How's that Jones Bank and REIT portfolio

Dec 18, 2007 3:51 pm

So how’s that Jones Bank and Reit Portfolio doing this year?  That buy and hold strategy paying off for your clients…  Since I never see published results on the analyst stock picks anywhere I can’t seem to find out.  Remind anyone of watching Lucent go from 80 to 8 (or lower I can’t actually remember) before the analysts downgraded it to a hold…

Dec 18, 2007 3:54 pm

not to mention

Enron Nortel WorldComm Baldwin United.....(shows how dated I am)
Dec 18, 2007 4:58 pm

Come on guys give Jones a break–they did recommend to sell Boeing about a year ago didn’t they?  How about that sell they did on MO in 1999 at $18–what a call!

Dec 18, 2007 5:33 pm

They had to make that MO call, they sell so many American Funds they were overweighting their clients… 

Dec 18, 2007 6:22 pm

Actually the BA sell was a couple of years ago.  Kind of funny that on the current Jones opinion of BA they say (paraphrased) “We blew it.”  Jones never had an opinion on Enron. 

The bank and REIT portfolio you're talking about is probably the Equity Income Buy List.  There are only 2 banks (BAC, USB) and 2 REITS (DRE, WRI) on it.   Overall, the portfolio has done well if you take a buy and hold approach.     Baldwin United was a bond issuer.  Not a stock.  And it may be the only bond Jones ever underwrote that has defaulted.  I don't remember hearing about any others.   If you're gonna play that game, why don't you include some other firm's worst mistakes.  What firms got stung the worst by Enron?  What firms got hit hard with LP losses 20 years ago?  What firms recently got beaten up because of hedge funds?  There are a lot of bad decisions out there.  Look hard enough and you'll find them everywhere.     
Dec 18, 2007 6:31 pm

sapceman,

  here you go highjacking a prefectly good anti -EJ post and try to turn it into anything butt. And yes enron was a pick
Dec 18, 2007 6:52 pm

Hijacking?  Really?  You didn’t read the topic line very well then.  Cause it started as a Jones thread.  Actually, one making fun of a specific list of stocks that Jones suggests for people looking for dividend income.  If that’s not a Jones thread, I don’t know what is.  You can attact all you like, but in this case you are W-R-O-N-G.   

Dec 18, 2007 7:05 pm

I see a couple options here:

1. Continue this game of essentially throwing darts at a dartboard to decide what to buy and when to sell; or, 2. Invest our clients' money in a portfolio of index funds and spend our time managing our investors.   The more I research this business, the more I realize how futile it is to try and time the market.   But as long as there's money to be made, it will continue...        
Dec 18, 2007 7:07 pm

Hey, Spiff–Enron was a pick!!!

Dec 18, 2007 7:40 pm

That’s funny!  Jones using index funds…ETFs… how would they pay for trips…

Dec 18, 2007 7:43 pm

Is Onion head still the cheif equity idiot at the cult

Dec 18, 2007 7:51 pm
outofjail:

Is Onion head still the cheif equity idiot at the cult

  Onion head??? Ha Ha Ha Ha   That made me crack up.. You mean Alan Skrainka? Yes...
Dec 18, 2007 8:35 pm

You got it! “BUY AND HOLD AND PRAY TO GOD NOTHING CHANGES IN THIS WORLD”! especially the price of Lucent@ $76.50. How bout some Rogaine?

Dec 18, 2007 9:11 pm

Spiff, I don’t know if they underwrote it, but EDJ sold a boat-load of bonds from a firm called Energy Management Corp. or something similar in the early 80’s that defaulted.  I know this well because my father and grandfather both bought the piece of garbage and settled in a class action for about a nickel on the dollar.  If I remember right, it paid about 14%, which was fairly typical for that time-frame.

Dec 18, 2007 9:13 pm

Yup that dre recommended buy at 47 was brilliant!

Dec 18, 2007 9:58 pm

Indy, I don’t either.  I’ve not heard of that one.  It was well before my time.  Anytime you look into an investment company’s past you are going to find those bad recommendations. 

  If anyone can find an analyst team that has a perfect record of calling the top and bottom, I'm all ears.  I'll admit Jones is slow to make a change in their opinions.  That's why I like looking at S&P, Yahoo, and Morningstar too.  At least that way I can get more than one recommendation.    Does LPL have an analyst team or a model stock portfolio?  I tried to look online for one, but hmm...your website is down.  Now that doesn't help me as an interested investor.  Maybe they should keep an extra 1% and pay for a better IT dept.   One of you guys should really tell them about that. 
Dec 18, 2007 10:05 pm

Yes we do have a research dept and I just got on the site…what is your problem.  Maybe its blocked by your great firm, not good use of the 1%.

Dec 18, 2007 10:06 pm

Sorry, guess again! Not LPL but they do in fact have a research team.  They aren’t bad.  Sure every firm has a list of “gee I wish I wouldn’t have recommended’s” but many firms say oops we blew it before it gets really ugly.  It will take some significant time, if at all, for the investors to recoup their losses on companies like C,DRE,BAC (not so much), and others.  Sometimes you just have to say “we were wrong” and move on.

Dec 19, 2007 12:43 am

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]Actually the BA sell was a couple of years ago.  Kind of funny that on the current Jones opinion of BA they say (paraphrased) “We blew it.”  Jones never had an opinion on Enron. 

The bank and REIT portfolio you're talking about is probably the Equity Income Buy List.  There are only 2 banks (BAC, USB) and 2 REITS (DRE, WRI) on it.   Overall, the portfolio has done well if you take a buy and hold approach.     Baldwin United was a bond issuer.  Not a stock.  And it may be the only bond Jones ever underwrote that has defaulted.  I don't remember hearing about any others.   If you're gonna play that game, why don't you include some other firm's worst mistakes.  What firms got stung the worst by Enron?  What firms got hit hard with LP losses 20 years ago?  What firms recently got beaten up because of hedge funds?  There are a lot of bad decisions out there.  Look hard enough and you'll find them everywhere.     [/quote]   spacepuppy, I guess sarcasm is not a required subject for continuing ed at your "regional firm" you are correct sir United Balwin is not a stock but it was "pushed" by your firm none-the-less.   Give it time and your firm "will be in play". ube not making money north of the border or across the pond. How long do you think the GPs will paly along with that??? this is an anti EJ thread and here you go trying to hijack it into any but.   as far as buy and hold concept "has done well" what sort of time frame are you looking at 6, 12, 18 or 24 months...... I think you are looking at 5, 10 or even 20 year time periods aren't you????   underwriten doesn't that suggest that there is a .....gasp ANOTHER profit center at your firm......but isn't the indoctrination I mean, gospel I mean promotion that there is BUT ONE profit center and it be called the Investment Representative (or whatever you call yourselves today)??????
Dec 19, 2007 6:09 am

Nothing makes me laugh like posts about Jones equity research.  Does Mel Marten, the brillian Jones analyst who had a Strong Buy on WCOM down to the single digits still work for the cult?  I read in his bio once that he was a member of the local Mensa chapter.  My first thought was who cares, but with that WorldCom call it delivered a good laugh. 

Just Curious.  Has the great buy and hold firm maintained a favorable recommendation on WMB over the last 7 years?  It's almost back to even........congratulations!
Dec 19, 2007 4:13 pm

Sorry, my bad.  I was thinking buy and hold actually meant buy and hold.  Yes, I was looking at 5 years.  I’ll bet if I looked 10 years it would have done well also.  I guess it depends on your philosophy with stocks.  I don’t have a huge stock business, so I tend to buy stocks for clients that I think will do well past the 12 or 24 month time frame.  Probably a part of my Jones background.

  The Jones research team is a value team.  Says so in the IP that gets mailed every month.  "The Edward Jones Research department typically recommends industry leading companies that appear reasonably valued."  There's one Buy recommended stock with a P/E above 25.  The majority of them are stocks with P/Es in the teens.  I know they aren't going to follow everything.  I know they are going to get some things wrong.  I know the same thing happens at ALL of the other firms.    I don't know what kind of money Jones makes on the underwriting.  If they do, I hope it's a bunch.  That takes some of the pressure of the FAs.  I think the one profit center mantra is flawed, but it plays well on TV.    Canada and the UK are growing enterprises.  Just like any startup company it is going to go through years of not being profitable.  The more veteran FAs we have in those countries the more profitable we are going to become.  I'd be willing to bet the GPs are pleased with most of what is going on in Canada and the UK and they're willing to take the returns they are getting right now and wait for bigger and better ones in the future.    I vaguely remember Jones following Williams.  They don't have an opinion on it now.  It's a shame too.  That stock has gone nuts since 2003.  Maybe we should have kept that buy opinion.    Sorry spears - when I tried to go through LPL.com>Investor Education>Stocks and clicked the Stocks link, I got an error message.  I tried several times.  Just tried it again.  Looks like they are trying to send me to Thompson.  Maybe their site is down.  Who knows.  I just thought it was funny that you guys bash the Jones technology and then your site doesn't work right.   
Dec 19, 2007 4:30 pm

Well sure…now after the recent performance of all of those “value” stocks the P/E’s are in the teens but where were they 8 months ago?  I know, I know…cheap shot…

Dec 19, 2007 5:30 pm

Spiff,

  Looks like you were right lpl.com seems to be down.  Branchnet is working though and thats what matters most.  I will say this for LPL though, when the system went down earlier this year for a number of days heads did roll.  It was done without fanfare and seemed professional, but it was dealt with.  When the great satellite blackout occured I dont recall any fallout for Malone who failed to have a practical contingency plan.  
Dec 19, 2007 5:46 pm
"Canada and the UK are growing enterprises.  Just like any startup company it is going to go through years of not being profitable.  The more veteran FAs we have in those countries the more profitable we are going to become.  I'd be willing to bet the GPs are pleased with most of what is going on in Canada and the UK and they're willing to take the returns they are getting right now and wait for bigger and better ones in the future."   Canada has been operational since 1994.  in 2003 there were nearly 600 reps, now they are over 500.  In Quebec there is nearly 1/4 of the population of Canada and there are only 10 reps to service them....   UK has been in operation since 1997.  There are 200 or so reps for 61 million people.   How long can your GPs afford to call these "startups" from what I've heard the returns have been negative for a long time.
Dec 19, 2007 6:05 pm

My bad Spiffy...site is not functioning.  I did see however this following prompt when I clicked on stocks.."Only enter if your age is 18 or above and or have the permission of your parents"...so I believe the Jones's will never or should never be allowed in...sorry

Dec 20, 2007 12:46 am

[quote=compliancejerk]

"Canada and the UK are growing enterprises.  Just like any startup company it is going to go through years of not being profitable.  The more veteran FAs we have in those countries the more profitable we are going to become.  I'd be willing to bet the GPs are pleased with most of what is going on in Canada and the UK and they're willing to take the returns they are getting right now and wait for bigger and better ones in the future."   Canada has been operational since 1994.  in 2003 there were nearly 600 reps, now they are over 500.  In Quebec there is nearly 1/4 of the population of Canada and there are only 10 reps to service them....   UK has been in operation since 1997.  There are 200 or so reps for 61 million people.   How long can your GPs afford to call these "startups" from what I've heard the returns have been negative for a long time.[/quote]   sapceman spiff when you have a moment could yourespond to this one?   Thanks
Dec 20, 2007 6:55 pm

Spaceman Spiff,

  I am still waiting for a resonse????
Dec 20, 2007 7:18 pm

[quote=compliancejerk]Spaceman Spiff,

  I am still waiting for a resonse????[/quote]

What is a 'resonse'?

  I just kill myself....

Seriously, though, Spiff, I think he might have you on that one.  10 years is an awful long time to hang on to the 'startup' moniker.

More importantly, though, who the hell cares?  How does it matter to ANY of us if the big green machine is profitable in the UK or Canada, or what they call it?

I don't know about y'all, but I come to this board for two reasons....
1.) entertainment
2.) potentially money making ideas.

Debating the merits of Jones and whether or not their international operations are profitable don't seem to fit under either of those criteria.  The whole 'Jones sucks' refrain is so tired it doesn't even qualify as entertainment any more.

And they don't suck, IMO, they just aren't for me.
Dec 20, 2007 7:27 pm

joedabrkr

  An herd I thought you injured my ritialin s kils
Dec 21, 2007 7:05 pm

[quote=compliancejerk][quote=compliancejerk]

"Canada and the UK are growing enterprises.  Just like any startup company it is going to go through years of not being profitable.  The more veteran FAs we have in those countries the more profitable we are going to become.  I'd be willing to bet the GPs are pleased with most of what is going on in Canada and the UK and they're willing to take the returns they are getting right now and wait for bigger and better ones in the future."   Canada has been operational since 1994.  in 2003 there were nearly 600 reps, now they are over 500.  In Quebec there is nearly 1/4 of the population of Canada and there are only 10 reps to service them....  -  Yep, you're right.  There have been FAs in Canada since 1994.  6 of them.  Who knows if they're still there.  We crossed the 100 mark in 97, 200 in 99, 400 in 2000, and today we're over 600.  We have a home office building in Toronto that employs hundreds of people.  Sounds kind of like EDJ in 1970.  Jones IRs back then were complaining when there were three Jones guys in one state.  Look where we are now.        UK has been in operation since 1997.  There are 200 or so reps for 61 million people. - Again, you are correct.  8 of them.  100 in 2002 (we hit that mark a couple of times, but finally stayed there in 2002), and today we're at 260.  They actually stopped hiring FAs for the UK for a while to work on getting the overall sales force there healthy.  That's been the toughest nut to crack for Jones.  It's not like MCDs, who open up shops in China and people start marching through the doors.  Just like in Canada, there is a home office in London employs hundreds of people.    How long can your GPs afford to call these "startups" from what I've heard the returns have been negative for a long time. - The GPs can "afford" for them to run indefinitely in the red.  The firm overall is still profitable.  The Canada and UK divisions will hit their stride and will become profitable.  I don't have any idea of the timeline or goals the firm has for them, but there's not a single GP who is in the poorhouse because of what is going on in the UK and Canada.  [/quote]   sapceman spiff when you have a moment could yourespond to this one?   Thanks[/quote]   I'll bet there's not a GP at the firm who doesn't wish that things in Canada and the UK were much more profitable.  Heck, as a lowly LP, I wish they were.  It just means my profits are going to look better when they do get there.  How long do you suspect it took for Merrill or Morgan to have profitable divisions in other countries?  A year or two?  My guess is probably not.  My guess would be many years.  But, the overall company was stronger for having that presence internationally whether they were immediately profitable or not.  I will venture a guess to say that Jones will be stronger 30 years from now because of the positive impact on the bottom line of Canada and the UK.      BTW - The "startup" moniker was mine, not something I heard from the home office.   
Dec 21, 2007 7:28 pm

Spaceman Spiff,

  Thanks for the great response, next time I have a question for you I'll just go read the answer of the Jonestown website.   Merry Christmas
Dec 21, 2007 8:01 pm

Spiff, can you refresh my memory.  Had did you merit getting LP??

Dec 21, 2007 8:39 pm

CJ - did you expect a different answer?  You begged me for an answer, so don’t complain about what you get. 

  spears - Years in the home office.  My office should, no will, be profitable enough by the next offering for my years in the field. 
Dec 21, 2007 10:04 pm
Spaceman Spiff:

CJ - did you expect a different answer?  You begged me for an answer, so don’t complain about what you get. 

  D'OH!!!! I didn't even see that answer coming ..... someone must have spiked the Vodka Martini again.   Merry Kawnza, Happy Eid etc etc  
Dec 22, 2007 3:08 am

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]CJ - did you expect a different answer?  You begged me for an answer, so don’t complain about what you get. 

  spears - Years in the home office.  My office should, no will, be profitable enough by the next offering for my years in the field.  [/quote] See that is why some of us who built our offices from scratch have less respect for a guy like you. Try building your office from scratch and qualifying for LP by actually producing revenue......
Dec 22, 2007 7:34 am

If I have one problem with Jones, and I don’t really think about them that often, it is illustrated every time I come on these forums (which is about once every couple of months).  There seems to be a strange arrogance, even in the face of failure, that permeates the IR’s.  A refusal to back down and admit there are other ways, other products than preferred funds, and other companies that do “the right thing”.  I was a guy that started and Jones and built from scratch.  Won the pacesetters award…the whole bit. Then I realized I was not a business owner, did not rule my own destiny, and was working within a system I didn’t believe in.  I still have friends that work at Jones, they are happy and I am happy for them.  It just simply didn’t fit me or my clients.

Dec 22, 2007 2:54 pm

This is my first posting, but I couldn’t help thinking about how bad Jones is really doing. I had a conversation with our VP of recruiting yesterday, and Jones has lost 20 $300k+ (on AVG) producers to our firm this year as of Nov 07. This is one firm, out of HOW MANY? I appreciate all my old Jones buddies that I went to kindergarten with, but wake up man! College is more fun! I think the reason Jones’ people are so arrogant is the ignorance that is pounded in the brain starting with the recruiting process. I mostly just feel sorry for Eddie Jones. I’ve been gone almost two years, and I have to say, I will out produce 95% of my old region this year. How do I know—people still call me and tell me about the “dot race”! What a great business!

Dec 23, 2007 8:12 pm

Interesting:



No REITS in the EJ Model Portfolio and only 15% in financials:



Take a look - http://www.edwardjones.com/graphics/usa/pdf/strategy_reports/RES-1289-A_model_for_your_stocks.pdf



This data was as of June 2007.

Dec 23, 2007 8:17 pm
donatello:

This is my first posting, but I couldn’t help thinking about how bad Jones is really doing. I had a conversation with our VP of recruiting yesterday, and Jones has lost 20 $300k+ (on AVG) producers to our firm this year as of Nov 07. This is one firm, out of HOW MANY? I appreciate all my old Jones buddies that I went to kindergarten with, but wake up man! College is more fun! I think the reason Jones’ people are so arrogant is the ignorance that is pounded in the brain starting with the recruiting process. I mostly just feel sorry for Eddie Jones. I’ve been gone almost two years, and I have to say, I will out produce 95% of my old region this year. How do I know—people still call me and tell me about the “dot race”! What a great business!



OK Joker,

Take a look at this:

http://www.edwardjones.com/cgi/getData.cgi?file=/pdf/media/branch_locations.pdf

By year end we will be around 11,000 globally. I think Jones is doing just fine.
Dec 23, 2007 9:48 pm
BigPayDay:

[quote=donatello] This is my first posting, but I couldn’t help thinking about how bad Jones is really doing. I had a conversation with our VP of recruiting yesterday, and Jones has lost 20 $300k+ (on AVG) producers to our firm this year as of Nov 07. This is one firm, out of HOW MANY? I appreciate all my old Jones buddies that I went to kindergarten with, but wake up man! College is more fun! I think the reason Jones’ people are so arrogant is the ignorance that is pounded in the brain starting with the recruiting process. I mostly just feel sorry for Eddie Jones. I’ve been gone almost two years, and I have to say, I will out produce 95% of my old region this year. How do I know—people still call me and tell me about the “dot race”! What a great business!



OK Joker,

Take a look at this:

http://www.edwardjones.com/cgi/getData.cgi?file=/pdf/media/branch_locations.pdf

By year end we will be around 11,000 globally. I think Jones is doing just fine.[/quote]

BPD-

Weren't you all pissed off about a year ago and posted about how the Big Green Machine had screwed you over and you were outta there?

What happened, did they promise you GP?
Dec 23, 2007 9:53 pm

BPD-I’m glad you could provide a website that proves you are recruiting. I didn’t say you aren’t adding brokers—all about 25 years old and never had a real job before. That sounds like trouble to me. 11,000 $200k brokers isn’t my idea of success or a firm that’s doing well. What’s the average production at Eddie right now?

Dec 24, 2007 12:26 am

[quote=joedabrkr]

BPD-

Weren’t you all pissed off about a year ago and posted about how the Big Green Machine had screwed you over and you were outta there?

What happened, did they promise you GP?
[/quote]

That was Bill Falkland

Dec 24, 2007 12:31 am

[quote=Maxstud]

[quote=joedabrkr]

BPD-

Weren’t you all pissed off about a year ago and posted about how the Big Green Machine had screwed you over and you were outta there?

What happened, did they promise you GP?
[/quote]

That was Bill Falkland
[/quote]

You’re absolutely right.  I stand corrected.

I wonder what happened to ole’ Bill.  It would be interesting to hear the sequel.

Dec 24, 2007 4:17 am

[quote=joedabrkr]

[quote=Maxstud]

[quote=joedabrkr]

BPD-

Weren’t you all pissed off about a year ago and posted about how the Big Green Machine had screwed you over and you were outta there?

What happened, did they promise you GP?
[/quote]

That was Bill Falkland
[/quote]

You’re absolutely right.  I stand corrected.

I wonder what happened to ole’ Bill.  It would be interesting to hear the sequel.
[/quote]

Agreed.

Dec 24, 2007 6:46 am
donatello:

BPD-I’m glad you could provide a website that proves you are recruiting. I didn’t say you aren’t adding brokers—all about 25 years old and never had a real job before. That sounds like trouble to me. 11,000 $200k brokers isn’t my idea of success or a firm that’s doing well. What’s the average production at Eddie right now?



Ok Donatello, sounds like you are an indy. Maybe LPL. How many reps does LPL have now? 6, 7, 8 maybe 9,000. How many would you say are over $100k gross? Take a look:

http://www.investmentnews.com/assets/docs/CI16801423.PDF

Could it be possible that half of LPL brokers are grossing less than $100k?
Dec 24, 2007 7:20 am

Who, knows, large, peanut-encrusted candy bar…and who cares.  I’m indy at LPL…grossing $300K and keeping over $200K.  Apparently LPL is willing to work with small producers while able to work with multi-million dollar producers.  I looked at your firm.  The technology and offerings were, to put it mildly, lacking when compared to LPL or even most other firms.  The freedom was lacking.  The payout was lacking.  I was recruited four times by four different EDJers and the decision was easy all four times.  The only plus I saw at Jones was availability of local muni bonds.

  With most of us here, you're wasting your time trying to convince us that your firm is an attractive alternative.  I may again change B/Ds in my career, but unless things change dramatically at EDJ, I won't be changing to your firm.
Dec 26, 2007 4:18 am

Indyone,

Not trying to convince anyone Jones is better than indy or LPL, justing letting donatello know that if he wants to start talking about firms with average productions that are low, he should look at his own firm and the largest indy firms, that’s all. I have friends at RJ and LPL and they are happy there. They do miss the trips and the comraderie (sp.) that they had at Jones and they say their net, net pay out is in the mid to high 60s range. Both have about half of their production coming from fee based with a full time assistant.

Dec 26, 2007 3:23 pm

BPD-The only person I know at LPL is netting 90k per month. He showed me him paycheck. Some may miss the trips, but not me. Nothing is more revolting than a bunch of wannabees in a room telling everyone how good they are and puffing up their chests. Where I work, we know how good you are. It’s posted every day. No more to say after that.

Dec 26, 2007 3:36 pm
BigPayDay:

Indyone,
Not trying to convince anyone Jones is better than indy or LPL, justing letting donatello know that if he wants to start talking about firms with average productions that are low, he should look at his own firm and the largest indy firms, that’s all. I have friends at RJ and LPL and they are happy there. They do miss the trips and the comraderie (sp.) that they had at Jones and they say their net, net pay out is in the mid to high 60s range. Both have about half of their production coming from fee based with a full time assistant.

  (picking jaw up off the floor) That's probably one of the most fair and balanced replies I've ever seen from you...what got into you...Christmas spirit?!!  You've completely disarmed me and thus I have no witty retort (I think you even spelled "camraderie" right).     I guess I'll just wish you a Happy New Year...   (PS, you really should look into what your indy friends have...it's a pretty good gig...)
Dec 26, 2007 3:50 pm

I’ve said it before and will say it again.  WE DON"T NEED ANYMORE INDY’S!!!  We have a good thing and I would like to keep it that way.  Jones is the greatest company in the world, along with UBS, SB, Merril and Wachovedwards…Indy is a terrible way to make a living and the hours suck, the time off sucks…everything sucks about being indy.  Wirehouse and little bitty regionals are the best. 

Dec 26, 2007 3:55 pm

[quote=noggin][quote=Spaceman Spiff]CJ - did you expect a different answer?  You begged me for an answer, so don’t complain about what you get. 

  spears - Years in the home office.  My office should, no will, be profitable enough by the next offering for my years in the field.  [/quote] See that is why some of us who built our offices from scratch have less respect for a guy like you. Try building your office from scratch and qualifying for LP by actually producing revenue......[/quote]   Sorry, noggin, but in this case you are wrong.  The LP I got didn't have anything to do with my office.  I left the home office a few months before the LP came out.  I was fully expecting to get skipped on that offering because I left for the field and my office wasn't anywhere near profitable enough for LP.  I was really suprised when they called and offered me a small chunk of LP because of the years I had spent in in the home office that would have otherwise been ignored.  Had I thought about it a little bit longer, I should have waited until after the LP offering to go to the field.    You can have a little less respect for me because you believe that taking over a small office is the same as winning the lottery if you feel like it.  But don't get uptight about my LP offering. 
Dec 26, 2007 4:17 pm
BigPayDay:

[quote=donatello] BPD-I’m glad you could provide a website that proves you are recruiting. I didn’t say you aren’t adding brokers—all about 25 years old and never had a real job before. That sounds like trouble to me. 11,000 $200k brokers isn’t my idea of success or a firm that’s doing well. What’s the average production at Eddie right now?[/quote]

Ok Donatello, sounds like you are an indy. Maybe LPL. How many reps does LPL have now? 6, 7, 8 maybe 9,000. How many would you say are over $100k gross? Take a look:

http://www.investmentnews.com/assets/docs/CI16801423.PDF

Could it be possible that half of LPL brokers are grossing less than $100k?

_____________________________________________________________________ BPD- You must understand that as a Independent  Advisor who also happens to be the Branch manager and boss/owner;  at LPL we can hire advisors to work under us.  This can skew the production numbers simply because I know several people who pay these advisors a salary + bonus comp structure and their job often involves more administrative tasks that are not necesarily totally production driven.  LPL also has a bank/credit union platform, but I must admit that I have no clue one way or another how it is structured and how that fits into the survey.  Maybe someone else on here could speak to that.    
Dec 26, 2007 4:21 pm

Spacey-Since I’ve been watching this forum for about two years without posting, it feels like I know a little about you. What’s interesting to me is that you seem pretty intelligent (Broker24 is too I think), but the Jones stuff is so deeply embedded in you—the only thing I can figure out is that you don’t have enough under management to move or even look. Once you look, you can’t go back. Remember what it was like when you came home that first time from college??? Things just weren’t the same. That’s how it will be for you.

  I was given NO SUCH GIFT as $10m in an office, but there are plenty that are given that gift today, including the person who took over my office....and yet I still transferred over 95% of what I wanted....YOOO HOOOO! Didn't hurt me a bit. I was new-new all the way, but would have jumped on such a free gift as an office with money in it. Good for you Spacey!   I've decided to try a really good exercise. I went to Jones' website and cut and pasted all the IRFA's they profiled on there. Even though most are probably relatives of the GP's, I think it will be interesting to check....1 month.....6 months....how many are left? In two years I've only seen one vet leave here (there have been a couple newbies out of 100 or so in the region), and the head of Compliance sent out an e-mail (high tech, huh?) to everyone telling them where he went and to give his number to those clients that call and ask. That's class. All I got was lied about and trashed. I won even more business because of it.   Someday I hope to see you break free. As of now, I just run outside with my arms in the air and yell...."free at last....thank God I'm free at last!!!!"
Dec 27, 2007 2:04 am

[quote=Spaceman Spiff][quote=noggin][quote=Spaceman Spiff]CJ - did you expect a different answer?  You begged me for an answer, so don’t complain about what you get. 

  spears - Years in the home office.  My office should, no will, be profitable enough by the next offering for my years in the field.  [/quote] See that is why some of us who built our offices from scratch have less respect for a guy like you. Try building your office from scratch and qualifying for LP by actually producing revenue......[/quote]   Sorry, noggin, but in this case you are wrong.  The LP I got didn't have anything to do with my office.  I left the home office a few months before the LP came out.  I was fully expecting to get skipped on that offering because I left for the field and my office wasn't anywhere near profitable enough for LP.  I was really suprised when they called and offered me a small chunk of LP because of the years I had spent in in the home office that would have otherwise been ignored.  Had I thought about it a little bit longer, I should have waited until after the LP offering to go to the field.    You can have a little less respect for me because you believe that taking over a small office is the same as winning the lottery if you feel like it.  But don't get uptight about my LP offering.  [/quote]   I think you missed my point but here it is for a second time.  I have built my office from scratch and should I have the necessary profit numbers I will have EARNED my LP offering. You, however, worked in the home office while providing NO revenue were granted LP.  Getting the small office is really none of my concern as I have seen several come through my region and do the same thing. They move offices to gain assets when if they would just do what they hired in to do they could build their own offices. I wish you well but what I have seen in the past doesn't bode well for your future success.....
Dec 27, 2007 3:46 am
doneWjones:

[quote=BigPayDay] [quote=donatello] BPD-I’m glad you could provide a website that proves you are recruiting. I didn’t say you aren’t adding brokers—all about 25 years old and never had a real job before. That sounds like trouble to me. 11,000 $200k brokers isn’t my idea of success or a firm that’s doing well. What’s the average production at Eddie right now?[/quote]

Ok Donatello, sounds like you are an indy. Maybe LPL. How many reps does LPL have now? 6, 7, 8 maybe 9,000. How many would you say are over $100k gross? Take a look:

http://www.investmentnews.com/assets/docs/CI16801423.PDF

Could it be possible that half of LPL brokers are grossing less than $100k?

_____________________________________________________________________ BPD- You must understand that as a Independent  Advisor who also happens to be the Branch manager and boss/owner;  at LPL we can hire advisors to work under us.  This can skew the production numbers simply because I know several people who pay these advisors a salary + bonus comp structure and their job often involves more administrative tasks that are not necesarily totally production driven.  LPL also has a bank/credit union platform, but I must admit that I have no clue one way or another how it is structured and how that fits into the survey.  Maybe someone else on here could speak to that.   [/quote]

That's exactly right.  Let's say I develop a really strong relationship with a local CPA, and he wants to be more proactive in helping his clients with tax planning and investment decisions, and he likes my approach.  So, I get him properly licensed and we set up a joint rep number where he gets 30% of all revenues from business he refers in to me.  We do $200,000 in our second year.  He gets $60,000 that flows down to his individual producer number, and probably about $50k in actual incremental revenue over and above his tax practice.  Not bad for him.  But in the LPL system, he counts as an advisor who did $60k total production.
Dec 27, 2007 4:11 pm

[quote=noggin][quote=Spaceman Spiff][quote=noggin][quote=Spaceman Spiff]CJ - did you expect a different answer?  You begged me for an answer, so don’t complain about what you get. 

  spears - Years in the home office.  My office should, no will, be profitable enough by the next offering for my years in the field.  [/quote] See that is why some of us who built our offices from scratch have less respect for a guy like you. Try building your office from scratch and qualifying for LP by actually producing revenue......[/quote]   Sorry, noggin, but in this case you are wrong.  The LP I got didn't have anything to do with my office.  I left the home office a few months before the LP came out.  I was fully expecting to get skipped on that offering because I left for the field and my office wasn't anywhere near profitable enough for LP.  I was really suprised when they called and offered me a small chunk of LP because of the years I had spent in in the home office that would have otherwise been ignored.  Had I thought about it a little bit longer, I should have waited until after the LP offering to go to the field.    You can have a little less respect for me because you believe that taking over a small office is the same as winning the lottery if you feel like it.  But don't get uptight about my LP offering.  [/quote]   I think you missed my point but here it is for a second time.  I have built my office from scratch and should I have the necessary profit numbers I will have EARNED my LP offering. You, however, worked in the home office while providing NO revenue were granted LP.  Getting the small office is really none of my concern as I have seen several come through my region and do the same thing. They move offices to gain assets when if they would just do what they hired in to do they could build their own offices. I wish you well but what I have seen in the past doesn't bode well for your future success.....[/quote] So, you are saying that the only LPs the firm has should be FAs?  That the time I spent doing my job at the home office, because it didn't bring any revenue to the firm, shouldn't be rewarded with LP?  Please tell me that's not really what you think. 
Dec 27, 2007 5:33 pm

[quote=Spaceman Spiff][quote=noggin]

  I think you missed my point but here it is for a second time.  I have built my office from scratch and should I have the necessary profit numbers I will have EARNED my LP offering. You, however, worked in the home office while providing NO revenue were granted LP.  Getting the small office is really none of my concern as I have seen several come through my region and do the same thing. They move offices to gain assets when if they would just do what they hired in to do they could build their own offices. I wish you well but what I have seen in the past doesn't bode well for your future success.....[/quote] So, you are saying that the only LPs the firm has should be FAs?  That the time I spent doing my job at the home office, because it didn't bring any revenue to the firm, shouldn't be rewarded with LP?  Please tell me that's not really what you think.  [/quote]

Yep Spiff, that's what I was thinking the first time I read his post.  Whether he realizes it or not, that's exactly what he's saying.  It's implicit in the statement.
Dec 27, 2007 5:51 pm

Uh oh…I hope you two don’t attend the same regional meeting…

Dec 27, 2007 6:01 pm

[quote=Indyone]Uh oh…I hope you two don’t attend the same regional meeting…[/quote]

troublemaker…

Dec 27, 2007 6:50 pm

Aw, they're both good guys...I'm sure they can patch things up...

Dec 28, 2007 3:09 am

[quote=Spaceman Spiff][quote=noggin][quote=Spaceman Spiff][quote=noggin][quote=Spaceman Spiff]CJ - did you expect a different answer?  You begged me for an answer, so don’t complain about what you get. 

  spears - Years in the home office.  My office should, no will, be profitable enough by the next offering for my years in the field.  [/quote] See that is why some of us who built our offices from scratch have less respect for a guy like you. Try building your office from scratch and qualifying for LP by actually producing revenue......[/quote]   Sorry, noggin, but in this case you are wrong.  The LP I got didn't have anything to do with my office.  I left the home office a few months before the LP came out.  I was fully expecting to get skipped on that offering because I left for the field and my office wasn't anywhere near profitable enough for LP.  I was really suprised when they called and offered me a small chunk of LP because of the years I had spent in in the home office that would have otherwise been ignored.  Had I thought about it a little bit longer, I should have waited until after the LP offering to go to the field.    You can have a little less respect for me because you believe that taking over a small office is the same as winning the lottery if you feel like it.  But don't get uptight about my LP offering.  [/quote]   I think you missed my point but here it is for a second time.  I have built my office from scratch and should I have the necessary profit numbers I will have EARNED my LP offering. You, however, worked in the home office while providing NO revenue were granted LP.  Getting the small office is really none of my concern as I have seen several come through my region and do the same thing. They move offices to gain assets when if they would just do what they hired in to do they could build their own offices. I wish you well but what I have seen in the past doesn't bode well for your future success.....[/quote] So, you are saying that the only LPs the firm has should be FAs?  That the time I spent doing my job at the home office, because it didn't bring any revenue to the firm, shouldn't be rewarded with LP?  Please tell me that's not really what you think.  [/quote] If a BOA helps the FA produce revenue then they should be rewarded with LP. If you knew that by staying at the home office you were forgoing LP wouldn't you have moved the field earlier to prove your real worth? Just because you did your job in the home office you can't seriously think that you deserve LP???? There is a huge difference between being given LP as you were and having earned it by hitting the profit numbers....
Dec 28, 2007 6:32 pm

OK, fine.  We'll take LP away from all those bond traders that put bonds in the inventory so YOU can make money for the firm.  We'll take LP away from those people in New FA training that helped you get through the Series 7, train you, and help get YOU on your way to making money for the firm.  We'll take LP away from the Compliance people who try to keep YOUR butt out of arbitration by looking over YOUR shoulder at what you do.  We'll take it away from that person in Cash Disbursements who make sure the client who YOU sold that bond to actually gets the interest check.  We'll take LP away from all those people in IT that have been working a lot more hours than you have to put the tools out there that YOU use everyday to make money for the firm.  In fact, we'll even take LP away from the BOAs because at the end of the day we all know they don't really bring in any revenue. They just answer the phone for YOU, do YOUR paperwork so YOU can make more money for the firm, make sure YOU get to YOUR meetings prepared and on time, and let YOU make money for the firm.

There is a huge difference in being given LP like I was and having hit the profit numbers.  That's why if you ever become profitable enough and manage to get some LP your offering will be much larger than the average home office employee.  It's the classic risk/reward payoff.    You have no idea how hard some of those people in the home office work to give you the ability to do what you do.  Think about it the next time you get out of bed.  The beauty of Jones is that all you really have to do is show up everyday and make your contacts.  Everything else is taken care of for you.  You don't have to monkey around with your lease, phones, computer, lights, parking lot, salaries, benefits, compliance, etc.  You turn the key (to a building that someone else set up for you from carpet to desk), sit down (in a chair someone at the home office ordered for you) and dial the phone (that somebody else put there for you) and make money.    You need to understand the firm you work for.  It's obvious from your comments that you don't.  I have a perspective from both sides.  I do understand the firm I work for.     One last thought.  There is a way you can have what you mentioned.  Where nobody but the producer gets the rewards.  It's called INDEPENDANT.  Knock yourself out.   
Dec 29, 2007 4:08 am

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]

OK, fine.  We'll take LP away from all those bond traders that put bonds in the inventory so YOU can make money for the firm.  We'll take LP away from those people in New FA training that helped you get through the Series 7, train you, and help get YOU on your way to making money for the firm.  We'll take LP away from the Compliance people who try to keep YOUR butt out of arbitration by looking over YOUR shoulder at what you do.  We'll take it away from that person in Cash Disbursements who make sure the client who YOU sold that bond to actually gets the interest check.  We'll take LP away from all those people in IT that have been working a lot more hours than you have to put the tools out there that YOU use everyday to make money for the firm.  In fact, we'll even take LP away from the BOAs because at the end of the day we all know they don't really bring in any revenue. They just answer the phone for YOU, do YOUR paperwork so YOU can make more money for the firm, make sure YOU get to YOUR meetings prepared and on time, and let YOU make money for the firm.

There is a huge difference in being given LP like I was and having hit the profit numbers.  That's why if you ever become profitable enough and manage to get some LP your offering will be much larger than the average home office employee.  It's the classic risk/reward payoff.    You have no idea how hard some of those people in the home office work to give you the ability to do what you do.  Think about it the next time you get out of bed.  The beauty of Jones is that all you really have to do is show up everyday and make your contacts.  Everything else is taken care of for you.  You don't have to monkey around with your lease, phones, computer, lights, parking lot, salaries, benefits, compliance, etc.  You turn the key (to a building that someone else set up for you from carpet to desk), sit down (in a chair someone at the home office ordered for you) and dial the phone (that somebody else put there for you) and make money.    You need to understand the firm you work for.  It's obvious from your comments that you don't.  I have a perspective from both sides.  I do understand the firm I work for.     One last thought.  There is a way you can have what you mentioned.  Where nobody but the producer gets the rewards.  It's called INDEPENDANT.  Knock yourself out.   [/quote] It's pretty obvious that you didn't read between the lines on my post.  I will have to say that you are extremely biased on the home office side. I , on the other hand, after being on the other end of the phone call where the home office has been less than helpful to me many times am probably just as biased  on the other side. This comment of yours about the IT folks working harder than I have just shows me how little perspective you have on the reps side of the business. If you were a scratch starter you wouldn't make such foolish statements. BTW, every hour that a person works in the home office they get paid for. I don't. I am paid only by the revenue I bring to the firm.   BTW, I have served in leadership in my region for quite some time...... I think I understand my firm.  We'll just agree to disagree. 
Dec 29, 2007 4:15 pm

Spaceman Spiff,

  Unfortunately your old department in Deperate, Missouri created noggin.   to sanctimonious please add arrogant
Dec 29, 2007 6:56 pm

Spiff,

Since you understand the firm, maybe you could give me their logic on LP offerings like the following: An on-call who previously worked at two different offices(3 0r 4 years ago) full time was made an offer during the last offering. She was asked to leave at least her first office, and I was told that the last guy she worked for was not happy with her performance. I don't know this for a fact, but bottom line she is an on-call. Two other BOA's that were marginal at best were offered Lp. One of them worked for me until she finally was offered another office(it is very difficult to fire BOA's), and the other one worked for a friend of mine who was trying to build the documentation required to fire her. He was not offered Lp but she was, and he is still with the firm and doing very well. I just can't see any logic here because very little contribution to the firm or IR seem to be required. It almost looked as if a quota of certain classes of people had to be met.
Dec 29, 2007 7:27 pm

ednomore,

1.) What does she look like?   2.) Who is she related to?   3.) What does she have on someone?   Finally remember that Desperate, MS always believes a BOA over a lowly IR.....always
Dec 29, 2007 7:59 pm

Compliancejerk,

You are correct about believing a BOA over an IR. I know from experience. To answer all of your other questions, Looks were average or below on all three BOA's and no relation or knowledge on anyone. It was a very strange thing! The BOA thing got out of hand in many ways the last couple of years. Even their evaluation was skewed such that it is impossible to rate them low enough  to be unacceptable without basically saying they can't do anything. When they came out with the new online system, I played around with it to find out different results,and you really to have to answer around  90% of the duties performed as unacceptable to give an unacceptable rating overall, and everybody has some ability. The system forces some untruthful answers or give an acceptable review. I am just glad I don't have to deal with it, but it is sad they they took total control of the BOA while saying that you run your own business.
Dec 30, 2007 10:29 pm

Interesting how far off topic a post can go.  I finally got some time to look at the model stock portfolio that was posted awhile back.  It was date 12/14 with the performance comparisons as of June.  As far as I can see, the vast majority of the portfolio is at or near a 52 week low (with a few exceptions). I fail to understand how this helps your case regarding quality research.  I know you still had a buy on DRE in the 40’s, and on C, and on BAC as recently as March of 2007.   Did they ever even get moved to a hold?  I know you guys must cover more than 50 stocks, how have those turned out for you?  Most of those stocks were still holding up ok in June and just starting to show weakness.  Did you seriously advise your clients to hold stocks like ZMH as it lost a quarter of it’s value or did you tell them the $80 dollar range was a good buying opportunity?  What about the any of the others?  Where is the updated performance numbers as of December? 

Ok, I am done with my rant but please don’t tell me about quality Jones research without a little more to go on then a spreadsheet of of stocks (without percentage allocations I might add) that represent a losing portfolio if purchased on an equal allocation model.  It just doesn’t prove your point…

Dec 31, 2007 6:09 pm

There are some of the MP stocks that are close to 52 week lows, but they are the minority.  BAC is still a Model Portfolio Stock and S&P still has it rated 5 stars.  C got moved to a Hold.  ZMH, which I don't personally follow, is a MP stock.  S&P still has it as a 4 star stock, with a target of $77.  When I look at stocks, I like to look at both Jones and S&P.  Jones has a bias toward long term holding, while S&P likes to look at the next 12 months.  I'm not an analyst, so I figure if S&P likes them short term and Jones likes them long term, it should work out in the end for the client. 

Performance numbers for the MP (taken from the January IP, which uses 11/30 numbers) are as follows:   1 yr - 6.7% 3 yr - 8.8% 5 yr - 10.7% 10 yr - 6.8%   I'm not sure how they track that, since there are periodic changes to the MP.  I don't think Jones' research is the best out there, but I also don't believe they are the worst.  They primarily follow large value and are starting to sprinkle in some mid cap.  It's pretty boring, but so are the majority of our clients.  Little old ladies like dividends.     
Dec 31, 2007 6:18 pm

[quote=ednomore]Spiff,

Since you understand the firm, maybe you could give me their logic on LP offerings like the following: An on-call who previously worked at two different offices(3 0r 4 years ago) full time was made an offer during the last offering. She was asked to leave at least her first office, and I was told that the last guy she worked for was not happy with her performance. I don't know this for a fact, but bottom line she is an on-call. Two other BOA's that were marginal at best were offered Lp. One of them worked for me until she finally was offered another office(it is very difficult to fire BOA's), and the other one worked for a friend of mine who was trying to build the documentation required to fire her. He was not offered Lp but she was, and he is still with the firm and doing very well. I just can't see any logic here because very little contribution to the firm or IR seem to be required. It almost looked as if a quota of certain classes of people had to be met.[/quote]   I don't pretend to understand how all the decisions are made at home office.  My point with Noggin was that he is discounting the work of a lot of valuable people who help his business run smoothly by thinking the way he does.    This last LP offering was a strange one and it may explain those BOA's getting LP.  This is just a guess.  This last LP offering in 2006 included everyone who was offered the LP in 2003 that didn't really get finalized.  So, if in 2002 she was working for an IR who was profitable enough to get an LP offering, they probably gave her some also.  Even though she was working as an on call in 2006, she would have been eligible from the last offering.  I would guess she didn't get any additional LP, above what she was offered back in 2003.  As an on call, I don't think she is eligible for it in the future.  Again, just a guess.   
Jan 5, 2008 4:38 am

Gee I am glad my clients aren’t still holding…

Jan 9, 2008 12:57 am

Still glad my clients aren’t still holding…

Jan 11, 2008 7:44 pm

So what’s that model portfolio lookin’ like now…

Mar 14, 2008 1:53 pm

Anyone know how that Jones Portfolio is doing as of last quarter?  Seems like every other firm publishes the data, or it can be easily obtained.  Even the other firms that are getting smoked come out and show the numbers.

Mar 14, 2008 3:00 pm

Guess I don’t see your point.  Not a Jones IR here, but plenty of stocks on the Jones MP I would still be holding, even if bought a year ago.  Look at upgrades/downgrades across the board in our industry.  They are always a day late and dollar short.  Remind me again what rating AMBAC and MBIA carry?

I guess I just feel you are picking a pretty easy time to point fingers.
Mar 14, 2008 3:13 pm

Actually it just annoys me that the data isn’t available.  I can pull every other major firm’s numbers without any particular difficulty.  Most publish the good and the bad.  I can’t seem to get the Jones numbers at all.  I admit there is a chip on my shoulder do to numerous arguments with my old firms research department, but it’s mostly a true desire to see the numbers. 

Actually…I’ve been picking on them for a long time so I don’t feel particularly like an opportunist…

Mar 14, 2008 4:07 pm

This is not a defense, but you know very well that Jones is not focused on short term results.  That is primarily why they don’t publish monthly/quarterly results of their MSP.  Not that their results are stellar, but they also don’t try to hang their hat on their stock picking ability, like many of the wirehouses and investment banks.  Good, bad or indifferent, picking individual stocks is just not a big focus at Jones.  Although, I would argue that they are no better or worse than any other firm over the long term.  I would guess we are somewhere right in the middle.

Mar 15, 2008 5:46 am

Okay, Okay everyone here we go.  One of my old Jones buddies read me a GREAT quote from Weddle's corner a few weeks back.  I have to paraphrase cause I don't remember exactly.  Space or 24 can we get some help here? 

A current broker wrote in asking why our stock picks (Jones') were on the bottom of the list for the 1 3 and 5 year periods in a recent report on firms analysts.  Weddle's reply?  Well I would be worried if we were on the top of the list for those because it would mean we were focusing on short term results.
Mar 15, 2008 1:36 pm

So when I was at Jones several years ago, the Model Portfolio was at or top of the performance list. I don't recall any communications about the short term focus generating the results.

Just another example of the Jones culture.
Mar 15, 2008 2:39 pm

Maybe somebody can help me out here by posting a few sources…I don’t pretend to know the inside scoop on any firm because I just started as a FA, but when I did some research this is what I found : TOP 13 ranked firms for the second half of 2007

Feb 22, 2008 - Top of the list Bear Stearns

#6 = EDJ , outperforming the S&P

EDJ is pretty much in the middle.

The only other list of model portfolios I found were in 2001 and EDJ still outperformed the S&P there.
I looked back through this thread but couldn’t find any links posted that support the argument that EDJ picks terrible stocks…Could somebody please post up a link so I can find out if there is a valid point or not.

Mar 15, 2008 5:14 pm

Anyone at Jones with access to Weddle's corner (all FA's and assistants) should have a fun one for us. 

Mar 15, 2008 7:43 pm

Regrep: The link you provided was for the period of 6/30/2007 through 12/31/2007.  During which the market had a false recovery during the last month of the year.  The losses did not accelerate until after the first of the year.  The question becomes whether or not Jones had their clients take the partial recovery as an opportunity to get out in the face of known risk exposure or if they stuck by their buy and hold philosophy and watched their clients values drop with the rest of the market after the first of the year?  In normal markets I am not a “trader”, nor do I try to pick tops and bottoms, but when the writing is on the wall as it really has been since last year, I also don’t see any reason to sit and take the pain if you don’t have to.  

Mar 15, 2008 7:51 pm

I can take the pain because I have a six pack of Avery I.P.A.  I love Avery I.P.A.  Everything is fine as long as your sipping some Avery I.P.A.  I wonder if they have some Avery I.P.A. at Bear Sterns, maybe thats why they didn’t notice that they had run out of money.

Mar 15, 2008 7:52 pm

In Fact, if we are going to use Zacks, try this link:
http://www.zacks.com/help/brok_pref_help.php

10th out of 14 over the longer time frames so the frequently argued long term performance, at least in this article, just doesn’t hold water.  And this list was as of the 1st quarter of 2006 so the recent volatility isn’t even calculated in.

Mar 15, 2008 7:55 pm

Here is the 1st half of 2007 also 10th out of 12:
http://www.zacks.com/research/brokerage_perf_detail.php

Mar 15, 2008 8:00 pm

[quote=new_indy]Here is the 1st half of 2007 also 10th out of 12:
http://www.zacks.com/research/brokerage_perf_detail.php

[/quote]

You should go out to you local liquor store and pick up some Avery I.P.A., its very tasty.

Mar 15, 2008 8:12 pm

I gave up drinking, that is why I am so cranky…

Mar 15, 2008 8:13 pm

Ah no wonder.

Mar 15, 2008 8:16 pm

But when I do start drinking again, it will be a fine, cold, black cream ale.  Just like mama used to make…

Mar 15, 2008 8:21 pm

[quote=new_indy]Here is the 1st half of 2007 also 10th out of 12:
http://www.zacks.com/research/brokerage_perf_detail.php

[/quote]

I’m not seeing the 10th out of 12 here, If I sort by 7 year performance then disregard the first 4 since they have N/A for 7 year stats, then EDJ comes in 5th ahead of Credit S, Goldman Sachs, AG Ed, and the S&P 500…Not terrific but not terrible either…Also I don’t see how these stats relate to individual retirement planning if a clients portfolio consist of a mix of different investments that change overtime.
Either way I’m sippin my Youngs double chocolate stout so I won’t be stressin the storm.

Mar 15, 2008 8:23 pm

[quote=regrep23]
Either way I’m sippin my Youngs double chocolate stout so I won’t be stressin the storm.
[/quote]

MMM  tasty.  You have to drink the stout first.  The Avery I.P.A. is so hoppy it kills your taste buds, so you have to wait to try something else.

Mar 15, 2008 8:29 pm

Fine taste in beer, even if you are backing the wrong brokerage…

Mar 15, 2008 8:31 pm

We can’t all be perfect.

Mar 15, 2008 8:53 pm

[quote=new_indy]Fine taste in beer, even if you are backing the wrong brokerage…
[/quote]

Again, I’m not stressing it. If I begin to resent EDJ as much as some do on this board I’ll just switch to another firm/career. No harm done. I’ll just be sure not to cry about it afterward

Mar 16, 2008 12:25 am

Please don’t mistake it for resentment.  It is really an issue of self-righteous I told you so-ness.  Oh and genuine dislike of the way they treat people when they leave-ness… with just a pinch of I hope others can avoid my mistake-ness…

Mar 16, 2008 1:24 am

This thread is bordering on pathetic.

  But I do like that I.P.A.
Mar 16, 2008 10:30 pm
regrep23:


Again, I’m not stressing it. If I begin to resent EDJ as much as some do on this board I’ll just switch to another firm/career. No harm done. I’ll just be sure not to cry about it afterward

  Cry about it????  You have no idea the lengths that jones will go to when you leave to destroy your reputation, demonize you to your colleagues and even attempt to diminish your character amongst your own relatives.  It is surreal.    Crying about it, no.  Just reporting to you.  If you leave, be prepared.     
Mar 16, 2008 11:37 pm

[quote=GoneIndy02]

Cry about it????  You have no idea the lengths that jones will go to when you leave to destroy your reputation, demonize you to your colleagues and even attempt to diminish your character amongst your own relatives.  It is surreal.    Crying about it, no.  Just reporting to you.  If you leave, be prepared. 

[/quote]

You make it sound pretty bad, What did “Jones” do? or was it some person in particular?  I’m sorry they stuck it to you.  Every company should leave their good employees in good taste but I hope that doesn’t reflect the company as a whole and instead just the region you were in. 

Mar 17, 2008 12:43 am

Demonizing amongst colleagues was from the region. 

All else came from several at the home office.  Relatives that held accounts at jones were called and given statements that implied misconduct.  Phone calls to my cell phone "yelling" at me about my "poor character" and  questioning my being a good parent because I left jones.   It's a little weird actually.  Please look at other posts where I have stated the very cultic behaviour of jones.  Jones behaviour is similar to the experiences of those I know that have left cultic faiths.  The required isolation from industry events in the local area, another cultic behaviour.   At many firms you get "we hate to see you go, if things don't work out the door is open here for you".  Especially when you gross as much as I do.    Others will add their experiences about leaving jones, I'm sure, to this thread.   You should be a bit curious...why is jones so insecure???  Maybe it's not the best, or even an average deal for you to be there.    
Mar 17, 2008 12:06 pm

And the anti-Jones cult marches on…

Mar 19, 2008 2:41 pm

Broker24,

  Cults have certain characterisitcs.  Three of the most prominent are isolation of its members, destroying the reputation of those that leave and having the "we are the only ones that do it right" attitude.   Jones is guilty of these.   (I am not angry, so please do not read any negative voice inflection into this post.)    If jones methods are so righteous, why the isolation?  Why can't jones reps attend industry events?   Why can a rep be held up as the "model for all newbies to copy" and then when he/she leaves 2 months later, the new ir meetings for the next year are just meetings for the firm to bash that same reps reputation?    Why do jones reps automatically bash the investments offered by other firms that jones doesn't offer as unethical and/or unsuitable?  This is usually done with a very pompous attitude.    When I first left, a jones "buddy" stopped by my new office.  He actually walked in and explained to me that if I put people in a mutual fund at my new b/d, it's a less ethical transaction than putting a client in the SAME fund at jones. (figure that one)   Two jones guys walked in to my office (at seperate times) and the FIRST thing they asked was, "Who pays for the upkeep of your computers?".  (Obviously a jones brain encripted phrase.  Another cultic behaviour.)   You have never had a pompous attitude in your posts-I appreciate that.   Anti-jones cult...not really.  Just keepin it real.
Mar 19, 2008 3:11 pm

Hey Gone,

  I was just yankin' your chain.  I should have added a snazzy little emoticon.    I hear what you are saying.  Trust me, the more I read on this forum, the more I realize that some of this Jones/cult/anti-leave-the-firm mentality does exist.  The truth is, I think it resonates from certain veteran groups in certain regions.  I truly see VERY little of that in my region.  Actually, many of the people in my region know brokers at other firms that are very good, ethical people, and they speak highly of them.  And there are other reasons, also.  The first person in our region started 17 years ago, and he (along with about 4 others) are the only ones with that much tenure.  Most are in the 5-10 year range.  So I guess there is not the deep-rooted green blood running through our region.  And only one guy that I know of has left to go indy, and he was a REALLY small producer, so nobody was surprised to see him go.  A few have gone to wirehouses, but they were not real big producers either.  Most of the time, the reactions are more like "Huh, that's too bad.  He was a good guy".  But the majority of people that leave are newbs that never really made the radar screen.   Sorry, I made a short story long.  I guess my point is that there is not much brainwashing going on around my parts.   It is funny, though.  I occassionally hear some of those "we are the only ethical firm" cracks by the REAL newbs that just came back from St. Louis's Paddy's Day parade.  Usually it's the young lads.  I find the older guys with more life experience aren't as influenced by the culture.  It's a good counter-balance.   And I agree, why we can't go to industry events is beyond me.  That's just paranoia.
Mar 19, 2008 3:59 pm

By the way, how is Bryan Cooper?..best guy at the home office.