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For a Career Changer, MetLife, EDJ or?

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Jun 24, 2009 8:31 pm

[quote=Borker Boy]Go with MetLife and tell prospects you chose them because you believe that folks should insure their retirement along with their lives, health, home and autos. Edward Jones SELLS risky investments to clients; MetLife ASSUMES the risk for its clients.

  Should be a very easy sell in this environment.[/quote]   He could offer a MetLife annuity, MetLife insurance, and MetLife LTC policy to the same family, but do it through EDJ.  Or he could say MetLife is a fine company, but Hartford, Lincoln, Hanc***, et al could offer a better product or a better price.  Then he could sell them the one that best matches his needs.  Then he could sell them a bond, stock, ETF, or CD.  Don't know for sure, but my guess would be that as a MetLife captive agent, you're stuck selling your one company.  Seems to me you'd rather have a multitude of options for your clients than just one company.     You really are a tool aren't you?  Find anywhere to jump to yet?  AXA not hiring? 
Jun 26, 2009 4:25 am

Iceco1d if you are still there, you said this… 

  I think you can do it @ both, but If you want to do financial planning as a core of your practice, you're probably better off @ neither of these firms.   If I did want to do financial planning as a core practice, what would be your firm of choice?  
Jun 26, 2009 10:22 am

Spiff, the Metlife guy could also sell those other products.  The difference is that he can do it without having to put the products through the grid.

  ByeByeGolf, if you want to make your money from financial planning, you probably don't want to affiliate with any broker/dealer.  Broker/dealers are needed to sell financial products, but you need an RIA firm to sell financial advice.   Except with rare exceptions, getting paid to do financial planning is a low paying career.   One can make lots of money selling financial products for a commission and one can make lots of money managing assets for a % fee.   The money simply isn't there for the financial planning.
Jun 26, 2009 9:31 pm

Not sure I know enough yet to answer this accurately, but I will give it a stab…

  Basically I'd like to be able to talk to clients about how to get from where they are now financially to where they would like to be.  And answer if that goal is a possible one.    I would imagine I can do that almost anywhere.  But when you mentioned financial planning as the core of a practice, I thought perhaps there were other avenues in terms of firms I was not aware of. 
Jun 26, 2009 10:59 pm

[quote=ByeByeGolf]Not sure I know enough yet to answer this accurately, but I will give it a stab…

  Basically I'd like to be able to talk to clients about how to get from where they are now financially to where they would like to be.  And answer if that goal is a possible one.   [/quote]   What you're describing is using a calculator to apply the client's idea and then taking your knowledge of investments and finding a suitable investment allocation.   Yes, you can do that anywhere.   But... you've got to do more than help the client reach their "financial goals".  If they are at "X" and they want "Y" in 5 years, what happens if they are sued for all they own?  What happens in case of death?  Disability?  Long Term Illness?  Unemployment?  OR they have a very good real estate investment opportunity and would need to deplete their account with you to take advantage of it (and take your income stream from that client away from you)?   At Edward Jones, you CAN answer those other questions and be paid for it (but there isn't much emphasis on those areas).  But you can do a better job at Metlife and be paid MUCH better for it and do a better job for the client.   I'm biased in where I would go, but I pose the question for you to ponder for yourself.
Jun 26, 2009 11:55 pm

“Basically I’d like to be able to talk to clients about how to get from where they are now financially to where they would like to be.  And answer if that goal is a possible one.”

  1) How much money do you think a client will pay for you to do this?  2)How many people will be willing to pay you this amount of money?  3)After your firm takes their cut and you pay your expenses, how much money do you think that you'll make?   In case you don't know the answers to the above questions, let me answer them for you. 1) Not very much.  2) Not very many.  3) Very little.   Financial planning = low paying job Financial plan implementation= high paying job Invesment management = high paying job   The value that you can bring to the table is getting people to take action on the things that need to be done.  That is sales.  That is where the money is made.   Telling people what needs to be done is easy.  That is why it is low paying.  Getting people to take action is difficult.  That is why it is high paying.   If you want to get paid to tell people what needs to be done as opposed to getting paid to get them to take action, EDJ and MetLife are both wrong places for you.   You would want to avoid all broker/dealers.
Jun 27, 2009 3:45 am

Seems to me the greatest plan in the world isn’t worth much unless you can get them to act.  So yes, I am looking to get paid to get them to take action.

  In terms of RIA firms, is there such a thing as an entry level position (or should I say, are there still positions in the current economy), or is it made up of people who gained experience elsewhere?
Jul 7, 2009 11:22 pm

I have worked at a large Northwestern Mutual  branch in one of the nations largest cities and I can tell you for a fact that all they care about is insurance. At Metlife it will be exactly the same. 95% of the guys working their will only sell insurance, whole life at that. The other 5% will peddle mutual funds amounting to less then 10% of their business. I have seen the breakdown month after month, for the branch and individuals.
 
The comment about people being more inclined to invest with a insurance company then the 2nd ranked full service broker by Forbes magazine, then you have your head in the sand.

Jul 8, 2009 12:50 am

[quote=svm21]I have worked at a large Northwestern Mutual  branch in one of the nations largest cities and I can tell you for a fact that all they care about is insurance. At Metlife it will be exactly the same. 95% of the guys working their will only sell insurance, whole life at that. The other 5% will peddle mutual funds amounting to less then 10% of their business. I have seen the breakdown month after month, for the branch and individuals.
 
The comment about people being more inclined to invest with a insurance company then the 2nd ranked full service broker by Forbes magazine, then you have your head in the sand.

[/quote]

I guess you didn’t make it then.  An insurance company can be a great place to build an investment business.  It’s all about positioning.

If you can’t or don’t want to talk to your clients about insurance then someone else will and they’ll end up walking out with the investments before it’s all said and done.

Jul 8, 2009 2:54 am


Lets consider the facts at hand. Insurance companies, are by their nature more interested and supportive of insurance sales, specfically whole life. Evidence of this can be found in the monthly production report that each employee would receive. Not surprsingly it would only include life insurance, after all they are indeed a LIFE INSURANCE company. As far as “a great place to build a investement business” your mistaken. Out of the two offices under the managing partner consisting of 80 reps, only eight of them had their series 7. Two of them were the Investment Specialists. None had their CFP. After seeing this month after month I inquired about the % that investments contributed to their total production. I was devastated to learn that it was less then 10% and none of the reps had any ambition to change that. In fact more then one rep, said “I don’t believe in stocks or mutual funds, I’m putting all my money into whole life.” Sad. but true.

 Further proof towards their disregard for investments can be found in their utter refusual to sponser or pay for the series 7, for anyone under the 3 year marker. The MP said himself that its "useless in this business."Some “great place” for a investment orinatated career. 

Jul 8, 2009 10:48 am

SVM21, I believe that your comments are 100% accurate for your specific branch of  one insurance company.

It is true that the insurance companies don't care about investments.  The insurance company B/D operation is a break even proposition at best.   The problem is that you are looking at this from the wrong point of view.  Look at it from the rep's point of view.  What does a high producing rep get from the insurance company?   80% + payout on GDC, insurance sales off the grid, pension, 401(k), health insurance, free office space, etc.   People care about their rep and not their rep's company.
Jul 8, 2009 4:32 pm

Your right on 80% payout, we earned 85%, but that’s it. In our branch, we had to pay for rent, paper, stables, marketing materials, business cards, copies, prints, etc., your name it we payed it. Rent alone was $700 for a small office. And I’m sorry but I couldn’t make a living selling whole life to people who didn’t need it. I felt it was unethical. Northwestern Mutual has the highest term life prices out their, and for what reason? O that’s right, because you can convert to whole life. Who gives a sh*t? Their business cards even say “Financial Representatives.” Were not allowed to tell people were financial advisors due to SEC regulations, yet all of the reps lead people to beleive that they run a "insurance and investment practice."They lead people to beleive that their representative is capable of giving well rounded financial advice. Their not. They don’t. Their insurance salesmen. Thats its. There not advisors.  I didn’t bust my ass for four years to be a insurance salesmen. 

Jul 8, 2009 7:40 pm

Typically with NML or a similar company if you are producing a decent amount of insurance, they won’t charge you rent.  If you were a decent producer, you should have been able to get out of the rent charge.

  Do you expect any company to pay you 85% and buy you staples?   You can't make a living selling whole life insurance to people who don't need it.  You can make a fortune selling it to people who do need it along with getting a payout of 85% of GDC.  You could have also make a lot of money selling term insurance outside of NML if you didn't like their term.   NML is my biggest competion.  Some of those guys are just insurance salesman.  Others have very comprehensive practices and do a great job for their clients.   Sorry, but it sounds as if the issue is you.
Jul 8, 2009 8:11 pm
svm21:


Lets consider the facts at hand. Insurance companies, are by their nature more interested and supportive of insurance sales, specfically whole life. Evidence of this can be found in the monthly production report that each employee would receive. Not surprsingly it would only include life insurance, after all they are indeed a LIFE INSURANCE company. As far as “a great place to build a investement business” your mistaken. Out of the two offices under the managing partner consisting of 80 reps, only eight of them had their series 7. Two of them were the Investment Specialists. None had their CFP. After seeing this month after month I inquired about the % that investments contributed to their total production. I was devastated to learn that it was less then 10% and none of the reps had any ambition to change that. In fact more then one rep, said “I don’t believe in stocks or mutual funds, I’m putting all my money into whole life.” Sad. but true.

 Further proof towards their disregard for investments can be found in their utter refusual to sponser or pay for the series 7, for anyone under the 3 year marker. The MP said himself that its "useless in this business."Some “great place” for a investment orinatated career. 

    Devastated? Wow.   And just how far have all those "investments" gotten our clients over the past several years?
Jul 8, 2009 8:58 pm

Anonymous which insurance company do you work for?


Lets make this clear. If someone wants to deal primarily with investments then they should avoid any/all insurance companies.  Theres a reason why there not called “full service brokers.” If someone want to deal primarily with insurance and sell a mutual fund one every three months, then they should work at NWM, Met, Mass, etc. They will make truckloads of money and be extremely happy.

Listen Porkerboy, I was devastated for several reasons. One during the interview process they lead me and many others to believe that we were advisors and investments were going to be a substanial part of our business. They lied. Flat out. I liked my bosses alot, hell  I even went to the MP house and went swimming. You are right that the problem was me. I wanted to help people with investing and retirment planning, not just selling them LTC or Life insurance. Will I sell those products at my new firm? Sure, when the situation demands it. If they could benifit more by investing in XYZ stock, bond, etf, index mutual fund then I will do that. By leaving a INSURANCE company and working at a full service broker I can provide my client a TRUE investment and insurance practice.   

In regards to Porkerboy’s comment, pertaining to the poor performance of all investments in the past 24 months.  To claim that this 50 year tragedy is the norm is very short-sighted.
A good whole life sales pitch for the old widow, “O but look at the Cash Surrender Value!!,” but transparent and pathetic.  God have mercy on all your clients. Hopefully you will fail before you do any more harm.

Jul 8, 2009 9:10 pm

I work for Anonymous Financial.  Keep in mind that most insurance B/D’s are independent.  Their reps are not employees of the B/D.  Investments weren’t a substantial part of your business because you didn’t make them a substantial part of your business.

  Your problem is probably that you were doing $50,000 of insurance commissions and $20,000 of GDC.  There is nothing that would have stopped you from doing $50,000 of insurance commissions and $500,000 of GDC.   I'm curious.  What will you offer that I can't?   "A good whole life sales pitch for the old widow, "O but look at the Cash Surrender Value!!,"   If you think whole life is about the cash surrender value, you don't understand the product.
Jul 8, 2009 9:22 pm
Is this 50 year tragedy the norm? Probably not. But we're in a heap of trouble if we see this type of thing every 5-6 years.   Regarding insurance, I've learned a great deal from anonymous and deekay about the importance of PROTECTING clients' assets before trying to grow them.   $100 a month into Capital Income Builder ain't gonna do a whole lot of good if daddy gets hit by a mack truck, but $100 a month into a term life policy could make a world of difference for momma and the kids after the funeral's over. I now lead with insurance and get into investments AFTER the client's protected.   It's apparent to me that you can't sell and believe working for an invesment-focused company will make you successuful.   You're wrong, though.    
Jul 8, 2009 9:30 pm



And I understand whole life insurance very well, I just don’t believe it s the best thing since sliced bread like many of the INSURANCE SALESMEN that sell them do. Hmm maybe it has do with the unethically high commissions!

Ok anonymous, I will puff up your ego, which Insurance company is honored to have you as their broker? What company emblem does your business card have? Hm?

If you can offer anything and everything that a full service broker offers, then why are not on any other lists of full service brokers?? Maybe just Maybe…BECAUSE YOU CAN’T OFFER ALL PRODUCTS AND SERVICES.


I’m not getting through to you. I quit.

Jul 8, 2009 9:34 pm

Porker, I don’t sell things I don’t believe in. Its the comments made by you and anonymous that insurance salesmen have a bad rep. You guys are always trying to make a buck by preying in people’s fears, i.e. death. Every unbiased advisor, expert will tell you that the commissions are insanely high on whole life, and that 90% of people should just buy term and invest the difference.  

Jul 8, 2009 9:35 pm

[quote=svm21]

And I understand whole life insurance very well, I just don’t believe it s the best thing since sliced bread like many of the INSURANCE SALESMEN that sell them do. Hmm maybe it has do with the unethically high commissions!

Ok anonymous, I will puff up your ego, which Insurance company is honored to have you as their broker? What company emblem does your business card have? Hm?

If you can offer anything and everything that a full service broker offers, then why are not on any other lists of full service brokers?? Maybe just Maybe…BECAUSE YOU CAN’T OFFER ALL PRODUCTS AND SERVICES.


I’m not getting through to you. I quit.

[/quote]

f*** you and your high commissions, you little bitch. How much profit does your doctor make when you have the sniffles? Teachers salaries are pure profit. So was your dad’s salary. Did you know that their was at least a 50% markup on the last box of cereal that you bought?