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Sep 11, 2006 8:02 pm

<span =“bold”>NASD Newbie



do you work for AMP?









Sep 11, 2006 9:13 pm

[quote=birdv]<span style=“font-size: 12pt; font-family: “Times New Roman”;”>

Rookies in the program?  There were atlot but people were dropping
out like flies.  Out of 30 sponsored I was one of the 3 that pass
all the test.


[/quote]

I’ve helped a lot of unhappy Ameriprise advisors move to other firms.  Usually they are people doing well under difficult circumstances, who want to start again with a different firm.

I know I’m going to get flamed for saying this, but I don’t think the kid has ruined his career.  We don’t KNOW what Ameriprise is going to place on his U4.  And if they put a mark on his record then an attorney may be able to set the record straight.

If he’d started, but failed to produce anything, then he would be in a much worse situation.  Personally, I have a lot of respect for somebody who gets this close and then says “I can’t, in good conscience, sell this”.

[quote=birdv]<span style=“font-size: 12pt; font-family: “Times New Roman”;”>

I passed all my test the first time. 





<span style=“font-size: 12pt; font-family: “Times New Roman”;”>

I do not know why they said that they haven’t had contact with me for
two weeks.  And I am starting to think that it really doesn’t
matter. 



[/quote]



It does matter.  If it says you were terminated for absenteeism that will haunt you for the rest of your career.



Taking the Series 7 and getting a CRD means that your association with
Ameriprise will be on your NASD record.  When they end this
association, they must include a reason for the separation.  That
reason will be on your permanent record and stay with you wherever you
go.  It may even become an issue with employers outside the industry.



Suggest you contact your former branch manager and inform him that you
disagree with his assertion that you have not been in the office in two
weeks.  Dig up any evidence you can (EZ-Tag from the tollway, credit
card receipts from the cafe next door, etc.) and offer to send him
copies.



Then inform him that you expect your U5 to reflect accuately that  you left the company voluntarily.

Sep 11, 2006 9:23 pm

Good stuff JC.  Birdv, just expect that most anything you get from Uncle Nasty will have a negative, insulting and/or sarcastic tone to it.  I don’t know why he has a problem with CONSTRUCTIVE criticism, but he does.  After you’re around him for awhile, you’ll realize that he doesn’t go easily, even when he’s obviously wrong.  Just let it roll off your back…glean the nuggets of truth from the bile and try not to engage him too often for fear that you’ll waste half of your day (like I usually end up doing…)

Sep 11, 2006 9:45 pm

[quote=JCadieux]

I've helped a lot of unhappy Ameriprise advisors move to other firms.  Usually they are people doing well under difficult circumstances, who want to start again with a different firm.

[/quote]

Nothing more than personal curiosity.  What do you think the odds of an AMP guy, say three years in, making it to a wirehouse?

Our branches used to get flurries of resumes--seemingly about a month or two after the latest covey of AEFA baby brokers got their tickets.

I've interviewed a lot of them over the years--it's my opinion that they are a cut above a chop  house but still pretty much subscribe to the recruiting philosophy of hiring everybody and letting those who can do it rise to the top.

[quote=JCadieux]

I know I'm going to get flamed for saying this, but I don't think the kid has ruined his career.  We don't KNOW what Ameriprise is going to place on his U4.  And if they put a mark on his record then an attorney may be able to set the record straight.

If he'd started, but failed to produce anything, then he would be in a much worse situation.  Personally, I have a lot of respect for somebody who gets this close and then says "I can't, in good conscience, sell this".

[/quote]

I suggest that somebody who has not even been appointed does not know what is good or bad.  What happened is this child found the amexpsux website and believed what he read--just like somebody might believe what they read about Jones on this site.

Only the failures bitch and moan--but unfortunately they get heard because the guys and gals who are doing just great don't waste their time bitching.

[quote=JCadieux]

It does matter.  If it says you were terminated for absenteeism that will haunt you for the rest of your career.

Taking the Series 7 and getting a CRD means that your association with Ameriprise will be on your NASD record.  When they end this association, they must include a reason for the separation.  That reason will be on your permanent record and stay with you wherever you go.  It may even become an issue with employers outside the industry.

Suggest you contact your former branch manager and inform him that you disagree with his assertion that you have not been in the office in two weeks.  Dig up any evidence you can (EZ-Tag from the tollway, credit card receipts from the cafe next door, etc.) and offer to send him copies.

Then inform him that you expect your U5 to reflect accuately that  you left the company voluntarily.
[/quote]

I'm not sure that a U-5 is used to provide previous employment information to a potential or new employer outside of the industry.

However, it is the only form that is used within the industry and if the former employer puts anything negative on it problems can result.

Each of us is entitled to see a copy of our exiting U-5 and if it indicates anything other than voluntary resignation or retirement the individual needs to challenge it.

Sometimes a manager simply needs to be reminded that it is a permanent record with a sentence such as, "I know why you said you will not rehire me--it's because you don't like me. To be honest with you I"m not wild about you either.  But in the future that could be interpreted as I did something to cause you to not rehire me--please change it to yes you would rehire.  I promise not to apply, but even if I do you don't have to hire me just because you said you might."

But let's get back to this kid's story.  He's telling us that he was only expected to come to the office on Thursdays--I know that to be typical for AEFA and assume it is for AMP too.

He said he took his Series 66 on a Thursday and got terminated via a letter that was recieved on Saturday. That letter had to be written no later than Friday.

Now why would a manager be pissed off that a kid was not at the Thursday meeting if the kid was taking his test on Thursday?  Could it be because he was told no not take tests on Thursdays so that he would be at the meetings?  Could be, and if it is it's insubordination.  Not a smile face.

If that's not the reason it would seem to be an easy enough situation to simply call the boss and tell the boss that he missed the meeting because he was testing--and he PASSED!  The boss will forgive and forget.

But apparently he missed the meeting the week before--they hadn't seen him in two weeks.  Why was that meeting missed?  If you're running an organization can you tolerate kids who may or may not decide to show up?  If a second week arrives and that same kid has no showed the meeting again I think it's critical to act quickly--to cover yourself.  Compliance issues are too significant to allow a child to be out there taking the tests and perhaps introducing himself to friends and family as a new AMP rep, blah, blah, blah.

This is a business for grownups--and not showing up when you're expected is one of the surest sign that you're not one.

Sep 11, 2006 10:12 pm

I missed one meeting when I was 200 miles taking my 66 class so I could start my appointment on the date that I wanted.



I came to the next meeting.



The other time I missed was the Thursday I passed my 66.



-I was not fired; I quit on Friday morning. 

-They left me a voicemail Friday night.(Not a very nice one,SO WHAT)

-They sent the letter that came on Saturday.



-I got into town Sunday night 9pm. 

-Sunday at 9:30 I called and left a message for the FVP to call me.

-Then I joined this forum and posted 11:09pm.



-Monday I have called and emailed and got nothing.

Apparently they don’t want to talk.

Hopefully they don’t have time to mess with me and my U5.



“insubordination” - I did everything AMP told me to do.  I just do
not want to work at AMP.  I have heard good things about the
training and I really liked the people in the office that is why I
picked AMP.  



You might love AMP.  And that is just fine.  I just do not want to be punished for not wanting to work at AMP.




Sep 11, 2006 10:16 pm

[quote=birdv] 

You might love AMP.  And that is just fine.  I just do not want to be punished for not wanting to work at AMP.


[/quote]

Punished?  Nobody is going to punish you.

Where do you see yourself working?

Sep 11, 2006 10:19 pm

"I just do not want to be punished for not wanting to work at AMP."

I am refering to my U5

Sep 11, 2006 10:21 pm

The question was, where do you see yourself working?  What type of firm?

Sep 11, 2006 11:15 pm

[quote=NASD Newbie]

[quote=JCadieux]

I’ve helped a lot of
unhappy Ameriprise advisors move to other firms.  Usually they are people who have done well under difficult circumstances, and want to start
again in a wirehouse training program.

[/quote]

Nothing more than personal curiosity.  What do you think the odds of an AMP guy, say three years in, making it to a wirehouse?

[/quote]


ANYBODY who can survive at Ameriprise and still pay their rent after three years has my respect.

If they have at least six months of above-average production and want to enter a training program (salary + commission), then most wirehouse managers will listen to our pitch.  I can't guarantee they'll get hired, but there are too many success stories to ignore.

But for every submittable candidate I see we find dozens that are not even close.  If you can't sell and don't understand customer service then going from Ameriprise to a HNW firm would be out of the frying pan and into the fire.  Training programs can't teach common sense.

You could say the same thing about a lot of firms.  They hire a bunch of people and most of them fail within a few months.  Ameriprise is pretty high profile, so they get a lot attention.  But don't think they're unique. 

Even my firm focuses on finding people who want to move between wirehouses, most of the unsolicited resumes we receive come from "Tier 2" and "Tier 3" firms.

Of these:
30% are trying to get out of the industry, or simply don't know what they want to do next.  (Not sure why they call me.) 25% are trying to get a non-production FS role.  (Once again, can't help them.)
35% are interested in a production role, but have no idea why they really failed.  They have no idea what to fix in order to make things better. 10% are submittable.  The majority of the candidates in this category place with a tier one or tier two firm (sometimes through us, sometimes we lose them to another firm).


Sep 11, 2006 11:17 pm

Newbie,  you could hire him at your firm.<!–
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Sep 11, 2006 11:42 pm

[quote=no idea]Newbie,  you could hire him at your firm.<!-- var SymRealOnLoad; var SymReal;

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Well, Newbie & Newbie hasn't gotten its NASD charter yet, although we're close to renting a seat on the NYSE.

Don't call us, we'll call you.  We promise to keep your resume on file should our needs change in the future.

Sep 12, 2006 12:30 am

<span style=“font-size: 12pt; font-family: “Times New Roman”;”>Where do you see yourself working?

I do not know.  I already have interviews setup for inside and outside the
securities industry.


Sep 12, 2006 12:58 am

To: AMP

From: Me



I am going to watch Wall Street for the first time.  I know that
if they do a remake with AMP they will not have to cast me.  just
kidding have a goodnight


Sep 12, 2006 1:14 am

[quote=NASD Newbie]

He’s very likely to have a U-5 that indicates “Terminated for cause.”

It's very difficult to put a happy face on a record of simply not showing up.  Regardless of what the representative says, that is what the record will show unless the manager of his office is a decent enough man or woman to not do that.

Additionally, put a happy face on job hopping right after passing the exams--what does that say for loyalty?

Put a  happy face on not knowing what you were expected to sell.

Put a happy face on deciding that what you were selling was just "high commission" products before you had ever made a sale.

Put a happy face on arguing with "the program" before even giving it a chance.

We don't know why AMP fired the guy--but the reality is they did.  It is very difficult to catch on with another firm AFTER you've been fired even if you have the tickets.  Too many hidden factors.

Disgruntled brokers are a dime a dozen and it often is simply a matter of changng venues for the situation to change--but when you're out there unemployed you are damn near unemployable in this industry.  It's not like he can claim to have been downsized or some other benign reason to be in purgatory.

Brokers like to think of themselves as somewhat similar to a professional athlete--you've got skills that translate onto the playing field and the teams know that and will hire you because of those skills.

That may be true with Terrell Owens--or whatever his name is--but it's not true with brokers.  There are too many compliance issues to be dealt with--can you imagine how a case would play out when the plaintiff's attorney realized that Ray Jay hired a guy who had simply not shown up at AMP so often that he was fired.

We've been told, "It is a lie" to the argument that he was terminated because he had not been seen in two weeks--what that could very well mean is that he was last seen 9 business days ago instead of ten.  Regardless, he's too big a flake to keep around, or to have around.

Again, boys and girls, do not enter this business on a lark.  Your U-4 follows you everywhere you go and it is best to be mature enough to know that if you don't like a job, quit.  Don't just stop showing up.

The actions we take have consequences.

Now, a quick piece of advice for the child who asked the "am I screwed" question.

Depending on where you live you may encounter one of the chop shop boiler rooms who would think that your indiscretion is minor since they actually prefer to hire ex cons.

If you go to work there, just to keep your licenses, you will screw your entire career up for THE REST OF YOUR LIFE.  So don't make an even more stupid mistake than laying around in bed so much that AMP fired you.

Go to work in the insurance industry.  Tell the hiring manager that you........damn I just don't know what you can say to explain away getting fired for not showing up.  What a stupid thing to do.

I know--stay out for close to two years then come back and explain that you were staying home with a new baby.  That's done a lot.

[/quote]

Seriously. Go see a doctor. Get that stick pulled out of your *ss.
Sep 12, 2006 3:20 am

birdv:

Apologies for getting your broker forum name wrong. Once again, I think it's worth your while to spend $350.00 or so and have a one hour consult with an experienced NASD arb attorney IF you wish to remain employed in this industry.

I don't think a MER, SB, or an MS will hire you with a "terminated for cause" on your U-5. You might be able to get into BAC, WB, or RJF with that, but even they view that as a red flag. Not sure you want to settle for a third tier firm. SWS does hire "terminated with cause types."

If you elect not to pursue a career in this sector, it will be easy to explain to a prospective employer why you didn't choose to do so. Very few outside the financial services sector have a positive spin on those of us who make our living managing money.

I think it's worth it for you to try and get that U-5 to reflect the fact you voluntarily resigned.

Sep 12, 2006 7:43 pm

[quote=ymh_ymh_ymh]

Once again, I think it’s worth your while to spend $350.00 or so and have a one hour consult with an experienced NASD arb attorney IF you wish to remain employed in this industry.

[/quote]

Ditto that.  If they are misrepresenting the circumstances of your departure in a public database, that’s libel.  If you can’t work this out with your former BOM, then contact at attorney with NASD arb experience.  There is at least one on this board.  If he can’t help he may be able to refer you to somebody.

[quote=ymh_ymh_ymh]

I don't think a MER, SB, or an MS will hire you with a "terminated for cause" on your U-5.

[/quote]

They probably won't hire somebody with "terminated for cause".  I don't think it's automatic disqualification (unlike certain compliance related terminations).  However, it's unlikely that you would be hired with a termination on your record.

That's why it's important that you either work this out with your BOM or hire an attorney to assist you.  Do it quickly.  This sort of thing is easier to prevent than correct.





Sep 13, 2006 12:56 am

Bill and Jeff:

Thanks for being mensch and willing to help birdv out a little.

Sep 13, 2006 7:34 pm

Bill is a great guy.  He had great insight into my situation.  I cannot  believe how willing he was to help me. THANK YOU BILL


<span =“bold”>ymh_ymh_ymh
you had the right idea. 

Sep 13, 2006 10:20 pm

[quote=birdv]

I signed up with Ameriprise Financial.  I just passed the entire string of test (INS,7 and 66) and found that they do not have good products and recommend "objectives" that are just high commission products.
I want out! 
 
They are saying that they are canceling my sponsorship, because they have not seen me in two weeks(which is a lie) and that they will assume that I have voluntarily have withdrawn from the sponsorship and will terminate the sponsorship agreement.
 
What should I do to keep my NASD licenses?
Will AMF withdrawing the sponsorship do anything?
 
Thanks

[/quote]

I assume that you are on the P1 platform at Ameriprise.  Once you are separated employment from them, contact all of the local P2 advisors in your area.  Anyone on the P2 platform knows that P1 is a joke, so they should not hold it against you that you didn't make it.  However, you already know the some of the language of Ameriprise, so you could be an asset to them.  Being on the P2 platform gives you the flexibility to call your own shots in regards to fund families, products, etc.  You could compare two P2 advisors and they could literally be as opposite as night and day.  Once you have had time to be mentored by and train with this P2 advisor, you could hopefully become and AFA and take over part of their book.  This is the part of Ameriprise that no one ever sees because P1 gets such a bad rap.