EJ Getting just like MER/MS
I’ve been At EJ over 7 years, and admittably stopped the kool aid awhile back. I am in Cali, one of the 5 states where the firm CUT OUR PAY (mine to 38% from 40) and told us they made it up to us in different treatment of expenses.
Guess what? This week we received a rather threatening LETTER, not wire from a GP stating that we could be fired for overspending our expense accounts! (He later had to write a wire of apology and explanation, so at least some of the FAs had the cojones to complain about the ivory tower tone in the letter). But that is what has happened here, even in my short time. Jones has changed. The only thing distinguishing us from the biggie wirehouses is our single office/partnership model. Otherwise, we act the same as MER/MS. Now, I am notified that my allotted expenses are almost exceeded, as of June! So, where is the new, nice expense treatment here? Now I have to get pre approval on expense items like cell phone, seminars, appreciation dinners?! I NEVER RAN OUT OF EXPENSE DOLLARS UNDER THE OLD SYSTEM. Jones is talking out of both sides of it's mouth, and playing right into the hands of the best Indie broker dealers. What would be the compelling reason to stay? It feels as though this firm is being ramped up for sale or merger. That certainly will benefit the GPs most, as per usual. I thought I would retire from here. Looks like I've gotta gird up my loins for one more change.Wow you have taken it for seven years!
After reading this forum for the past several years. Five to ten years is about the time frame for a EJ rep to figure it out and get fed up and go indy. Well now it looks like it is time to give yourself a pay raise and go indy. Good luck!"CAUTION" Imposter here ....no need to believe anything this person has just said. Payouts in Cali have actually went up to 45%...not down. Its funny how this person just finds this forum and casually plants this propaganda...its probably BSPEARS again..just planting this anti jones stuff....oh..and by the way...MER/MS do this to their brokers..so why can't Jones...right Spiff.
Jones reps have expense accounts now?
So I hear…I bet it was the gay mafia’s idea…
Hey, Babs
No, we had the pre tax expense allowance taken from our comp just like you. But the firm took that away this year in the "5 states" where it costs so horribly much to do biz. Now they allot a figure based on production, and if you exceed that number you have to have expenses pre approved by a frickin commitee. Seems there was some real creative expensing goin out out here in Cali....HEY HEY HEY…PROPAGANDA…STOP…STOP IT…Funny how you come on here and start all this and you really don’t know anything about the expense set up…its obvious to me and everyone else…anti Jones…thats it…gay mafia, JFK assasination, UFO’s, Saskwatch
Put down the bottle spears. Seems like you've been hitting it pretty hard lately. More than usual.
z
Waaa…All I was doing was attacking a anti Jones thread…that’s it. I was attacked when I stood up and said Jones should payback all that was stolen from clients…thats it. I was accused of making a new login name and posting…I was just acting like Spiff and B24…I was protecting the Jones name. Damn…wtf…I love Jones and Spiff. IF you want to know about LPL, go to their website. They work for me…and do a great job of it. IF you don’t like my sarcastic posts…first…don’t read them…2…I don’t know…I guess don’t read them again…3rd…yell at someone else
And anyway..I worked there, I know the crap they spew...I see right through it..I can counter anything they want to say about there firm..nothing I have said is to far off the truth..and as time goes by..more and more of the defenders become the.....well, I've been off the Koolaid now for two months and ......I have many PM's from Jonesers looking for some answers...And I have answered those in a very professional and non sarcastic, truthful manner...SO GO F*ck YOURSELF..Yah man…great post…alot of gay overtones in you post…scarry…I won’t be part of your fantasy…lube or no lube…good luck, I hope you find what your looking for…in or out of the closet.
Are you looking for some type of role playing with pain or should I dress up for you..or what...Napoleon maybe...I'm confused but would like more clarity.Liar…
Classy.
A) Nobody attacked you for saying that Jones should make those people whole. In fact, most people agreed with you. You went with the 60 minutes, Jones is screwing people, dragging their feet, etc angle. B) My statement on that thread was that it seemed strange to me that the poster couldn't remember something like when Ed died. If you're that involved in the case, surely you know a piece of info like that. C) I've never accused you of creating a new login. I don't think you're that creative. It scares me that there are people out there desperate enough to PM you about LPL. If anyone out there from Jones is SERIOUSLY looking for info on LPL, I'd sincerely recommened Indyone or Joedabrkr. Talking to spears about Jones is like asking a guy about his ex wife. She could be smoking hot, smart, and funny, but he'd say stay away from her because she can't cook.Can someone please tell me how I got stomped earlier. I moved assets to the sidelines, the market tanks and I’m in the wrong. A fun banter back and forth on protecting assets vs riding the elevator down.
Really ice, if you don’t like my posts, don’t read them. I could care less what your opinions are of my posts, really. It doesn’t mean anything…nothing…your opinion means absolutely zero to me. Your position in life is just that, a spot you take up that has no bearing whatsoever on anyone else. I have fun here, and will admit(sort of) that I go over the top about jones, because I do hate them.
I do target Spiff, just as he targets me. Its a fun banter back and forth and when I’ve decided to blow off the day…I post way to many times…and get way over the top. Oh well…who really gives a shit. If a newbie is coming here for advice…he’s already lost the game. Find a mentor, not a forum. If an EDJ newbie is questioning his/her firm and is on here ranting…well…I think they already know what to do… Remember…your opinion means zero…except for maybe your family…just as mine shouldn’t mean anything to anyone…we’re on the internet…posting with fictitious names…calling each other names…queers and Napoleons and all the other great ones…sorry if you feel you’re important on here or this forum is important.
LOL...first smart, well put reply i've ever heard out of spears, Spears/Lohan for Prez!Can someone please tell me how I got stomped earlier. I moved assets to the sidelines, the market tanks and I’m in the wrong. A fun banter back and forth on protecting assets vs riding the elevator down.
Really ice, if you don’t like my posts, don’t read them. I could care less what your opinions are of my posts, really. It doesn’t mean anything…nothing…your opinion means absolutely zero to me. Your position in life is just that, a spot you take up that has no bearing whatsoever on anyone else. I have fun here, and will admit(sort of) that I go over the top about jones, because I do hate them.
I do target Spiff, just as he targets me. Its a fun banter back and forth and when I’ve decided to blow off the day…I post way to many times…and get way over the top. Oh well…who really gives a shit. If a newbie is coming here for advice…he’s already lost the game. Find a mentor, not a forum. If an EDJ newbie is questioning his/her firm and is on here ranting…well…I think they already know what to do… Remember…your opinion means zero…except for maybe your family…just as mine shouldn’t mean anything to anyone…we’re on the internet…posting with fictitious names…calling each other names…queers and Napoleons and all the other great ones…sorry if you feel you’re important on here or this forum is important.
[quote=bspears]Can someone please tell me how I got stomped earlier. I moved assets to the sidelines, the market tanks and I’m in the wrong. A fun banter back and forth on protecting assets vs riding the elevator down.
Really ice, if you don’t like my posts, don’t read them. I could care less what your opinions are of my posts, really. It doesn’t mean anything…nothing…your opinion means absolutely zero to me. Your position in life is just that, a spot you take up that has no bearing whatsoever on anyone else. I have fun here, and will admit(sort of) that I go over the top about jones, because I do hate them.
I do target Spiff, just as he targets me. Its a fun banter back and forth and when I’ve decided to blow off the day…I post way to many times…and get way over the top. Oh well…who really gives a shit. If a newbie is coming here for advice…he’s already lost the game. What’s wrong with newbies learning a business from as many different angles as possible? A web forum is a great way for people to be candid about things without being “on the record.” Find a mentor, not a forum. Find a mentor, a forum, magazines, books, articles everything you can get your hand on. If an EDJ newbie is questioning his/her firm and is on here ranting…well…I think they already know what to do… Remember…your opinion means zero…except for maybe your family…just as mine shouldn’t mean anything to anyone…we’re on the internet…posting with fictitious names….calling each other names…queers and Napoleons and all the other great ones…sorry if you feel you’re important on here or this forum is important.
[/quote] Two months removed it’s easy to see where the bitterness comes from. Especially if you were let go. I’m not saying you were. However, it’s been my experience interviewing people that those who have been let go take it very personal and are usually bitter.
How can I be let go from my own business? I'm scared now...did I miss some meeting with myself....
[quote=bspears]
How can I be let go from my own business? I'm scared now...did I miss some meeting with myself....
[/quote] No. You missed his point.Well, if his point was I got let go from the cult…funny. He got me on that one…
I think he misunderstood your post. He doesn’t know that you’ve been gone from EDJ for more than two months like one of your posts/rants mentioned.
[quote=bspears]
How can I be let go from my own business? I'm scared now...did I miss some meeting with myself....
[/quote] Are you kidding me? In my post I put in BOLD print that I was not saying you were let go. How did you miss take that?River,
Right after the "BOLD" your next sentence implies that he must have been let go because he hates Jones...I hate Jones, got them fined over $202 mil. and left on my own over 5 years ago.
Thank God its Friday–after reading all this I need a drink!
I was at Jones for 14 years (Good and Bad) been at LPL 16 months (Good and ???). If you need to know the difference between being at Jones and being an Indy you can PM me. I check my messages once a day. Jones isn't a bad place and I have no bitter feelings at all. Being an Indy is NOT for everyone! It has its good points and not so good points too. Now where did I sit that beer?Lets agree River King thinks its okay to get info from forums…I disagree. When I made the choice to leave the cult and move to Indy, it was ONLY after I watched several of my friends do it. I watched, visited, looked at what assets they moved and found out for myself if it was for me. Looked at inventory, their platform, hell even a friends commission statement. Its not that I wouldn’t take Roadhards advice or Indyone…but gosh dangit…I don’t know who the hell Roadhard is…when i think of Roadhard…I think of woody harrelsons landlady in Kingpin??..no offense
If you make a decision based on what I'm typing on this forum, sorry...but I think you need to think on your own. Hell, when I read Borkers comments on another thread about being told x amount of assets and received x....well I shake my head and would have moved on asap, but thats me and not him.[quote=uwec1986]
River,
Right after the "BOLD" your next sentence implies that he must have been let go because he hates Jones...I hate Jones, got them fined over $202 mil. and left on my own over 5 years ago.
[/quote] So, does the fact that you got "got the ball rolling on RS" and got Jones fined $202 mil, but nothing has changed (except some extra trees get killed because of the stupid RS paperwork that prints with EVERY mfd trade) materially drive you nuts? Are you going to try to figure out how much Jones will actually pay on the RS class action suit and then ammend your numbers? There are a bunch of lazy people out there who won't go out of their way to give me their voucher for $6 for the next three years. In the end all that money goes right back into the Jones checkbook. Not to mention all those people (like Roadhard's clients) who got tagged as a Jones client, were given the vouchers, but can't use them. Seems like the only money Jones is guaranteed to pay out are those clients who left Jones before the cutoff date. At least they got a check in their mailbox. All in all, at the end of the day, what is it exactly that you accomplished?Don’t forget that the attorney’s must have gotten about $100 mil…EJ won’t be getting that back.
What I accomplished was exposing the out right hypocrisy of EJ. 1. Lied to clients about their motivations (only provide info. to brokers from "the seven" because of Rev. Sharing), 2. Printed a HUGE ad in the WSJ about how bad the other guys are. 3. Created disincentives to FA's attempting to annuitize their business (lower payouts on c-shares). 4. EJ takes .75 to 1.25% off the top of all VA purchases (I signed up for a 40% payout of the revenue not for 40% of what's left) That's just a start but it looks like I win and it brings me great joy to think of the checks Jones sent me and all my clients. You're a reasonable guy and you'll be free of Jones some day...I'm sure of it.THANKS, GUYS, FOR STOPPING THE PREVIOUS PISSIN MATCH!
I am one of those folks that uses this forum to gather data. I believe I can tell who is blowin smoke and who isnt.
My end analysis of Jones is in the post that started this thread.
Jones has changed, and is no longer as sanctimonious as we were under Bachman (and yes, Bachman and Hill painted HUGE targets on their own backs when they published the WSJ ad. Hill paid that tab, Bachman pretty much skated). Under Weddle, this firm is being ramped up to go SOMEWHERE...I am just not sure where. Regardless, we were so far behind our peers in technology that we need to update simply to stay competitive.My time at Jones has been good, except for the last few years. So, the real reason for even messing with these forums is to get real, viable feedbacck from brothers and sisters in this Biz. For those of you that provide it, THANKS!
[quote=bspears]Lets agree River King thinks its okay to get info from forums…I disagree. When I made the choice to leave the cult and move to Indy, it was ONLY after I watched several of my friends do it. I watched, visited, looked at what assets they moved and found out for myself if it was for me. Looked at inventory, their platform, hell even a friends commission statement. Its not that I wouldn’t take Roadhards advice or Indyone…but gosh dangit…I don’t know who the hell Roadhard is…when i think of Roadhard…I think of woody harrelsons landlady in Kingpin??..no offense
If you make a decision based on what I'm typing on this forum, sorry...but I think you need to think on your own. Hell, when I read Borkers comments on another thread about being told x amount of assets and received x....well I shake my head and would have moved on asap, but thats me and not him. [/quote] It wasn't quite that simple. I told the hiring guy I'd take over the office, as long as they guaranteed I'd retain all of the accounts. (Or as many as were willing to wait for me to get licensed.) Jones told me that I would walk into $26 million, and I didn't know what else to do but trust them. After I became licensed and "trained," I re-opened the office and discovered there was $15 million on the books. The FA that transferred to another office took numerous accounts with him--although he told me he wouldn't--and the Seg. 5 in town cherry-picked several out before I got into the office. If I'd had a way to monitor what was going on, or even better, predict the future, I'd have never taken the job.Borker Boy,
Jones does make big claims to the new guy taking an office and I'm sorry they lied to you but $15 mil is about a 2 or 3 year head start...take it and run.That’s what I was told, but when a person takes over a book of CDs and A-shares, I have trouble seeing how it’s a legitimate 2-3 years head start.
Trust me, I can't imagine having started as newnew (I wouldn't have), but taking over a $15 million book of money that's already invested isn't quite as glamorous as it may appear.So what was the feedback you received from home office when you discovered the missing or moved assets? Sorry…if you don’t like it you can leave…its exactly what was said to a friend of mine who left a great position to take over a non competitive empty office. 1/2 of the assets moved to another office in town and when he tried to get them back…well…when he decided to solicit the clients who left to come back…he got a wonderful call from the RL…Effay…you say Weddle has changed things…but you say things have been good except the last few years…under Weddle??? hmmm
The accounts were first moved to St. Louis, then picked through by the FA that transferred to another office, then co-mingled with a Seg. 5 in my town and picked through by him, and then transferred back to my office just before I got back from Eval/Grad.
When I asked HQ why I was missing $11 million in assets, I was told that it would "all work out in the wash." I wasn't really sure what to do from there, but those assets never re-appeared on my book.Borker Boy,
$15 mil no matter what it's invested in is a HUGE start so I suggest you stop whining and get to work on your mutual fund upgrade program. The referrals alone could be huge too. Trust me...you got a big gift! Jones does suck for lying to you and you should be pissed about that but you can't do anything about it so go make some money.
Spears your comments are right on and I've seen the same thing happen here when another local office raided the one that left. The new guy was promised $15 m and got $2 mil.In EJ’s defense…the clients did need to be serviced but they certainly could have found a way to keep the assets in the office. I’m sure EJ knew that a good portion of the assets would be gone because they have done this in the past.
I suggest you get off this board, get to work learning the business and come back in 3 years when you can move to an independent platform without EJ charging you $75k in training fees. Good luckWait…let me step back for a second…this could not have happened…this is Jones we’re tallking about…
Unless you're prepared to move, I would take uwec's comments...15 mil isn't to bad..26mil would have been great..but 15 isn't chump change to start with...Hey, guys!
I went thru the same crap at Jones. Was supposed to take over 15 mn., bring same from my old firm, and the Jones broker took much of what he was supposed to leave to his new office - and he was given 75mn in a new city!! He is now a top producer.
It boils down to your RL, I think. Mine raised hell at the time, and so did the past RL. The SOB that took the assets was supposed to leave was not well liked in the region. But boy did he have some buddies in STL!, He ended up having to split commissions with me for 3 years on some key accounts.
WOULD THAT HAVE HAPPENED TODAY? Hell no!
If my RL(s) had not screamed bloody murder, the firm would have taken the “sorry, you are the new guy, deal with it” approach. Like they did with Borker.
And, Borker? Take ALL of the above comments to heart. You DID get a gift. Hope that Karma is in opreation, and get to work. Think of the referrals you’ll get from the A++ service you are going to provide!
Your situation further illustrates how EJ has changed with "Bryll Cream" at the helm.
UWEC is right on the money. Read, learn, and GTW
(get to work).
I think most of our books adhere to the 80/20 principle. So, if you are promised a $25mill office, and some vet gets to basically cherry pick off even $5mill (20%), that’s a massive drop in possible revenue seeing as how he probably took out 80% of revenue production. Yeah, a $20mill office would have been great (I started new/new), but it is NOT what was promised.
[quote=bspears]Lets agree River King thinks its okay to get info from forums…I disagree. When I made the choice to leave the cult and move to Indy, it was ONLY after I watched several of my friends do it. I watched, visited, looked at what assets they moved and found out for myself if it was for me. Looked at inventory, their platform, hell even a friends commission statement. Its not that I wouldn’t take Roadhards advice or Indyone…but gosh dangit…I don’t know who the hell Roadhard is…when i think of Roadhard…I think of woody harrelsons landlady in Kingpin??..no offense
If you make a decision based on what I'm typing on this forum, sorry...but I think you need to think on your own. Hell, when I read Borkers comments on another thread about being told x amount of assets and received x....well I shake my head and would have moved on asap, but thats me and not him. [/quote] bspears I think we agree on this more than you realise. As you stated you made the move after you watched friends, visited, and looked at everything. That is exactly what I was saying. Why not exam every piece of information you can when you're making a life changing move?If you are going to get angry with jones over promises broken, get out the pepto-bismol.I think most of our books adhere to the 80/20 principle. So, if you are promised a $25mill office, and some vet gets to basically cherry pick off even $5mill (20%), that’s a massive drop in possible revenue seeing as how he probably took out 80% of revenue production. Yeah, a $20mill office would have been great (I started new/new), but it is NOT what was promised.
I did not read this thread past the first post, so if it has already been brought up forgive me, but...
MS raised payouts a year ago and they are still unchanged. EJ is nothing like MS/MER until they bring new issues to market, advise corporations on mergers and aquisitions, build structured investments, offer alternative investments such as futures, hedge funds, exchange funds, and so on. I am absolutely not trying to put EJ down, I just get tired of hearing retail firms compared to investment banks. I am not offering an opinion on who's better.wlooney
You are absolutely correct. EJ is not an investment bank and probably never will be...which I say because the firm is changing rapidly, and, who knows, if the GPs see a profitable niche somewhere they will look closely, see who else is doing it and try and iimprove on it... That is my point, really...EJ has become just like the major firms in areas like production requirements, reducing payouts (how do you discriminate against FAs in 5 states and get away with it??), treating FAs like production units. We have over 10,000 offices now, so this in inevitable. But sad, in my view. If I had wanted to go to work at MER/MS, I wouldve started there. Point taken. Clarification made. Thanks![quote=Effay] wlooney
That is my point, really…EJ has become just like the major firms in areas like production requirements, reducing payouts (how do you discriminate against FAs in 5 states and get away with it??), treating FAs like production units.
We have over 10,000 offices now, so this in inevitable. But sad, in my view. If I had wanted to go to work at MER/MS, I wouldve started there. Point taken. Clarification made.
Thanks!
[/quote]
Effay, I think you’re confused. I don’t think Jones is much different now (in relation to other firms) than it has been in the past. You are just pissed because of the 5 state thing. I have not heard any problems internally from people in those affected states. I realize they cut payout and increased reimbursements (their alternative was they had to increase reimbursements, but not change payout, so to keep things equitable among all FA’s, they had to lower the payout). Honestly, I think you shoudl talk to someone in STL about it, if it really seems to be screwing you. Maybe you are not managing your expenses the right way. They never would have done this had it not been for the stupid overtime lawsuit. But from everything I have heard (granted, mostly from STL), it seems to be compensation-neutral.
Spiff could probably add something to this conversation.
Effay,
Imagine a life where you control your own expenses, where you don’t have to worry about some committee approving how you spend your money, where you don’t have to explain to an Uncle Millty why you didn’t use an EDJ preferred fund, where your reward for working on a Saturday is financial not a smoked turkey, where the firms culture is your culture not cult culture. That is what Independence brings. Independence is not the only answer. I went from a bank, to Jones and then to a wire and then at long last to independence. My only regret is I should have gone independent much sooner. I have never met anyone who went from an independent to Jones. I wish you well on your personal path to enlightenment.
[quote=B24] [quote=Effay] wlooney
That is my point, really...EJ has become just like the major firms in areas like production requirements, reducing payouts (how do you discriminate against FAs in 5 states and get away with it??), treating FAs like production units.
We have over 10,000 offices now, so this in inevitable. But sad, in my view. If I had wanted to go to work at MER/MS, I wouldve started there. Point taken. Clarification made.
Thanks!
[/quote]
Effay, I think you're confused. I don't think Jones is much different now (in relation to other firms) than it has been in the past. You are just pissed because of the 5 state thing. I have not heard any problems internally from people in those affected states. I realize they cut payout and increased reimbursements (their alternative was they had to increase reimbursements, but not change payout, so to keep things equitable among all FA's, they had to lower the payout). Honestly, I think you shoudl talk to someone in STL about it, if it really seems to be screwing you. Maybe you are not managing your expenses the right way. They never would have done this had it not been for the stupid overtime lawsuit. But from everything I have heard (granted, mostly from STL), it seems to be compensation-neutral.
Spiff could probably add something to this conversation.[/quote] The only compensation changes I've seen in 10+ years of working with or as an FA have been positive for the majority of FAs. They haven't changed the gross payout on your average everyday investments in years. They have INCREASED payout on things like B & C shares, but that was quite a while ago. There is still an incentive to sell A shares with a higher payout (40%) than B or C (35%). But that's the only one I can remember. There are some people that were negatively affected by the change in the bonus structure. Weddle has said in his weekly suggbox responses that they knew it was going to negatively affect a small percentage of the FA population. But, like B24 said, if it wasn't for the overtime lawsuit they wouldn't have changed anything. I honestly don't know how often grids change at some place like ML or MS. I know that I've read articles in RR and some other publications that have mentioned that grids are changing. So I know it's more frequent than Jones does it. You may feel like a lot of compensation changes are happening if you're relatively new to Jones, but I assure you the last couple of years have been the exception, not the rule.
I am in one of the 5 states and i’ll tell you…it has been better for me. Yes my payout was cut from 40% to 37%…but now they pay my cellphone, advertising, all of my networking groups (3), and many other things that at the end of the day makes my end of year take home better than before. Like Spiff said, Weddle openly said at the beginning of all of this, that there will be a small % of the population that will be negatively affected by the change, as there obviously are.
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