No longer at Edward Jones, looking into options
Well, a couple of weeks ago the train ride came to an end. My CSD was mid '08 and I couldn’t regain enough traction over the past few months after PDP. I was let go and am now looking for insight. Thanks to all for any helpful input.
EJ must be doing some housecleaning…I just got let go last week. Didn’t even make it to PDP.
I’m looking at 3 options:
2. Going back to my old industry and working 60-80 hours a week.
3. Going back to my old industry but working 30-40 hours a week and trying to start and advisor biz on the side.
I actually believe #3 is a pipe-dream, but it’s still on the table.
[quote=Still@jones]EJ must be doing some housecleaning…I just got let go last week. Didn’t even make it to PDP.
I’m looking at 3 options:
2. Going back to my old industry and working 60-80 hours a week.
3. Going back to my old industry but working 30-40 hours a week and trying to start and advisor biz on the side.
I actually believe #3 is a pipe-dream, but it’s still on the table.
[/quote]
Check out insurance companies. I’m sure most of them would love to have you and the minimums won’t be like Jones since you’d share secretaries and they’d house you in a central office location with several other agents/advisors, in other words you can build at your own pace because they’re not spending $100k per year on you or whatever Jones offices cost. Payout will be better too on investments. We get 80% on wrap business, and a sliding scale from 50% up to 85% of GDC on commission based business.
[quote=voltmoie]
Sometimes you gotta know when to hold then, know when to fold them, know when to walkaway when the dealings done… casue you sure are not counting your money. Primerica might be your only other option unless a bank or an indy are desperate. [/quote]Shouldn't you be calling California right now, Volt?
Remember the 30 day war...
I'm looking at 3 options:
1. Joining another firm to see if having an office and some mentors makes a difference.
2. Going back to my old industry and working 60-80 hours a week.
3. Going back to my old industry but working 30-40 hours a week and trying to start and advisor biz on the side.
I actually believe #3 is a pipe-dream, but it's still on the table.
[/quote]
Check out insurance companies. I'm sure most of them would love to have you and the minimums won't be like Jones since you'd share secretaries and they'd house you in a central office location with several other agents/advisors, in other words you can build at your own pace because they're not spending $100k per year on you or whatever Jones offices cost. Payout will be better too on investments. We get 80% on wrap business, and a sliding scale from 50% up to 85% of GDC on commission based business.
[/quote]
DCnew, I’d rather not name my company specifically but I know we’re not alone, I have a buddy at NML and he gets the same type payout. I think most big mutual insurance companies pay really well on the investment side.
[quote=voltmoie]
Sometimes you gotta know when to hold then, know when to fold them, know when to walkaway when the dealings done.... casue you sure are not counting your money. Primerica might be your only other option unless a bank or an indy are desperate. [/quote] Volt, Why would you say primerica? I have not heard the greatest things about them in the past. I was let go for not hitting my goals, clean u5, so why smear my resume with a chop shop? I'm not here bad mouthing EDJ, so why slam me? It didnt work out there, but I had 10 years successful sales/management experience prior to EDJ, am well educated (BBA, working on MBA ) and I see no reason to lower my standards at this stage of my career. I wish you the best in building your business, I was exceeding EDJ expectations at your stage of the game; Just some humble food for thought. good luck building your business and I hope you are more successful at Jones than I ended up. Best wishes.Still - I stopped calling at 6:30 today. Did some paperwork this evening. Cold calling is Friday. The WAR is on!
DC … You missed the point of my comment and I didn’t mean it it be rude … but from what I understand Jones has VERY low goals within the industry. If you failed out of a company with low goals what makes you think you’ll do better else where? I don’t give two SH*TS about your education or background … did it matter at Jones? NOPE… you were fired for not hitting goals. Like I said, if you can find a bank or an indy willing to give you a shot that’s a good bet. Those are the first doors I’d knock on if I was let go. If not, what else is there? The wires don’t want a guy that can’t hit Jones numbers. That’s just reality. Berk said insurance companies, so that’s a good option too.
Either way, good luck …
It’s not that hard to hit Jones “Goals” if you are doing the work. They are pretty low, unless you are just not doing the work. I haven’t met a person yet who did the work and got fired for not hitting goals. It’s usually the people who sit in their office, make excuses not to cold call or door knock, and focus on non productive activities (paperwork, tomorrows calendar, etc). I’d say anyone who is fired from Jones, is screwed. If you don’t do the work at Jones, you aren’t going to do the work anywhere else. It’s not rocket science, it’s all self motivation. If you can’t motivate yourself to do well at Jones in this biz, you won’t anywhere.
You could apply to be the guy at Mcdonald’s that tries to sell you a “Premium Ice Mocha” everytime we go through the drive through. You’re a shoe in.
There are independents looking to help you build your business. Speak to Fred at tradepmr. He can hook you up with a bd that will have ridiculously low minimums while you build the RIA side of your business.
That said, I pretty much agree with Ronnie/Volt et al. However, don’t dismiss the value of Jones training. It carries weight with insurance type companies. Look at the June issue of Financial Planning (Top 50 Independents) and go through the list of companies with no minimum.
Good luck.
[quote=Ronnie Dobbs]It’s not that hard to hit Jones “Goals” if you are doing the work. They are pretty low, unless you are just not doing the work. I haven’t met a person yet who did the work and got fired for not hitting goals. It’s usually the people who sit in their office, make excuses not to cold call or door knock, and focus on non productive activities (paperwork, tomorrows calendar, etc). I’d say anyone who is fired from Jones, is screwed. If you don’t do the work at Jones, you aren’t going to do the work anywhere else. It’s not rocket science, it’s all self motivation. If you can’t motivate yourself to do well at Jones in this biz, you won’t anywhere.
You could apply to be the guy at Mcdonald’s that tries to sell you a “Premium Ice Mocha” everytime we go through the drive through. You’re a shoe in.[/quote]
You take your clients and prospects to McDonalds?? Sorry, couldn’t resist.
I would have to agree though, you really need to do some soul searching to determine if the business is really for you. It’s not just long hours and prospecting that makes you successful. You need a certain charisma on top of it all to gain the trust of people.
Take BioFreeze, he may be a real smart ass, but I’ll bet he has charisma.
Good luck.
[quote=BerkshireBull]
DCnew, I’d rather not name my company specifically but I know we’re not alone, I have a buddy at NML and he gets the same type payout. I think most big mutual insurance companies pay really well on the investment side.
[/quote]
NML has a nice office in my town. I like the idea of my payout being almost 3 times what Jones would give me (and with low minimums)…what’s the catch?
Actually, I will take a different approach to this one. I think there are plenty of honest, hard-working FA's out there that just can't make it because they don't know what works, and they can't figure it out on their own. But you put them on a wirehouse team where they are a junior, and the senior members just tell them what to do, hand them some small accounts to work on, whatever, they could end up beign very effective and having a great career. The BIG downside at Jones is, despite all the "help" you get, sometimes it's not the best help. Like everyone, I have hit walls where I felt like NOTHING I was doing worked. Vets were more than willing to offer advice, but more often than not, the advice was "get out there and bang on more doors" or "just call everyone with a good bond". That's great. I don't need some knucklehead 250K producer to tell me that. This is one of the few industries where you are essentially left to your own devices to figure it out. Ever notice how EVERYONE builds their business differently? Some have tons of CPA's feeding them, some figured out a great niche, some have a rich Dad in the business, some cold call for hours on end, some do retirement seminars, some inherited a huge book, etc. The point is, there is no ONE answer in this business, and it varies by region and by specific location. Having a successful senior advisor that can help guide you through that process is priceless. Most guys just run out of time/money before they ever really figure it out. So it really is not all about hard work or hours worked. After all, the difference between great and fired/broke is only one or two good accounts per month. Some of my best months have come from luck and referrals, not from hours and hours of calling and doorknocking. What I WILL SAY, is that hard work and activity generally presents more opportunities. But you can't spend 12 hours a day doing something that clearly doesn't work.It’s not that hard to hit Jones “Goals” if you are doing the work. They are pretty low, unless you are just not doing the work. I haven’t met a person yet who did the work and got fired for not hitting goals. It’s usually the people who sit in their office, make excuses not to cold call or door knock, and focus on non productive activities (paperwork, tomorrows calendar, etc). I’d say anyone who is fired from Jones, is screwed. If you don’t do the work at Jones, you aren’t going to do the work anywhere else. It’s not rocket science, it’s all self motivation. If you can’t motivate yourself to do well at Jones in this biz, you won’t anywhere.
You could apply to be the guy at Mcdonald’s that tries to sell you a “Premium Ice Mocha” everytime we go through the drive through. You’re a shoe in.
I have a buddy at NML. He does fine, but I think he pays for all his own stuff (assistant, rent, etc.). So you have to compare apples to apples. I don't know what their model is though. And his business is really insurance driven. He does some small IRA's and SIMPLE's, but not much else. However, much of his insurance stuff is renewable and a lot of it is employer-based, so it's basically annuitized.[quote=BerkshireBull] DCnew, I’d rather not name my company specifically but I know we’re not alone, I have a buddy at NML and he gets the same type payout. I think most big mutual insurance companies pay really well on the investment side.
[/quote]
NML has a nice office in my town. I like the idea of my payout being almost 3 times what Jones would give me (and with low minimums)…what’s the catch?
Unless of course you go to a bank. Then you just have no clue what you are doing. If you want to build a book of business under no circumstances should you be in a place where people initiate a majority of their financial transactions.
[quote=B24]
Actually, I will take a different approach to this one. I think there are plenty of honest, hard-working FA's out there that just can't make it because they don't know what works, and they can't figure it out on their own. But you put them on a wirehouse team where they are a junior, and the senior members just tell them what to do, hand them some small accounts to work on, whatever, they could end up beign very effective and having a great career. The BIG downside at Jones is, despite all the "help" you get, sometimes it's not the best help. Like everyone, I have hit walls where I felt like NOTHING I was doing worked. Vets were more than willing to offer advice, but more often than not, the advice was "get out there and bang on more doors" or "just call everyone with a good bond". That's great. I don't need some knucklehead 250K producer to tell me that. This is one of the few industries where you are essentially left to your own devices to figure it out. Ever notice how EVERYONE builds their business differently? Some have tons of CPA's feeding them, some figured out a great niche, some have a rich Dad in the business, some cold call for hours on end, some do retirement seminars, some inherited a huge book, etc. The point is, there is no ONE answer in this business, and it varies by region and by specific location. Having a successful senior advisor that can help guide you through that process is priceless. Most guys just run out of time/money before they ever really figure it out. So it really is not all about hard work or hours worked. After all, the difference between great and fired/broke is only one or two good accounts per month. Some of my best months have come from luck and referrals, not from hours and hours of calling and doorknocking. What I WILL SAY, is that hard work and activity generally presents more opportunities. But you can't spend 12 hours a day doing something that clearly doesn't work.[/quote] [quote=noggin] I concur with B24. I love the guys that haven't even built a book who have the audacity to let you know that you are a failure. The greatest President that we have ever had in our country didn't win the first election that he ran for. If he hadn't run for President where would our great country be today? I salute you for posting and taking the guff that goes with it. Good luck to you in whatever you decide to do.[/quote] I'll jump on this bandwagon too. There were two guys in my training class, one that quit and one that got fired, that were decent FA's. One guy ran out of money, and now is launching a successful business in a different industry, the other moved to Prudential and is doing very well. I think that the model is just not right for some people, and you really have to have a mix of work ethic, luck, and some timing to make it.[quote=SometimesNowhere]
I'll jump on this bandwagon too. There were two guys in my training class, one that quit and one that got fired, that were decent FA's. One guy ran out of money, and now is launching a successful business in a different industry, the other moved to Prudential and is doing very well. I think that the model is just not right for some people, and you really have to have a mix of work ethic, luck, and some timing to make it.[/quote]When I look back on my time at Jones, the one thing that could have made a difference is a different Field Trainer. I had a guy who built his business making 300 dials/day 15 years ago. I thought he was an ass...
It's hard to learn from someone you don't like and the Jones model doesn't give me any quality time with anyone else. I can look back and say I should have asked to sit in at another FAs office, but at the time, I didn't know that's what I needed.
Still@Jones, I understand your pain. Keep in mind, there are useless a$$es at every firm. You just happened to have a bad experience at Jones. I have been very lucky to get the training and mentorship I received at Jones. I hooked up with some very good guys, that continue to be mentors to me today. But I look around our region at some of the newbs and who they have been paired up with, and I feel for them. Honestly, if I had been trained or mentored by our top producer in the region, I would have hated it. He’s not a bad advisor, I just dislike his style. He’s a cold-calling, doorknocking, machine. But he built his business in the early and mid-90’s, and most of his advice is from the perspective of a nearly-20 year veteran. So yes, I’d love to call 25 clients a day on a really good muni (he’s a big muni advisor, lot of HNW clients), but I would run out of clients that would buy muni’s after about 3 days. He’s got like 1000 households. So the advice is not always relevant.
[quote=B24]Still@Jones, I understand your pain. Keep in mind, there are useless a$$es at every firm. You just happened to have a bad experience at Jones. I have been very lucky to get the training and mentorship I received at Jones. I hooked up with some very good guys, that continue to be mentors to me today. But I look around our region at some of the newbs and who they have been paired up with, and I feel for them. Honestly, if I had been trained or mentored by our top producer in the region, I would have hated it. He’s not a bad advisor, I just dislike his style. He’s a cold-calling, doorknocking, machine. But he built his business in the early and mid-90’s, and most of his advice is from the perspective of a nearly-20 year veteran. So yes, I’d love to call 25 clients a day on a really good muni (he’s a big muni advisor, lot of HNW clients), but I would run out of clients that would buy muni’s after about 3 days. He’s got like 1000 households. So the advice is not always relevant.
[/quote] x2. My Field Trainer had a very different style than I did, and my "mentor" never even called me. If it weren't for another FA in the region reaching out and showing me some important things, I would have probably sunk like the other guys.[quote=B24]
Actually, I will take a different approach to this one. I think there are plenty of honest, hard-working FA's out there that just can't make it because they don't know what works, and they can't figure it out on their own. But you put them on a wirehouse team where they are a junior, and the senior members just tell them what to do, hand them some small accounts to work on, whatever, they could end up beign very effective and having a great career. This is one of the few industries where you are essentially left to your own devices to figure it out. Ever notice how EVERYONE builds their business differently? Having a successful senior advisor that can help guide you through that process is priceless. [/quote] Thats why I said it's all self motivation at Jones and well alot of other firms. I agree some people do leave and then do very well in a team atmosphere, because they aren't self motivated. I would have to say though, that it is probably the exception rather than the rule. Most of the people I know that got fired just weren't in the right business. The ones that run out of money usually quit.[quote=DCnew]
HUGE payouts!, what firm/ B/D? [quote=BerkshireBull] [quote=Still@jones]EJ must be doing some housecleaning...I just got let go last week. Didn't even make it to PDP.I'm looking at 3 options:
1. Joining another firm to see if having an office and some mentors makes a difference.
2. Going back to my old industry and working 60-80 hours a week.
3. Going back to my old industry but working 30-40 hours a week and trying to start and advisor biz on the side.
I actually believe #3 is a pipe-dream, but it's still on the table.
[/quote]
Check out insurance companies. I'm sure most of them would love to have you and the minimums won't be like Jones since you'd share secretaries and they'd house you in a central office location with several other agents/advisors, in other words you can build at your own pace because they're not spending $100k per year on you or whatever Jones offices cost. Payout will be better too on investments. We get 80% on wrap business, and a sliding scale from 50% up to 85% of GDC on commission based business.
[/quote] [/quote]
I think Berkshire is at Northwestern Mutual.
Thanks all,
I am looking into all options, I currently have the advantage of a steady paycheck while I evaluate my circumstances, options, and carefully make my next move. I have no question that I have the "charisma" if you will, and my field trainer as well as several other brokers literally called me saying they knew I had what it takes to succeed in this business. I also fully understand that this is a public furum and none of you have the opportunity to size me up face to face. I am confident in my skills and abilities but was hoping to get some seasoned advice from those more tenured in the industry than myself.A) How bad were you guys missing numbers before they gave you the axe?
B)Did they give you a hint to let you know it was coming? C) And lastly, were you guys actually doing the work or not?[quote=SometimesNowhere]
x2. My Field Trainer had a very different style than I did, and my "mentor" never even called me. If it weren't for another FA in the region reaching out and showing me some important things, I would have probably sunk like the other guys. [/quote]I was never told I had a mentor. I wonder if that would have helped.
Berkshire is the 17 guy on a 16 man team. He picks up lunch and shines shoes for minimum wage. In his free time he rips on EJ and bank advisors.
You have to go out and find one for yourself. It’s called initiative. They talked about this in KYC and Eval/Grad multiple times.
"Hey Frank, wow you’ve really built a great business. Would it be okay if I called you once a week for 15 mins to pick your brain? - I’d love to be like you when i grow up!"
My field trainer is a nice guy but I found a guy to model myself after before Eval/Grad … he’s a rockstar. Call him twice a month, he pushes me, gives me ideas, tells me I’m a lazy bastard.
Come on guys … tell us your numbers when Jones let you go. How many accounts, how much gross, and how many months/weeks you were with the company!
There are 3 guys in my old region who are 3 years out and have a 4 month rolling of 5k. They haven't been axed.
[quote=fa09]A) How bad were you guys missing numbers before they gave you the axe?
B)Did they give you a hint to let you know it was coming? C) And lastly, were you guys actually doing the work or not?[/quote]C: I started off very badly. I was doing the work, but I was having an impossible time getting phone numbers. I made it through Eval/Grad with mostly business contacts. But, once in production, I wasn't selling anything. I realized a few weeks into production, I needed to find MY way of selling.
I do admit, I spent more time reading and planning than I should, but it was what I needed to do. And I actually did turn things around. By July, I was getting phone numbers from almost 90% of the doors I knocked and I was getting appointments (I actually talked up the appointment at the door). But, EJ wasn't going to keep me on with my low numbers, and I was gone.
B: I got 2 stern warnings that I was running out of time. If I didn't show vast improvement in the number of accounts I was opening.
A: Less than 6 accounts, and that's all you will get out of me.
[quote=Ron 14]Berkshire is the 17 guy on a 16 man team. He picks up lunch and shines shoes for minimum wage. In his free time he rips on EJ and bank advisors. [/quote]
Free time my ass. I schedule those activities in as part of my day.
[quote=Still@jones]
[quote=BerkshireBull]
DCnew, I’d rather not name my company specifically but I know we’re not alone, I have a buddy at NML and he gets the same type payout. I think most big mutual insurance companies pay really well on the investment side.
[/quote]
NML has a nice office in my town. I like the idea of my payout being almost 3 times what Jones would give me (and with low minimums)…what’s the catch?
[/quote]
I don’t work for NML but I can guess how they work. Anon would know more but here’s what I know.
You pay your own way on most things, that’s the catch. You probably pay $150-200/mo if you want them to house you and provide copier, printer, fax, secretaries to take incoming calls for you. You probably pay $50-100 for your E&O depending if you are an IAR or just a reg rep. You probably have some sort of small monthly fee for the computer programs you choose to buy a license for. You probably pay a small fee if you want to participate in any home office generated lead programs.
The advantages are the occasional freebie call-in leads and inexpensive home office leads, less meddling management than Jones (I’d guess), access to orphan policyholders for prospecting, a more respected company name than Jones (heh heh), and most importantly a higher payout.
LOL. Well played.[quote=Ron 14]Berkshire is the 17 guy on a 16 man team. He picks up lunch and shines shoes for minimum wage. In his free time he rips on EJ and bank advisors. [/quote]
Free time my ass. I schedule those activities in as part of my day.
[quote=BerkshireBull]
I don’t work for NML but I can guess how they work. Anon would know more but here’s what I know.
You pay your own way on most things, that’s the catch. You probably pay $150-200/mo if you want them to house you and provide copier, printer, fax, secretaries to take incoming calls for you. You probably pay $50-100 for your E&O depending if you are an IAR or just a reg rep. You probably have some sort of small monthly fee for the computer programs you choose to buy a license for. You probably pay a small fee if you want to participate in any home office generated lead programs.
The advantages are the occasional freebie call-in leads and inexpensive home office leads, less meddling management than Jones (I’d guess), access to orphan policyholders for prospecting, a more respected company name than Jones (heh heh), and most importantly a higher payout.
[/quote]
I would guess, if you are paying for your space they don’t care how slowly you build your business. This might actually be the perfect format for me.
When I was at Jones, I actually paid for my own office space. I was so ineffective out of my home that I paid $200/month to use a shared space 10 days a month. I had to sign a 6 month lease, so I’m still paying…
Thanks all, I'll be interviewing for a Chase FA position in the next week,
any input?[quote=DCnew]
Thanks all, I’ll be interviewing for a Chase FA situation in the next week,
any input? [/quote]Talk about building relationships with your bankers, the power of the chase brand, and how excited you'll be to work within the framework of a bank with such a great history of customer service. BLAH BLAH BLAH
What is the job title for this position with Chase?
Financial Advisor, servicing two branches and 4 personal bankers.
[quote=Still@jones]
[quote=BerkshireBull]I don’t work for NML but I can guess how they work. Anon would know more but here’s what I know.You pay your own way on most things, that’s the catch. You probably pay $150-200/mo if you want them to house you and provide copier, printer, fax, secretaries to take incoming calls for you. You probably pay $50-100 for your E&O depending if you are an IAR or just a reg rep. You probably have some sort of small monthly fee for the computer programs you choose to buy a license for. You probably pay a small fee if you want to participate in any home office generated lead programs.The advantages are the occasional freebie call-in leads and inexpensive home office leads, less meddling management than Jones (I’d guess), access to orphan policyholders for prospecting, a more respected company name than Jones (heh heh), and most importantly a higher payout.[/quote]I would guess, if you are paying for your space they don’t care how slowly you build your business. This might actually be the perfect format for me. When I was at Jones, I actually paid for my own office space. I was so ineffective out of my home that I paid $200/month to use a shared space 10 days a month. I had to sign a 6 month lease, so I’m still paying… [/quote]
Seriously? Your region sucks. Or you showed no common sense. Why not just ask another fa with an office if you could use his place when you schedule appointments. That is if the client insists on it as opposed to the convenience of you coming to their home where all the paperwork is. Signing a lease is crazy talk with the jones salary. Honestly, I know its been said before but if you couldn’t hack it full time then why on earth do you think you will make it part time? Sounds like you’re just wasting time money and effort on a pipe dream that you aren’t willing to commit yourself enough to be successful at.
[quote=fa09] [quote=Still@jones]
[quote=BerkshireBull]I don’t work for NML but I can guess how they work. Anon would know more but here’s what I know.You pay your own way on most things, that’s the catch. You probably pay $150-200/mo if you want them to house you and provide copier, printer, fax, secretaries to take incoming calls for you. You probably pay $50-100 for your E&O depending if you are an IAR or just a reg rep. You probably have some sort of small monthly fee for the computer programs you choose to buy a license for. You probably pay a small fee if you want to participate in any home office generated lead programs.The advantages are the occasional freebie call-in leads and inexpensive home office leads, less meddling management than Jones (I’d guess), access to orphan policyholders for prospecting, a more respected company name than Jones (heh heh), and most importantly a higher payout.[/quote]I would guess, if you are paying for your space they don’t care how slowly you build your business. This might actually be the perfect format for me. When I was at Jones, I actually paid for my own office space. I was so ineffective out of my home that I paid $200/month to use a shared space 10 days a month. I had to sign a 6 month lease, so I’m still paying… [/quote]
Seriously? Your region sucks. Or you showed no common sense. Why not just ask another fa with an office if you could use his place when you schedule appointments. That is if the client insists on it as opposed to the convenience of you coming to their home where all the paperwork is. Signing a lease is crazy talk with the jones salary. Honestly, I know its been said before but if you couldn’t hack it full time then why on earth do you think you will make it part time? Sounds like you’re just wasting time money and effort on a pipe dream that you aren’t willing to commit yourself enough to be successful at.[/quote]
What he said
How did you rent your own space at Jones? Offices have to be registered and as far as I know, Jones doesn’t register offices besides your house and your permanent office? You may be the only person in the history of Jones (definitely my 10+ year history) to rent a space like that before you get your own office. Maybe things have changed for noobs over the past few years, but I didn’t think that was even possible. Did you tell Jones that you rented it, or did you just break a lot of securities laws and do what you wanted?
I am guessing he did the second part…
He told a prospect he worked for ML after Jones fired him… what do you think? The guy is a first rate piker. Opened less than 6 accounts. Blames field trainers, lack of metors, no office, etc. etc. You’d think after alllllll those years in a previous job you’d have enough friends to open a few accounts. Nope, he’s a liar.
Thanks for the feedback - Maybe I’m just no good…
But I will say this:
1. I was interviewing with ML when I wrote that. I got an offer, but decided not to take it.
2. I had access to a Jones office for client meetings, but there were no offices with space for a Legacy; or even a frequent visitor - I asked everyone!
3. I used the rented office space so I could make phone calls without any distractions.
4. Renting shared office might have been a little extreme, but I wasn’t making numbers and I was willing to try anything I thought might help.
5. The reason I will succeed is because sales is about confidence and certainty about the product I am selling…I never felt good selling the way I was told…but If I never give up, and keep trying new things (like renting quiet office space to make calls) I will eventually find what I need to do to succeed.
6. Hotair1 is still in High School
Ok so you are looking for options and willing to try something different so you succeed in a format different than Jone but turn down an offer from ML? Hotair may be in highschool but he seems to be on the right track.
… Still, I’ve heard a hundred times “it’s your business” did you never hear this? You’ve seen many a Jones broker on this board say " as long as you are hitting your #s St. Louis will leave you alone"
They had their suggested products to sell and how to sell them .. I think most of it applys but I've sold insurance, VAs, UITs, C shares, and advisory solutions. All of which we were encouraged to wait to sell until after PDP. I've not gotten but two calls in 3 months - both touching base and suggesting I up my prospecting. Not a mention of how I was selling or what I was selling. Excuses bro... When i have a crap day, it's because of me. Not the fact I'm making calls out of the kitchen or my wife and kids get home at 4pm.I was sticking to it because I was certain I could turn things around. Maybe I was making excuses in the beginning, but everyone does. But, by eliminating my excuses, I could see that it all comes down to me. I wasn’t ready to give up and I believe if I had 3 more months I would have made things work.
If you went to the new FA meeting, you saw Phelan talk about how he sucked for his first 5 months. How he didn’t have any good training. But, that he started reading sales training materials and became a good sales person. I believe I was on the same track…month 3 of 5.
My decision not to take the ML offer had to do with a gut feeling that I would not fit in that office.
Still@jones have you decided what direction you’re going to go yet?
You were obviously not doing the work. If you had a hard time closing but were getting 25 or 30 contacts a day you would have had an easy bargaining chip and Jones would have sent you a helping hand or at the very least let you get to month 5. You let yourself get fired, let’s be honest. And as far as the guys at the office, you are begining to sound like MBA2FA at this point. Suck it up, you should have been greatful for an offer after dropping from jones.
[quote=fa09]You were obviously not doing the work. If you had a hard time closing but were getting 25 or 30 contacts a day you would have had an easy bargaining chip and Jones would have sent you a helping hand or at the very least let you get to month 5. You let yourself get fired, let’s be honest. And as far as the guys at the office, you are begining to sound like MBA2FA at this point. Suck it up, you should have been greatful for an offer after dropping from jones.[/quote]
All true…
I’m actually on the fence right now…not the straight/gay fence, like Voltmoie (zing!!!) but the FA/“Old Job” fence. I have an interview with NWL next week and 2 “old industry” interviews. I’m hoping that I have a better feel for what I want to do after I go through those.
[quote=voltmoie] … Still, I’ve heard a hundred times “it’s your business” did you never hear this?
It’s not your business.
Still - I think you should leave the business. PDP is there for a reason. Jones may not have the best research when it comes to investments, but they do have research on how likely people are to make it in the business. They probably devote most of their time to it.
If you can’t make it to PDP, you likely will not make it in this business.
You say "it's not your business"...technically speaking you are absolutely correct, I am an employee of Edward Jones! However, I certainly feel that I am my own boss. The only true difference to me is that Jones pays for everything and as my business grows, I will have a decision to make since I cannot sell my book upon retirement. Otherwise, I am here in my office with my BOA, and we can choose to run our business any way we choose, as long as we are legal and eventually profitable. Even Indy's have certain SEC rules to abide by. Your statement about PDP is spot on! The numbers required, as a new/new to reach PDP after 17 weeks are laughable and if a Broker can't hit them by that time, they are not cut out for this business at any firm, either due to their lack of skills/personality or sheer laziness![quote=voltmoie] … Still, I’ve heard a hundred times “it’s your business” did you never hear this?
It’s not your business.
Still - I think you should leave the business. PDP is there for a reason. Jones may not have the best research when it comes to investments, but they do have research on how likely people are to make it in the business. They probably devote most of their time to it.
If you can’t make it to PDP, you likely will not make it in this business.
I would agree. It takes, what, 4 or 5 months of selling, 25 contacts a day, to get to PDP with under $2500 in commissions on the table? That’s one decent rollover. If you weren’t going to do the work at Jones, you won’t do the work at some other company. It sucks there just like it sucks here.
If you can get back into your old industry making the kind of money you referenced before, do it. You'll thank us later.[quote=Moraen] [quote=voltmoie] … Still, I’ve heard a hundred times “it’s your business” did you never hear this? It’s not your business. Still - I think you should leave the business. PDP is there for a reason. Jones may not have the best research when it comes to investments, but they do have research on how likely people are to make it in the business. They probably devote most of their time to it. If you can’t make it to PDP, you likely will not make it in this business.
You say “it’s not your business”…technically speaking you are absolutely correct, I am an employee of Edward Jones! However, I certainly feel that I am my own boss. The only true difference to me is that Jones pays for everything and as my business grows, I will have a decision to make since I cannot sell my book upon retirement. Otherwise, I am here in my office with my BOA, and we can choose to run our business any way we choose, as long as we are legal and eventually profitable. Even Indy’s have certain SEC rules to abide by.
Your statement about PDP is spot on! The numbers required, as a new/new to reach PDP after 17 weeks are laughable and if a Broker can’t hit them by that time, they are not cut out for this business at any firm, either due to their lack of skills/personality or sheer laziness![/quote]
HKA - technically speaking and realistically speaking I am correct. True difference is you work only as a broker of investments (and credit cards and mortgages I guess). I do things that are legal, ethical AND profitable that you can’t do. So that means you can’t run your Jones office as you see fit. You run it according to Jones. Can you sell your clients bonds that are not in inventory at Jones? Can you sell a stock under $2 to your clients? Can you write covered calls? Can you collar stock?
Jones is a great firm. We will have to disagree about the business ownership thing, since I don’t think I’ll ever convince you guys.
But at least we can agree on the PDP thing!
Why we can’t sell covered calls and other perfectly ethical and conservative things I will never understand. And bttw I believe we can’t trade stocks under $4 not $2. However the reputation among clients truly is unprecedented, so they do a lot of things right, just ask Jim Cramer.
[quote=Moraen] [quote=Hey Kool-Aid] [quote=Moraen] [quote=voltmoie] … Still, I’ve heard a hundred times “it’s your business” did you never hear this? It’s not your business. Still - I think you should leave the business. PDP is there for a reason. Jones may not have the best research when it comes to investments, but they do have research on how likely people are to make it in the business. They probably devote most of their time to it. If you can’t make it to PDP, you likely will not make it in this business.[/quote]
You say "it's not your business"...technically speaking you are absolutely correct, I am an employee of Edward Jones! However, I certainly feel that I am my own boss. The only true difference to me is that Jones pays for everything and as my business grows, I will have a decision to make since I cannot sell my book upon retirement. Otherwise, I am here in my office with my BOA, and we can choose to run our business any way we choose, as long as we are legal and eventually profitable. Even Indy's have certain SEC rules to abide by.
Your statement about PDP is spot on! The numbers required, as a new/new to reach PDP after 17 weeks are laughable and if a Broker can't hit them by that time, they are not cut out for this business at any firm, either due to their lack of skills/personality or sheer laziness![/quote]
HKA - technically speaking and realistically speaking I am correct. True difference is you work only as a broker of investments (and credit cards and mortgages I guess). I do things that are legal, ethical AND profitable that you can't do. So that means you can't run your Jones office as you see fit. You run it according to Jones. Can you sell your clients bonds that are not in inventory at Jones? Can you sell a stock under $2 to your clients? Can you write covered calls? Can you collar stock?
Jones is a great firm. We will have to disagree about the business ownership thing, since I don't think I'll ever convince you guys.
But at least we can agree on the PDP thing![/quote] I guess that is why I highlighted and underlined TO ME . The things you mentioned may be good strategies for money management, but they are not absolutely necessary to properly help the type of client that we serve. The only thing that I would definately find usefull of those things is writing of covered calls. But the individual investors I am dealing with wouldn't understand some of the more creative ways to invest and are watching there investments beat the S&P which is all they really care about. I have come across plenty of advisors that are indy and have access to all those wonderful things that you listed and continue to underperform markets and lose money for thier clients, and on the other side of the coin, I have seen Broker's of avg intelligence use Jones Inventory Bonds & American Funds and have their clients well prepared for early retirement. I am a big believer that the Advisor is much more important thant the available products. What we have available at Jones may not be as extensive as an Indy platform, but it is more than adequate in the right hands to build a fine portfolio and take care of our clients!
[quote=Moraen] [quote=Hey Kool-Aid] [quote=Moraen] [quote=voltmoie] … Still, I’ve heard a hundred times “it’s your business” did you never hear this? It’s not your business. Still - I think you should leave the business. PDP is there for a reason. Jones may not have the best research when it comes to investments, but they do have research on how likely people are to make it in the business. They probably devote most of their time to it. If you can’t make it to PDP, you likely will not make it in this business.[/quote]
You say "it's not your business"...technically speaking you are absolutely correct, I am an employee of Edward Jones! However, I certainly feel that I am my own boss. The only true difference to me is that Jones pays for everything and as my business grows, I will have a decision to make since I cannot sell my book upon retirement. Otherwise, I am here in my office with my BOA, and we can choose to run our business any way we choose, as long as we are legal and eventually profitable. Even Indy's have certain SEC rules to abide by.
Your statement about PDP is spot on! The numbers required, as a new/new to reach PDP after 17 weeks are laughable and if a Broker can't hit them by that time, they are not cut out for this business at any firm, either due to their lack of skills/personality or sheer laziness![/quote]
HKA - technically speaking and realistically speaking I am correct. True difference is you work only as a broker of investments (and credit cards and mortgages I guess). I do things that are legal, ethical AND profitable that you can't do. So that means you can't run your Jones office as you see fit. You run it according to Jones. Can you sell your clients bonds that are not in inventory at Jones? Can you sell a stock under $2 to your clients? Can you write covered calls? Can you collar stock?
Jones is a great firm. We will have to disagree about the business ownership thing, since I don't think I'll ever convince you guys.
But at least we can agree on the PDP thing![/quote] You don't have to convince me. I look at myself like a "branch office manager" (not in the technical sense) or general manager of a business, not the owner of the business. In the grand scheme of things, you don't have to "call" yourself anything. But Jones never says you "own" your own business. You "run" your own business. There's a distinct difference. And it's a stupid argument anyway. It is what it is, and whatever we call it is just semantics. Anyoen fooled into thinking they can own and sell their book at Jones is either really stupid or, well, really stupid. It's no different at a wirehouse.
Why we can’t sell covered calls and other perfectly ethical and conservative things I will never understand. And bttw I believe we can’t trade stocks under $4 not $2. However the reputation among clients truly is unprecedented, so they do a lot of things right, just ask Jim Cramer.
I agree that your reputation among the mass affluent is unprecedented. However, the whole "we'll bore you rich" thing is false. Nobody gets rich at Edward Jones.
My guess is that most Edward Jones clients don't know the first thing about investing and so of course think everything is great.
And I like Jim Cramer. I think he did your firm a solid with that statement he put out. I find it odd that Jones leaders bashed him so much.
Moraen, I liek your posts, but I have to tell you, if you think that Jones is the only firm “not making people rich”, then you live in a little bubble. Maybe we don’t sell obscure products or use sophisticated strategies, but the truth is, 95% of all advisors out there are managing just as simply as Jones. I have almost NEVER seen a wirehouse or Indy portfolio come over that was anything more sophisticated than what we offer. 9 times out of 10, the portfolio is much worse than what I do for clients, and 1 out of 10 MIGHT be even close. And I’M NOT BEING THAT CREATIVE WITH MY INVESTMENTS.
I have seen a grand total of TWO portfolios come over with options. And I have probably ACAT'd 50-60 households (the rest being rollovers, checks, CD's, trust transfers, etc.) I also know several wirehouse AND indy brokers AND RIA's personally. Exactly ZERO of them are doing anything we can't do. One indy does American Funds ONLY, another does simple mutual fund models, the two RIA's (OK, IAR's of their RIA so nobody tries to CORRECT me) both do discretionary mutual fund models (actually one uses index funds and ETF's), and the wirehouse guys use primarily SMA's, mutual fund models, annuities, and individual muni's. There is a very small % of advisors out there (though a high % in the UHNW space) using sophisticated products or strategies. And I am not saying that's good or bad, just that your suggestion that Edward Jones is alone in this is patently false (OK, to be fair, you didn't say we were the only firm like this, but it seemed like you were alluding to that fact) .I didn’t mean just Jones at all B. I pretty much meant all firms. And I like “patently false” - I used that earlier.
I see pretty much the same. No matter where it comes from. I think that it is slightly more difficult at a captive firm and I think that the philosophy is one of let’s make you some “decent” returns. Yet time after time, I heard “just tell your clients, we may be boring, but we’ll bore you rich!”.
Anyway. I definitely don’t think that Jones is the only one. But, since we were talking about Jones…
Well, I just got home and this thread has been all over the place. I was between 4-8 months past PDP when I was let go(anonymity) and when I hit PDP I was in excess of 120% above standard. The working out of my house thing began to be of great detriment in building relationships, office backed up do to lack of production, adn I couldnt get my head back above water. I did the work, just stopped being effective after awhile. I even had a few rollover/ transfer meetings in my living room, but that ended the relationship once, and put me on the blow off list.
As stated earlier, I received good advice while at Jones from people on this board, including Spiff early on and I amnot going to bad mouth the firm. At the end of the day in that structure I didnt get the job done, but I feel in a different set of circumstancces, given my success in the beginning and my past experience I have the potential to succeed. I originally posted to get insightful input and opinions. I am open to different industry ideas, and firm/bank reccomendations for my given situation. Thanks again DCNEWStill if the title of this thread was meant to be ironic then kudos. I’m a little slow. If you wanted to trade options you could’ve stayed at Jones and asked them if it was ok to open an account elsewhere I know they do that for risk takers of options and commodities.
The OP was just let go from EDJ...he is looking for LIFE OPTIONS....not to trade options!!!Still if the title of this thread was meant to be ironic then kudos. I’m a little slow. If you wanted to trade options you could’ve stayed at Jones and asked them if it was ok to open an account elsewhere I know they do that for risk takers of options and commodities.
I take back the Kudos Still, you still suck, the kudos rightfully belong to DCnew I misread who started this thread.
I know I just wanted to point out the irony in verbage if no one else picked up on it.
Ah, that’s why we went into discussion Put/Call options last week.
I’m sorry. I hate whiners and you are whining. “If only I had this, if only I had that”. If you want something you make it happen regardless of your circumstances. Successful people don’t start with everything, true success is made by changing your own circumstances. Couldn’t work outta your house? Then make a few calls and find a legacy. don’t have enough in commissions, then make more calls or change up your process. Everything else is just an excuse for your failure.
[quote=DCnew]Well, I just got home and this thread has been all over the place. I was between 4-8 months past PDP when I was let go(anonymity) and when I hit PDP I was in excess of 120% above standard. The working out of my house thing began to be of great detriment in building relationships, office backed up do to lack of production, adn I couldnt get my head back above water. I did the work, just stopped being effective after awhile. I even had a few rollover/ transfer meetings in my living room, but that ended the relationship once, and put me on the blow off list.
As stated earlier, I received good advice while at Jones from people on this board, including Spiff early on and I amnot going to bad mouth the firm. At the end of the day in that structure I didnt get the job done, but I feel in a different set of circumstancces, given my success in the beginning and my past experience I have the potential to succeed. I originally posted to get insightful input and opinions. I am open to different industry ideas, and firm/bank reccomendations for my given situation. Thanks again DCNEW[/quote] Jones numbers are probably the lowest in the industry to hit(not a knock, they just ease everyone in) try as a junior fa or somebodys assistantSource URL:https://www.wealthmanagement.com/forums/rookies-trainees/no-longer-edward-jones-looking-options