Starting Salaries and Comp
Greatings,
I'm new here although I'm been in the FInancial Services business for many years. I decided to take the leap in to a full-fledged sales career and I'm looking at a few different firms. The one that looks the most promising, as well as appealing, is Merrill. From the reading I've done, it would seem that starting base could range anywhere between about 40-80 depending on experience and that one would not see their commissions/earnings until they exceed the base. My question is this: is that base about right? And, how are you guys generally compensated for AUM once you bring in the accounts? I know it's based on how the account is set up. Just looking for general info here. Sorry for the amaturely questions but I'm just trying to prepare for the inevitable salary/earnings discussion that I expect will occur soon. The other firms were NYL and EDJ. I'm sure they are both good firms but based on where I owuld like to fucus my business, at least initially, I don't think they would work. ALso, no disrespect to fellow professionals who are legit Financial people, I'm getting the sense that they will hire anyone with a pulse. I will not mention which firm of the two but I know one of them just hired a guy that was a Sheetrocker recently with zero FS experience. That just seems kind of fishy. Sorry for the long post. Any comments are welcome. Thank you,…oh yeah, I already have S-7/63.
If you want a guaranteed salary go teach third grade public school.
If you want a guaranteed salary go teach third grade public school.
Hey Cape - Don’t mind these pricks! I don’t see anywhere that you have expectations of an ongoing “guaranteed salary” WTF?? I assume that you’re asking about the initial salary that is offered while you build your book…I have heard 36k-60k, depending on your geographic area. I just joined and haven’t found the ignore button yet…
Most likely it will be between 40-55k. Unless you can’t live on that, but at most places, the higher your salary the higher your goals. That salary is based on wirehouse. EDJ salary is less probably 30-40k.
ML has 3 tiers.
<50k 50k>75k 75k>125k. If i were you id go for 74k as a starting salary. The top tier has pretty high expectations.BTW average starting salary is 60k
Thanks to those of you who provided a thoughtfull response.
To those who did not, maybe I should teach 3rd grade English and you can be my first students. We'll start with 2nd grade reading comprehension just for you ;) I think I was just looking for comparisons and trying to better understand the comp packages. Sorry if I offended your Delicate F'ing sensabilities....Some of us get grumpy because the search key will find most of this info on this site. A lot of this stuff has been re-asked 5-10Xs. Others well you know.
CHief, just trying to clarify what I read…using the search function and looking at threads that seemed dated. Sorry if I missed one along the way. ALso, clearly, the person responding certainly has the option of not responding if it is really going to upset them to do so…
You did read it correctly… As far as dated this same topic has been discussed over the last 6 months(salarys are similar).
Are your feelings hurt? Bud if you are getting into this job you better get a thicker skin.CHief, just trying to clarify what I read…using the search function and looking at threads that seemed dated. Sorry if I missed one along the way. ALso, clearly, the person responding certainly has the option of not responding if it is really going to upset them to do so…
If you are truly that concerned about starting salaries, this business probably isn’t for you. Not trying to be a d1ck, but you really need to ask yourself if you are willing to be underpaid and overworked for 5 years before you can become overpaid and underworked for the rest of your life.
Actually, “bud”, no my feeling are not hurt at all. To the contrary, I’m sort of getting a laugh at some of these repsonses.
never understood the negative responses to this question.
It's true that eventually we all eat what we we kill, but why wouldn't you want to negotiate the highest salary before that day comes?I really don’t understand the negativity either. I’m just trying to weigh the pro’s/con’s of the different opportunities that have presented themselves. Kind of hard to do that without asking questions. I thought I asked a reasonable question.
In fact, I may actually take a job for a firm that has no base salary because I like what I'm hearing. Maybe these other guys are just used to people coming on here with the wrong attitude about the business.Depends on what you want to do in the business. I am also a newbie to the forums but in my second year in the financial services business. Firms like Merrill and MSSB are wirehouses (now govt owned) which basically means that you will be an asset gatherer (hence the higher starting salary while building your book). Success rate at such places are low so if you don't have a slew of rich friends you'll be in for a tough ride.
On the other end of the spectrum you have the NYL, NMFN, Mass Mutual, Guardian and MetLife's of the world. All of these are basically life insurance companies masquerading as financial planning outfits. Starting salaries are zero in most cases. In some cases you will get a draw or an allowance for a period of time which is basically cut off after six months or so. However, if you like selling insurance products, go to one of these places. Then you have places like Ed Jones. I'm not to familiar with them other than they pay you a modest salary while studying for the 7/66, then as you migrate into production that salary decreases and about 18 months into the game you are on straight commission. Ed Jones has the rep for being "middle America's" financial advisor. Actually I may be looking at them for making a career transition. Hope this helps.It’s all a matter of personal opinion and personal situations:
I looked for a place with a decent starting salary (MSSB is where I ended up). Some would sit here on this board and tell me I might not want to try this business if I am worried about salary. However, that is where my situation comes in: I just closed on my first house with the woman I will marry next year. No way could I afford to start on straight commissions with that mortgage every month, simply would not have been a smart life decision. However, this does NOT mean I won't be comfortable on straight commissions if I can make it through the next year and a half with reasonable success. So that is just my $0.02, but I agree with the other posts: There should not be such negativity around this subject. I hope to be successful and actually look forward to being on straight commissions, just not RIGHT NOW. I bet there are a lot of other people out there that are not scared of commissions, but realize it isn't the best thing for their immediate future. Happy prospecting![quote=workinhard]It’s all a matter of personal opinion and personal situations:
I looked for a place with a decent starting salary (MSSB is where I ended up). Some would sit here on this board and tell me I might not want to try this business if I am worried about salary. However, that is where my situation comes in: I just closed on my first house with the woman I will marry next year. No way could I afford to start on straight commissions with that mortgage every month, simply would not have been a smart life decision. However, this does NOT mean I won't be comfortable on straight commissions if I can make it through the next year and a half with reasonable success. So that is just my $0.02, but I agree with the other posts: There should not be such negativity around this subject. I hope to be successful and actually look forward to being on straight commissions, just not RIGHT NOW. I bet there are a lot of other people out there that are not scared of commissions, but realize it isn't the best thing for their immediate future. Happy prospecting![/quote] My situation is a bit more complicated than yours (all due respect). I have all of the above, wife, kids, mortgage, etc. I've been in the business approx 18 months. Looking back on it one of my big mistakes was taking a position (commission only) at a life insurance company. Being new in the industry, I didn't fully realize that's what I'd be doing with the firm I chose, it was sort of a bait and switch type of thing. As for the commission only part, the experience has been invaluable and fairly successful compared to most. However, my major problem is that I am becoming something that I did not set out to become.Understood.
That's actually the other reason I chose to go after this job now, because there is no kids yet, and my future wife has a full time job that pays decent. So if anything ever happened where things didn't work out like I wanted them to, I would have a window of time to get myself set up for success again either with a different firm or in a different field. From what you are saying though, I would suggest you look into a wirehouse and continue your hunt. The jobs are out there. Best of luckThanks again to the people making a contribution here. I appreciate your feedback.
THanksAre your feelings hurt? Bud if you are getting into this job you better get a thicker skin.[/quote] I dont think his feelings are hurt at all, i think he just thinks the answers he got from some folks showed that they are pricks. We all know that if you go into a training program, and wont be prospecting for at least a few months, you arent going to do much business for the first 8 months or so. So of course he wants to know what the salary is. If he didnt care he'd either be rich in the first place, or a fool.[quote=Cape1]CHief, just trying to clarify what I read…using the search function and looking at threads that seemed dated. Sorry if I missed one along the way. ALso, clearly, the person responding certainly has the option of not responding if it is really going to upset them to do so…
[quote=Cape1]
Greatings,
I'm new here although I'm been in the FInancial Services business for many years. I decided to take the leap in to a full-fledged sales career and I'm looking at a few different firms. The one that looks the most promising, as well as appealing, is Merrill. From the reading I've done, it would seem that starting base could range anywhere between about 40-80 depending on experience and that one would not see their commissions/earnings until they exceed the base. My question is this: is that base about right? And, how are you guys generally compensated for AUM once you bring in the accounts? I know it's based on how the account is set up. Just looking for general info here. Sorry for the amaturely questions but I'm just trying to prepare for the inevitable salary/earnings discussion that I expect will occur soon. The other firms were NYL and EDJ. I'm sure they are both good firms but based on where I owuld like to fucus my business, at least initially, I don't think they would work. ALso, no disrespect to fellow professionals who are legit Financial people, I'm getting the sense that they will hire anyone with a pulse. I will not mention which firm of the two but I know one of them just hired a guy that was a Sheetrocker recently with zero FS experience. That just seems kind of fishy. Sorry for the long post. Any comments are welcome. Thank you, [/quote] you must be talking about edward jones. they have a wide range of people that they hire.....some have financial experience, some of them were truck drivers/plumbers. jones doesnt care about your experience...just be able to pass the series 7 and be able to sell.What’s with all the angry, aggressive, jumping down this guy’s throat?
[quote=utcheachea][quote=Cape1]
Greatings,
I'm new here although I'm been in the FInancial Services business for many years. I decided to take the leap in to a full-fledged sales career and I'm looking at a few different firms. The one that looks the most promising, as well as appealing, is Merrill. From the reading I've done, it would seem that starting base could range anywhere between about 40-80 depending on experience and that one would not see their commissions/earnings until they exceed the base. My question is this: is that base about right? And, how are you guys generally compensated for AUM once you bring in the accounts? I know it's based on how the account is set up. Just looking for general info here. Sorry for the amaturely questions but I'm just trying to prepare for the inevitable salary/earnings discussion that I expect will occur soon. The other firms were NYL and EDJ. I'm sure they are both good firms but based on where I owuld like to fucus my business, at least initially, I don't think they would work. ALso, no disrespect to fellow professionals who are legit Financial people, I'm getting the sense that they will hire anyone with a pulse. I will not mention which firm of the two but I know one of them just hired a guy that was a Sheetrocker recently with zero FS experience. That just seems kind of fishy. Sorry for the long post. Any comments are welcome. Thank you, [/quote] you must be talking about edward jones. they have a wide range of people that they hire.....some have financial experience, some of them were truck drivers/plumbers. jones doesnt care about your experience...just be able to pass the series 7 and be able to sell.[/quote] See that's the thing. When you have a wife, kids, house, dog and cat; getting paid is a very nice thing. FOr me it depends on the outfit I work for and my clients. At NYL, I can make money selling a Life Policy to a few people so I would probably be off and running allot quicker. IN the case of ML, they want me to focus in a space where it's going to take some time to. These are institutional sales in their case and not middle class, 50k, one-and-done kinds of situations. The sales cycle is upward of 6 months. So clearly, to your point, unless I was rich, stupid or don't mind telling the family they have to live in a tent; the base is a must have for that situation. I hope people see what I mean. THis is not a matter of lacking self image or inability to sell; it's, rather, a matter of weighing the individualities of each opportunity. I probably should have clarified this in the first place.Given the date that you joined the forum, it's obvious that you don't know that that's what we do here. It's a tough business, and the perception that people are more concerned with a handout then making their own way is a real one that affects the actual producers in a firm. Not saying that's what this guy is doing, but there are about a dozen of these questions a month and many of the people that ask them fail out and cost the firms money. I understand people are trying to be prudent in financial decisions that affect their family, but starting in this business is rarely a financially prudent decision (unless you have some business handed to you for one reason or another). If you are trying to make a prudent decision, this isn't the place or the business to do it. The worst case scenario you imagine shouldn't be your first year guarantee, it should be total failure because it is a statistical likelihood. Your expectation for your income isn't something someone else can answer because it lies 100% on the shoulders of the person who is building their business. The reason these questions get answered with sarcasm and vitriol is because they are asked with the wrong attitude. As has been well documented, this is not a "guaranteed salary" job. If you want one of those you should go work somewhere else.What’s with all the angry, aggressive, jumping down this guy’s throat?
I don’t think I asked “with the wrong attitude”. The base is not my first concern and I am not new to the industry.
I was trying to weight the pros and cons of each position and base is only one consideration of many. The hero's among us who would turn down a base pay are probably not selling into a high-ticket arena where sales cycles are long. For lower end selling, I would not mind not having a base. In fact the NYL job is appealing to me on many levels and they offer no base pay at all. I understand that asking with the wrong attitude is probably frustrating. Perhaps I should have explained my reasons for asking a bit more.Cape your question is fine. and with the way ML stopped hiring newbies and now re-started, getting an update on salaries is a good question to ask. If you can get in with ML and get a 60k salary, give it serious consideration. Most important thig is to make sure they are a good fit for you. That you like the environment and the emphasis on annuitized business building. If so, it may be a great fit. If not, then look elsewhere.
[quote=SometimesNowhere]If you are trying to make a prudent decision, this isn’t the place or the business to do it. [/quote]
And you’re advising clients on what to do with their money?
Half the people on this forum, yourself included, remind me of the Ed Helms character from “The Office.”
Thanks. I can see their points though too (those who got jumpy). I bet allot of people would want to try this gig but are timid. IT’s like they want to go Fishing but it’s windy and rough so they stand on the dock waiting for the fish to jump in the bucket. For me, for many reasons, it’s do or die. I need to get to where the fish are or it’s all over. So F-it, I’ll head straight into the Hurricane and like it.
Salaries are for chumps.
Well, if I'm offered a base to start, I'm not turning it down. I guess I'm a "Chump"... But then again, I'm thinking most people who are so vocally against starting base are those who probably couldn't get an interview with the firms that pay them. Just a hunch. Either that or they once had a starting base too but figure the Base-Draw-bridge should be hoisted up behind them now that they are enlightened. I could be wrong.Salaries are for chumps.
Haha, so says the guy that's trying to bring on recruits...without a salary! Cape - you are indeed wrong. Moraen used to be with one of the major firms that does indeed pay a salary.[/quote] Not necessarily aiming that at him. Seriously, can you guys tell me, practically speaking, what the sense would be in turning down the starting salary? Is there a benefit to doing so at one of the wire houses? That info would be great if you have insight.[quote=Moraen]Salaries are for chumps.
[quote=Moraen]Salaries are for chumps.
Haha, so says the guy that’s trying to bring on recruits…without a salary!
Cape - you are indeed wrong. Moraen used to be with one of the major firms that does indeed pay a salary.[/quote]
I know, I finally offered someone a salary, with slightly lower payout… and he turned it down!
Bump... I know this is an old thread but I just interviewed with ML for a PMD position and the BM told me I would start out at $50K if I got the position. Now I am a career changer with a wife and kids. I currently make approximately $65K. From what he tells me the first six months I would only make $50K as I would be getting licensed. My max out in the first year would probably be $52K. I don't think I can afford that kind of pay cut. Are these starting salaries negotiable? I know I have no book or prior sales experience but isn't everything negotiable? I could probably take a small cut but anything over $50K puts me into another bracket anyways from what I been hearing so I should be able to get $65K since the next bracket is up to $75K. To make it clear, I am not looking for hand out and understand that it's better to be full commission in the end but just need to pay the bills while I build a book. Any thoughts? Thanks.
amancu-
The salary is usually negotiable to a certain extent. If I was you I would sell myself to the BM get him to like me. And once you get an actual offer...then start your negotiating. If you start bringing up numbers before your even hired it makes the BM think your in this for the salary.
Not sure what the brackets are as I only interviewed there but didn't end up going, but you don't want to be in that upper bracket which is for the career changers who know they'll be able to bring in family money, friend, etc.... Look at your finances, take the lowest salary you can to get by, and the highest you can get without going into another bracket.
You should know if you want to get into this business that the beginning pay is the hardest part. Your not going to find any more at any other place. Wirehouses will pay you the most to train.
Good luck
Makes sense. When he started talking salary numbers I just let him go and took it for what it was. I didn't try to negotiate on the spot. I figured I would do it later in the process. From what I have heard the brackets are Under $50K (which is what he was telling me I would get), $50K-$75K, and $75K and over. So if I asked for anything more than the $49,999 then I would be into the next bracket. I just ran my finances and don't think I could survive on $50k. So if they do extend me an offer I will have to negotiate a higher starting salary. If it doesn't work out...on to the next place. I am determined to make this work but I have to take care of family also. Thanks.
If you don't think you can survive on $50k wait until the salary goes away....
If you aren't doing $150k in production by then your income will be less than $50k anyways..
Take the $50k and beat the production standards and you will get paid more..
This career is just like being a lawyer.. The first 3-5 years is nothing but grunt work (at much lower pay) but once you are established (7-10 years) it is a cake walk..
I get what you are saying but I don't think I can survive the first 6 months on $50k while I am not in production. I will only take home so much money with no opportunity to make more. I don't think I will be able to pay my bills with that salary. After I am in production and the salary runs out I better be producing enough to bring home more money otherwise I will be starved out of the biz anyways. From what I can see the only way for a career changer to make it through the first few lean years is to have an established reserve which I don't have. I currently make $65K and really need close to that to live. I am just kind of pissed at myself for not making the switch sooner. I had the opportunity to start when I graduated college but went for the bigger check in corporate finance. Kickin myself now since I still lived at home with no bills. Would have been a perfect time to build up my business. I could have had an established business by now. Oh well we'll see how it goes. I have another meeting with the BM to present my business plan. Then they will probably extend me an offer. From there I have to negotiate and make a decision. Really want into this business but can only sacrifice so much since I have a family and other responsibilities.
Take an Engineering course to make sure for a high-paying job. But education is not an assurance for a stable job. Is it a good idea to go to law school? According to a survey, there are lots of unemployed Law graduates.
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