - do it.



If you're leaving the industry and have a friend at a different firm - make an arrangement

for the names of your clients, an endorsement from you, and negotiate so you get something

for your book besides a handshake. That transfer broker coming in don't give a Rats but about

your client. He just wants to churn the book a bit for a paycheck.



Jones is a great firm. These days though there is so much nepotism and favoritism going on

that all that talk about the old days and how the old timers did it really doesn't mean anything.

It's meaningless chatter.



If this market has another down 20 some of these old timers that feel so smug right now may be

joining you - and perhaps tasting financial fear for themselves for the first time in a long time.



What the old timers won't tell you is that they are all secretly happy that they didn't hit a down 38% in

their third or fourth year of the business. From 1980 to 1999 was a unique period of time and a rather

rosy one to be a stock broker. Also, I'm tired of hearing about the crash of 1987. I don't want to hear about it any more because it was a speed bump compared to this.





Jan 22, 2009 9:30 pm

Paulie, I served as a RL/GP for several years and will tell you that the decision to make the exception, or not, was primarily mine. Your RL would have had a conversation with those in the region who spent the most time with you. Your production would not have been the only consideration. New accounts, new prospects (verified by those entered into the system), daily activities, etc. were all reviewed. It is not difficult to tell who is doing the right activities and who is not. The final conversation is between the RL and area leader, that is when the decision is made. The reason an exception would not have been made for you in my region is because the consensus was that you would continue to struggle, which does neither you or the company any good. This may not bring you peace with the decision, but it explains why it was made. Best wishes!

Jan 22, 2009 9:43 pm

you are an absolute jackass!  The man is working his butt off trying to establish himself in this industry and you have to question his work ethic.  It's morons like you that continue to give this profession a black eye

Jan 22, 2009 9:58 pm

If your business is only transactional, like all newer jones fa are, then you are not being paid for calling all your clients over and over and over again. To tell them the buy and hold is the only way to go!  Is there any other way?

Jan 22, 2009 11:00 pm
Spaceman Spiff:
...... my little dot on my performance chart will move up. 
 
 
And there is the essence of Jones in one little phrase.  After more than 6 years at the company, Spiff, you're nothing more than a little performance dot on your RL's and AL's screen.  They couldn't give a shit about you, your kids, your family, your situaton, or the fact that we're in the midst of the most difficult market condtions in 75 years.  Pathetic.
Jan 22, 2009 11:07 pm
harris9:

you are an absolute jackass!  The man is working his butt off trying to establish himself in this industry and you have to question his work ethic.  It's morons like you that continue to give this profession a black eye



Hey noob-

He didn't question the guy's work ethic.  He simply described the process Jones followed in making these decisions.  Sounds like a fair process to me, actually.

This is a business where 'trying hard' does not matter, only the final result.  Ink on paper.

It sucks when you end up on the short end of the stick whether by bad luck or bad work habits...but that's how it is.