Good-bye to all that

I think any AGE person has considered almost all of the above. I have not drank the Kool-aid but I am inclined to see what's around the corner. The indy route is attractive but looks like too much work. The wirehouse route is just indentured servitude. Believe me, there is a reason that they have to pay you so much upfront.  Friends at WS are very happy and say we'll benefit from the merger. I'll just take the  check, bank it and see how things go. If it is intolerable, I'll leave and give the money back. Simple plan.

Saw this coming a few years back and started researching all options then.  Leaning towards “going indy”.  View this as a good opportunity to make a change for the better (all options are good).  This thread is interesting since it seems much of the “leaving talk” is picking up a bit.  But haven’t heard of much activity yet.  

Shredder,

Can you expand on your WS friends’ comments that the merger between AGE and WS would be good for AGE brokers?  Do you think it odd that WS is also providing retention for the WS  brokers?    Are there any WS FAs on this forum who wish to comment?

GBTAT

researching careeerfield: just curious, why 9 yr committment?  Isn't working at wirehouse just being an employee?  Do you sign an agreement to work there 9 years?

[quote=WYSIWYG]

researching careeerfield: just curious, why 9 yr committment?  Isn't working at wirehouse just being an employee?  Do you sign an agreement to work there 9 years?

[/quote]

Flamingo.  Give it up. 

[quote=WYSIWYG]

researching careeerfield: just curious, why 9 yr committment?  Isn't working at wirehouse just being an employee?  Do you sign an agreement to work there 9 years?

[/quote]

That's nthe upfront money, he's talking about.  Take 120% of T12 and sign a 9 year deal.

And I thought marriage was a longterm committment. Thanks Ferris.

I have been researching what to do over the past few weeks also. 
Been with AGE almost 6 years and planned to be here for the next
twenty.  MS offered 200% deal with nine year commitment, but I got
the impression that could be negotiated down to six or seven.  I
think that if I did anything, the indy route would be it.  I also
think that everyone in the branch is talking to everyone.  My
guess is that about one third of the AGE reps nationwide will
leave.  Anyone care to offer another guess?

[quote=illinoisrep] My guess is that about one third of the AGE reps nationwide will leave.  Anyone care to offer another guess? [/quote]

Wachovia estimated that 3-5% of the AGE advisors would walk. I could see it being a little higher but one third? How do you arrive at a figure that high and are you including AGE reps that go over to Finet in that guess?

They havent even had time to build the firm yet. If indeed they do take the best of both firms and create one - it could very well be the best place on the street. The best firm and you're paid for doing nothing but sticking it out and approaching change with an open mind. I'm in no rush on this one.   

I agree with Bache, I think that this firm in the number two spot is going to change the face of the industry (this and the fact that the current No. 2 is imploding embarassingly).

I am ambivalent in re. EZMoney's take on the situation (that being that since there is a bank involved there is bound to be a pole probing in your future's past). OT1H, yes, banks have a long and distinguished history of blowing themselves into tiny bits (Remember First Union which was the big fish swallowed by the smaller fish Wachovia?) And there have been scores of the seemingly dumbest mo fos in pinstripes at the tops of banks?

OTOH, Smith Barney's troubles began long before the Citi was taken over by Sandy's Weild men. Maybe they should have listened to Sandy and tossed Robinson at AmEx back in the day. And then there's Bache, didn't they have to run into the arms of Pru when they had allowed the Hunt brothers to over leverage themselves when they were trying to corner Silver in the early '80s? (answer is yes). George Ball (of both Pru AND EFHutton) didn't need a bank to destroy two companies (not to mention the careers of thousands of otherwise perfectly good salesmen). Point being that there are plenty of brains spattered on sidewalks far away from the banking section of Wall Street.

9 year lockups? Egads... Well, the truth of that is that this is the last time you are going to get paid to move. The next jump bonus will go to paying off the note you still carry from the last firm. It won't really matter to the firms because they'll all have a stream of on jumpers and off jumpers that will offset each other. It's really pretty ridiculous, always has been. We used to say in the wirehouse, if they just spent that $250,000 in advertising CD rates, we'd all make more money for everybody than the puke Merrill broker they bought will ever make them! (but they made the Merrill puke "Sales Manager" and so where was your reasoning going to go then?)

The big fish (First Union) is still out there.  It just calls itself a smaller fish (Wachovia).  I remember this deal well because SunTrust was calling at the same time with a better deal for the stockholders.  I just hope they do better than they did with The Moneystore and Core States.  See article: http://www.cavalierdaily.com/CVArticle.asp?ID=8496&pid=7 23 

I am going to Janney Next Month. 150k up front vs. 60 with some good

back end incentives. F off Bagby.

[quote=Goodbytoallthat]Shredder,

Can you expand on your WS friends' comments that the merger between AGE and WS would be good for AGE brokers?  Do you think it odd that WS is also providing retention for the WS  brokers?    Are there any WS FAs on this forum who wish to comment?

GBTAT
[/quote]

These FC's are all experianced transfers to WS, one from AGE. In a nutshell: 1. great fee based platform 2. better technology 3. Envision is excellant. 4. Strong regional management 5. THEY WILL LEAVE YOU ALONE!

That is the 30 sec version. Is it odd they are giving WS brokers a ret. pkg? NO, they are moving their HQ to St Louis, that blew away some of those reps. Things are going to change for them also.  As far as 1/3 of AGE reps leaving, that's crazy.  Everyone will talk to other BD's, most won't leave, it's too much effort. Will WS keep all the AGE FC's - NO. They probably don't want the bottom 20%. Good bye- good luck besides what kind of a "deal" can they really get? If you are in the business over 10 yrs and doing under $300k, might want to explore your options, but that was more than likely going to happen under a Bagby regime anyways, it was going down that road.

I agree with Bache, might be worth sticking around for, those deals will always be out there for good producers.

Not sure about the better tech at WS.  Sat down and compared at a buddy’s WS office and was not impressed.  Envision is a step up, but very wordy and really an average presentation.  It was the only step up in technology I noticed.  Most was the same, a few things worse.

[quote=brokerman]I am going to Janney Next Month. 150k up front vs. 60 with some good

back end incentives. F off Bagby.[/quote]

Bman,
Was there anything else about the new firm that mattered to you, other than the money?  Did you compare their offer to other companys’  offers?
I was talking last week with a large producer who left AGE after the new pay schedule was imposed 11 months ago.  He was a transactional guy, and the new “3 percent” cut affected him  by 10 percent.    He claims he loves the new company and his decision to leave.   He said he used a spread sheet to  compare over 30  variables for the many companies he analyzed.  Is advice to me was look hard before you leap.

[quote=brokerman]I am going to Janney Next Month. 150k up front vs. 60 with some good
back end incentives. F off Bagby.[/quote]

That's the spirit, you're really going to teach Bagby a lesson!

GOD I hope you're in my branch, but I don't think so.  Either way the other brokers in your branch are going to have some fun.

1)  Take the check 2) Wait and see ............ Easy short term decision.  The conditions ask for $ back, There appears to be no sign of a "no solicit" or "no compete".  Nothing to do until all details of merger are in place.

No offense to Brokerman but your production doesn't warrant a leave on the basis of such a small sum of money, however you could be very new to the biz.

[quote=advisor28]

1)  Take the check 2) Wait and see ............ Easy short term decision.  The conditions ask for $ back, There appears to be no sign of a "no solicit" or "no compete".  Nothing to do until all details of merger are in place.

No offense to Brokerman but your production doesn't warrant a leave on the basis of such a small sum of money, however you could be very new to the biz.

[/quote] Agreed, besides brokerman will be in the sam boat 2-4 yrs from now when JMS is bought out.

There does appears to be a non-solicit but if u give the $$ back when u leave there ar eno hand cuffs.

[quote=Ferris Bueller]

[quote=brokerman]I am going to Janney Next

Month. 150k up front vs. 60 with some good back end incentives. F off

Bagby.[/quote]

That’s the spirit, you’re really going to teach Bagby a lesson!

GOD I hope you’re in my branch, but I don’t think so. Either way the other

brokers in your branch are going to have some fun.

…My clients would see right through cockroaches like you…

I’m sorry you guys don’t have cofidence that your clients would follow if you

decided another firm made sense for you. Funny how you take out your

insecurities on others.

You're going to win some and you're going to lose some. Get ready for that fact. There are going to be people who have seen nothing but black since they started working with you who will not follow you and there are people who have seen nothing but red who will follow.

This could be that the people of blackness assume that things have been ok at their current firm and their string of success is because they were smart and you were lucky to have had them as clients. Clients tend to take credit for what goes right and blame you for what goes wrong.

I was fortunate in that I had a small percentage of my book given to qualified people who were willing to try to put me out of business. Most of the people I worked with were guys that I had worked with for over 15 years. The ones who worked for less time with me (and the ones who went after my book the hardest) were generally losers who had come over from Merrill after being less than mediocre there, and I was able to retain against them.

Mr Whitehair in the corner took out many of the stops, but he overplayed many clients "Don't worry, Mrs. Client, all YOUR money is here, but Whom no longer works for this firm!" and, well it's a Holiday weekend so... He didn't give it his usual 1,000 watt smile treatment.

So in no small part, your degree of success will have a correlation to the efforts of the others in the branch.

Recently, 3 good sized producers left the firm (went to Wachovia) and their accounts were split out across several offices for calling (For some odd reason they left on a Thursday morning! What is it with some people that they invite disaster to themselves?) Reason I bring this up is that, hungry brokers in other offices have nothing to lose and everything to gain by pounding your book and offering all sorts of enticements (the sorts that clients like, including no fees and preferential commission rates and lowered margin rates) and blandishments to just give it a year and "see how the other place works out (after all, many people who switch firm don't stay at the firm they switch to*), if you still want to go then, I'll do everything in my power to help you."

* Technically true in that many people who have jumped in the past, jump again at some time in the future. 2 of this threesome where employed elsewhere before they came to SB.

It's a good time to leave, but also a bad time to leave too soon. You can tell your clients that you don't like the way the new management was shaping up... But, Wachovia has a good name, High Cust Satisfaction Nums, good advertising, an aggressive up'n'commer. Saying that you don't like them before you even find out what they're like is going to be a weak argument, one that clients will be hesitant of accepting.

ESPECIALLY, if you're taking a check to go to another Retail branch.

If you think the "It makes sense for me" line is going to work for clients, you're in for a rude awakening. "It makes sense for YOU!" might be a better attitude.

[quote=Indyone]...My clients would see right through cockroaches like you...[/quote]

Youre clients are no different than any others.  I'm a top producer in my branch, I have a huge office with plaques all over the wall.  They will only see my success and my charm, I'd HAMMER you and at the end of the day you'll be sorry.

I disagree with you whom it may. My client retention rate depends on the

relationship I have with my clients not the efforts of other brokers in the

branch.



I feel pretty confident.

[quote=Indyone]…My clients would see right through cockroaches like you…

Youre clients are no different than any others.  I'm a top producer in my branch, I have a huge office with plaques all over the wall.  They will only see my success and my charm, I'd HAMMER you and at the end of the day you'll be sorry.[/quote]

You're a pathetic leech...building "your" book on the backs of failed brokers.  My clients don't give a sh*t about your big office or your tiny pecker...all they see is a pretentious asshole in a suit lying to them about a trusted advisor.  They'd be well-prepared for your pathetic assault and at the end of the day, the only thing you're hammering is yourself in the shower.

Brokerman, man.

Plenty of guys felt pretty confident as they went over Niagra Falls too.

I've been through it Brokerman and I am a guy who was doing much bigger nums than the ones you are showing. I am a guy who had many years under my belt and I am a guy who has very good relationships with my clients.

I'm just telling you that confidence alone won't cut it. You had better be ready to anwer some very pointed questions from clients and be ready for people who smiled in your face to be backstabbers.

As always, I wish the broker the best. In my world it is your book of business and that's the way it should be seen.

The thing you have going for you is that management is stoopid! What they'll do is give the biggest clients to the biggest brokers. Your biggest clients are the most likely to follow because they have put more of their trust in you. But, still in all, don't think you're going to take your whole entire book, and do the math for yourself from a worst, medium, medium good and best case scenario and be honest with yourself. Then try to decide if you will be as well off after three years given the number of "c-listers that you don't care about anyway" that won't come and then add in a couple of your big "absolutely positively" clients to the don't come list ('cause some of them might just not!).

"You're a pathetic leech...building "your" book on the backs of failed brokers."

Uh speak for yourself dude!

I left as a plenty successful broker and still am one!

Thank you very much! 

A little Sunday night sparring that was not directed at you, Whomit.  Re-read the post.  I’m not even saying Reggin isn’t a successful broker…I’m just not impressed with his methods of adding to “his” book.  You & I have disagreed before, but for the most part, what you said above makes sense and argues for a strong battle plan and excellent preparation done under the deepest of cover.  Leaving and retaining clients is a game you must win and should be treated as such.

[quote=Indyone]A little Sunday night sparring that was not directed at you, Whomit.  Re-read the post.  I'm not even saying Reggin isn't a successful broker...I'm just not impressed with his methods of adding to "his" book.  You & I have disagreed before, but for the most part, what you said above makes sense and argues for a strong battle plan and excellent preparation done under the deepest of cover.  Leaving and retaining clients is a game you must win and should be treated as such.[/quote]

Oh so you're Mr. Ethical and have NEVER called the clients of a broker that has just deserted the firm?  BM goes around and hands everyone a client list of the departed and everyone calls.  That's how the game is played, except for Mr. Ethical over here.  WHatEvA liar.

[quote=Indyone]A little Sunday night sparring that was not directed at you, Whomit.  Re-read the post.  I’m not even saying Reggin isn’t a successful broker…I’m just not impressed with his methods of adding to “his” book.  You & I have disagreed before, but for the most part, what you said above makes sense and argues for a strong battle plan and excellent preparation done under the deepest of cover.  Leaving and retaining clients is a game you must win and should be treated as such.

Oh so you're Mr. Ethical and have NEVER called the clients of a broker that has just deserted the firm?  BM goes around and hands everyone a client list of the departed and everyone calls.  That's how the game is played, except for Mr. Ethical over here.  WHatEvA liar.[/quote]

Hey, believe what you want, but no, I didn't.  That kind of shark tank crap is just one of the reasons I went independent...it's not my style.  I find it a lot more productive and satisfying to convert client referrals and prospects than to try and convert someone else's clients.  From what I've heard through the grapevine, most of the guys I left behind at my former employer feel the same way.

Well that type of shark tank crap is how the rest of this industry works and it's good you took your thin skin to the independent side.

The BM's job is to retain the assets of departing brokers, and that's when he turns to the rest of his branch.  It's gravy to us, same as when he distributes walk-in or phone-in accounts.  I don't build my book that way, but when something comes in unexectedly, I take advantage of it.  Blame the departing broker for underestimating the relationship he has with his clients.  If I left, I would expect the rest of my office to be doing the same thing.

So get off your high horse.

[quote=Reggin]I'm a top producer in my branch, I have a huge office with plaques all over the wall.  They will only see my success and my charm, I'd HAMMER you and at the end of the day you'll be sorry.[/quote]

I'll get off my horse when you dismount yours...

Really, the jousting has been entertaining, but you and I have work to do later this morning...