No longer at Edward Jones, looking into options

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Aug 3, 2009 9:09 pm

Well, a couple of weeks ago the train ride came to an end. My CSD was mid '08 and I couldn't regain enough traction over the past few months after PDP. I was let go and am now looking for insight. Thanks to all for any helpful input.

Aug 3, 2009 9:40 pm

EJ must be doing some housecleaning...I just got let go last week. Didn't even make it to PDP.


I'm looking at 3 options:

1. Joining another firm to see if having an office and some mentors makes a difference.
2. Going back to my old industry and working 60-80 hours a week.
3. Going back to my old industry but working 30-40 hours a week and trying to start and advisor biz on the side.

I actually believe #3 is a pipe-dream, but it's still on the table.

Aug 3, 2009 9:48 pm
Sometimes you gotta know when to hold then, know when to fold them, know when to walkaway when the dealings done.... casue you sure are not counting your money.
 
Primerica might be your only other option unless a bank or an indy are desperate. 
Aug 3, 2009 9:54 pm
[email protected]:

EJ must be doing some housecleaning...I just got let go last week. Didn't even make it to PDP.


I'm looking at 3 options:

1. Joining another firm to see if having an office and some mentors makes a difference.
2. Going back to my old industry and working 60-80 hours a week.
3. Going back to my old industry but working 30-40 hours a week and trying to start and advisor biz on the side.

I actually believe #3 is a pipe-dream, but it's still on the table.



Check out insurance companies.  I'm sure most of them would love to have you and the minimums won't be like Jones since you'd share secretaries and they'd house you in a central office location with several other agents/advisors, in other words you can build at your own pace because they're not spending $100k per year on you or whatever Jones offices cost.  Payout will be better too on investments.  We get 80% on wrap business, and a sliding scale from 50% up to 85% of GDC on commission based business. 

Aug 3, 2009 9:58 pm
voltmoie:
Sometimes you gotta know when to hold then, know when to fold them, know when to walkaway when the dealings done.... casue you sure are not counting your money.
 
Primerica might be your only other option unless a bank or an indy are desperate. 



Shouldn't you be calling California right now, Volt?
Remember the 30 day war...

Aug 3, 2009 10:01 pm
HUGE payouts!, what firm/ B/D?
 
 
BerkshireBull:
[email protected]:

EJ must be doing some housecleaning...I just got let go last week. Didn't even make it to PDP.

I'm looking at 3 options:
1. Joining another firm to see if having an office and some mentors makes a difference.
2. Going back to my old industry and working 60-80 hours a week.
3. Going back to my old industry but working 30-40 hours a week and trying to start and advisor biz on the side.

I actually believe #3 is a pipe-dream, but it's still on the table.



Check out insurance companies.  I'm sure most of them would love to have you and the minimums won't be like Jones since you'd share secretaries and they'd house you in a central office location with several other agents/advisors, in other words you can build at your own pace because they're not spending $100k per year on you or whatever Jones offices cost.  Payout will be better too on investments.  We get 80% on wrap business, and a sliding scale from 50% up to 85% of GDC on commission based business

Aug 3, 2009 10:07 pm

DCnew, I'd rather not name my company specifically but I know we're not alone, I have a buddy at NML and he gets the same type payout.  I think most big mutual insurance companies pay really well on the investment side.

Aug 3, 2009 10:13 pm
voltmoie:
Sometimes you gotta know when to hold then, know when to fold them, know when to walkaway when the dealings done.... casue you sure are not counting your money.
 
Primerica might be your only other option unless a bank or an indy are desperate. 
Volt, Why would you say primerica? I have not heard the greatest things about them in the past. I was let go for not hitting my goals, clean u5, so why smear my resume with a chop shop? I'm not here bad mouthing EDJ, so why slam me?
It didnt work out there, but I had 10 years successful sales/management experience prior to EDJ, am well educated (BBA, working on MBA ) and I see no reason to lower my standards at this stage of my career. I wish you the best in building your business, I was exceeding EDJ expectations at your stage of the game; Just some humble food for thought. good luck building your business and I hope you are more successful at Jones than I ended up.
Best wishes.
Aug 3, 2009 11:51 pm

Still - I stopped calling at 6:30 today.  Did some paperwork this evening.  Cold calling is Friday. The WAR is on! 
 
DC .. You missed the point of my comment and I didn't mean it it be rude .. but from what I understand Jones has VERY low goals within the industry.  If you failed out of a company with low goals what makes you think you'll do better else where?  I don't give two SH*TS about your education or background ... did it matter at Jones?  NOPE... you were fired for not hitting goals.  Like I said, if you can find a bank or an indy willing to give you a shot that's a good bet. Those are the first doors I'd knock on if I was let go.  If not, what else is there? The wires don't want a guy that can't hit Jones numbers.  That's just reality.  Berk said insurance companies, so that's a good option too. 

Either way, good luck ...

Aug 4, 2009 12:32 am

It's not that hard to hit Jones "Goals" if you are doing the work. They are pretty low, unless you are just not doing the work. I haven't met a person yet who did the work and got fired for not hitting goals. It's usually the people who sit in their office, make excuses not to cold call or door knock, and focus on non productive activities (paperwork, tomorrows calendar, etc). I'd say anyone who is fired from Jones, is screwed. If you don't do the work at Jones, you aren't going to do the work anywhere else. It's not rocket science, it's all self motivation. If you can't motivate yourself to do well at Jones in this biz, you won't anywhere.



You could apply to be the guy at Mcdonald's that tries to sell you a "Premium Ice Mocha" everytime we go through the drive through. You're a shoe in.

Aug 4, 2009 8:29 am

There are independents looking to help you build your business. Speak to Fred at tradepmr. He can hook you up with a bd that will have ridiculously low minimums while you build the RIA side of your business.



That said, I pretty much agree with Ronnie/Volt et al. However, don't dismiss the value of Jones training. It carries weight with insurance type companies. Look at the June issue of Financial Planning (Top 50 Independents) and go through the list of companies with no minimum.



Good luck.

Aug 4, 2009 10:43 am
Ronnie Dobbs:

It's not that hard to hit Jones "Goals" if you are doing the work. They are pretty low, unless you are just not doing the work. I haven't met a person yet who did the work and got fired for not hitting goals. It's usually the people who sit in their office, make excuses not to cold call or door knock, and focus on non productive activities (paperwork, tomorrows calendar, etc). I'd say anyone who is fired from Jones, is screwed. If you don't do the work at Jones, you aren't going to do the work anywhere else. It's not rocket science, it's all self motivation. If you can't motivate yourself to do well at Jones in this biz, you won't anywhere.



You could apply to be the guy at Mcdonald's that tries to sell you a "Premium Ice Mocha" everytime we go through the drive through. You're a shoe in.



You take your clients and prospects to McDonalds??  Sorry, couldn't resist. 

I would have to agree though, you really need to do some soul searching to determine if the business is really for you.  It's not just long hours and prospecting that makes you successful.  You need a certain charisma on top of it all to gain the trust of people. 
Take BioFreeze, he may be a real smart ass, but I'll bet he has charisma.

Good luck.

Aug 4, 2009 10:51 am
BerkshireBull:

DCnew, I'd rather not name my company specifically but I know we're not alone, I have a buddy at NML and he gets the same type payout.  I think most big mutual insurance companies pay really well on the investment side.



NML has a nice office in my town. I like the idea of my payout being almost 3 times what Jones would give me (and with low minimums)...what's the catch?

Aug 4, 2009 10:59 am
Ronnie Dobbs:

It's not that hard to hit Jones "Goals" if you are doing the work. They are pretty low, unless you are just not doing the work. I haven't met a person yet who did the work and got fired for not hitting goals. It's usually the people who sit in their office, make excuses not to cold call or door knock, and focus on non productive activities (paperwork, tomorrows calendar, etc). I'd say anyone who is fired from Jones, is screwed. If you don't do the work at Jones, you aren't going to do the work anywhere else. It's not rocket science, it's all self motivation. If you can't motivate yourself to do well at Jones in this biz, you won't anywhere.

You could apply to be the guy at Mcdonald's that tries to sell you a "Premium Ice Mocha" everytime we go through the drive through. You're a shoe in.

 
Actually, I will take a different approach to this one.  I think there are plenty of honest, hard-working FA's out there that just can't make it because they don't know what works, and they can't figure it out on their own.  But you put them on a wirehouse team where they are a junior, and the senior members just tell them what to do, hand them some small accounts to work on, whatever, they could end up beign very effective and having a great career.  The BIG downside at Jones is, despite all the "help" you get, sometimes it's not the best help.  Like everyone, I have hit walls where I felt like NOTHING I was doing worked.  Vets were more than willing to offer advice, but more often than not, the advice was "get out there and bang on more doors" or "just call everyone with a good bond".
That's great.  I don't need some knucklehead 250K producer to tell me that.  This is one of the few industries where you are essentially left to your own devices to figure it out.  Ever notice how EVERYONE builds their business differently?  Some have tons of CPA's feeding them, some figured out a great niche, some have a rich Dad in the business, some cold call for hours on end, some do retirement seminars, some inherited a huge book, etc.  The point is, there is no ONE answer in this business, and it varies by region and by specific location.  Having a successful senior advisor that can help guide you through that process is priceless.  Most guys just run out of time/money before they ever really figure it out.  So it really is not all about hard work or hours worked.  After all, the difference between great and fired/broke is only one or two good accounts per month.  Some of my best months have come from luck and referrals, not from hours and hours of calling and doorknocking.  What I WILL SAY, is that hard work and activity generally presents more opportunities.  But you can't spend 12 hours a day doing something that clearly doesn't work.
Aug 4, 2009 11:02 am
[email protected]:
BerkshireBull:

DCnew, I'd rather not name my company specifically but I know we're not alone, I have a buddy at NML and he gets the same type payout.  I think most big mutual insurance companies pay really well on the investment side.



NML has a nice office in my town. I like the idea of my payout being almost 3 times what Jones would give me (and with low minimums)...what's the catch?

 
I have a buddy at NML.  He does fine, but I think he pays for all his own stuff (assistant, rent, etc.).  So you have to compare apples to apples.  I don't know what their model is though.  And his business is really insurance driven.  He does some small IRA's and SIMPLE's, but not much else.  However, much of his insurance stuff is renewable and a lot of it is employer-based, so it's basically annuitized.
Aug 4, 2009 11:18 am
 
Actually, I will take a different approach to this one.  I think there are plenty of honest, hard-working FA's out there that just can't make it because they don't know what works, and they can't figure it out on their own.  But you put them on a wirehouse team where they are a junior, and the senior members just tell them what to do, hand them some small accounts to work on, whatever, they could end up beign very effective and having a great career.  The BIG downside at Jones is, despite all the "help" you get, sometimes it's not the best help.  Like everyone, I have hit walls where I felt like NOTHING I was doing worked.  Vets were more than willing to offer advice, but more often than not, the advice was "get out there and bang on more doors" or "just call everyone with a good bond".
That's great.  I don't need some knucklehead 250K producer to tell me that.  This is one of the few industries where you are essentially left to your own devices to figure it out.  Ever notice how EVERYONE builds their business differently?  Some have tons of CPA's feeding them, some figured out a great niche, some have a rich Dad in the business, some cold call for hours on end, some do retirement seminars, some inherited a huge book, etc.  The point is, there is no ONE answer in this business, and it varies by region and by specific location.  Having a successful senior advisor that can help guide you through that process is priceless.  Most guys just run out of time/money before they ever really figure it out.  So it really is not all about hard work or hours worked.  After all, the difference between great and fired/broke is only one or two good accounts per month.  Some of my best months have come from luck and referrals, not from hours and hours of calling and doorknocking.  What I WILL SAY, is that hard work and activity generally presents more opportunities.  But you can't spend 12 hours a day doing something that clearly doesn't work.[/quote]
 
I concur with B24. I love the guys that haven't even built a book who have the audacity to let you know that you are a failure. The greatest President that we have ever had in our country didn't win the first election that he ran for. If he hadn't run for President where would our great country be today?
 
I salute you for posting and taking the guff that goes with it. Good luck to you in whatever you decide to do.
Aug 4, 2009 11:32 am

Unless of course you go to a bank. Then you just have no clue what you are doing. If you want to build a book of business under no circumstances should you be in a place where people initiate a majority of their financial transactions.

Aug 4, 2009 11:33 am
B24:
 
Actually, I will take a different approach to this one.  I think there are plenty of honest, hard-working FA's out there that just can't make it because they don't know what works, and they can't figure it out on their own.  But you put them on a wirehouse team where they are a junior, and the senior members just tell them what to do, hand them some small accounts to work on, whatever, they could end up beign very effective and having a great career.  The BIG downside at Jones is, despite all the "help" you get, sometimes it's not the best help.  Like everyone, I have hit walls where I felt like NOTHING I was doing worked.  Vets were more than willing to offer advice, but more often than not, the advice was "get out there and bang on more doors" or "just call everyone with a good bond".
That's great.  I don't need some knucklehead 250K producer to tell me that.  This is one of the few industries where you are essentially left to your own devices to figure it out.  Ever notice how EVERYONE builds their business differently?  Some have tons of CPA's feeding them, some figured out a great niche, some have a rich Dad in the business, some cold call for hours on end, some do retirement seminars, some inherited a huge book, etc.  The point is, there is no ONE answer in this business, and it varies by region and by specific location.  Having a successful senior advisor that can help guide you through that process is priceless.  Most guys just run out of time/money before they ever really figure it out.  So it really is not all about hard work or hours worked.  After all, the difference between great and fired/broke is only one or two good accounts per month.  Some of my best months have come from luck and referrals, not from hours and hours of calling and doorknocking.  What I WILL SAY, is that hard work and activity generally presents more opportunities.  But you can't spend 12 hours a day doing something that clearly doesn't work.
 
noggin:

I concur with B24. I love the guys that haven't even built a book who have the audacity to let you know that you are a failure. The greatest President that we have ever had in our country didn't win the first election that he ran for. If he hadn't run for President where would our great country be today?
 
I salute you for posting and taking the guff that goes with it. Good luck to you in whatever you decide to do.  
I'll jump on this bandwagon too. There were two guys in my training class, one that quit and one that got fired, that were decent FA's. One guy ran out of money, and now is launching a successful business in a different industry, the other moved to Prudential and is doing very well.
 
I think that the model is just not right for some people, and you really have to have a mix of work ethic, luck, and some timing to make it.
 
 
Aug 4, 2009 11:58 am
SometimesNowhere:
I'll jump on this bandwagon too. There were two guys in my training class, one that quit and one that got fired, that were decent FA's. One guy ran out of money, and now is launching a successful business in a different industry, the other moved to Prudential and is doing very well.
  I think that the model is just not right for some people, and you really have to have a mix of work ethic, luck, and some timing to make it.


When I look back on my time at Jones, the one thing that could have made a difference is a different Field Trainer. I had a guy who built his business making 300 dials/day 15 years ago. I thought he was an ass...

It's hard to learn from someone you don't like and the Jones model doesn't give me any quality time with anyone else. I can look back and say I should have asked to sit in at another FAs office, but at the time, I didn't know that's what I needed.

Aug 4, 2009 1:50 pm

[email protected], I understand your pain.  Keep in mind, there are useless a$$es at every firm.  You just happened to have a bad experience at Jones.  I have been very lucky to get the training and mentorship I received at Jones.  I hooked up with some very good guys, that continue to be mentors to me today.  But I look around our region at some of the newbs and who they have been paired up with, and I feel for them.  Honestly, if I had been trained or mentored by our top producer in the region, I would have hated it.  He's not a bad advisor, I just dislike his style.  He's a cold-calling, doorknocking, machine.  But he built his business in the early and mid-90's, and most of his advice is from the perspective of a nearly-20 year veteran.  So yes, I'd love to call 25 clients a day on a really good muni (he's a big muni advisor, lot of HNW clients), but I would run out of clients that would buy muni's after about 3 days.  He's got like 1000 households.  So the advice is not always relevant.