What can one expect from cold calling? $$
I just got my tax and wage statement for my second calender year in this business. FYI I’m the least shiniest person in the group I started with. My education was mediocre at a mediocre college that was known for parties. I have no graduate degree. I’m short, fat, half crippled and losing my hair. One thing I do know is how to work hard AND make money in the market. I had ZERO connections and refused to recruit family members.
I worked harder and smarter than most which is the only way I can conclude why I'm smoking them all (that are left in my class) in production by 258% of the class average. The first year I cold called with over 35000 dials in total and did everything I could to get 40 new contacts a day. I believe if you do this you can't fail no matter how impossible it will feel at times. If I had to start over again I have 110% confidence I would be where I am now or even better. If I can pull this off YOU CAN $122,395.94 W2 income + $58,000 deferred comp bonus for production and another $10200 of deferred comp for growing my business more than 15% this year. AND the remaining $12,500 of $25,000 that is for business expenses. In 2010 I'll bring home at least 30% more.Those are some impressive numbers!
Do you have any support staff or assistant?I have an assistant that I share with two other brokers. I am the only one that gives bonuses so I get better help and she’s awesome. I pretty much dont do any paperwork. Sure did not start out that way. I was 100% on my own with a bunch of vultures waiting to split up my book.
[quote=Gaddock]I just got my tax and wage statement for my second calender year in this business. FYI I’m the least shiniest person in the group I started with. My education was mediocre at a mediocre college that was known for parties. I have no graduate degree. I’m short, fat, half crippled and losing my hair. One thing I do know is how to work hard AND make money in the market. I had ZERO connections and refused to recruit family members.
I worked harder and smarter than most which is the only way I can conclude why I'm smoking them all (that are left in my class) in production by 258% of the class average. The first year I cold called with over 35000 dials in total and did everything I could to get 40 new contacts a day. I believe if you do this you can't fail no matter how impossible it will feel at times. If I had to start over again I have 110% confidence I would be where I am now or even better. If I can pull this off YOU CAN $122,395.94 W2 income + $58,000 deferred comp bonus for production and another $10200 of deferred comp for growing my business more than 15% this year. AND the remaining $12,500 of $25,000 that is for business expenses. In 2010 I'll bring home at least 30% more.[/quote] what was you career background before this? Congrats on the $$Looks like you average 145 calls a day if I take 35k and divide by 12 months and 20 days in a month. On another thread you posted:
Daily Activity Gaddock Dials 364 Contacts 15 Qualified Leads / Prospects Contacts per Prospect 9Looks like some variability in calls is that right?
Also, do not remember reading anywhere do you have a "brand name" behind you or is is "jellystone investments"? Just trying to figure out the other obstacles you might have had to overcome. Clearly dialing is a non issue for you.
Thank you. I was prop trading stat risk arbitrage at bright and before that insurance sales. I was a partner of an insurance agency that did group health insurance primarily that was sold when the market became pretty much a duopoly. Some guys bought it for a ridiculous amount of money that allowed me to concentrate on trading.
Thanks for sharing your story and your numbers Gaddock. I read everything you post and always come away confident and inspired. Thanks for sharing your great attitude and continued success with everyone on here! Hope you have an incredible 2010!!
[quote=Roxie]
Looks like you average 145 calls a day if I take 35k and divide by 12 months and 20 days in a month. On another thread you posted:
Daily Activity Gaddock Dials 364 Contacts 15 Qualified Leads / Prospects Contacts per Prospect 9Looks like some variability in calls is that right?
Also, do not remember reading anywhere do you have a "brand name" behind you or is is "jellystone investments"? Just trying to figure out the other obstacles you might have had to overcome. Clearly dialing is a non issue for you.
[/quote] The calling was not linear as time went by and I was building my book there was less and less time for cold calling. Those stats are right on the money as I took pretty good records. I started with AGE and rode the horse through the entire sordid affair so you can easily conclude who I'm with now. At first I was calling at the tail end of a bull market. Nobody was even opening their statement as every time they did they had more money than before. The February when the first real cracks in the foundation began to show the prospecting was MUCH MUCH easier. By the time the market was crashing I was shorting the market. I had two very wealthy clients that brought me other wealthy people and we made a lot of money while their other brokers were like deer in the headlights. If there was anything that was key in my success it was being very proactive when the market tanked.[quote=Gaddock][quote=Roxie]
Looks like you average 145 calls a day if I take 35k and divide by 12 months and 20 days in a month. On another thread you posted:
Daily Activity Gaddock Dials 364 Contacts 15 Qualified Leads / Prospects Contacts per Prospect 9Looks like some variability in calls is that right?
Also, do not remember reading anywhere do you have a "brand name" behind you or is is "jellystone investments"? Just trying to figure out the other obstacles you might have had to overcome. Clearly dialing is a non issue for you.
[/quote] The calling was not linear as time went by and I was building my book there was less and less time for cold calling. Those stats are right on the money as I took pretty good records. I started with AGE and rode the horse through the entire sordid affair so you can easily conclude who I'm with now. At first I was calling at the tail end of a bull market. Nobody was even opening their statement as every time they did they had more money than before. The February when the first real cracks in the foundation began to show the prospecting was MUCH MUCH easier.[/quote] How many assets does it take to generate that revenue in your second year?Not as much as you would think. I do large amounts of trades. I dropped over 5000 tickets in 09. About two thirds were transactional and averaged out at about $97. Options tickets can be as high a 5% on some trades. I averaged a bit over 60% net with a beta of .57 so even with fees that some feel are high I have no complaints.
A response and the karma received from a post like that is worth a million dollars. I don't know about the great attitude these days here but I am proud. After getting this thing off the ground, the hardest thing I've ever done, I can see how one might become a bit arrogant. But again if I can do it ANYBODY can do it. THAT MEANS YOU!!!Thanks for sharing your story and your numbers Gaddock. I read everything you post and always come away confident and inspired. Thanks for sharing your great attitude and continued success with everyone on here! Hope you have an incredible 2010!!
I too am a follower and fan… Care to divulge any other information about your calling strategy?
Residential vs Business or both.. Script preferences(product vs planning) Times to call average day?[quote=Gaddock]I just got my tax and wage statement for my second calender year in this business. FYI I’m the least shiniest person in the group I started with. My education was mediocre at a mediocre college that was known for parties. I have no graduate degree. I’m short, fat, half crippled and losing my hair. One thing I do know is how to work hard AND make money in the market. I had ZERO connections and refused to recruit family members.
I worked harder and smarter than most which is the only way I can conclude why I'm smoking them all (that are left in my class) in production by 258% of the class average. The first year I cold called with over 35000 dials in total and did everything I could to get 40 new contacts a day. I believe if you do this you can't fail no matter how impossible it will feel at times. If I had to start over again I have 110% confidence I would be where I am now or even better. If I can pull this off YOU CAN $122,395.94 W2 income + $58,000 deferred comp bonus for production and another $10200 of deferred comp for growing my business more than 15% this year. AND the remaining $12,500 of $25,000 that is for business expenses. In 2010 I'll bring home at least 30% more.[/quote] I am guessing for $120K in W-2 income your production for the year had to be in the neighborhood of at least $300K.. am I correct?You should get a couple discretionary accounts opened (if approved) and start building a track record. Keep in mind what you will need for performance portability issues when you eventually leave your firm.
[quote=chief123]I too am a follower and fan… Care to divulge any other information about your calling strategy?
Residential vs Business or both.. Script preferences(product vs planning) Times to call average day?[/quote] +1Good numbers Gaddock.
I worked for Stuart James like 19 years ago myself, I thought I read a post of yours recently where you said you worked there? A little confusion as to the 2nd full year in the biz. Great work ethic, congrats! StokBeginner’s luck!!! Who are you kidding!
Seriously, nice job. Looking forward to reading about your continued success.[quote=Gaddock]I just got my tax and wage statement for my second calender year in this business. FYI I’m the least shiniest person in the group I started with. My education was mediocre at a mediocre college that was known for parties. I have no graduate degree. I’m short, fat, half crippled and losing my hair. One thing I do know is how to work hard AND make money in the market. I had ZERO connections and refused to recruit family members.
I worked harder and smarter than most which is the only way I can conclude why I'm smoking them all (that are left in my class) in production by 258% of the class average. The first year I cold called with over 35000 dials in total and did everything I could to get 40 new contacts a day. I believe if you do this you can't fail no matter how impossible it will feel at times. If I had to start over again I have 110% confidence I would be where I am now or even better. If I can pull this off YOU CAN $122,395.94 W2 income + $58,000 deferred comp bonus for production and another $10200 of deferred comp for growing my business more than 15% this year. AND the remaining $12,500 of $25,000 that is for business expenses. In 2010 I'll bring home at least 30% more.[/quote] You should reward yourself with some rogaine and a personal trainer Just kidding, I look forward to more success stories and use that as motivation; You're obviously killing it and making clients happy at the same time, they don't always go hand in handTalk about a hypocritcal thread! If i would have posted this, holy crap. sh*tstorm.
yeah well if you had then we would add in the IDIOT factor[/quote] Coming from a guy who talks and spells like he's 5.[quote=Ronnie Dobbs]Talk about a hypocritcal thread! If i would have posted this, holy crap. sh*tstorm.
I never thought I would say this, but I agree with you Wind. People need to zip up their pants and realize that he has accounts in which he has discretionary trading authority. He didn’t do 350k gross because he brought in 35mil in 1% wrap accounts in year one or two. Gaddock is obviously doing a great job and has found a niche that fits him perfectly. It needs to be pointed out that the way he is building his book and managing money is different from 99% of us. It isn’t financial planning, it is trading.
Holy crap, do I smell a truce Ron?I never thought I would say this, but I agree with you Wind.
I think thats my pants. I had chili for lunch. Luckily the weather is keeping people out of the branch today because it smells like an outhouse.
First off, thank you ALL for the positive comments. I've learned more than I can quantify by reading peoples thoughts and experiences on this BBS. Thank you all. Ron, not sure where the "People need to zip up their pants" comments comes from and I guess I don't want to know. Ron is correct. My business model is different from any I have seen. I feel planning is very secondary to making money. All my efforts have been in finding and executing high probability trades that diversify and hedge the account(s). My gig is to keep the account(s) "market neutral" Any direction the market goes will allow us to have a desired effect. Today I was selling puts and buying back calls. The constant hedging is why my overall beta is .57. I created software that searches the market for these high probability trades and a way to always monitor them to insure they remain 'in tolerance' I only take trades that have an 85% probability or better. That means nothing on any one trade but the larger the sample becomes the more validity the probabilities have. My sample is getting larger and larger by the day. Example. I found a trade that used a buy and sell on an option that resulted in a 18% credit on a February expiration. It has a 97% probability of success. That's the kind of edge I LOVE and create on a daily basis Beyond the cold calls I've received some huge referrals that are centers of influence the keep the snowball rolling down the hill. That's kind of it in a nutshell.I never thought I would say this, but I agree with you Wind. People need to zip up their pants and realize that he has accounts in which he has discretionary trading authority. He didn’t do 350k gross because he brought in 35mil in 1% wrap accounts in year one or two. Gaddock is obviously doing a great job and has found a niche that fits him perfectly. It needs to be pointed out that the way he is building his book and managing money is different from 99% of us. It isn’t financial planning, it is trading.
And I will add this… For you guys who have made it in this business and are pulling in 100k/200k plus with little or no effort you would be an idiot not to contact Gaddock and open an account. What he is doing beats any “alternative” forms of investing that seem to be sprouting up in all corners. I don’t know Gaddock at all outside of this forum and I benefit in no way from promoting his services. In fact, half of the time we are going after each other on this site. What I will say is I have significant floor trading experience and I understand the opportunites. There are very few ways, if any, in which the average investor can benefit from market volatility without murdering themselves. His use of options provides this opportunity. PM him, liquidate 10-15% of your sh*tty American Funds Portfolio, and send him a check.
I have significant floor trading experience …
How often do you take turns? Make sure you wear your knee pads.....:)...Sorry buddy...Had to...
Wow! Ron ... you OK? do you have a fever? he he. I know we have had our differences, pretty much nothing but differences. Not sure if you're serious or just have a very smooth way of sarcasm in mammoth proportions. Either way you slice it I do have to hand it to you. The only guy that truly understands the larger part of my strategy is a bank broker. Who would have ever thought that. Reality is truly stranger than fiction. PS I still have not traded one single position that my clients have. I'm still the emotional wreck I always wasAnd I will add this… For you guys who have made it in this business and are pulling in 100k/200k plus with little or no effort you would be an idiot not to contact Gaddock and open an account. What he is doing beats any “alternative” forms of investing that seem to be sprouting up in all corners. I don’t know Gaddock at all outside of this forum and I benefit in no way from promoting his services. In fact, half of the time we are going after each other on this site. What I will say is I have significant floor trading experience and I understand the opportunites. There are very few ways, if any, in which the average investor can benefit from market volatility without murdering themselves. His use of options provides this opportunity. PM him, liquidate 10-15% of your sh*tty American Funds Portfolio, and send him a check.
I am being dead serious. Our arguments in the past were always about trading for yourself vs trading for clients and I think we understand each other on that.
Damn ... coming from you that means a lot, thanks. As I said I can't do it for myself. I thought about just taking small positions but then decided I would be screwing my clients by introducing my emotional baggage and it's distortions of fact and reality into the formula. Next time I put money into any mutual funds I'll give you the business, for real. I've decided to invest in vintage machine guns in an NRA trust for my retirement. Believe it or not one can make huge profits if they know what they are doing and are on good terms with the local Sheriff.I am being dead serious. Our arguments in the past were always about trading for yourself vs trading for clients and I think we understand each other on that.
hey gaddock inbox is full…
PM me your email address and I’ll send you a list.
Gaddock,
What do you think the capacity is for your strategy (as in at what AUM limit would you not be able to do this effectively)?Its kind of hard to say but I want my book to eventually have 20 to 30 accounts with 3 million plus in them. I see this as a real possibility in the next 3 or 4 years. Since no position exceeds 3% of the account size even when using leverage I don’t see an economy of scale issue under 6 or 7 hundred million.
Truth is I can only speculate as in truth I have no idea.Gaddock
Did you open all these accounts with appointments or over the phone?
All in person or by mail after I met in person.
Interesting. Let me know when you are shopping for a CCO for your future RIA.
JANITOR If you ran a real business you'd not have time to post here all day. Look for stupid pictures. Be your witty gay self. Go back to cleaning tool box.[quote=Wet_Blanket] Interesting. Let me know when you are shopping for a CCO for your future RIA.[/quote]
GAY
What? It's not like I asked for nudes.[quote=Wet_Blanket] Interesting. Let me know when you are shopping for a CCO for your future RIA.[/quote]
GAY
inspiring. thanks gaddock and congrats. im curious about 2 things-- first, what firm are you with that your collecting commissions so quickly rather than being on a flat training salary for your first couple of years? and what made you leave the trading job you had prior to this?
It’s pretty bad when Mel backs me up.
[quote=Wet_Blanket] [quote=mlgone] [quote=Wet_Blanket] Interesting. Let me know when you are shopping for a CCO for your future RIA.[/quote] GAY
What? It’s not like I asked for nudes.[/quote]
just bustin chops…[/quote]
Go mop a floor piker
[quote=Wet_Blanket]Gaddock,
What do you think the capacity is for your strategy (as in at what AUM limit would you not be able to do this effectively)?[/quote] Very good question and probably the only potential pitfall.I’ve got to be honest: Someone who says they have a trading strategy that beats the market makes me suspicious. And, with your experience Gaddock, you should make yourself suspicious too; especially when we have Ron14 telling us to send you our money.
If you both weren’t senior members, I would certainly call fraud.
Markets are up ALOT in 2009. Any trading strategy (except a shorting strategy) made money last year. Anyone in options made a KILLING!!!
Update: Doesn’t help that Ron14 just answered a question to Gaddock; and in the manner I would expect Gaddock to answer. (same person?) This is starting to stink!
Larry, you are an idiot. Check the threads on this site over the last year and see the brawls Gaddock and I have gotten into over options trading and what not. Nobody values my opinion on this site anyway because I am a bank bitch so if we had some scheme lined up I would definitely have started a different screen name. Why don't you do this ? Report me to registeredrep or finra. They can do some computer and phone line investigation to unearth this conspiracy between us.
[quote=Ron 14] And I will add this… For you guys who have made it in this business and are pulling in 100k/200k plus with little or no effort you would be an idiot not to contact Gaddock and open an account. What he is doing beats any “alternative” forms of investing that seem to be sprouting up in all corners. I don’t know Gaddock at all outside of this forum and I benefit in no way from promoting his services. In fact, half of the time we are going after each other on this site. What I will say is I have significant floor trading experience and I understand the opportunites. There are very few ways, if any, in which the average investor can benefit from market volatility without murdering themselves. His use of options provides this opportunity. PM him, liquidate 10-15% of your sh*tty American Funds Portfolio, and send him a check.
This document shall not constitute an offer to sell or the solicitation of an offer to buy any securities, nor shall there be any sale of securities in any jurisdiction in which such offer, solicitation or sale would be unlawful prior to registration or qualification under the securities laws of any such jurisdiction. No offering of securities shall be made except by means of a prospectus meeting the requirements of the Securities Act of 1933, as amended.
This news release may include “forward-looking statements.” All statements, other than statements of historical facts, included in this press release that address activities, events or developments that the Partnership expects, believes or anticipates will or may occur in the future are forward-looking statements and speak only as of the date on which such statement is made. These statements are based on certain assumptions…
Contacts:
Gaddock @ RR
Ron14 @ The Bank
[/quote]
I’m absolutely not an idiot.
I don’t know you, so I can’t judge you.
Just telling everyone what my gut is telling me.
You answered a question posed to Gaddock.
[quote=Gaddock]I just got my tax and wage statement for my second calender year in this business. FYI I’m the least shiniest person in the group I started with. My education was mediocre at a mediocre college that was known for parties. I have no graduate degree. I’m short, fat, half crippled and losing my hair. One thing I do know is how to work hard AND make money in the market. I had ZERO connections and refused to recruit family members.
I worked harder and smarter than most which is the only way I can conclude why I'm smoking them all (that are left in my class) in production by 258% of the class average. The first year I cold called with over 35000 dials in total and did everything I could to get 40 new contacts a day. I believe if you do this you can't fail no matter how impossible it will feel at times. If I had to start over again I have 110% confidence I would be where I am now or even better. If I can pull this off YOU CAN $122,395.94 W2 income + $58,000 deferred comp bonus for production and another $10200 of deferred comp for growing my business more than 15% this year. AND the remaining $12,500 of $25,000 that is for business expenses. In 2010 I'll bring home at least 30% more.[/quote] 30K Salary, 500 401K match, verbal abuse from real brokers, oh yeah this kick @ss watch I bought after opening a 25 dollar 529! Who is your daddy now Biofreeze?oh yeah my car keys, how could I forget
[quote=Lawrence] [quote=Ron 14] And I will add this… For you guys who have made it in this business and are pulling in 100k/200k plus with little or no effort you would be an idiot not to contact Gaddock and open an account. What he is doing beats any “alternative” forms of investing that seem to be sprouting up in all corners. I don’t know Gaddock at all outside of this forum and I benefit in no way from promoting his services. In fact, half of the time we are going after each other on this site. What I will say is I have significant floor trading experience and I understand the opportunites. There are very few ways, if any, in which the average investor can benefit from market volatility without murdering themselves. His use of options provides this opportunity. PM him, liquidate 10-15% of your sh*tty American Funds Portfolio, and send him a check.
This document shall not constitute an offer to sell or the solicitation of an offer to buy any securities, nor shall there be any sale of securities in any jurisdiction in which such offer, solicitation or sale would be unlawful prior to registration or qualification under the securities laws of any such jurisdiction. No offering of securities shall be made except by means of a prospectus meeting the requirements of the Securities Act of 1933, as amended.
This news release may include “forward-looking statements.” All statements, other than statements of historical facts, included in this press release that address activities, events or developments that the Partnership expects, believes or anticipates will or may occur in the future are forward-looking statements and speak only as of the date on which such statement is made. These statements are based on certain assumptions…
Contacts:
Gaddock @ RR
Ron14 @ The Bank
[/quote]
I’m absolutely not an idiot.
I don’t know you, so I can’t judge you.
Just telling everyone what my gut is telling me.
You answered a question posed to Gaddock. [/quote]
Yes you are an idiot. A little Roogle would have made you notice that. Ron is a bona fide asset allocation enthusiast, as well as an EMH guy and believes mainly in planning.
Gaddock is a genius with numbers.
It makes you suspicious when someone says they beat the market. Well, I beat the market handily. As a matter of fact, last year I beat Gaddock’s numbers. Although my portfolios were considerably more risky. I’ve spoken with Gaddock over the phone. He’s the real deal.
Your gut is wrong this time Gibbs.
[quote=Lawrence] [quote=Ron 14] And I will add this… For you guys who have made it in this business and are pulling in 100k/200k plus with little or no effort you would be an idiot not to contact Gaddock and open an account. What he is doing beats any “alternative” forms of investing that seem to be sprouting up in all corners. I don’t know Gaddock at all outside of this forum and I benefit in no way from promoting his services. In fact, half of the time we are going after each other on this site. What I will say is I have significant floor trading experience and I understand the opportunites. There are very few ways, if any, in which the average investor can benefit from market volatility without murdering themselves. His use of options provides this opportunity. PM him, liquidate 10-15% of your sh*tty American Funds Portfolio, and send him a check.
This document shall not constitute an offer to sell or the solicitation of an offer to buy any securities, nor shall there be any sale of securities in any jurisdiction in which such offer, solicitation or sale would be unlawful prior to registration or qualification under the securities laws of any such jurisdiction. No offering of securities shall be made except by means of a prospectus meeting the requirements of the Securities Act of 1933, as amended.
This news release may include “forward-looking statements.” All statements, other than statements of historical facts, included in this press release that address activities, events or developments that the Partnership expects, believes or anticipates will or may occur in the future are forward-looking statements and speak only as of the date on which such statement is made. These statements are based on certain assumptions…
Contacts:
Gaddock @ RR
Ron14 @ The Bank
[/quote]
I’m absolutely not an idiot.
I don’t know you, so I can’t judge you.
Just telling everyone what my gut is telling me.
You answered a question posed to Gaddock. [/quote]
Gaddock, I can’t believe you made over 1600 posts under the screen name Ron14 just to answer your own question in this thread! That’s brilliant!
Since the cat is out of the bag, I am also BondGuy. See you guys, off to my 40 foot yacht!
[quote=iceco1d]
[quote=Lawrence]I’ve got to be honest: Someone who says they have a trading strategy that beats the market makes me suspicious. And, with your experience Gaddock, you should make yourself suspicious too; especially when we have Ron14 telling us to send you our money.
If you both weren’t senior members, I would certainly call fraud.
Markets are up ALOT in 2009. Any trading strategy (except a shorting strategy) made money last year. Anyone in options made a KILLING!!!
Update: Doesn’t help that Ron14 just answered a question to Gaddock; and in the manner I would expect Gaddock to answer. (same person?) This is starting to stink![/quote]Really? How did the people buying puts do? Anyone that’s been on this site for more than a week knows that Gaddock & Ron aren’t the same person.------Gaddock, You’ve only shared a few trades on here…as I recall, they been buy a call, short the stock, and write a put (oh, and hope for no special dividends). Anything else out there you’re doing consistently?[/quote]
See, there’s my defense - I’ve been here less than a week.
Just so nobody gets confused, I also post under the names of “Gaddock”, “Ron 14”, “iceco1d”, “putsy” and “Bobby Hull”.
Whatever dude, I’m “the Judge”, “meletoi”, “permabear” and “Spaceman Spiff”.
I’m Ronnie Dobbs.
You’re brutalizin’ me. I was in my home, my new home!
LOLI’m Ronnie Dobbs.
Looks like all the regulars have come out to mock me. I guess you all are right, I’m going to liquidate 10%-15% of my client’s portfolios and send the money to Gaddock because he had a good 2009.
Just tell me where to send the check?
BTW, if Ron14 used to work the trading floor, why is he at a bank now…I guess he thinks CDs are sexy?
It’s about to get ugly…
Like your momma?It’s about to get ugly…
I couldn't hand out suckers on the trading floor.Looks like all the regulars have come out to mock me. I guess you all are right, I’m going to liquidate 10%-15% of my client’s portfolios and send the money to Gaddock because he had a good 2009.
Just tell me where to send the check?
BTW, if Ron14 used to work the trading floor, why is he at a bank now…I guess he thinks CDs are sexy?
Like your momma?[/quote][quote=Moraen]It’s about to get ugly…
Library hasn't banned you yet, huh mel?
Larry my entire history is on this site just look at previous threads. I have even posted my month to month numbers in the 2+ years I was at Jones. Have at it and then you will be back ripping on me because I am a bank FA, blah blah blah.Looks like all the regulars have come out to mock me. I guess you all are right, I’m going to liquidate 10%-15% of my client’s portfolios and send the money to Gaddock because he had a good 2009.
Just tell me where to send the check?
BTW, if Ron14 used to work the trading floor, why is he at a bank now…I guess he thinks CDs are sexy?
Like your momma?[/quote] Hate to admit it but I am DD and Lawrence and ADMIN and staffwriter2[/quote] and a janitor[quote=DD][quote=Moraen]It’s about to get ugly…
Don't bother, you'll never make my minimum. People who automatically find others suspicious are usually the ones that are the shysters. If you told me you beat the market the first thing that would come to my mind is to congratulate you and see if you were willing to share ideas. If you cant beat the market, well ... that's pathetic. Buy the SPY and write a call on it, taadaaaaa you've beaten the market. Ron knows a lot more than people give him credit for. He has convictions and sticks to them come hell or high water. My ideas are very different. It doesn't make either right or wrong just different. There isn't any magic to what I do. It's a matter of finding trades that have an 85% probability or better in my favor. Any one trade means nothing BUT the larger the sample the more validity the probabilities have. That's why I dropped 5000+ tickets in 09.Looks like all the regulars have come out to mock me. I guess you all are right, I’m going to liquidate 10%-15% of my client’s portfolios and send the money to Gaddock because he had a good 2009.
Just tell me where to send the check?
BTW, if Ron14 used to work the trading floor, why is he at a bank now…I guess he thinks CDs are sexy?
So you know I use options heavily. and then you write ... "Anyone in options made a KILLING!!!" but you're suspicious because I said I beat the market? to the point of accusing people of fraud? I'll bet you have a hard time making decisions. That's sounds like something Hillary Clinton or Nancy Pelosi would say.I’ve got to be honest: Someone who says they have a trading strategy that beats the market makes me suspicious. And, with your experience Gaddock, you should make yourself suspicious too; especially when we have Ron14 telling us to send you our money.
If you both weren’t senior members, I would certainly call fraud.
Markets are up ALOT in 2009. Any trading strategy (except a shorting strategy) made money last year. Anyone in options made a KILLING!!!
Update: Doesn’t help that Ron14 just answered a question to Gaddock; and in the manner I would expect Gaddock to answer. (same person?) This is starting to stink!
[quote=chief123]I too am a follower and fan… Care to divulge any other information about your calling strategy?
Residential vs Business or both.. Script preferences(product vs planning) Times to call average day?[/quote] BUMPI started at AGE and still sit at the same desk. The training salary declines for two years. At AGE it was either the salary or commissions whichever was greater. Then Wachovia came along and it was commission on top. By the time it had dwindles to a small amount but was nice. My sixth month and beyond my gross was far more than the salary then Wachovia came into the picture there was a lot less but it was nice on top. Now that it's gone there are rookie bonuses that are making up for it. I quit prop trading when my wife got pregnant. It was an all encompassing addiction that was one mistake away from being fired. The stress was huge and I wanted to have a relationship with my family. I now have two kids. It was the best move I've ever made.inspiring. thanks gaddock and congrats. im curious about 2 things-- first, what firm are you with that your collecting commissions so quickly rather than being on a flat training salary for your first couple of years? and what made you leave the trading job you had prior to this?
[quote=shrek][quote=chief123]I too am a follower and fan… Care to divulge any other information about your calling strategy?
Residential vs Business or both.. Script preferences(product vs planning) Times to call average day?[/quote] BUMP[/quote] On day one in production I called from a list that I purchased for training that had 3000 retired people on it. During training I found four other people to split Sales Genie five ways on an annual contract each of us had one day a week to get lists together. The four I chose were those that I thought had the least chance of survival. Within four months I had it to myself. Making a short story long ... residential. I found the best were people that had just moved to the area. The script was the generic AGE schtick. Hello bla bla this is bla bla with bla bla here in bla bla. I was calling to see if you're an investor and if so are you open to new ideas from time to time. out of 365 14 would say yes in what I considered a meaningfully way. I sent them a thank you note with my card that day. A week later I sent them a bio about me. The next week a short sample of a financial plan then the next week I would call with a 'good idea' As far as time to call I started at 8am and if I got 40 contacts I called it a day. These days were few and far between. Otherwise I called until 8pm and went home. I've posted this 20 times but I'll do it one more. 365 dials = 14 contacts = one customer after nine contacts This is new to the summary. It takes about 8 customers to get one client. I haven't made any cold calls for quite some time. I'm getting large referrals and I'm slammed during market hours running my book. My greatest accomplishment was having the guys a Thomson produce some software to my specification. They have a group of programmers that will create anything you can concoct. Luckily it works great and gives me a huge edge.[quote=Lawrence]Looks like all the regulars have come out to mock me. I guess you all are right, I’m going to liquidate 10%-15% of my client’s portfolios and send the money to Gaddock because he had a good 2009. Just tell me where to send the check? BTW, if Ron14 used to work the trading floor, why is he at a bank now…I guess he thinks CDs are sexy?
Don’t bother, you’ll never make my minimum.
People who automatically find others suspicious are usually the ones that are the shysters. If you told me you beat the market the first thing that would come to my mind is to congratulate you and see if you were willing to share ideas. If you cant beat the market, well … that’s pathetic. Buy the SPY and write a call on it, taadaaaaa you’ve beaten the market. Ron knows a lot more than people give him credit for. He has convictions and sticks to them come hell or high water. My ideas are very different. It doesn’t make either right or wrong just different.
There isn’t any magic to what I do. It’s a matter of finding trades that have an 85% probability or better in my favor. Any one trade means nothing BUT the larger the sample the more validity the probabilities have. That’s why I dropped 5000+ tickets in 09.[/quote]
I’m in NY, I deal with 100 scams every minute. Maybe this is why I am jaded.
I disagree that covered calls “beat the market”. I believe the EMH is right, there’s additional risk that comes with that return.
When I say “beat the market”, I mean make a greater return without taking more risk.
People who took more risk had greater returns in 2009.
People who took more risk tended to lose in '08 & '07.
And why you bashing Hillary, she’s my former Senate-ress…
I give up…anyone know how I can resize an image in this forum?
u say u wanted to spend more time with family, but theres no way u were working 8-8 as a prop trader, so u must be spending less time w/family now as an FA than u did then as a trader.
I don't think he is working 8-8 anymore.. just originally to build his book... Small sacrafice for 2 years, to be able to do what you want for the next 30... I think that is what he meant, as a prop trader the hours would never change. I remember at Jones some lady told me something along the lines of "Work like nobody else for 4 years, so you can live like nobody else for the next 40."u say u wanted to spend more time with family, but theres no way u were working 8-8 as a prop trader, so u must be spending less time w/family now as an FA than u did then as a trader.
It was more like 7am to 12 am. I didn't even use the bathroom during market hours. I worked all day Saturday and Sunday all I thought about was the open on Monday morning. The first year with this gig I did work until 8pm These days I'm in a 8am (the first one there believe it or not) and out of there by 4:30 - 6pm. I leave my work at the office. I love my job, I love my family, I have a perfect balance between the two.u say u wanted to spend more time with family, but theres no way u were working 8-8 as a prop trader, so u must be spending less time w/family now as an FA than u did then as a trader.
[quote=Lawrence]I’m in NY, I deal with 100 scams every minute. Maybe this is why I am jaded.
[/quote]
Less than 1 hour after I posted this, I just faced another scam:
I’m in a starbucks in SOHO. A guy comes in and says, "Is that anyone’s bike outside - It’s about to get stolen!"
The bike is locked to a street sign outside. There’s a guy with a hacksaw is cutting away at the bolts that hold the sign. The guy inside says, he will cut the bolts and lift the bike off the post and ride away.
There’s about 60-80 people in this starbucks. Nobody does anything. About 3 minutes later the guy finishes cutting - The bolts he cut weren’t holding down the sign; but rather, holding an illegal placard that was attached to the street sign. He puts the placard in his backpack and walks away.
Here’s the scam, there was a 3rd or 4th person in the store. If I got up to look out the window, the guy inside would talk to me and distract me while guy #3 & #4 took my stuff (laptop, wallet, jacket, etc.) I see this sh*t every day - I love this city!
Starbuck scam in NYC?..how about Goldman Sachs. They just hacksawed the American public for billions.
Pretty elaborate! Nice thing about where I live is half of the population is packing. It tends to make people polite and like scams very few and far between.
just to clarify gaddock… when you say “it was more like 7am-12am… all day saturday and sunday” are you talking about your time as a prop trader or the begining of your career as an FA? also, out of curiosity, what did you trade and where? and how much were u taking home as a trader?
[quote=Gaddock]Pretty elaborate! Nice thing about where I live is half of the population is packing. It tends to make people polite and like scams very few and far between.[/quote]
G, what is the population of the area you live in?
[quote=twoeyeguy]just to clarify gaddock… when you say “it was more like 7am-12am… all day saturday and sunday” are you talking about your time as a prop trader or the begining of your career as an FA?
Prop Trader, it was all consuming. also, out of curiosity, what did you trade Statistical Risk Arbitrage and where? Bright / Pairco and how much were u taking home as a trader?[/quote] Not enough for the effort but the learning experience was priceless.What percentage of your book is comission based?
Do you do any fee based business? What is your average account size? Congrats on making it and your positive attitude. . . . .loved your personal description too.See the reply to you PM
The area I live in the county has just over $300k. A lot of $$ from up north comes here. Some consider it quite the tourist spot. We have very nice beaches etc. But strangely enough many of my largest clients are in NYC. That I find bizarre. It should be people from here having a broker in NYC not people in NYC having a broker here. The world is now a small place.[quote=Gaddock]Pretty elaborate! Nice thing about where I live is half of the population is packing. It tends to make people polite and like scams very few and far between.[/quote]
G, what is the population of the area you live in?
Great post Gaddock!
[quote=Northfield]2 clients per month, assuming a 40% close ratio =
5 new prospect meetings per month. Assuming 20% of cold called prospects agree to a meeting, then 25 new prospects in the pipeline every month. Assuming 10% of folks you have a phone conversation with qualify themselves and agree to receive some info then you need to have 250 new phone conversations with prospects every month. And assuming you are able to have an intelligible conversation on 10% of your dials then you need to dial 2500 times per month or 125 per day. Of course, if your average client is $100k, this only yields you $2.4 million per year, so if you wanted $5 mill per year you would need to double this math. This math has remained one of the few constants in our ever-changing business. Try it, you'll see what I mean.[/quote] I think this person has posted this before, but one of the best posts ever... The dials/day seems light for someone just starting out with nothing to do, but overall seems very good. I also like the idea of 40 contacts/day(though under these numbers, your dials would need to be in the 400 dial range).Today is the last day of year three. It seems like a decade. I missed my goal but did a bit over $370k T12. I'm OK with it I guess. I've received well over $100k in bonus money / deferred comp. as well as $25k in cash for expenses. I was promoted to an Associate Vice President / Investment Officer (Big Fing Deal).
Every bit of business I have, not including Mom, is from cold calling. It's the only way you can do it IMHO other than door knocking which isn't my gig at all. I have some very HNW clients and want 20 with 5 million+ as my career goal. I'll be there in 5 years.
Moral of the story. GET ON THE PHONE AND DIAL DIAL DIAL!!!
Gaddock, do you still do any calling? Is calling easier at the end of year 3 than it was at the beginning? Great story and I really enjoy reading your posts!
Just a recap Gaddock... who are you calling? I remember reading "residential" but I would assume that all of the people with $5M+ are on the DNC... Did you also do business? Did you just dial all day?
Gaddock , I've been in this buisness for years , trading destroyed my career. Now , I need to build a customer base again . What do you pitch? stocks ? I do stocks and options , how much do you charge ? in and out.
thanks
Congrats Gaddock. Not an easy three years to get through.
+1 on what BondGuy said...
Congrats Gaddock... I'd love to swap war stories one day. I'm guessing you're still doing a good bit of transactional, which is good as there aren't many of us left... (which is really good...!)
Clemente, no I've been getting referrals these days. All my time is taken up running my book. After I make some changes I'll get back on the phone.
Chickenfeed, I was calling any number I could find anywhere. The best list I had was new people moving many times they have not put themselves on the DNC yet. I got lucky with one very HNW guy on a cold call and now get referrals of the same.
Stickem, OUCH! how did trading destroy your career? beyond the obvious of losing big. I've punched just under 5000 tickets year to date. I run an options strategy around core equities. It's been hugely successful. Half my book are in wrap accounts for 1.5% the other are transactional with a 25% discount.
Bondguy, what a freaking roller coaster ride, never mind the market but the whole AGE to WB to WFA. I unfortunately now understand when they say the culture is different. Sure have learned a lot. Thanks for the kind words
Jack, ditto, yes half is transactional. Some folks think they get better service, they are correct.
Congratulations. I've been trying to find an interesting (and recurring) strategy, and you inspired some thinking. I don't know if options are for me, but you created a great niche for yourself.
I'm currently hiring new advisors and trainees in my office and it has been inspiring and motivating to get back to training and explaining the business... Sometimes we take for granted this business (and our wives, kids, families, etc.) ...
One thing I did when I started making money was hire assistants (ie.: cold callers, interns) and looking back that is what pushed me through year 3,4, 5... faster than the others and later allowed me to go out on my own...
Anyway, Gaddock's story is evidence of what one who works hard can expect from our business... and depending on product, previous experience, and attitude in some cases better results can be had.
Anyone w/ a book will tell you 90% of your revenue comes from 10% of your clients... Further, 90% of the revenue in this business comes from guys like Gaddock and BondGuy.
Good Stuff..
This deserves a bump.
Hows the business been Gaddock? Did you reach your goals you spoke about in the thread for 2010?
Am I the only one who sees a flaw here? Gaddock says that cold calling worked for him and it will work for you too. That is, if you develop some programmable algorithm, hire someone to create a program for you, generate 5000 tickets, and bring in ridiculous referrals.
Great for Gaddock, but I wouldn’t call him a stereotypical “cold caller” who is starting on a level playing field. Look at his background – comparing his success to what a new broker could do based on cold calling is absurd. The same would be true for someone who is “cold calling” from a list of bank prospects. That isn’t cold calling at all.
When someone claims success at cold calling, or mandates that cold calling is the only way to go, take a look at their background. A lot of guys on here aren’t on the same playing field.
[quote=Strng2QtStrng]
Am I the only one who sees a flaw here? Gaddock says that cold calling worked for him and it will work for you too. That is, if you develop some programmable algorithm, hire someone to create a program for you, generate 5000 tickets, and bring in ridiculous referrals.
Great for Gaddock, but I wouldn’t call him a stereotypical “cold caller” who is starting on a level playing field. Look at his background – comparing his success to what a new broker could do based on cold calling is absurd. The same would be true for someone who is “cold calling” from a list of bank prospects. That isn’t cold calling at all.
When someone claims success at cold calling, or mandates that cold calling is the only way to go, take a look at their background. A lot of guys on here aren’t on the same playing field.
[/quote]
Your outlook is very flawed. Here is why. You could have the secret that corners the market on gold. You could have a bond inventory that no one else has. You could even have the boiler plate "hot stock" picks that your firm recommends. But they are all completely worthless unless you are in front of people asking them to buy. How do you think he was able to write 5000 tickets? Do you think people were calling him up and ASKING to buy his option strategies? No, he proactively looked for opportunities and made the most of them.
Bottomline, if you have been in this business for any length of time, you will find out that there is always a story behind the story when someone experiences "bigtime" success, but all I see here is a willingness to zealously outwork the competion until his prospecting strategy paid dividends...and that is what he did.
Oh, and I don't think anyone is saying that cold calling is the only way to go, but if you are a rookie, what in the hell are you going to do? The way I see it, outside of family money (we all know tons of these guys), there are only a handful of ways to gather assets. You have the option of cold prospecting (call or door knock), network, direct mail, seminars, and referrals.
Most rookies don't have the bankroll for direct mail or seminars so throw those out the window. And you simply can't get client referrals unless you have clients right? Networking takes awhile so you need to start that immediately in order to bear fruit down the road. What does that leave you with? Cold prospecting. If you have found a way that is better, please let us know, but in my experience (and that of many others) there is no magic bullet. There isn't some slick pitch that no one has ever heard of. There is however a thing called hardwork.
Doesn't sound like you have made any signifcant dials in your career and given your pessimistic view of cold calling, I would say you are defeated before you even start...but good luck!
The title of this thread is “what one can expect from cold calling”. All I’m saying is that I agree with you – there is no magic bullet. I just don’t think Gaddock’s path is typical. He clearly did more than just pick up the phone. Instead he:
Came into the industry with a rich background and ample experience Conceived of a market beating strategy Invested in the production of a program that would beat the market Got in front of prospects by cold calling Generated a effective referral stream
Instead of “what one can expect from cold calling”, maybe it would be better to say: What one can expect from: see above 1-5. This forum has largely presented cold calling as the magic bullet, but clearly Gaddock’s success resulted from much, much more than simply picking up the phone. It was more than just outworking the competition. While both working hard and picking up the phone may be necessary, Gaddock created a strategic plan based on his background and experience which gave him the edge.
I give up. No sense in trying to explain anything else, because I think you just don't get it.
Gaddock didn't start using his option thing til the end of the first year if I remember correctly.. And even if he did.. what does it matter.?
Clients don't know the difference, I would argue it was harder for him to explain his strategy then simply using a bond or SMA
Maybe I can help
WIthout picking up the phone and COLD calling, his strategy, background, and most important the referrals do not happen.
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