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Sep 11, 2006 12:09 am

I signed up with Ameriprise Financial.  I
just passed the entire string of test (INS,7 and 66) and found that
they do not have good products and recommend "objectives" that are just high commission products.

I want out! 

 
They
are saying that they are canceling my sponsorship, because they have
not
seen me in two weeks(which is a lie) and that they will assume that I
have voluntarily have withdrawn from the sponsorship and will terminate
the sponsorship agreement.

 

What should I do to keep my NASD licenses?

Will AMF withdrawing the sponsorship do anything?

 

Thanks

Sep 11, 2006 1:10 am

It sounds like AMP just gave you a free pass...consider yourself fortunate.  I'd check out Raymond James, AG Edwards and some mid-sized firms like that.  You should have some takers since you have your tests passed.

Sep 11, 2006 6:35 am

He's very likely to have a U-5 that indicates "Terminated for cause."


It's very difficult to put a happy face on a record of simply not showing up.  Regardless of what the representative says, that is what the record will show unless the manager of his office is a decent enough man or woman to not do that.


Additionally, put a happy face on job hopping right after passing the exams--what does that say for loyalty?


Put a  happy face on not knowing what you were expected to sell.


Put a happy face on deciding that what you were selling was just "high commission" products before you had ever made a sale.


Put a happy face on arguing with "the program" before even giving it a chance.


We don't know why AMP fired the guy--but the reality is they did.  It is very difficult to catch on with another firm AFTER you've been fired even if you have the tickets.  Too many hidden factors.


Disgruntled brokers are a dime a dozen and it often is simply a matter of changng venues for the situation to change--but when you're out there unemployed you are damn near unemployable in this industry.  It's not like he can claim to have been downsized or some other benign reason to be in purgatory.


Brokers like to think of themselves as somewhat similar to a professional athlete--you've got skills that translate onto the playing field and the teams know that and will hire you because of those skills.


That may be true with Terrell Owens--or whatever his name is--but it's not true with brokers.  There are too many compliance issues to be dealt with--can you imagine how a case would play out when the plaintiff's attorney realized that Ray Jay hired a guy who had simply not shown up at AMP so often that he was fired.


We've been told, "It is a lie" to the argument that he was terminated because he had not been seen in two weeks--what that could very well mean is that he was last seen 9 business days ago instead of ten.  Regardless, he's too big a flake to keep around, or to have around.


Again, boys and girls, do not enter this business on a lark.  Your U-4 follows you everywhere you go and it is best to be mature enough to know that if you don't like a job, quit.  Don't just stop showing up.


The actions we take have consequences.


Now, a quick piece of advice for the child who asked the "am I screwed" question.


Depending on where you live you may encounter one of the chop shop boiler rooms who would think that your indiscretion is minor since they actually prefer to hire ex cons.


If you go to work there, just to keep your licenses, you will screw your entire career up for THE REST OF YOUR LIFE.  So don't make an even more stupid mistake than laying around in bed so much that AMP fired you.


Go to work in the insurance industry.  Tell the hiring manager that you........damn I just don't know what you can say to explain away getting fired for not showing up.  What a stupid thing to do.


I know--stay out for close to two years then come back and explain that you were staying home with a new baby.  That's done a lot.

Sep 11, 2006 7:55 am

Anybody who would take a sales job without knowing what he will be selling is an idiot. Here's some advice...go to your state's driver's license department and get a job taking pictures for driver's licenses.

Sep 11, 2006 11:21 am

I told ameriprise that I did not wish to continue with the career. 

The no contact for two weeks is a lie.

Sep 11, 2006 11:37 am

"voluntarily have withdrawn from the sponsorship" sounds like fairly benign language to me, Nasty, but you do make a good point.  If birdv cares to share exactly what AMP put on his/her U-5, maybe things won't look as grim as you painted them...

Sep 11, 2006 11:44 am

Did you "Tell them" or turn in a wrtten document?

Sep 11, 2006 12:22 pm

I don't have my U5. I passed the 66 on Thursday and told AMP I was
leaving on Friday morning.  I left town for the weekend and came
back to a nasty message and a Saturday express letter telling me that
they have been out of contact etc.  Today is Monday.



"Anybody who would take a sales job without knowing what he will be
selling is an idiot. Here's some advice...go to your state's driver's
license department and get a job taking pictures for driver's licenses."



This might be true and I know ignorance is not a defense.  I did
not do my due diligence in researching the companies history.  I
believe ameriprise has some great people working for them.  I just
don't wish to drag my natural market to a place with "bad products" AKA
Riversource.  



I liked the people at ameriprise and wish on some level that my manager had never mentioned putting
my natural market in VUL's and VA's.  Because I would not have
googled "VUL ameriprise" and found amexsux.com. 



After reading about Ameriprise would you have taken the $1500 and given
it a try.  I would feel wrong taking the money from Ameriprise and
just could not feel good about myself putting my friends in lesser
products.



I did not take the money and run.  




Sep 11, 2006 12:33 pm
Indyone:

"voluntarily have withdrawn from the sponsorship" sounds like fairly benign language to me, Nasty, but you do make a good point.  If birdv cares to share exactly what AMP put on his/her U-5, maybe things won't look as grim as you painted them...


The fact is that if you've been fired from a broker/dealer, and this kid was fired, it is almost impossible to get another broker/dealer to take a chance on you.


If you're wanting to leave your firm don't do it until you have somewhere to land.


Tell me something Indy--it's a dark night.  No moon.  You crawl over the fence into the country club's swimming pool area--just a teenage prank, lots of kids do it.  I did it three or four nights a week every summer for years.


Are you going to go racing at the pool and jump into the deep end, or are you going to walk over carefully to see if there's water in there?


Would you hire somebody who quit their job without having another one?

Sep 11, 2006 12:45 pm

"Would you hire somebody who quit their job without having another one?"


It would depend a lot on the circumstances, but in general, yes, I believe that it's damn foolish to quit without a replacement job in place.  You lose all leverage with potential employers.  I just placed a friend and former colleage in touch with an LPL recruiter after chastising him for quitting the bank without his new B/D lined up and ready to go.  No doubt he'll get less than he would have as a transition package simply because LPL knows his levegare is non-existent.  He'll also be several days, perhaps even a week or two without being able to transfer clients.  I told him that time is money, and he's losing money every day that he's not up and running.


Most times, yes...quitting without having another job in place is foolish to say the least.

Sep 11, 2006 12:50 pm
Indyone:

"Would you hire somebody who quit their job without having another one?"


It would depend a lot on the circumstances, but in general, yes, I believe that it's damn foolish to quit without a replacement job in place.  You lose all leverage with potential employers.  I just placed a friend and former colleage in touch with an LPL recruiter after chastising him for quitting the bank without his new B/D lined up and ready to go.  No doubt he'll get less than he would have as a transition package simply because LPL knows his levegare is non-existent.  He'll also be several days, perhaps even a week or two without being able to transfer clients.  I told him that time is money, and he's losing money every day that he's not up and running.


Most times, yes...quitting without having another job in place is foolish to say the least.



I'm enough of a cynic to believe you shot yourself in the foot there.  I would never refer somebody who was probably fired--there is nothing good that can come of it.


I know, I know--your friend quit the bank.  If you believe that I'd like to talk to you about a bridge I own that connects Brooklyn with Manhattan.  I'm willling to sell it cheap just to get rid of it, I want to move South.

Sep 11, 2006 1:08 pm

Well in the sense that management wasn't satisfied with his production, yes, I'm sure that he had some encouragement to act as he did.  I don't think that going from zero to 14 mil aum and averaging 15-20K/month in less than two years is doing a bad job, but apparently his bank wanted more.  He got tired of the harping about the budget and quit.  Dumb move in my opinion, but it's done.


As far as me shooting myself in the foot, I don't see a downside.  I'm not supervising him and I didn't tell the recruiter anything but his numbers, so assuming they take him, I don't think there's anything on me if he doesn't work out.  I just told the recruiter that he was a nice guy and appeared to be doing a reasonable job where he was.  In my mind, that's where my responsibility ends.  I hope he makes it, but once you go indy, your success is your own responsibility and I won't lose any sleep if it doesn't work out...I've got my own ship to run.

Sep 11, 2006 1:20 pm
Indyone:

In my mind, that's where my responsibility ends.



The recruiter will remember.  If the guy doesn't work out it will somehow reflect badly on you--if he does work out the recruiter will consider himself to be a recruiting genius.


I am not saying that making recommendations and referalls is a dumb thing to do--what is dumb is to stick your neck out when the story doesn't pass the smell test.


I am sixty one and have been working since I was a fourteen year old paperboy.  I don't know anybody who spontaneously quit--it's not a sign of maturity and clear thinking.  You suck it up and start looking, you do NOT just quit.

Sep 11, 2006 1:25 pm

"
Did you "Tell them" or turn in a wrtten document?"



Does email count as written?

Sep 11, 2006 1:30 pm
birdv:

" Did you "Tell them" or turn in a wrtten document?"

Does email count as written?


Are you saying you quit a job by sending an email?   It's getting worse.

Sep 11, 2006 1:30 pm

Well if the recruiter is unhappy with my friend as a recruit, I won't lose any sleep over it.  My contract says 90% payout plus production bonuses and I don't see how having a recruiter, who's not in my food chain, being upset with me can cause any problem with that.

Sep 11, 2006 1:41 pm

I did not quit without consulting other companies about their business
practices in relation to AMP.  The three companies I asked all
offered me positions(2 offered me sponsorship before I picked
AMP).  One of which is not a FA, but working at a trading
desk(hello 55).  I had several offers going into the business, I
just need to establish what part of the industry I wish to be in. And
pick a good company to work with.








Sep 11, 2006 1:47 pm
Indyone:

Well if the recruiter is unhappy with my friend as a recruit, I won't lose any sleep over it.  My contract says 90% payout plus production bonuses and I don't see how having a recruiter, who's not in my food chain, being upset with me can cause any problem with that.



How about your reputation with others--including people not in your "food chain" but at LPL?


Maybe a day will come when being well thought of will matter?

Sep 11, 2006 1:50 pm
birdv:

I did not quit without consulting other companies about their business practices in relation to AMP.  The three companies I asked all offered me positions(2 offered me sponsorship before I picked AMP).  One of which is not a FA, but working at a trading desk(hello 55).  I had several offers going into the business, I just need to establish what part of the industry I wish to be in. And pick a good company to work with.


Is "consulting" with other companies the same as accepting an offer from another firm?


Do you think it's possible that one of those firms contacted AMP asking about your time there and they pulled the rug out from under you?


That would be very unusual, but if you were talking to second or third tier B/Ds it might be possible.

Sep 11, 2006 1:51 pm

Birdy:


If all else fails, this organization might be hiring:


http://www.usarmy.com