EDJ New/New vs. Existing

When it comes time for LP, production wins.  Jones doesn't care how your book was built (or inherited).

But, when the RL asks him to get up and "say a few words" at a regional meeting, make sure you take a LOT of notes.

Hasn't anyone explained to you that AUM has nothing to do with LP.  You get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  That's it.  If you don't have the profitability for your branch, they don't even look at your volunteer record BTW.  They just toss your name out of the hat.  Sucks, but that's the way it is. 

If you decide to move to another firm, remember that you aren't always going to get fair treatment there either.  It's the way the industry works.  You can whine about it or ignore it and just focus on your business.   

" I mean, won't EDJ try and keep him and his assets happy at Jones?  I told this to an ex-EDJ man.  He laughed a little and said, "when you start out at Jones, some get sucked and some get f**ked."  I've been thinking about what he said.  Do you know how I feel?  "

Moist?

Mr. A

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]

Hasn't anyone explained to you that AUM has nothing to do with LP.  You get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  That's it.  If you don't have the profitability for your branch, they don't even look at your volunteer record BTW.  They just toss your name out of the hat.  Sucks, but that's the way it is. 

[/quote]

True, but it is kind of tough to run a profitable office without sufficient AUM.

Ed,

I can appreciate your situation, I've seen several similar situations, seg 3 in a year..new new, nope, knew the RL, inherited a 30MM office.  Tauted as the production superstar, while the hardest working new-new's are bombing out every other week. If your are new, work hard and avoid distractions, the opportunity you were given is decent and  it is a near miracle you made it into an office as a new new. CONGRATS!  Around the 3 year mark, if you are not content with being a Jones employee, revisit this forum, speak to some indys and get some valid input on the business.  GOOD LUCK

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]

Hasn't anyone explained to you that AUM has nothing to do with LP.  You get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  That's it.  If you don't have the profitability for your branch, they don't even look at your volunteer record BTW.  They just toss your name out of the hat.  Sucks, but that's the way it is. 

If you decide to move to another firm, remember that you aren't always going to get fair treatment there either.  It's the way the industry works.  You can whine about it or ignore it and just focus on your business.   

[/quote]

NOT TRUE!  There were several brokers who were offered LP in 2003 who not only did not have profit, but were still in the red.  That is an absolute, undeniable FACT. 

The question from the original poster was basically, "Does the other guy get a free ride one time, or does his free ride go on forever?"  The answer, unfortunately, is that his free ride goes on at least until you surpass the "lucky" broker in AUM and production.  That may take you anywhere from 4-7 years from the sounds of it.  You have caught on very quickly that the LP carrot keeps getting dangled out in front of you.  What you will find out is that Jones can move that carrot anytime they like.  And, when you do finally get it--it really doesn't taste as great as they say.   

It’s easy to try to string all this together and come up with the Jones

conspiracy theories. The truth is, the way LP works is independant of

assets being assigned to offices, new brokers getting existing offices,

Goodknights, etc. The fact is, some get real, real lucky due to timing and

location. Others get real, real, real lucky to be the child of a big

producer. But at the end of the day, it just is what it is. Some will make

out better than others. Jones does not have some hidden back-room

agenda. Some are just lucky and some are not. And yes, the lucky ones

will get LP quicker, and achieve higher AUM, and higher income and all

that.



They are trying very hard to address the new/new thing (yes, very few

new/new’s really make it) by enhancing all of the various partnership and

Goodknight programs. Despite what people think, they are not interested

in hiring and firing. They really do want everyone to make it. But they

are also not going to tell new/new candidates, "hey, we don’t think you

should join our firm, 'cause it’s like, really really hard to make it in this

business."



It IS a hard business. Not everyone will make it (at any firm starting out).

In my opinion, that was made pretty clear before I started).



If you are not one of the “Chosen Ones” at ANY firm, just keep your head

down, work hard, soak up some good ideas from REAL top producers,

and your time will come eventually. It WILL take longer than being

handed something, but the fact is, not everyone is going to get it handed

to them.

<span =“bold”>EdJehovah-I am new/new as well.  And yes, this
does happen.  Has happened in my region already to a couple
guys.  I do feel Jones makes it very difficult to survive as
new/new, but I also think if it was easy, everyone would be doing
it.  I have two seg 5’s in my region who know little if anything
about investing, but their Dad was a big producer before them. 
Trust me, all the other FA’s know this and respect the success of
new/new guys.  Doesn’t make it any easier for us, but it happens
in every other profession too.

[quote=EdJehovah]  I'm a new/new at ED Jones: i'm a new broker, in a new office.  What I see now, is that another broker, same tenure, less productive, was given an office around the corner from me with 40 million in assets.  He is moving up the ladder quick.  Now everyone says, why isn't everyone like him, i.e. productivity.  He moves thru sales segments every four months, bonuses, trips, not to mention a great client base.  My concern is that EDJ dangles this hope of a Limited Partnership in front of us like a carrot.  But i'm starting to wonder, when the time comes, will they offer it to me, or to the guy with millions of extra assets?  I mean, won't EDJ try and keep him and his assets happy at Jones?  I told this to an ex-EDJ man.  He laughed a little and said, "when you start out at Jones, some get sucked and some get f**ked."  I've been thinking about what he said.  Do you know how I feel?  [/quote]

Welcome to the world of Edward Jones.  Don't ya love it.

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]

Hasn't anyone explained to you that AUM has nothing to do with LP.  You get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  That's it.  If you don't have the profitability for your branch, they don't even look at your volunteer record BTW.  They just toss your name out of the hat.  Sucks, but that's the way it is. 

If you decide to move to another firm, remember that you aren't always going to get fair treatment there either.  It's the way the industry works.  You can whine about it or ignore it and just focus on your business.   

[/quote]

Fair treatment versus having EDJ screw you over are two totally different things.  I got so tired of hearing IR's who either took over a large office or were given one or a goodnight who took over a lot of assets, held up as the next god to worship.  Glad I'm gone.

Just took a big Weddle and it stunk!!!

[quote=Soothsayer][quote=Spaceman Spiff]

Hasn't anyone explained to you that AUM has nothing to do with LP.  You get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  That's it.  If you don't have the profitability for your branch, they don't even look at your volunteer record BTW.  They just toss your name out of the hat.  Sucks, but that's the way it is. 

If you decide to move to another firm, remember that you aren't always going to get fair treatment there either.  It's the way the industry works.  You can whine about it or ignore it and just focus on your business.   

[/quote]

NOT TRUE!  There were several brokers who were offered LP in 2003 who not only did not have profit, but were still in the red.  That is an absolute, undeniable FACT. 

The question from the original poster was basically, "Does the other guy get a free ride one time, or does his free ride go on forever?"  The answer, unfortunately, is that his free ride goes on at least until you surpass the "lucky" broker in AUM and production.  That may take you anywhere from 4-7 years from the sounds of it.  You have caught on very quickly that the LP carrot keeps getting dangled out in front of you.  What you will find out is that Jones can move that carrot anytime they like.  And, when you do finally get it--it really doesn't taste as great as they say.   

[/quote]

Yep, your right about the LP.  I was one of them.  I wasn't red, but I wasn't profitable either.  However, I had just left the home office where I would have been offered my second round of LP.  Jones could have told me to forget it, but they didn't.  In fact the GP that called said they had several IRs that were in my position that they didn't want to forget about. 

You're also right that Jones can move the carrot whenever they choose.  They do run the company after all.  From what I have heard the profit numbers are somewhere in the $20's pretty consistently.  Yeah, it sucks to have a carrot that pays out somewhere between 15 and 20% annually.  The down side is that I can't buy more whenever I want.     

I'm not sure I get the free ride until you pass him thing you said.  If you get a $30 mill book handed to you then sit on it, it won't take long for a new guy to pass you in production or assets.  The "lucky" guy still has to work the book, ask for referrals, etc, or he'll starve too. 

In your first post, you said that you get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  Since you had no profitability in 2003, can we now admit that was a false and misleading statement by the GPs prior to the offering. 

Let's do a little hypothetical.  Let's say Broker A has no profit (in the red as far as P/L, not production), but has volunteered his/her ass off.  Mentored, trained, #77, organizing regional events, etc., etc.  Broker B (who took over Daddy's book) never volunteers, not even a lick, but has a decent profit.  Broker C starts from scratch,has all the volunteerism of A, and the production and profit of B.  All are in the same region.  Who gets the most LP?  Careful how you answer Spiff.  It might me a trick question.

I think Spiff is in a unique situation. He came from the home office where

he had LP already. So they took into account his previous service, which

was under different criteria. I think it’s the right move.



As far as the a/b/c thing…good question. I am not up for LP yet, but I am

always curious exactly how the decide on it.



From what I understand, you generally have to be profitable, and then

they consider your volunteerism as far as amount is concerned. Of

course, I may be way off. That’s just what I have gathered from different

people.

I just left Jones recently.  I think that the LP 'carrot' is a subjective bunch of phooey.  Anyone out there know exactly how it is decided who gets LP and how much?  Of course not.  LP is simply an arbitrary way to reward the offices that are 'contributing' to there respective regions and whose broker is a 'good ole boy' in the region.  Profitability can be soooo controlled by the Jones bureaucracy... anybody really know exactly how your 'allocation' is figured?  $1,000 for 'technology' is but one example of the arbitrary expenses they tack on each branch.  I assure you....they'll award LP as they see fit and not by any metric that anyone in the field will ever truly understand.......and it's by design.  You can call it a conspiracy theory if you like, but you know it's true.

And these 'Good ole' Boys'................C'mon, you all knew/know them......the butt-kissers that come to the regional meetings and sit up front by the RL......try to answer questions to which they obviously don't know the answer......work their tails off for those regional 'awards' that don't amount to jack....etc.  These guys and gals are the folks that end up w/ partnerships and leadership roles and Jones makes sure of it.

Keep bustin' it at EDJ....win yourself a few more awards.....then look in the mirror in a few years and ask yourself a question.....Does anybody really give a $hit?  Hell no. 

EDJ SUCKS!

[quote=Soothsayer]

In your first post, you said that you get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  Since you had no profitability in 2003, can we now admit that was a false and misleading statement by the GPs prior to the offering. 

Let's do a little hypothetical.  Let's say Broker A has no profit (in the red as far as P/L, not production), but has volunteered his/her ass off.  Mentored, trained, #77, organizing regional events, etc., etc.  Broker B (who took over Daddy's book) never volunteers, not even a lick, but has a decent profit.  Broker C starts from scratch,has all the volunteerism of A, and the production and profit of B.  All are in the same region.  Who gets the most LP?  Careful how you answer Spiff.  It might me a trick question.

[/quote]

My best guess is that Broker A would get passed over, simply because he doesn't have any profit.  In fact they would probably tell him to stop volunteering and working on making the office profitable.  Broker B would get considered, maybe given some, but not as much as Broker C. 

However, I'm sure you have a different answer based on something you experienced.  Otherwise you wouldn't have been dumb enough to put the question out there. 

[quote=Soothsayer]

In your first post, you said that you get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  Since you had no profitability in 2003, can we now admit that was a false and misleading statement by the GPs prior to the offering. 

[/quote]

I like how you took part of my answer and twisted it to match your own opinion.  That was smooth. 

You missed the part where I said I just left the home office when the LP offering came out.  See, that's what I like about Jones.  They SHOULD have said, Spiff, thanks, but too bad.  But they DIDN'T.  Those evil GP's, always up to no good.   

Spiffy, you better wakeup.  You will never be a GP…you don’t have the arrogance to be part of the group.  Sorry, but I tried to let you down easy…what bond are you selling today?

I'm not sure I get where you are coming from (other than the Jones sucks that you so eloquently keep stating for us). No one has ever accused me of being arrogant.  Confident, self assured, good looking, yes. Arrogant. No.

No bonds today, too many other appointments.  However, the NVS that I've been selling for the past few days worked out really well today.  Thanks for asking though.   

I know that my answer to sooth didn't fit with the opinion you have of Jones GPs.  Caused some kind of cognitive dissonance (you might need a dictionary for that one) in your head.  Just another attempt from the spin doctors on this board to share their contempt for Jones. 

I'm curious.  How long were you at Jones to develop this attitude?  6 months?  A year?  Were you successful while you were there?  I'm just trying to figure out where all the venom comes from.

[quote=Spaceman Spiff][quote=Soothsayer]

In your first post, you said that you get LP based on profitability and volunteerism.  Since you had no profitability in 2003, can we now admit that was a false and misleading statement by the GPs prior to the offering. 

Let's do a little hypothetical.  Let's say Broker A has no profit (in the red as far as P/L, not production), but has volunteered his/her ass off.  Mentored, trained, #77, organizing regional events, etc., etc.  Broker B (who took over Daddy's book) never volunteers, not even a lick, but has a decent profit.  Broker C starts from scratch,has all the volunteerism of A, and the production and profit of B.  All are in the same region.  Who gets the most LP?  Careful how you answer Spiff.  It might me a trick question.

[/quote]

My best guess is that Broker A would get passed over, simply because he doesn't have any profit.  In fact they would probably tell him to stop volunteering and working on making the office profitable.  Broker B would get considered, maybe given some, but not as much as Broker C. 

However, I'm sure you have a different answer based on something you experienced.  Otherwise you wouldn't have been dumb enough to put the question out there. 

[/quote]

Since you took the bait, I'll give you the answer.  Brokers A, B, and C were all offered LP.  Brokers' A and B amounts were identical.  However, Broker C was offered substantially less than Broker A or B.  Why?  Who knows why.  But, I can tell you that I was Broker C.  And, when no one could give an honest, truthful, logicial, marginally objective reason for that outcome, I left.

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]  

I know that my answer to sooth didn't fit with the opinion you have of Jones GPs. 

[/quote]

I know that you're confident, self-assured, and good-looking.  But, trust me, I'm even more confident, more self-assured, and no doubt much better looking.  For those reasons, please remebmer to capitalize "Sooth" in all of your future posts.  Appreciate it much!

Sooth- I have to say that I am without a doubt less confident, with no self assurance and look horrible in a suit… But I wear nice shoes…

I’ll smash you on the shoes, too.  I admit to a rather severe shoe fetish.  My collection would dwarf most womens’.  I ain’t braggin, just sayin’…

Ok Sooth- I wear Allen Edmonds almost exclusively now, what say you?

Not bad, noggin.  But, trust me.  You don’t want to compete here.  Some guys have obscene golf clubs, maybe an obscene boat, or a 911 in the garage.  Some guys’ wives have big bling and fantastic fake racks.  And then there is the guy with a cabin in the mountains or a handful of snow machines, wave runners, or dirt bikes in the third bay.  But with me, it’s all about the shoes.  I like blue and grey suits, but I wear them with some serious pimp-ass shoes.  And if there were 23 working days in a month, I might not wear the same pair twice.  Again, not braggin’.  Just sayin…

Ok,ok I give. Peace my friend…

A little story for you.  I got invited to a client's Christmas party this last year.  It was getting late, and everyone had had a few pops, and my client asked if I would like to see his wine cellar.  I was like, "Sure."  (Just being polite.)  He takes me and my wife down to his basement, opens this really heavy door, and our jaws hit the floor.  It wasn't just that the cellar was freakin' huge and well oraganized.  It was all of the building materials, thoughtfulness, and detail that had gone into the constuction and plannning of the cellar.  It was unbelievable.  

On the way home, I was commenting to my wife how blown away that I was, but also how I was surprised to know that he had such a passion, and had never mentioned it to me.  I told my wife, "I need a passion like that."  She says, "Sooth, he would be every bit as blown away by your shoe collection as you were by his wine collection."  I said, "OK, you're probably right." 

[quote=noggin]Ok Sooth- I wear Allen Edmonds almost exclusively now, what say you?[/quote]



JM Weston or Death.



More seriously, AE’s are nice shoes. Especially the black cordovan. Horsehide is tough leather which makes for very nice shoes.



Personally I like to wear my Wolverine Oxford’s unless I have client
meetings in which case I pull out the nice shoes. I used to wear
Johnston Murphy, but they have outsourced the low end to china, which
is just a sign that the rest of the brand will be going downhill



I hate polishing my shoes though, it takes good effort to have it done
right and preserve the finish of the leather without overshining it.



Also, the stocks of the various shoemakes: GCO, WWW, BWS etc are historically good investments since people need shoes.

Two words: Short sighted

    Why worry about 5k LP here or 10k LP there?  It's pocket change.  Worry about the 75k you get 10 or 15 years in the business.  An inherited 20 or 40 million book, who cares?  Those that start from scratch and LEARN how to gather assets will ALWAYS pass someone that starts at the same time and inherits assets.  If you are worried about the awards someone is getting because they inherited assets, call them out on it.  Grow some balls if it bothers you. 

    It's miopic to think that what happens now or in the near future really matters much.  This is a career, not a short-term job. 

Holy crap - 15 yrs in I might have $75k in LP what a great deal!  I am staying put, thanks you changed my mind!

What a load of crap - "short sighted" and "grow some balls" gotta love those recommendations from somebody who has drank so much koolaid they are beginning to look like "Hey Kool-aid" - Great insight there buddy!

Hey…f u…the koolaid has a minty taste and it allows me to stay regular!!!  I loved that crap!!!  I called the new guy in my old office and asked him why he wasn’t out DKing?  He said he was to busy calling on a great bond they have…5.4% BofA…YAHOOOOO.  HE said he sold 5k worth…A GP IN THE ROOM PLEASE!!!

csmelnix,

    75k of LP every 2 or 3 years.  That's what I was talking about.  Now that your moronism has become apparent, please enlighten us even more.

Will do - it takes 15 yrs for you to get that offer, that you pay for and cover the cost from all your earlier offers.  Yea, great deal again!  Take off the blinders stupid, I crossed the street and instantly increased my networth, had a true 1.5-2x value on my business w/o any strings attached, GPs to stroke, unpaid volunteer work to do, kool aid to drink etc… You are right, I guess I am a moron.

 Rank- you are a green-eyed pigeon. I was with edj 12 years top producer 7 of the 12. Started from scratch, the first 8 years I DID  EVERYTHING ASK OF ME, GROWTH LEADER,NEW IR LEADER,ran monthly cold call sessions etc etc. Left with 69k of lp that I paid for -with a promise of 60 more. Big deal!!! Its who you know-keep spreading the bs you must me a gp or a gp wanna be.

Free,

Thanks for the input...LP is a JOKE. Rank, can you be honest with the forum about your LP holdings?

FREE,

    Top producer for 7 years and had only 69k LP?  Your story doesn't add up.  Last offering I got 55k and I'm only at 570k production.  20% annual rate of return a joke?  haven't heard that one before.  BS?  Tell me where my numbers are off?

csmelnix,  What about your first statement?  15 years to get 75k LP?  Sounds like your production was such that you HAD to go across the street.  Let me take a guess.....No assistant, IKEA desk, first sale was an EIA, happy with 10% ticket charges, pay all 12.6% Social Security tax, haggled so you can afford your $500/month office rent, named your office "csmelnix wealth management, inc.", pay your own insurance, have your Banker's Life annuity support line on speed dial, and just bought a 1988 Lexus fully loaded.

And still have more net income, more freedom, control my exit strategy, more money into my retirement, more options to suit the needs of my clients, better technology to run more efficiently, better reporting and planning capabilities for my clients, and the clients do business with me not Jones....again, I guess I am a moron. 

I detailed my numbers in other posts while at Jones and while I been here with LPL - Try again....and let's all be honest rank; are you really producing or just a minion of Weddle in St. Louis?

Open up your eyes - I have yet to meet a former Jones rep that has joined LPL or anyother indy firm who has ever looked back.  Each time I come across one, we all say the same thing, "I WISH I WOULD HAVE DONE THIS SOONER!"  

You are such a TOOL!

Rank-

I left 6 months ago and have had two BME's in the last 3 months. After all expenses I have money left over to buy anything I want, including fabulous trips (which I do admit I miss) or pay down debt that I incurred at Jones over the previous 10  years. I also contribute 45K into a retirement plan (far more than being an employee) I have the time and the freedom to bring ALL products into the planning equation. I have never and will never sell an EIA. Others might but I find them too hard to describe to a retiree. I would much rather offer what I did at Jones and add key investments (which were never offered at Jones)to suit each client. 

I now sell C shares to clients under 100K. I now offer a total fee based platform. I still do transactions and probably never will stop, but I know  I don't want 1500 accounts. I'll bet your approaching that madness with nearly 600K gross (I admire that number and should hit it next year). I brought my assistant with me. I pay my own social security taxes. I have a payroll service. Yeah, it takes some time to set up but now its automatic.

While I appreciate the ownership concept (LP), I always felt that the income ownership but no true equity epitomized the double standards at Jones. We'll give you a great income investment that you don't have to pay totally for upfront (oh yeah and we'll make more money because we charge you interest). It reminded me of buying on leverage. Something I try to avoid for clients and Jones GP's were pushing it. Once again the doublespeak smells.

And it troubled me that they felt it was appropriate to borrow to buy their bond (because that's what it is). So rank, while I can appreciate your half hearted remarks about Lexus and our transitions, remember this if nothing else.

THERE IS A BETTER LIFE OUTSIDE OF JONES.

My wife tells me she has never seen me happier in the 20 years we have been married. And to me, that is a major difference because I did not get anything from Jones that I didn't earn. Most at Jones can not say that. The majority of the truly successful IR's were handed great opportunities.

Rank,

You will eventually see the light.  Even Bill Fakkland (sp?) left the cult and he was one of the biggest Jones backers on this board.

I'd forgot about our old friend Bill...I'm looking forward to the day he comes back and tells us how his transition went...

for those who didn't see the shot heard 'round the world...

Here is a good one for you RANKSTER…Old client came in to transfer his 40k account.  He then asked if I worked with Vanguard funds.  I said yes I do…he threw another statement which had 400k+ in it.  Can we transfer this?  I asked why we hadn’t discussed this in the past.  I didn’t want you to SELL me out of these, so I never brought it up.  I have railed and railed on this fun site about JONES is nothing but a sales organization, who happens to sell securities.  Hell it could take its model and sell vacuum cleaners.  The individuals who have money know this.  They may throw you a little because you hound the hell out of them on bond after bond…but their serious money is elsewhere.  Good luck and Good selling!

[quote=bspears]Here is a good one for you RANKSTER...Old client came in to transfer his 40k account.  He then asked if I worked with Vanguard funds.  I said yes I do...he threw another statement which had 400k+ in it.  Can we transfer this?  I asked why we hadn't discussed this in the past.  I didn't want you to SELL me out of these, so I never brought it up.  I have railed and railed on this fun site about JONES is nothing but a sales organization, who happens to sell securities.  Hell it could take its model and sell vacuum cleaners.  The individuals who have money know this.  They may throw you a little because you hound the hell out of them on bond after bond...but their serious money is elsewhere.  Good luck and Good selling![/quote]

You're going to blame Jones on this guy hiding money from you?  I think this example is perfect for the arguement that it doesn't matter what company you work for.  A good broker is a good broker.  It wasn't his job to bring it up.  It was your job to ask about it.  Didn't it confuse you when the guy said I've got $40k for you to invest for me, but my net worth is $500K?  In my office the follow up to that is where's the other $460K?  Past Seg 1 and 2 Jones really focuses on planning, not selling.  Noobs have to sell everywhere. 

I was in Segment 3, and NO its still about selling not planning.  My mentor, who was Segment 4, even after 7 years was making product calls daily.  Sounds like sales to me not planning.  Yes I did the Know your client spiel, and asked networth…blah blah blah. However his original comments did not include the Vanguard acct, dumbass. Did you ever think that the client might not tell you everything, especially if he is afraid your going to hard sell him. What I’m pointing to is I was perceived as a sales guy, mainly because of the training to push product. I hated it but to excel in the Jones culture, you always need money moving. If it isn’t coming in, its about the great repositioning of assets.  You know Spiffy, you play that game.  Hey, you know that stock we bought last year, I think its time to move out of it and into this one.  That Hartford Growth and Income we purchased 3 years ago, well I believe its run its course and this Washington Mutual fund has the potential to be the next runner. Why don’t we move this money?  Of course you’ve snowballed the client into thinking well, they preach they always do whats right for the client and not his wallet…so sure go ahead. Great, we’ll get that done today…(good the selling month is just about over).  SELLING MONTH…there you go.

My favorite sales tool…moving cd money into Capital Income Builder.  I was the best!!  I even sold a 96 year old on the fund.  Like I said, I went to segment 3 the first year.  But then,the children found out about the cd’s going to a mutual fund. The scam was over…but heck, I made the money, the GPS were happy.  It was there fault for not understanding what a great fund CIB is, and how, because I work for the BEST firm in the world, the cd was the worst thing a 96 year old widow could own-- cause we know whats right!!!  Another great month I had—retiree had 5000 shares of a particular oil stock…it was early 2004. The stock was trading at 36…EDJ didn’t cover it.  I told the client, we didn’t cover it and we should find something EDJ could keep an eye on.  He agreed(pat myself on the back).  Sold out, put into mutual funds from the preferreds.  Long story short, he’s done okay in funds, but that oil stock…well lets just say it’s up 2.5x’s.  But, it was what got me to segment 3 man…that’s what it was all about…segment 3.  GOOD LUCK and GOOD SELLING!

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]You’re going to blame Jones on this guy hiding
money from you?  I think this example is perfect for the arguement
that it doesn’t matter what company you work for.  A good broker
is a good broker.  It wasn’t his job to bring it up.  It was
your job to ask about it.[/quote]



Spiff, this may not apply to you, but alot of clients are afraid of salepeople, since they fear they may get suckered into somthing.



If you bring 400K of VG funds, you’re typical EDJ’er will try to put
you into GFA A-Shares. Clients sense that, and so they arent fully open
with you.

Jones is 100% sales. The most common use of the financial assesment tools is to convince people to buy more cwgix and caibx. Of course people hide what they have, because revealing assets to a Joneser is like telling a Hummer salesman that you have $100,000 you just don't know what to do with.

Here’s another thing I forgot to ask, as I have been reading this forum for a while but have never posted: I am fed up with pointless, pi$$ant fees. $40 for an IRA. $3 for low money market balance. Do indy firms have these little fees that just exist to irritate clients?

Kills me how you guys act like you bring the client in and Jones sells
them the inappropriate investment.  YOU make the recommendation
and verify the buy order!  I doubt the client asked Edward Jones
(and not you personally) which way they should go.  End of the day
it is your ethics being compromised, no matter how much you like to
shift blame.

I don't know who you're responding to, ironhorse, but I sell everything, not just what Jones tells me to. That said, I am commenting on what I see Jones guys do on a regular basis with no remorse. Most of them, it seems, don't even blame the firm, but have truly convinced themselves that 400M into A share AGTHX is "doing what's right for the client."

I'm also generalizing, as there are many good Jones brokers out there who do do what's right for the client.

Farotech and others-- The only person that I control is myself. I strive to be the best that I can on a daily basis for my clients. There are people at all firms that I would not care to be stuck in a room with but complaining about the way they run their businesses is an exercise in futility.

"There is nothing as foolish as worrying about things out of your control"

farotech-I was not addressing anyone specifically, just the general
consensus around here that Jones forces reps to do inappropriate
things, when they themselves make the recommendation(s).  Jones
has never “made” me sell anything I didn’t think fit the clients best
interests.  Does it happen, sure, but again, it is the advisor
doing the advising.

[quote=footsoldier]

Rank-

I left 6 months ago and have had two BME's in the last 3 months. After all expenses I have money left over to buy anything I want, including fabulous trips (which I do admit I miss) or pay down debt that I incurred at Jones over the previous 10  years. I also contribute 45K into a retirement plan (far more than being an employee) I have the time and the freedom to bring ALL products into the planning equation. I have never and will never sell an EIA. Others might but I find them too hard to describe to a retiree. I would much rather offer what I did at Jones and add key investments (which were never offered at Jones)to suit each client. 

I now sell C shares to clients under 100K. I now offer a total fee based platform. I still do transactions and probably never will stop, but I know  I don't want 1500 accounts. I'll bet your approaching that madness with nearly 600K gross (I admire that number and should hit it next year). I brought my assistant with me. I pay my own social security taxes. I have a payroll service. Yeah, it takes some time to set up but now its automatic.

While I appreciate the ownership concept (LP), I always felt that the income ownership but no true equity epitomized the double standards at Jones. We'll give you a great income investment that you don't have to pay totally for upfront (oh yeah and we'll make more money because we charge you interest). It reminded me of buying on leverage. Something I try to avoid for clients and Jones GP's were pushing it. Once again the doublespeak smells.

And it troubled me that they felt it was appropriate to borrow to buy their bond (because that's what it is). So rank, while I can appreciate your half hearted remarks about Lexus and our transitions, remember this if nothing else.

THERE IS A BETTER LIFE OUTSIDE OF JONES.

My wife tells me she has never seen me happier in the 20 years we have been married. And to me, that is a major difference because I did not get anything from Jones that I didn't earn. Most at Jones can not say that. The majority of the truly successful IR's were handed great opportunities.

[quote=EdJehovah][quote=footsoldier]

Rank-

I left 6 months ago and have had two BME's in the last 3 months. After all expenses I have money left over to buy anything I want, including fabulous trips (which I do admit I miss) or pay down debt that I incurred at Jones over the previous 10  years. I also contribute 45K into a retirement plan (far more than being an employee) I have the time and the freedom to bring ALL products into the planning equation. I have never and will never sell an EIA. Others might but I find them too hard to describe to a retiree. I would much rather offer what I did at Jones and add key investments (which were never offered at Jones)to suit each client. 

I now sell C shares to clients under 100K. I now offer a total fee based platform. I still do transactions and probably never will stop, but I know  I don't want 1500 accounts. I'll bet your approaching that madness with nearly 600K gross (I admire that number and should hit it next year). I brought my assistant with me. I pay my own social security taxes. I have a payroll service. Yeah, it takes some time to set up but now its automatic.

While I appreciate the ownership concept (LP), I always felt that the income ownership but no true equity epitomized the double standards at Jones. We'll give you a great income investment that you don't have to pay totally for upfront (oh yeah and we'll make more money because we charge you interest). It reminded me of buying on leverage. Something I try to avoid for clients and Jones GP's were pushing it. Once again the doublespeak smells.

And it troubled me that they felt it was appropriate to borrow to buy their bond (because that's what it is). So rank, while I can appreciate your half hearted remarks about Lexus and our transitions, remember this if nothing else.

THERE IS A BETTER LIFE OUTSIDE OF JONES.

My wife tells me she has never seen me happier in the 20 years we have been married. And to me, that is a major difference because I did not get anything from Jones that I didn't earn. Most at Jones can not say that. The majority of the truly successful IR's were handed great opportunities.

[/quote] [/quote]

Amen, I'm starting to see just what you have written: "The majority of the truly successful IR's were handed great opportunities."

Thank you for your words. 

My feet hurt,

ED

[quote=noggin]

The only person that I control is myself. I strive to be the best that I can on a daily basis for my clients. 

"There is nothing as foolish as worrying about things out of your control"

Where did Rank go?  He seems to run like Big Pay Day use to before he changed screen names…hmmmmmmmm?

[quote=joedabrkr] [quote=noggin]

The only person that I control is myself. I strive to be the best that I can on a daily basis for my clients. 

"There is nothing as foolish as worrying about things out of your control"

[/quote]

That is IT in a nutshell.  Keep that your focus and you will continue to be successful!

Thanks for the reminder!
[/quote]

You're welcome Joe.

Bspears,

    Let me get this strait.  You were barely Segment 3 when you left Jones, and you are telling me how to run my business? 

EDJahovah,

    You just started with Jones and you are complaining how you weren't handed any assets and that Jones sucks because you can't build a business yourself.

I hope this forum realizes these two are rookie failures.  Why aren't they out prospecting instead of posting, I don't know.  I sure have been enlighted by their in-depth knowledge.

Rank, funny your name was a great selling tool.  I used to pull up rank,stocks on the old dos system, find hold, sell or not covered stocks in my book and make a sales call on them. It was awesome.  Made my month several times.  Prospecting, hell with all the transfers from my old office, I don’t have the time.  This will pass, and I will be hitting it hard. 1 goal, run the pyramid schemed EDJ office out of town!!!

[quote=farotech]Here’s another thing I forgot to ask, as I have been reading this forum for a while but have never posted: I am fed up with pointless, pi$$ant fees. $40 for an IRA. $3 for low money market balance. Do indy firms have these little fees that just exist to irritate clients?[/quote]

Pretty much every firm has IRA fees in that neighborhood or higher.  At least when you’re indy you can more easily afford to waive them because of the higher payout.

Most firms also have inactive account fees.  They are worse at some firms than others.

I have NEVER heard of a fee for a “low money market balance”.

EDJ’s has the dreaded 3$ low money market fee.  I’m sure this little suggestion got someone an “atta boy” from the white boy GP structure

I have NEVER heard of a fee for a "low money market balance

We have one ($2) only if you have a checking account option on the mmkts brokerage account and the balance falls below $5000.  No minimums or fees if you don't have the checking account.  Most of my clients who have the checking never fall below the minimum and if they did...big deal... the interest rate on the account is 4.5% or higher.  They are pulling money out of the bank MMKTs right and left for this.

Joe,

You've got to be kidding!!  If you want a mmkt account in the Jones brokerage account you have to keep a minimum of $2500 in it or they will charge you $3.00 to keep it.  This goes directly to the GPs bottom line and your office profitability.  I agree it's not well advertised but it is there.

[quote=FreeFromJones]

Joe,

You've got to be kidding!!  If you want a mmkt account in the Jones brokerage account you have to keep a minimum of $2500 in it or they will charge you $3.00 to keep it.  This goes directly to the GPs bottom line and your office profitability.  I agree it's not well advertised but it is there.

[quote=AllREIT] [quote=FreeFromJones]

Joe,

You've got to be kidding!!  If you want a mmkt account in the Jones brokerage account you have to keep a minimum of $2500 in it or they will charge you $3.00 to keep it.  This goes directly to the GPs bottom line and your office profitability.  I agree it's not well advertised but it is there.

[/quote]

That is among the more retarded things about EDJ. This sort of nickel and diming will cost you clients in the long run.
[/quote]

First, I agree.  Second, I think all firms have some version of this, where someone who hasn't seen a client in 10 years gets a bright idea on how to squeeze out a few bucks of extra revenue at the expense of pissing off some of the clients.

Third, stupid fees like this led to me having a relatively large account at EDJ.  I had a client with maybe $50,000, and he was hit with a couple of stupid fees, I don't even remember what they were exactly, but it was under $50.  When he figured it out, he was hot.  He came in with his wife, I believe to close out the account, but he wanted the satisfaction of chewing me out face to face in front of his wife before he moved his money.  I agreed with him on the fees, and had already gotten his account reimbursed out of my commissions earlier that morning.  When he found out that I went out of pocket to fix it, his attitude changed completely. 

About a week later he came back in with stock certificates and moved about $300,000 to me, part as stock we left alone, but the majority as stock we liquidated and bought A share mutual funds with.  AND, when we were done, he insisted on taking my BOA and I out for lunch as his treat (he was hellbent on getting me back my $50, never mind that I made a couple of thousand that morning on the trades we did).

I’ve never seen numbers on how much fee revenue Jones gets from the $3 fee on MMKT, but I can’t imagine it’s huge.  I don’t see it in my office.  I rarely have a client who has a MMKT fall below the minimum.  If they do I usually suggest they add more money at about 4.5% or let me send them a check for the balance.  I hate that fee. 

[quote=Spaceman Spiff]I’ve never seen numbers on how much fee revenue
Jones gets from the $3 fee on MMKT, but I can’t imagine it’s
huge.  I don’t see it in my office.  I rarely have a client
who has a MMKT fall below the minimum.  If they do I usually
suggest they add more money at about 4.5% or let me send them a check
for the balance.  I hate that fee.  [/quote]



Given that current MMA rates are 5.05%, EDJ should be paying me to have money on deposit at below market rates.



Why is Scottrade so sucessful? B/c they don’t have the endless stupid
fee’s that other discount brokers have.  Stupid stuff like account
minimums or  inactive account fee’s etc.



Yet another area where fee only is going to win. Clients see a single fee vs a storm of chickensh*t itemised fees.



 

Honestly, although I agree that extra fees are a nuisance, if you manage it

correctly, there are very few fees actually charged. I don’t have anyone

with the $3 fee (I manage it with the low-balance reports). Most firms

have an IRA fee (most wirehouses are higher than EJ), and we waive it if

you have more than $500K in Household assets with us - so about half

my clients don’t pay that fee. Some of the other fees are in liue of

commissions (i.e. stock dividend reinvestment). For $100/yr, you get 2

fee-free IRA’s, unlimited checking and unlimited dividend reinvestment.

That can save a lot of $$.



It’s not perfect, but it really stacks up very comparably to most other

firms.

[quote=FreeFromJones]

Joe,

You've got to be kidding!!  If you want a mmkt account in the Jones brokerage account you have to keep a minimum of $2500 in it or they will charge you $3.00 to keep it.  This goes directly to the GPs bottom line and your office profitability.  I agree it's not well advertised but it is there.

You'd think that gross commission from mutual funds would be enough to cover the home office's bottom line, but no, they need an additional $3 every time a money market goes below $2500. So what does that do for the guy who has a pile of money in investments and uses the money market as a holding pen occasionally? Nothing makes big clients madder than chicken$hit fees.

farotech-I am not arguing for/against the $3 fee, I hate it too, but in
your situation the guy would not be charged the fee if he used it as a
"holding pen" once in awhile.  his account would likely NOT be
coded as a money market but as a cash account, and the fee is not
charged to those accounts.

therefore, if you need to hold $2499 for a year while you wait for buying opportunities, you lose $36 to fees, or gain nothing and keep the money in cash.

CTAXX for anyone below $2500 in cash. Quitcherbitchin

 THE WORD IS ON THE STREET....THE WORD IS ON THE STREET!!!

 My Damn Feet Hurt

 ED JEHOVAH

therefore, if you need to hold $2499 for a year while you wait for
buying opportunities, you lose $36 to fees, or gain nothing and keep
the money in cash.



NO-a cash account receives the same interest rate that the money market
account does, and would not have the $3 fee.  the cash account
simply does not buy money market shares and is not eligible for
checkwriting or debit card transactions.  the 2 “classes” receive
the same interestrate.

[quote=theironhorse]therefore, if you need to hold $2499 for a year while you wait for buying opportunities, you lose $36 to fees, or gain nothing and keep the money in cash.

NO-a cash account receives the same interest rate that the money market account does, and would not have the $3 fee.  the cash account simply does not buy money market shares and is not eligible for checkwriting or debit card transactions.  the 2 "classes" receive the same interestrate.
[/quote]

Uh- NO.  Cash does not recieve the same interest.  (And it's not even close.)  Re-check your info.

[quote=farotech]

therefore, if you need to hold $2499 for a year while you wait for buying opportunities, you lose $36 to fees, or gain nothing and keep the money in cash.

gad12-sorry-I was speaking out of my rear, you are correct, the % in
the cash account is significantly lower than the money market.

ironhorse - what percent interest does the cash account pay?

maxstud - little fees make big clients mad

[quote=farotech]

maxstud - little fees make big clients mad

and the account would not have a $3/month fee after the first months interest was paid, because the balance would be over $2500 at that point. Pretty basic math.

farotech-under 1%, so yes, a HUGE difference.

[quote=rankstocks]

Bspears,

    Let me get this strait.  You were barely Segment 3 when you left Jones, and you are telling me how to run my business? 

EDJahovah,

    You just started with Jones and you are complaining how you weren't handed any assets and that Jones sucks because you can't build a business yourself.

I hope this forum realizes these two are rookie failures.  Why aren't they out prospecting instead of posting, I don't know.  I sure have been enlighted by their in-depth knowledge.

[/quote]   Let me tell you something else, while your mid-swallow sucking off Jones: I have built a business at Jones.  Whining?  I'll drop Jones like a bad habit, when I choose.  Complaining about not inheriting a large business?  You bet.  These guys inheriting $40,000,000 + offices are going to earn a hell of a lot more than me, they are going to be able to let their wives stay at home (which Jones loves to express is ideal when all the Veteran wives speak at Regional functions), they will find it easier to fund private schools for their children, and max out 401k and Roths, 529 plans, they will likely make LP and GP sooner, their sales numbers are likely higher, and yada, yada, on and on, and on, and on.......

  I just don't see why those account's aren't moved around by zip code.

 My damn feet hurt,

 ED

[/quote]

Of course that wasn't my point, my point is that your hypothetical client with $2499 in the money market account would pay $36 in fees over a year, while waiting for a good investment, is not true.

Big clients don't have $2499 in a money market account waiting for a good investment.

Good luck.
[/quote]

OK, so $2400. And does it matter? It's a pi$$ant fee regardless. Are you a Jones GP?

[quote=farotech]

OK, so $2400. And does it matter? It's a pi$$ant fee regardless. Are you a Jones GP?

obviously, maxstud, you are a brilliant s.o.b.

Maxdud,

  It's simple. The $3.00 fee is an embarrassment. I don't have to apologize to the big clients but I have to apologize to their kids, etc.

[quote=EdJehovah]

  Let me tell you something else, while your mid-swallow sucking off Jones:

[quote=DRAPALA]

Maxdud,

  It's simple. The $3.00 fee is an embarrassment. I don't have to apologize to the big clients but I have to apologize to their kids, etc.

[/quote]

Why don't you eat the fee?

[quote=DRAPALA]

Maxdud,

  It's simple. The $3.00 fee is an embarrassment. I don't have to apologize to the big clients but I have to apologize to their kids, etc.

[quote=Bobby Hull][quote=DRAPALA]

Maxdud,

  It's simple. The $3.00 fee is an embarrassment. I don't have to apologize to the big clients but I have to apologize to their kids, etc.

[/quote]

Why don't you eat the fee?

[/quote]

Good point.  If they are "good" clients what's 3 bucks.

bhull,

 Wow, gee, Thanks, I would have never thought of that. Your cool.

He can also spell.



It’s “you’re”, a contraction for “you are”.

Thanks Pilo,  your even cooler.

Thanks Pilo, your even cooler.

[quote=Philo Kvetch] [quote=DRAPALA] Thanks Pilo,  your even cooler.[/quote]

Eveybody already knows that![/quote]

Eveybody being the Americanization of the yiddish "OyVeyBuddy!"

As in: Oy vey, Buddy already knows that! wherein Buddy, being the universal male greeting and interpreted as "all men".

Hence.. "Oy Vey (whatever that means!) all men already know that to be true."

[quote=Whomitmayconcer]

[quote=Philo Kvetch] [quote=DRAPALA]

Thanks Pilo, your even cooler.[/quote] Eveybody already knows that![/

QUOTE]

Eveybody being the Americanization of the yiddish "OyVeyBuddy!"

As in: Oy vey, Buddy already knows that! wherein Buddy, being the

universal male greeting and interpreted as “all men”.

Hence… “Oy Vey (whatever that means!) all men already know that to be

true.”

Or, maybe, he's just a knucklehead that misspelled "everybody" while being pedantic about whose is what.

[quote=Whomitmayconcer]

Or, maybe, he’s just a knucklehead that misspelled “everybody” while

being pedantic about whose is what.

Big clients will, from time to time, fall below the required 2500 in the money market. As most of you know, the three dollar fee has not always been there, and in my opinion is an indication of the direction Edward Jones is going. The GPs are more focused on squeezing an extra few bucks out of clients, rather than avoiding the very things that brought people  to Edward Jones in the first place, such as petty fees.

[quote=farotech]

 The GPs are more focused on squeezing an extra few bucks out of clients, rather than avoiding the very things that brought people  to Edward Jones in the first place, such as petty fees.

[/quote]

Speaking of squeezing, I luckly got all my clients out before they started the "Don't let the door hit ya in the ash" fee. It must be a cash cow with the turnover. However it was Weddle stating, "....this will get us in line with other firms." He also said that they will refund if the client comes back. Whats that ratio?  That's really unfortinate, it was a good selling point for Jones.

A small one, I’m guessing. Did you go indy?

I did last September. It’s so enlightening. Going indy is like the American Dream. You own your business, you are helping familys, and making good money doing it. I love it!

What percent of clients moved, and what was the biggest objection you got from them? Thanks for the help.

90% of aum moved, (I only wanted 92% or so) only objection was "change" which is overcome with a little open discussion and honesty.

[quote=Broker24]Honestly, although I agree that extra fees are a nuisance, if you manage it
correctly, there are very few fees actually charged. I don't have anyone
with the $3 fee (I manage it with the low-balance reports). Most firms
have an IRA fee (most wirehouses are higher than EJ), and we waive it if
you have more than $500K in Household assets with us - so about half
my clients don't pay that fee. Some of the other fees are in liue of
commissions (i.e. stock dividend reinvestment). For $100/yr, you get 2
fee-free IRA's, unlimited checking and unlimited dividend reinvestment.
That can save a lot of $$.

It's not perfect, but it really stacks up very comparably to most other
firms. [/quote]

Sure, they are "fee-free," but you must still keep at least $1500 in at least one acct, because only one acct does not have the mmkt balance.  And as for, "half you client's with 500k?"  I bet.  Your probably one of those pretty little over paid "overhead" skamps up in St. Louis that is paid to post responses to this website.  Your posts are too canned. 

 My damn feet hurt,

 ED

[quote=farotech]

ironhorse - what percent interest does the cash account pay?

maxstud - little fees make big clients mad

[/quote]

 .25%

 My damn feet hurt,

 ED

Broker24...half of your clients have assets over 500,000? That's BS.

The average account size at Jones is less than 100k. You must be in the top 1% of producers if what you say is true.

Either you are a lying St. Louis troll, or you are telling the truth and you are the elite, and therefore your experiences and opinions are irrelevant to normal producers. Therefore, no one should listen to what you say.