Diversification trips
i’ve heard a lot about diversification trips at edward jones…who can go on these trips besides the employee?
The employees spouse, immediate family, or friend of the same sex.
I'm sure there are other stipulatory allowables but I'm not sure of the details.you can now bring someone you have a committed relationship with (i.e. live in girlfriend). Cannot bring another FA or client
what if the girlfriend is a client?
Actually it says that you may bring a client, aslong as they do not work for another firm and it isn't involving any future business.you can now bring someone you have a committed relationship with (i.e. live in girlfriend). Cannot bring another FA or client
Windy - Give us more details on the same sex invites
I couldn't tell you, but we could ask your husband.Windy - Give us more details on the same sex invites
Windy … since you are not married how are you getting around the rule with your GF?
A live in gf is considered a "Domestic Partner" if you share bills and/or have a child together. Ron and his husband needed a loophole to be able to suck face on a div trip, so in doing so they opened all the doors for people needing to bring their hot young gfs. Funny thing is Ron never made the numbers, so he never used the loophole. Now he hands suckers out and charges ATM fees. Moral to the story - Ron's a homoWindy … since you are not married how are you getting around the rule with your GF?
Windy, tell us again how a guy who is going to gross 250k plus in year 1 should stay at Jones and not go Indy ? Don't hit your head on Weddle's desk when you get up to type.
Are these questions being asked by ej fas? Have none of you used joneslink before?
[quote=Ron 14]
Windy, tell us again how a guy who is going to gross 250k plus in year 1 should stay at Jones and not go Indy ? Don’t hit your head on Weddle’s desk when you get up to type.
[/quote]Windy, tell us again how a guy who is going to gross 250k plus in year 1 should stay at Jones and not go Indy ? Don’t hit your head on Weddle’s desk when you get up to type.
Damn it Ron, do you know how painful it is to have Mountain Dew come out of your nose!
That does hurt, sorry man!
3rd time I’ve read it and it’s still funny… If you’d put spiff in there instead of Weddle I would have sent you a hundred dollars.
Damn, you are right. That would have been better.
Hey, easy there boys. I don’t say stuff like that about you, I’d appreciate the same consideration.
I miss WeddleMe.
[quote=Spaceman Spiff]Hey, easy there boys. I don’t say stuff like that about you, I’d appreciate the same consideration.
[/quote] You know better than to ask these guys to be adultlike....I hear this is the next Jones trip…looks fun! http://www.couplesfest.com/
that is a funny link…is that really where EJ people go to vacation?
I enjoyed Italy in March. Nice 5 star resort. Where did your firm send you?that is a funny link…is that really where EJ people go to vacation?
They didn’t but with double the payout you are getting(not to mention the enormous tax bill you are getting on that) I could. Plus hanging out with Jones people isn’t all that fun(have had experience)
isn’t there a trip this week to cairo…
Double payout BEFORE expenses.They didn’t but with double the payout you are getting(not to mention the enormous tax bill you are getting on that) I could. Plus hanging out with Jones people isn’t all that fun(have had experience)
That's a really tired, and not very well thought out comeback Squash. "Enormous" tax bill is about $1500. There's a trip to Rome this contest period that the room alone is over 300 euros a night. Now throw in the airfare for two, breakfast every morning (optional, but free), two dinners (optional, but free), 4 dine arounds (Jones just hands you money and says go get dinner), plus the tour guide for the half day tour (also optional, but there for the taking) and you're way past $1500. Not to mention the fact that you have to do zero research on your own other than open the book and pick a trip. Expedia can book the same hotel and fly you over there for about $4300. Whether you have a better payout or not, the fact is that Jones people who are winning those trips can travel at a far lower cost than almost anyone else. My wife and I visited Italy on our first trip. It would have been incredibly easy to not interact with the other Jones people at all if we would have wanted it that way. I like Jones people in general, so it wasn't a goal of mine. I met a lady on the flight over who we kept running into. One day she invited my wife and I to join her for lunch. I got to spend some quality time picking the brain of a $2 million producer over pasta in a random little restaurant. As a new FA at the time, it was an incredible experience. The trip, the people, the stuff Maritz put together...incredible. You can't tell me that you can't get away from the other Jones folks in places like Rome, Sydney, or New York. The only meeting that's required is the business meeting for the FAs. Other than that, you can be on your own. I figure I've got about 20-25 more years left with Jones. Figure two trips a year, that's 40-50 vacations to places like Bali, Dubai, Costa Rica, New Zealand, Tahiti, or pretty much anywhere else you can think of that I'll get to experience. Using today's dollars, I'll spend about $75K to do it. Not a bad way to spend your career.They didn’t but with double the payout you are getting(not to mention the enormous tax bill you are getting on that) I could. Plus hanging out with Jones people isn’t all that fun(have had experience)
[quote=Squash1]They didn’t but with double the payout you are getting(not to mention the enormous tax bill you are getting on that) I could. Plus hanging out with Jones people isn’t all that fun(have had experience)
That’s a really tired, and not very well thought out comeback Squash. “Enormous” tax bill is about $1500. There’s a trip to Rome this contest period that the room alone is over 300 euros a night. Now throw in the airfare for two, breakfast every morning (optional, but free), two dinners (optional, but free), 4 dine arounds (Jones just hands you money and says go get dinner), plus the tour guide for the half day tour (also optional, but there for the taking) and you’re way past $1500. Not to mention the fact that you have to do zero research on your own other than open the book and pick a trip. Expedia can book the same hotel and fly you over there for about $4300. Whether you have a better payout or not, the fact is that Jones people who are winning those trips can travel at a far lower cost than almost anyone else.
My wife and I visited Italy on our first trip. It would have been incredibly easy to not interact with the other Jones people at all if we would have wanted it that way. I like Jones people in general, so it wasn’t a goal of mine. I met a lady on the flight over who we kept running into. One day she invited my wife and I to join her for lunch. I got to spend some quality time picking the brain of a $2 million producer over pasta in a random little restaurant. As a new FA at the time, it was an incredible experience. The trip, the people, the stuff Maritz put together…incredible.
You can’t tell me that you can’t get away from the other Jones folks in places like Rome, Sydney, or New York. The only meeting that’s required is the business meeting for the FAs. Other than that, you can be on your own.
I figure I’ve got about 20-25 more years left with Jones. Figure two trips a year, that’s 40-50 vacations to places like Bali, Dubai, Costa Rica, New Zealand, Tahiti, or pretty much anywhere else you can think of that I’ll get to experience. Using today’s dollars, I’ll spend about $75K to do it. Not a bad way to spend your career. [/quote]
There should be NO required business meetings.
Vacation isn’t “What’s working for you?” or picking the brain of a $2 million producer. That’s called WORK.
I went to Austrailia. Spent $3700 for 17 day trip. 5 were in Sydney, 12 in Cairns. That also includes a $250 dinner bill at the Sydney Opera House.
People can define vacation any way they choose - one night of picking the brain of a star producer does not seem like too much. .... If you only spent $3700 on that trip you must have flow for free. Been to Austrailia about 4 times and it's not cheap to get there and I won't even go into the price of food. Gotta love the people though, even if the females are not that hot.
There should be NO required business meetings.
Vacation isn’t “What’s working for you?” or picking the brain of a $2 million producer. That’s called WORK.
I went to Austrailia. Spent $3700 for 17 day trip. 5 were in Sydney, 12 in Cairns. That also includes a $250 dinner bill at the Sydney Opera House.
[quote=Moraen] There should be NO required business meetings. Vacation isn’t “What’s working for you?” or picking the brain of a $2 million producer. That’s called WORK. I went to Austrailia. Spent $3700 for 17 day trip. 5 were in Sydney, 12 in Cairns. That also includes a $250 dinner bill at the Sydney Opera House.
People can define vacation any way they choose - one night of picking the brain of a star producer does not seem like too much.
… If you only spent $3700 on that trip you must have flow for free. Been to Austrailia about 4 times and it’s not cheap to get there and I won’t even go into the price of food. Gotta love the people though, even if the females are not that hot.[/quote]
Depends on where you are flying from. March '05, got the ticket for $750. I even paid for my brother’s. Called airlines directly and negotiated. Stayed in a resort apartment in Cairns for $60 a day (AUS), plus groceries. Three swimming pools, etc. Rented a car too. Also cheap.
I don’t know what part of Austrailia you were in, but the food was only expensive in Sydney. Cairns was very inexpensive. And the women were hot in Cairns.
You are right about vacation being different for different people. I know that a vacation for me is not having people ask me “what’s working for you?” and having to sit through a meeting with Jonesies.
But that’s just me.
Flights are a bit more expensive now and I fly from the east coast. Good on you mate for that deal.
(my last tickets were $1350 each - just looked them up) Madrid, oh Mardrid ... all I can say is spain is hottie central.How many times in your career, especially as a new advisor, do you have the opportunity to just have lunch with a $2 million producer? No appointments coming in, no phones ringing, no schedules to keep. Just you, the big guy (girl in this case), and the pasta. Time well spent in my opinion.
You obviously got a good deal on your trip down under. But, for about the same price per day, the average Jones FA didn't have to call the airline company, the car rental company, the opera house, the condo people, etc to get all of that arranged and paid for. Instead, he clicked a button on his desktop and waited for further instructions. All he had to do was pack. And I'd bet that your $60 a night apartment wasn't as nice as the 5 star hotel that the Jones guy would have been in. It was probably sufficient, but not "pamper your spouse because she puts up with a lot of crap while you're working to run your business" nice. I'll be there was no "Heavenly Bed" in that apartment. You didn't have breakfast waiting for your family, no money in an envelope handed to you for dinners out on the town. I'm sure your vacation was great. Do you do that twice a year?[quote=Spaceman Spiff] How many times in your career, especially as a new advisor, do you have the opportunity to just have lunch with a $2 million producer? No appointments coming in, no phones ringing, no schedules to keep. Just you, the big guy (girl in this case), and the pasta. Time well spent in my opinion.
You obviously got a good deal on your trip down under. But, for about the same price per day, the average Jones FA didn’t have to call the airline company, the car rental company, the opera house, the condo people, etc to get all of that arranged and paid for. Instead, he clicked a button on his desktop and waited for further instructions. All he had to do was pack. And I’d bet that your $60 a night apartment wasn’t as nice as the 5 star hotel that the Jones guy would have been in. It was probably sufficient, but not “pamper your spouse because she puts up with a lot of crap while you’re working to run your business” nice. I’ll be there was no “Heavenly Bed” in that apartment. You didn’t have breakfast waiting for your family, no money in an envelope handed to you for dinners out on the town. I’m sure your vacation was great. Do you do that twice a year?
[/quote]
Spiff you have no idea. That apartment had two bedrooms with king-sized beds, a porch that looked out over the river leading out the Reef, a golf course (if you play golf), tennis courts and three swimming pools, two with a swim up bar.
A little effort goes a long way. I also didn’t have to go to a dinner, I was gone for a lot longer than you ever will be on a div trip (unless you extend it yourself), didn’t have to see other Jonesies.
My wife and I go somewhere every quarter. Last year we went to Greece for two weeks. Not only that, we spent a day in Paris, two days in Germany, a few in the countryside around Northern Greece, four in Santorini. The year before that we climbed a mountain in the Alps and spent a few days driving through Italy. The same year as the Greece trip, we also spent a week in the Caymans scuba diving.
This year we went to Vegas and Tahiti. In addition, because my wife is involved in the business - these are Executive team building trips. Business pays for it. So while you get taxed on your trips - we expense ours.
Talk about saving money!
Sounds like a great deal. Executive team building trips. Umm…OK. You’re CPA signs off on that does he? But then GAAP is filled with all kinds of grey areas.
You apartment in Australia sounds like a lot of the timeshare places I've been here in the states. Minus the swim up bars. Heck, you can go to Branson, MO and get a two bedroom apartment with king beds, golf course view, jacuzzi tub, tennis courts, swimming pools, etc. I'm not trying to downplay your vacations. I'm trying to get the other folks who read this stuff to see that the Jones trips aren't the bad, worthless, expensive trips that a lot of you try to make them appear to be. Anyone who travels a lot learns how to get good deals on travel. You obviously travel enough to have learned some tricks.Now Morean, we know you’re full of it. Jones has the market cornered when it comes to trips. Your trip(s) sound nice, but golly, you had to pay for them. I mean, how could you have afforded those trips with the ALL the expenses being Indy. I mean, cmon, phone, utilities, TP, rent, ticket charges…in my calculations, you would have to be paid 150% of production just to meet Jones’ 36%. If I were you, and I’m not thank God, I would close shop and head over to the local Jones branch (if that one is closed) try another one, and ask to be their BOA.
You will never know what it is like to stay at a 5 star resort...never never never. Jones has all of them, even some made up ones.[quote=Spaceman Spiff] Sounds like a great deal. Executive team building trips. Umm…OK. You’re CPA signs off on that does he? But then GAAP is filled with all kinds of grey areas.
You apartment in Australia sounds like a lot of the timeshare places I’ve been here in the states. Minus the swim up bars. Heck, you can go to Branson, MO and get a two bedroom apartment with king beds, golf course view, jacuzzi tub, tennis courts, swimming pools, etc.
I’m not trying to downplay your vacations. I’m trying to get the other folks who read this stuff to see that the Jones trips aren’t the bad, worthless, expensive trips that a lot of you try to make them appear to be. Anyone who travels a lot learns how to get good deals on travel. You obviously travel enough to have learned some tricks.
[/quote]
Just to be clear - I don’t think Jones trips aren’t nice - if they were just trips. They are thinly disguised tools to create phantom handcuffs.
As for GAAP - certain things on the trip can be used - meals cannot be. But plane tickets and hotel rooms can. Certain activities can be as well. It was my CPA’s idea!
Branson, MO is not Cairns, Austrailia.
[quote=Spaceman Spiff]Sounds like a great deal. Executive team building trips. Umm…OK. You’re CPA signs off on that does he? But then GAAP is filled with all kinds of grey areas.
You apartment in Australia sounds like a lot of the timeshare places I've been here in the states. Minus the swim up bars. Heck, you can go to Branson, MO and get a two bedroom apartment with king beds, golf course view, jacuzzi tub, tennis courts, swimming pools, etc. I'm not trying to downplay your vacations. I'm trying to get the other folks who read this stuff to see that the Jones trips aren't the bad, worthless, expensive trips that a lot of you try to make them appear to be. Anyone who travels a lot learns how to get good deals on travel. You obviously travel enough to have learned some tricks. [/quote] Spiff, just a little tax/GAAP 101. First off, GAAP doesn't matter in this case, tax law does. Two different animals. You can expense anything you want for P&L purposes, doesn't mean tax law allows it. Secondly, you ever wonder why brokerage firms like to incur all the expense of your office, rather than allow you to pay it out of pocket and make you a 1099 employee? Taxes! Third - Jones gets to expense the cost of the Div trips, just like an indy expenses theirs. Why is it right for Jones, but not for an indy rep? Because Genworth comes and talks about long-term care? Sorry to say, on the Div Trips, I fall in the Indy camp. Unless you are a real big producer and money's not really an object, the Div Trips are just way too expensive after taxes. Plus, personally, I would be able to do the trips I like for a LOT less than Maritz. Think of it this way....you use AFTER TAX money to pay your expenses (a few thousand $$ if you have kids), then get TAXED on the value of the INFLATED trip cost (someone is paying for Maritz and that big steak dinner your kids didn't eat).No, Branson is certainly not Australia. But where else in the world can you hear a russian comedian pontificating the virtues of America, see great feats of horsemanship while munching on a cornish hen, watch a craftsman turn a blob of sand into a stunning glass vase, get a funnel cake, and then get a great deal on a new pair of shoes at the outlet mall? Certainly not in Australia.
I don't think Jones tries to thinly veil anything. The trips are one of the big selling points with new FAs. Work hard and you too can be enjoying vacationing in any one of a dozen and a half exotic locals. There's no thinly disguised anything there.[quote=bspears]Now Morean, we know you’re full of it. Jones has the market cornered when it comes to trips. Your trip(s) sound nice, but golly, you had to pay for them. I mean, how could you have afforded those trips with the ALL the expenses being Indy. I mean, cmon, phone, utilities, TP, rent, ticket charges…in my calculations, you would have to be paid 150% of production just to meet Jones’ 36%. If I were you, and I’m not thank God, I would close shop and head over to the local Jones branch (if that one is closed) try another one, and ask to be their BOA.
You will never know what it is like to stay at a 5 star resort...never never never. Jones has all of them, even some made up ones. [/quote] Once again in your never ended attempt to make yourself feel better about leaving Jones, you have missed the entire point of this conversation. Of course that's not anything new with you. Don't you have another pony you can do a trick with?Wow…1 trick pony. Maybe B24 could help you with your math skills once again. Are they really 5 star resorts or its just what the glossy catalog says? Maybe they’re 3 star resorts, but are marketed as 5 star. Have you ever been to a 5 star resort before slamming your clients into categories to win a “trip” to one of these exclusive reorts, only open to EDJ’s?
You jonesers are so brainwashed into thinking everything you have is the best, when in reality you don't have a clue of what is the best.As far as i’m concerned, what’s wrong with taking 2 Jones trips a year and learning a bit while you are there from big producers and such. If you’re earning trips, you have enough cash to take a few trips of your own too. Best of both worlds in my opinion. I’ve been to Hawaii, Branson, Stowe, VT, Vegas (all paid for by me), and now going on a Div Trip, all in a year. Don’t make a sh*t to me to sit through 2 meetings and meet a few top producers. Hell I sat through a timeshare meeting to get a free $200 Luau in Hawaii, and arguing with the salesmen was worth it!
As far as i’m concerned, what’s wrong with taking 2 Jones trips a year and learning a bit while you are there from big producers and such. If you’re earning trips, you have enough cash to take a few trips of your own too. Best of both worlds in my opinion. I’ve been to Hawaii, Branson, Stowe, VT, Vegas (all paid for by me), and now going on a Div Trip, all in a year. Don’t make a sh*t to me to sit through 2 meetings and meet a few top producers. Hell I sat through a timeshare meeting to get a free $200 Luau in Hawaii, and arguing with the salesmen was worth it!
You haven't even been on one yet and are already making judgements about how great they are?
[quote=B24][quote=Spaceman Spiff]Sounds like a great deal. Executive team building trips. Umm…OK. You’re CPA signs off on that does he? But then GAAP is filled with all kinds of grey areas.
You apartment in Australia sounds like a lot of the timeshare places I've been here in the states. Minus the swim up bars. Heck, you can go to Branson, MO and get a two bedroom apartment with king beds, golf course view, jacuzzi tub, tennis courts, swimming pools, etc. I'm not trying to downplay your vacations. I'm trying to get the other folks who read this stuff to see that the Jones trips aren't the bad, worthless, expensive trips that a lot of you try to make them appear to be. Anyone who travels a lot learns how to get good deals on travel. You obviously travel enough to have learned some tricks. [/quote] Spiff, just a little tax/GAAP 101. First off, GAAP doesn't matter in this case, tax law does. Two different animals. You can expense anything you want for P&L purposes, doesn't mean tax law allows it. Secondly, you ever wonder why brokerage firms like to incur all the expense of your office, rather than allow you to pay it out of pocket and make you a 1099 employee? Taxes! Third - Jones gets to expense the cost of the Div trips, just like an indy expenses theirs. Why is it right for Jones, but not for an indy rep? Because Genworth comes and talks about long-term care? Sorry to say, on the Div Trips, I fall in the Indy camp. Unless you are a real big producer and money's not really an object, the Div Trips are just way too expensive after taxes. Plus, personally, I would be able to do the trips I like for a LOT less than Maritz. Think of it this way....you use AFTER TAX money to pay your expenses (a few thousand $$ if you have kids), then get TAXED on the value of the INFLATED trip cost (someone is paying for Maritz and that big steak dinner your kids didn't eat).[/quote] First, I don't remember enough of my accounting classes to be anywhere close to fluent in accounting linge. My apologies for using the wrong terminology. Second, Jones only gets to expense the part of the trip that they pay for. Genworth or John Hanc*** or whoever gets to expense the other part. I understand the tax benefits to the firm. Third, this one is my opinion, not anything I've ever heard anyone from the firm talk about. I've heard more than one indy advisor talk about all the things they get to expense through their businesses. Some of it, like Morean's vacations, sorry Executive Team Building trips make me shake my head and kind of chuckle. I don't have a problem with anyone writing off legitimate business expenses. But to write off your vacation because you take your wife who happens to be a part of your staff is pushing it in my opinion. Jones gets to write off those trips because they set them up as a production bonus. Not unlike the bonuses they pay the new FAs. I think there's a big difference between a firm sponsored trip and my personal vacation to Disney World.[quote=bspears] Wow…1 trick pony. Maybe B24 could help you with your math skills once again. Are they really 5 star resorts or its just what the glossy catalog says? Maybe they’re 3 star resorts, but are marketed as 5 star. Have you ever been to a 5 star resort before slamming your clients into categories to win a “trip” to one of these exclusive reorts, only open to EDJ’s?
You jonesers are so brainwashed into thinking everything you have is the best, when in reality you don't have a clue of what is the best. [/quote] You really are an idiot aren't you? Slamming my clients into categories? Exclusive resorts only open to EDJ's? I'm guessing from your last sentence that you have discovered what is the best and it's anything that EDJ isn't involved in? Did you ever go on a Div Trip? The categories I normally fill are growth, growth and income, taxable income, and insurance. What part of that is slamming my clients into categories? I did fill non taxable income this time too. Maybe that's the slamming you're talking about. I forced my clients into tax free bonds. As far as I know, if you wanted to treat your wife to a resort better than you might be able to find in someplace like Podunk, IN you can book a room at any of the hotels Jones uses for the Div trips. If you want to go to Borneo you can book it at Shangri-La's Tanjung Aru Resort. Or if your passport has been confiscated for some reason and you need to stay in the continental US you could try Fairmont, Washington D.C. Those are just a couple of the nineteen different destinations Jones has booked recently. I'm sure Mrs. Spears would be thrilled to go to any of those places. You should look into it.I see both sides to the argument and what I will say is pretty simple. The taxation is pretty rough at Jones on the trips, it simply does not work in favor of the FA, it works in the firm’s favor. After a couple of trips, the shine was off of the trips for me. I personally didn’t enjoy yet another meeting to stand up and tell when my can sell date was, where I was from and my name. It was interesting to sit next to a big producer at a dinner and pick their brain but what I discovered after a while is that they had been in the business 20 years or more or inherited a ton of assets. My wife and I counted on the 3 Div trips that we took and no one was on any of the trips that started on or after I did unless they inherited a ton of assets. I do count it a honor to have visited France, Portugal and China on trips but when you weigh the facts out you discover that the trips are used as a tool to govern behavior.
There was a certain aura of entitlement that I saw especially from those that inherited assets. To be sure this was a minority but it was strange none the less. This certainly makes the trips less enjoyable than they certainly deserve to be. My favorite was in China when we were back in the hotel after a shopping excursion, someone was talking about buying rolex watches on the street. I bought 3 for 5 bucks or so...one of the people on the trip who had inherited I think 40M or so had to show us his REAL rolex and talk about how much he paid for it. We all thought it was pretty funny especially when he couldn't point out any differences in the watches.......[quote=Spaceman Spiff][quote=B24][quote=Spaceman Spiff]Sounds like a great deal. Executive team building trips. Umm…OK. You’re CPA signs off on that does he? But then GAAP is filled with all kinds of grey areas.
You apartment in Australia sounds like a lot of the timeshare places I've been here in the states. Minus the swim up bars. Heck, you can go to Branson, MO and get a two bedroom apartment with king beds, golf course view, jacuzzi tub, tennis courts, swimming pools, etc. I'm not trying to downplay your vacations. I'm trying to get the other folks who read this stuff to see that the Jones trips aren't the bad, worthless, expensive trips that a lot of you try to make them appear to be. Anyone who travels a lot learns how to get good deals on travel. You obviously travel enough to have learned some tricks. [/quote] Spiff, just a little tax/GAAP 101. First off, GAAP doesn't matter in this case, tax law does. Two different animals. You can expense anything you want for P&L purposes, doesn't mean tax law allows it. Secondly, you ever wonder why brokerage firms like to incur all the expense of your office, rather than allow you to pay it out of pocket and make you a 1099 employee? Taxes! Third - Jones gets to expense the cost of the Div trips, just like an indy expenses theirs. Why is it right for Jones, but not for an indy rep? Because Genworth comes and talks about long-term care? Sorry to say, on the Div Trips, I fall in the Indy camp. Unless you are a real big producer and money's not really an object, the Div Trips are just way too expensive after taxes. Plus, personally, I would be able to do the trips I like for a LOT less than Maritz. Think of it this way....you use AFTER TAX money to pay your expenses (a few thousand $$ if you have kids), then get TAXED on the value of the INFLATED trip cost (someone is paying for Maritz and that big steak dinner your kids didn't eat).[/quote] First, I don't remember enough of my accounting classes to be anywhere close to fluent in accounting linge. My apologies for using the wrong terminology. Second, Jones only gets to expense the part of the trip that they pay for. Genworth or John Hanc*** or whoever gets to expense the other part. I understand the tax benefits to the firm. Third, this one is my opinion, not anything I've ever heard anyone from the firm talk about. I've heard more than one indy advisor talk about all the things they get to expense through their businesses. Some of it, like Morean's vacations, sorry Executive Team Building trips make me shake my head and kind of chuckle. I don't have a problem with anyone writing off legitimate business expenses. But to write off your vacation because you take your wife who happens to be a part of your staff is pushing it in my opinion. Jones gets to write off those trips because they set them up as a production bonus. Not unlike the bonuses they pay the new FAs. I think there's a big difference between a firm sponsored trip and my personal vacation to Disney World. [/quote] We are all entitled to our opinions. Virtually everyone I know that's been on them love them. Never heard a single complaint (outside this board). Personally, the trips were the one thing I didn't like about Jones, even before starting here. I just don't like the idea of incentive trips. I think it sends a bad message to clients. It sends the message that your advisor is a salesman, incented to sell as much to you as possible. I am good friends with an ADP rep. He just won his first incent trip at ADP. He is a salesman. It's not that I look down at salespeople, it's that the concept of being a salesperson in the investment advice business seems inherently wrong. And there is no two ways around it, the Div Trips are sales incentive trips. We can call them whatever we want. You sell more, you go on trip. I just don't like that. But there's really no way around it.How could the taxation work in the favor of the FA? Unless there weren't any taxes, I'm not sure I understand how the taxation could possibly be a benefit to the FA. You're going to have to educate me on that one.
A tool to govern behavior? What kind of behavior do you think they're trying to govern? Put your client's assets in a well diversified portfolio? Don't sell all growth stocks? You're going to have to explain that one too.[quote=Spaceman Spiff]
...Third, this one is my opinion, not anything I've ever heard anyone from the firm talk about. I've heard more than one indy advisor talk about all the things they get to expense through their businesses. Some of it, like Morean's vacations, sorry Executive Team Building trips make me shake my head and kind of chuckle. I don't have a problem with anyone writing off legitimate business expenses. But to write off your vacation because you take your wife who happens to be a part of your staff is pushing it in my opinion. Jones gets to write off those trips because they set them up as a production bonus. Not unlike the bonuses they pay the new FAs. I think there's a big difference between a firm sponsored trip and my personal vacation to Disney World. [/quote] WTF? Really??? You work for a firm, Morean works for a firm. Both firms send their employees on a trip. You get to own a part of your firm; Morean gets to own all of his. How is that any different? You benefit - albeit indirectly as a partner - from the positive tax consequences of how Jones handles the trips. Morean benefits wholly from the tax implications of his trip and well he should, as he has taken on the risk. That his employee is his wife ... well, I would have loved to be able to hire my son to work with me. Wouldn't you like something like that? If that was the case, would you be so against sharing the team-building exercises with another FA? And above all, what gives you the right to judge sight unseen what his wife does for his firm??? I can dig defending the Jones trips, even never having been on one - they seem pretty neat. But I think you're a little far afield and letting your emotions get the better of you on this one, Space. JMO.[quote=Spaceman Spiff] [quote=B24][quote=Spaceman Spiff]Sounds like a great deal. Executive team building trips. Umm…OK. You’re CPA signs off on that does he? But then GAAP is filled with all kinds of grey areas.
You apartment in Australia sounds like a lot of the timeshare places I’ve been here in the states. Minus the swim up bars. Heck, you can go to Branson, MO and get a two bedroom apartment with king beds, golf course view, jacuzzi tub, tennis courts, swimming pools, etc.
I’m not trying to downplay your vacations. I’m trying to get the other folks who read this stuff to see that the Jones trips aren’t the bad, worthless, expensive trips that a lot of you try to make them appear to be. Anyone who travels a lot learns how to get good deals on travel. You obviously travel enough to have learned some tricks.
[/quote]
Spiff, just a little tax/GAAP 101. First off, GAAP doesn’t matter in this case, tax law does. Two different animals. You can expense anything you want for P&L purposes, doesn’t mean tax law allows it.
Secondly, you ever wonder why brokerage firms like to incur all the expense of your office, rather than allow you to pay it out of pocket and make you a 1099 employee? Taxes!
Third - Jones gets to expense the cost of the Div trips, just like an indy expenses theirs. Why is it right for Jones, but not for an indy rep? Because Genworth comes and talks about long-term care?
Sorry to say, on the Div Trips, I fall in the Indy camp. Unless you are a real big producer and money’s not really an object, the Div Trips are just way too expensive after taxes. Plus, personally, I would be able to do the trips I like for a LOT less than Maritz.
Think of it this way…you use AFTER TAX money to pay your expenses (a few thousand $$ if you have kids), then get TAXED on the value of the INFLATED trip cost (someone is paying for Maritz and that big steak dinner your kids didn’t eat).[/quote]
First, I don’t remember enough of my accounting classes to be anywhere close to fluent in accounting linge. My apologies for using the wrong terminology.
Second, Jones only gets to expense the part of the trip that they pay for. Genworth or John Hanc*** or whoever gets to expense the other part. I understand the tax benefits to the firm.
Third, this one is my opinion, not anything I’ve ever heard anyone from the firm talk about. I’ve heard more than one indy advisor talk about all the things they get to expense through their businesses. Some of it, like Morean’s vacations, sorry Executive Team Building trips make me shake my head and kind of chuckle. I don’t have a problem with anyone writing off legitimate business expenses. But to write off your vacation because you take your wife who happens to be a part of your staff is pushing it in my opinion. Jones gets to write off those trips because they set them up as a production bonus. Not unlike the bonuses they pay the new FAs. I think there’s a big difference between a firm sponsored trip and my personal vacation to Disney World.
[/quote]
It’s called an executive perk. Companies do it all the time. Jones does it all of the time. Why do the GP’s get to go on Div trips?
Spiffy is drunk on koolaid. He’s the real idiot. Giving up 64% to rub elbows with people who he wants to be, but those people are fakes. Most of the non 20 year vets INHERITED assets or took over large offices. Are you to stupid to see the brains you want to pick are no more educated in building an office than you are. Why is it so obvious, even to someone’s wife, that Jones is a pig with lipstick.
IF you want to rub elbows with people who have built great businesses, look up the top 20 advisors at Raymond James, LPL or Common Wealth. I'm sure they would be able to teach you more than doorknocking or calling 25 people a day with the best 30 year bond in inventory.Also, for the record - my wife is no mere employee. My business would not be a success if it was not for her. I have zero doubt of that. She contributes likely a lot more than I do.
I have fond memories of my diversification trip. Midway through our first meeting I stepped out to take a leak. As I am washing my hands I see behind me, through the angle of the mirror, the RL and a newbie who got a 40mil goodknight walk into the same stall with the newbie carrying a brown paper bag. I thought they were going in to clean something up, but as I walked towards the door I only saw the paper bag and the newbie’s feet positioned like he was taking a deuce. I then realized why “servicing” clients was the theme of the meeting or should I say meating.
My emotions aren’t getting the better of me here. I have an opinion that, apparantly, is counter to what everyone else’s is.
I never made any comments about his wife. I could go back and edit my post to read team instead of staff, but it would be a waste of time. I meant nothing negative by the word staff. I'm sure the IRS doesn't have any problems at all with the way Morean reports his team building excercises on his taxes. Carry on Morean.[quote=B24]1. The ability to work as a 1099 employee and be able to write off expenses, not just deduct them subject the floor.
2. Behavior - misnomer - it's really to tie people to Jones. I know some guys that say they would NEVER leave Jones, specifically because of the trips. Weird, but true. Also it DOES force people into the Jones "investment box". Not that diversification is bad, but what if you don't want to do any insurance, you don't want to hire new FA's, and you don't like the idea of pushing credit cards? No trip for you! OK, you CAN get it, but sometimes you may not do enough tax-free income. Guess what? Someone's getting a muni! I just don't like it. If I just want to be an equity guy, and do nothing else, then that's what I want to do. Or what if I just want to be a "Bond Guy"? It's B.S. Remember, legal, ethical, profitable? Well, that "5th pillar" of compensation only applies to people that do muni's, or open credit cards, or get a "qualified hire". [/quote] B24- You get it. Thanks a much better explanation than I could do.B24, before you tread to far off path and being tagged as a “rogue” loser, I suggest you look up some of the old fireside chats from Bachmann and Hill. Get a couple of those watched and you will be back in the fold before you know it.
[quote=Spaceman Spiff] My emotions aren’t getting the better of me here. I have an opinion that, apparantly, is counter to what everyone else’s is.
I never made any comments about his wife. I could go back and edit my post to read team instead of staff, but it would be a waste of time. I meant nothing negative by the word staff.
I’m sure the IRS doesn’t have any problems at all with the way Morean reports his team building excercises on his taxes. Carry on Morean. [/quote]
I didn’t think you were being negative. I personally just thought we were all having a healthy debate.
I think the fact that just because our professional lives spill over into our personal lives doesn’t mean that climbing a mountain together or scuba diving or even spa treatments doesn’t help us work better together. Professionally and privately.
[quote=bspears]Spiffy is drunk on koolaid. He’s the real idiot. Giving up 64% to rub elbows with people who he wants to be, but those people are fakes. Most of the non 20 year vets INHERITED assets or took over large offices. Are you to stupid to see the brains you want to pick are no more educated in building an office than you are. Why is it so obvious, even to someone’s wife, that Jones is a pig with lipstick.
IF you want to rub elbows with people who have built great businesses, look up the top 20 advisors at Raymond James, LPL or Common Wealth. I'm sure they would be able to teach you more than doorknocking or calling 25 people a day with the best 30 year bond in inventory. [/quote] Yes, yes, I'm sure the big guys at the indy firms never inherited books from the exiting advisors in their wirehouse days then took them with them when they went indy. I'm sure they never bought someone's book. I'm sure they never absorbed someone else assets into their book when they brought them onto the team and then kept them when that advisor left. EDJ is the ONLY place in the industry where advisors take over books. The advisor at Jones who takes over a big enough book to make a substantial difference in the long run is rare. People take over $5MM -$10MM books all the time. But you can starve while trying to take over that branch. You're certainly not going to be winning any Div Trips because of taking over a branch like that. You could double that and you're still not even close to being able to win the trips repeatedly just based on the branch's assets. You and your wife can see whatever you choose to see when looking around on those trips. Personally, I never take the time to get to know everyone on the trips well enough to know how they built their offices. I'm sure there are some guys who's daddy gave them a big book or they took over for a retiring Jones FA. But for every one of those I'll bet there are ten who just simply worked their butt off to get to where they are and are just simply reaping the rewards. As for the big guys at the indy firms, all of us would learn a thing or two from them if we could rub elbows with them. That $2 million producer I mentioned before. New/New 20 years ago. Managed something like $350MM. You don't inherit a book like that.[quote=Moraen] [quote=Spaceman Spiff] My emotions aren’t getting the better of me here. I have an opinion that, apparantly, is counter to what everyone else’s is.
I never made any comments about his wife. I could go back and edit my post to read team instead of staff, but it would be a waste of time. I meant nothing negative by the word staff.
I'm sure the IRS doesn't have any problems at all with the way Morean reports his team building excercises on his taxes. Carry on Morean. [/quote]
I didn't think you were being negative. I personally just thought we were all having a healthy debate.
I think the fact that just because our professional lives spill over into our personal lives doesn't mean that climbing a mountain together or scuba diving or even spa treatments doesn't help us work better together. Professionally and privately.
[/quote] Some folks confuse my "debating" with me being negative or bashing you. Evidently around here we can't have a civil discussion with differing opinions without everyone getting their panties in a wad.
[quote=B24]1. The ability to work as a 1099 employee and be able to write off expenses, not just deduct them subject the floor.
2. Behavior - misnomer - it's really to tie people to Jones. I know some guys that say they would NEVER leave Jones, specifically because of the trips. Weird, but true. Also it DOES force people into the Jones "investment box". Not that diversification is bad, but what if you don't want to do any insurance, you don't want to hire new FA's, and you don't like the idea of pushing credit cards? No trip for you! OK, you CAN get it, but sometimes you may not do enough tax-free income. Guess what? Someone's getting a muni! I just don't like it. If I just want to be an equity guy, and do nothing else, then that's what I want to do. Or what if I just want to be a "Bond Guy"? It's B.S. Remember, legal, ethical, profitable? Well, that "5th pillar" of compensation only applies to people that do muni's, or open credit cards, or get a "qualified hire". [/quote] I understand the tax benefits that the indy guys have. I'd have the same issue if my CPA was writing off his trips to Grand Cayman with his wife/part time secretary every year. I heard Bachmann answer a question about the trips and the categories. The person asking was basically saying the same as you. Bachmann said that the reason they call it a Diversification Trip is specifically reward advisors for building well diversified portfolios. He said he knew that there were Seg 4 IRs who weren't winning the trips because they were just selling stocks or just selling bonds. He said that was fine, it was their business to run, but the trips would always be about diversification, not just production. I would say those types of offices are incredibly rare.Yeah you LPL & indy people may go on nice trips, but there’s ONE trip in the latest Div Trip book all of your money CAN’T buy — a trip to the home office in St. Louis! It includes a tour of the home office! And a trip to Ted’s farm for lunch!
And yes, I'm serious. This trip has got to be for those folks who have a picture of Teddy hanging on their wall at home. And for the record, I don't think trips with 60 Jones brokers is much fun, either. That's why I cash mine out.I am so going to St. Louis for my first Div Trip! I have a picture of the Arch on my wall to keep me motivated.
[quote=Spaceman Spiff]
… Carry on Morean. [/quote]
[quote=Spaceman Spiff]
…But to write off your vacation because you take your wife who happens to be a part of your staff is pushing it in my opinion[/quote]
Sorry … I probably read too much into that earlier comment. I was just kibitzing, is all. Hope y’all have a great weekend.
You are the idiot. Saying you get an extra 64% is like saying that you get all 100% of your paycheck every month. You can say the payouts better, but really all we are trading is the trip to the post office to hand that 60% over to the local bill collectors. While you are running around paying bills, or paying someone else MORE money to do it, were letting Jones do it.Spiffy is drunk on koolaid. He’s the real idiot. Giving up 64% to rub elbows with people who he wants to be, but those people are fakes.
[quote=bspears]Spiffy is drunk on koolaid. He’s the real idiot. Giving up 64% to rub elbows with people who he wants to be, but those people are fakes.
You are the idiot. Saying you get an extra 64% is like saying that you get all 100% of your paycheck every month. You can say the payouts better, but really all we are trading is the trip to the post office to hand that 60% over to the local bill collectors. While you are running around paying bills, or paying someone else MORE money to do it, were letting Jones do it.[/quote]
Wind that’s the stupidest thing you’ve ever said.
Unbelievable
It’s not actually. Sure, you may get a bit more, but to come on here and brag that you get 100%, or even 60% after you pay all your bills is retarded.
You indy guys need to admit the trips are a nice perk for doing your job at Jones. They don’t suck. They force people to take a breath which is healthy and your family can be part of it. Stop acting like they are terrible. They were the worse trips ever. You sound like petulant children.
Jones guys. We pay for the trips. They are not free. They are only great because of us … Not Jones. We could keep the money and do it ourselves. Not that most would.
Windy … You’re smart.
There aren’t free, but a sh*tload cheaper than I could manage by myself.
No argument here
PLus like I said. If you’re making Div Trips, then you can afford a few of your own.
He wasn't bragging about getting 100% dipsh*t. He was just referring to the 65% that Jones takes.It’s not actually. Sure, you may get a bit more, but to come on here and brag that you get 100%, or even 60% after you pay all your bills is retarded.
“There aren’t free, but a sh*tload cheaper than I could manage by myself”
"PLus like I said. If you're making Div Trips, then you can afford a few of your own. " - Windy Well which is it you babbling dumbass ?Babbling? I said the trips Jones gives you are cheaper than I could manage, but that doesn’t mean I can’t afford a few vacations, you f*** stick. Seriously, that quote was stupid. I’ll make sure to speak with your assistant manager about that one.
Windy - Let’s assume for a second that I will make as much as you this year gross - say 250k. Let’s further assume I don’t make income off of anybody else.
As an RIA, I get 100% of all revenue. So let’s do a little math.
250k works out to about 20,833/month.
Minus 1285 for office. Which mine is a little big. I could have gotten a one person office (like yours) for about 800 in this area.
$180 for phone and internet, $100 power and water. $800 payroll. $118 for E & O. $17 for Business insurance.
What else? Hmmm, let’s see licenses average out to about $200 a month. Postage at most $14 a month. Or should I say $7, since you pay out of pocket for half of yours as well?
That’s 87%. And let’s not get into the tax benefits. It would blow your mind. You get paid out 38% (maybe) then you pay all of your net (minus your payroll deductions) at your tax bracket. I don’t.
I put a LOT more money in my pocket than you do.
Once again, that was the stupidest thing you’ve ever said.
[quote=voltmoie] You indy guys need to admit the trips are a nice perk for doing your job at Jones. They don’t suck. They force people to take a breath which is healthy and your family can be part of it. Stop acting like they are terrible. They were the worse trips ever. You sound like petulant children.
Jones guys. We pay for the trips. They are not free. They are only great because of us … Not Jones. We could keep the money and do it ourselves. Not that most would.
Windy … You’re smart.[/quote]
I agree that the trips are nice - but if I were you I would reserve judgement until you’ve been on one. They are not what you are sold when you get hired.
They are business trips with a good bit of vacation shot throughout.
They are certainly not the worse trips ever. But when my wife is uncomfortable, it makes them bad. Anybody who is married knows that when mama isn’t happy, no one is happy. Just sayin’.
I know an Italian Sports car is fast not because I’ve driven one but because I know people that have. I’ve spoken to dozens of advisors that rave about the trips and have heard a few clowns on here bash them. Forgive me if I’ll trust their judgment more… I’m more than comfortable passing judgment at this point.
With respect to your wife, she seems to have been uncomfortable in many Jones situations. Whether it was her or your region, that sucks but it is no way shape or form other peoples experience. My family has not been in the same boat (minus a silly wholesaler) I like Jones people minus the koolaid. They have been warm, inviting, and decent people.
My point is your experience (and a few ex-jones guys) while valid seems to be an anomaly but I guess the minorities always scream the loudest and drive the debate.
Volt - It’s a cult-like atmosphere. Some guys can ignore it. If it were just me, I probably could as well. If it were just my region, it wouldn’t have happened on the div trips.
Just because people rave about the trips, doesn’t mean I’m not right. Some people love the kool-aid. Like I said, those trips are world class business trips.
As for you being comfortable making the judgement, that’s fine. But I have to say your analogy is flawed. You may know that an Italian sports car is fast, but the experience of driving it is different. And different for different people.
But it’s a different world as an indy/RIA
I can relate to what you're saying Morean. My wife instantly picked up on the implications of the trip ("do we have to spend time with 'those people'? I want my vacation to be about us!"). She pretty much hates the force-fed Koolaide at Regionals, and the Seg Five wives telling her what it will be like when her husband "earns one".
I don't mind the Koolaide myself; I have pride in my organization and a lot of it. Personally, I'd welcome interacting at least a little bit with other people from the company and reinforcing that I am part of a larger organism. And of course, that doesn't preclude my thinking I might do better for myself outside this same organization. FWIW, there is a negative to being indy/RIA - and that is all too often you face the threat of becoming insular and cut off from others. Not saying that is the case with you, but it's an unstated negative about taking business vacations and only meeting those you already know.You may say that is a negative, but I don’t. Just like people don’t think it’s a negative to interact with other people in your company. Besides, if we want to we can just invite our friends (which we wouldn’t). Vacations are family time and family time only for us.
Also, we’ve met wonderful people in our travels. Two intrepid British brother’s in law while mountain climbing, one of whom was in investment banking for 20 years - talk about a lot of good info! A Canadian teacher and her mother while in Greece. An Austrailian fighter pilot and his wife in the Caymans.
You learn a lot and experience a lot more when you aren’t surrounded by Jonesies in my opinion.
My analogy didn’t revolve around the handling of the cars. Simply the speed. It works because the trips are nice and they treat you well.
Are they the right trips for everyone, obviously not … However, it does not mean they are not good trips … Just the “drive” might be too firm for you.
Fair enough.
Do indy guys actually take trips or do they just talk about how many and how expensive the trips would be that they could take?
Maybe expensive vacations aren’t your cup of tea and you choose not to do them. What do you do with the the warchest of extra indy money then?
Or is all the extra indy money we hear so much about hearsay that gets exaggerated and overblown because a few guys made it big going independent and now everyone believes that’s where the money is when in reality for most there is not a lot to be had in that model?
[quote=BerkshireBull]
Do indy guys actually take trips or do they just talk about how many and how expensive the trips would be that they could take?
Maybe expensive vacations aren’t your cup of tea and you choose not to do them. What do you do with the the warchest of extra indy money then?
Or is all the extra indy money we hear so much about hearsay that gets exaggerated and overblown because a few guys made it big going independent and now everyone believes that’s where the money is when in reality for most there is not a lot to be had in that model?
[/quote]
I think you’re part correct with this. I know there are some Indy’s that take probably much nicer trips than the Jones Diversification trips, but I’ve been on both sides of this fence and since I left Jones quite a while ago, I have yet to take a vacation as nice as most of the Div Trips I went on there. Other than maybe my honeymoon. We still take one week trip each year and maybe one or two smaller 3-4 day get a ways but a jones trip to Cabo still beats the 5 days I’ll take to Fort Meyers in March. But once again, it’s all personal perference on how much you really want to shell out of your pocket to take a nice trip. Bottom line is, the Jones trips are nice, even if you still spend some of your own money. And it’s not “work”. I took one trip to Honolulu and i honestly went to the opening dinner, our I think one morning meeting and I did not see another Jones person the remainder of the trip. You are not forced to attend dinners or bullsh*t by the pool if you don’t want to.
[quote=BerkshireBull]
Do indy guys actually take trips or do they just talk about how many and how expensive the trips would be that they could take? Maybe expensive vacations aren’t your cup of tea and you choose not to do them. What do you do with the the warchest of extra indy money then? Or is all the extra indy money we hear so much about hearsay that gets exaggerated and overblown because a few guys made it big going independent and now everyone believes that’s where the money is when in reality for most there is not a lot to be had in that model?
[/quote]
Did you not read my posts about my trips BB? Mine are both longer and full of more adventure.
[quote=voltmoie] My analogy didn’t revolve around the handling of the cars. Simply the speed. It works because the trips are nice and they treat you well.
Are they the right trips for everyone, obviously not … However, it does not mean they are not good trips … Just the “drive” might be too firm for you.
[/quote]
Volt - one of the trips was a “Porsche driving experience”. Driving a Porsche on the autobahn is not the same as knowing it’s fast.
[quote=Moraen] [quote=voltmoie] My analogy didn’t revolve around the handling of the cars. Simply the speed. It works because the trips are nice and they treat you well.
Are they the right trips for everyone, obviously not … However, it does not mean they are not good trips … Just the “drive” might be too firm for you.
[/quote]
Volt - one of the trips was a “Porsche driving experience”. Driving a Porsche on the autobahn is not the same as knowing it’s fast.
[/quote]
Your comparing it wrong. Volt is saying that, Just because you haven’t “Drove a Porsche on the Authobahn” doesn’t not mean that you don’t know driving a porsche on the autobahn is fun.
[quote=Moraen] [quote=BerkshireBull]
Do indy guys actually take trips or do they just talk about how many and how expensive the trips would be that they could take? Maybe expensive vacations aren’t your cup of tea and you choose not to do them. What do you do with the the warchest of extra indy money then? Or is all the extra indy money we hear so much about hearsay that gets exaggerated and overblown because a few guys made it big going independent and now everyone believes that’s where the money is when in reality for most there is not a lot to be had in that model?
[/quote]
Did you not read my posts about my trips BB? Mine are both longer and full of more adventure. [/quote]
I did miss it, but I went back and found it and it looks like you’ve had some great adventures. My post wasn’t directed at you specifically, in fact I think you’re the first indy guy whose made the “I could…” statement that’s actually then followed that up by posting "I did ________.
My company does one trip per year, I will get to go on them someday, some of it’s stuff I’d pay out my pocket to do, some of it’s stuff I wouldn’t pay to do, but if forces you to get out and take your wife somewhere that you probably otherwise wouldn’t go and do and I think it’s a good thing.
The trips are a perk of being affiliated with a company and when people are excited about winning them I don’t understand why some indy guy always has to chime in:
“I make so much money with my 96.8% payout at LPL that I could just go and buy my own island in the Caribbean and build my own resort”
[quote=Ronnie Dobbs] [quote=Moraen] [quote=voltmoie] My analogy didn’t revolve around the handling of the cars. Simply the speed. It works because the trips are nice and they treat you well.
Are they the right trips for everyone, obviously not … However, it does not mean they are not good trips … Just the “drive” might be too firm for you.
[/quote]
Volt - one of the trips was a “Porsche driving experience”. Driving a Porsche on the autobahn is not the same as knowing it’s fast.
[/quote]
Your comparing it wrong. Volt is saying that, Just because you haven’t “Drove a Porsche on the Authobahn” doesn’t not mean that you don’t know driving a porsche on the autobahn is fun.[/quote]
It does mean that. Driven is the correct form of the past tense verb by btw. Have you ever driven a porsche on the autobahn, Wind? Did you know that there ARE speed limits? Did you also know that the Polize do NOT play around. You literally have to be 6 and a half feet tall to be one. Have you ever been in a Stau? NOT fun.
The trips are a perk of being affiliated with a company and when people are excited about winning them I don’t understand why some indy guy always has to chime in:“I make so much money with my 96.8% payout at LPL that I could just go and buy my own island in the Caribbean and build my own resort”[/quote]
Nice one BB!
They are a nice perk. To me it was just a debate about the merits of company sponsored trips versus taking your own.
Personal preference. I know guys who couldn’t WAIT to go on div trips just so they could talk to top producers and GPs.
Using the trips to "pick the brain" of a (multi)million dollar producer or a GP is silly. If I want that (and I DON'T), I can pick up the telephone and call them - I don't need to waste my time on my "vacation" to do that. When I'm on vacation, I don't want to hear about the investment business - no TV news, Wall Street Journal, IBD, etc. It took me a while to get there, but man, is it nice!!!
Not saying the Jones trips are 100% unpleasant. But it's very true they are not represented with complete accuracy to the newbies. They are simply glorified, expanded regional meetings in very nice locations that (if you take your kids) are going to cost you between 2 and 3 thousand bucks (including the taxes you pay). But, ultimately, to each his own.[quote=Moraen]
It does mean that. Driven is the correct form of the past tense verb by btw. Have you ever driven a porsche on the autobahn, Wind? Did you know that there ARE speed limits? Did you also know that the Polize do NOT play around. You literally have to be 6 and a half feet tall to be one. Have you ever been in a Stau? NOT fun.
[/quote]
Just because someone hasn’t done something or been somewhere, does NOT mean that they know about it.
No i have never driven a Porsche on the autobahn, nor have i been to Germany, but I could tell you that the Autobahn means highway in German. It is not a specific highway. I could tell you that there are speed limits on the “Highways” in Germany in the “Ungoverned” part of the country. I could also tell you that the cities speed limits are very slow. I could also tell you that “Die Polizei” (Plural) does not f*** around when you break the law. I could also tell you that even though I have not been to Germany (and maybe you have), that I know more about the language, culture, and country than you probably ever will…
Oh and I could also say…
Besprechen Sie etwas, das Sie nächste mal wissen. - But i’m sure you knew that.
I lived in Germany for seven years. Still think you know more than me?
Also. Do you think never having been to combat, that you know what it’s like? I’ve never been in a band like you and I have no clue what it’s like to make music for people.
Please spare us the fact that you think you know everything. Theory and practice are two different things. You may have read a lot about Germany, but until you’ve done some of those things you don’t know.
M … Living on a military base in germany is certainly not cultural immersion. (Have no idea if you lived on the base.) But I agree its difficult to understand a culture if you’ve never experinced it.
I know Navy guys that have been to dozens of ports and never go beyond the bar and the cheap $20 hooker.
The combat analogy does not fit at all - we’ve all driven cars at fast speeds. Its easy enough to make the leap of what it would feel to drive a performance vehicle in Germany.
Fun side note - my brother in law has a mini. It handles better than the Porche, I’ve driven that ugly ass car hard and fast down some crazy mountain roads. I’ve got an idea I’d like that div. trip
I never said I knew everything. It’s obvious however, that I know as much as you about Germany, if not more and I’ve never been there. Maybe i’ve never walked down the streets of Berlin, but if we both were in germany and had to take a sht, atleast i’d be able to find my way to the bathroom without looking like a tourist, while you sht your pants asking for directions in English. Lucky for you, most germans speak English.
My father was in germany for the same amount of time as you, and i know 100 times more about Germany than him. Theory is not the same as practice, but if you don’t know Theory…you can’t f***in practice.
The only thing that is obvious here is you know a lot more about gay bars in Germany than anyone else.
[quote=Moraen]I lived in Germany for seven years. Still think you know more than me?
Also. Do you think never having been to combat, that you know what it’s like? I’ve never been in a band like you and I have no clue what it’s like to make music for people.
Please spare us the fact that you think you know everything. Theory and practice are two different things. You may have read a lot about Germany, but until you’ve done some of those things you don’t know. [/quote]
I heard that they give you a ticket for flipping people off…is that true?
The only thing that is obvious here is you know a lot more about gay bars in Germany than anyone else.
Oh shaddap Volt. Go to PDP
[quote=Ronnie Dobbs] I never said I knew everything. It’s obvious however, that I know as much as you about Germany, if not more and I’ve never been there. Maybe i’ve never walked down the streets of Berlin, but if we both were in germany and had to take a sht, atleast i’d be able to find my way to the bathroom without looking like a tourist, while you sht your pants asking for directions in English. Lucky for you, most germans speak English.
My father was in germany for the same amount of time as you, and i know 100 times more about Germany than him. Theory is not the same as practice, but if you don’t know Theory…you can’t f***in practice.[/quote]
Here we go:
Went to a GERMAN school for two years of primary school. 1 of secondary. Actually, I have never walked down the streets of Berlin.
Do you know what the protocol is in a German swimming pool? Can you navigate to Neuschwanstein? How many locks do you have to go through on the Rhine (total)? How many castles did Mad King Ludwig finish? How many didn’t he finish? I’ve been skiing in the German Alps with Herman Schepers and understand German farming more than I’d like to admit.
I have, in fact been in many Staus, and have driven there (as recently as last year). My mother is FROM Germany. My father lived there for five years before marrying my mother, spent the last three years there.
I’ve also eaten AUTHENTIC German food (since I was actually there). I have NEVER lived on a military base. We live out on “the economy” because that’s the way to really do it.
And NEWSFLASH Windy - they have PICTURES on the bathrooms! I’m surprised from all of your research you didn’t know that. And most Germans do NOT speak English for your information. Most Germans you will meet at an Airport will.
I slept with two German chicks one night in Spain after a long night of drinking. I’d say I’m an expert in German protocol.
One thing I never figured out though,what is the strange German obsession with tractors? Seriously.
I lied, I have lived on military bases. As an adult. Most of my time in Germany was in primary and secondary school.
And volt - that means you have more experience than Windy
[quote=Moraen] [quote=Ronnie Dobbs] I never said I knew everything. It’s obvious however, that I know as much as you about Germany, if not more and I’ve never been there. Maybe i’ve never walked down the streets of Berlin, but if we both were in germany and had to take a sht, atleast i’d be able to find my way to the bathroom without looking like a tourist, while you sht your pants asking for directions in English. Lucky for you, most germans speak English.
My father was in germany for the same amount of time as you, and i know 100 times more about Germany than him. Theory is not the same as practice, but if you don’t know Theory…you can’t f***in practice.[/quote]
Here we go:
Went to a GERMAN school for two years of primary school. 1 of secondary. Actually, I have never walked down the streets of Berlin.
Do you know what the protocol is in a German swimming pool? Can you navigate to Neuschwanstein? How many locks do you have to go through on the Rhine (total)? How many castles did Mad King Ludwig finish? How many didn’t he finish? I’ve been skiing in the German Alps with Herman Schepers and understand German farming more than I’d like to admit.
I have, in fact been in many Staus, and have driven there (as recently as last year). My mother is FROM Germany. My father lived there for five years before marrying my mother, spent the last three years there.
I’ve also eaten AUTHENTIC German food (since I was actually there). I have NEVER lived on a military base. We live out on “the economy” because that’s the way to really do it.
And NEWSFLASH Windy - they have PICTURES on the bathrooms! I’m surprised from all of your research you didn’t know that. And most Germans do NOT speak English for your information. Most Germans you will meet at an Airport will. [/quote]
Wrong buddy. As English is a mandatory study in high school, in Germany. I know that for fact. Now if you are talking about people from the old country in the hills that speach Hoech Deutsch, i would agree. But thats like going into the deep south in the U.S, they don’t even speak english in our own country. My family is from Germany as well, not to mention the many friends i have over there. One being a high school ENGLISH teacher. Which by the way is a high paying occupation over there. He drives a Benz.
I’m sure you went to an American School, Moraen.
Windy = Owned
I’m serious with my tractor question.
BJ Windy - Just do us all a favor and find a busy street to play in.
Now here comes your lame bank joke........You don’t know anything for a fact. Have you been to school there? Who told you that? English fluency is NOT mandatory. Even in this country. And, the German education system isn’t set up like ours.
Once again you have proven your ignorance by not experiencing something. Ever read the poem, “The arena”? You are like a TV pundit commenting on things you’ve never experienced. Branson, MO indeed.
Anyway, back to the original topic. Div trips are cool. But you can do more as an indy for less. Also, you never responded to my breakdown of my expenses. Why is that? You thought that being independent was just like being at Jones except you pay for the stuff yourself. Yet again, inexperience shows.
Morean, wind, lets just agree that insurance b/d are the best of both worlds.
70% payout on loads
85% payout on 12b-1
80% payout on wrap
… and lets not talk about that $250k SEP plan we lost 2 weeks ago because we can sell existing but can not buy individual T-bills. A couple more losses like that and we’ll be asking about what we can get going indy
[quote=BerkshireBull]
Morean, wind, lets just agree that insurance b/d are the best of both worlds. 70% payout on loads85% payout on 12b-180% payout on wrap… and lets not talk about that $250k SEP plan we lost 2 weeks ago because we can sell existing but can not buy individual T-bills. A couple more losses like that and we’ll be asking about what we can get going indy
[/quote]
Ok. I’ll agree.
[quote=Ron 14] BJ Windy - Just do us all a favor and find a busy street to play in.
Now here comes your lame bank joke…[/quote]
Lets just not hope it’s a street near you, or I might take all your clients:)
2. DivTrips are nice…but they are really just a retention ploy. I’m sure there are many wives who convinced their husbands to stay with Jones just cause they liked taking the trips.
3. To “pick the brain” of a (multi)million dollar producer on a trip is silly - if this is important, you should work in an office with several producers so you can see them in action…that’s how you learn. Not listening to their BS on vacation.
4. What’s up with the Germans and tractors?
I wish I could have taken you on a few of my last few 'company' trips. They were a little longer than you may have wanted--a little over a year each. Twice to historic Iraq; did you know they have 7,000 years of civilization? Once for some lively time in Central America, and lets not forget Kosovo/Serbia.
I know there are a few on here who have actually done something. The rest of you are really hitting the whiney bitch stage. If I had you with me for 48 hours, I would have made your heart explode. Get a life. Right now there is very little difference between you and a $20 hooker, with the exception of the price and no smile at the end when dealing with you.Still … How close did you come for qualifying for a trip?
… With respect to retention tools. Everything any company offers you including salary is a retention tool. Don’t think you uncovered a hidden secret. It’s also a production driver for multiple reasons.
The reason Jones comes up on Div. Trips is pretty simple. It’s the one common thread everyone shares. If I have a chance to “pick” the brain of a super star you better damn well believe I’m going to do it. Regardless of where it is. Only a fool turns down that chance. I’ve done it on reward trips before with no regrets.
Since M and Windy refuse to answer the tractor question I’m calling BS!!!
[quote=TwoTour]
I wish I could have taken you on a few of my last few ‘company’ trips. They were a little longer than you may have wanted–a little over a year each. Twice to historic Iraq; did you know they have 7,000 years of civilization? Once for some lively time in Central America, and lets not forget Kosovo/Serbia.
I know there are a few on here who have actually done something. The rest of you are really hitting the whiney bitch stage. If I had you with me for 48 hours, I would have made your heart explode.
Get a life. Right now there is very little difference between you and a $20 hooker, with the exception of the price and no smile at the end when dealing with you.[/quote]
What are you babbling about? We have a volunteer military so you get my appreciation but not my sympathy.
[quote=voltmoie] Still … How close did you come for qualifying for a trip?
… With respect to retention tools. Everything any company offers you including salary is a retention tool. Don’t think you uncovered a hidden secret. It’s also a production driver for multiple reasons.
The reason Jones comes up on Div. Trips is pretty simple. It’s the one common thread everyone shares. If I have a chance to “pick” the brain of a super star you better damn well believe I’m going to do it. Regardless of where it is. Only a fool turns down that chance. I’ve done it on reward trips before with no regrets.
Since M and Windy refuse to answer the tractor question I’m calling BS!!!
[/quote]
I"ll admit I don’t know anything about the tractors. My great-grandfather had a farm - HE had a tractor (two). But I’ve only seen them a few times outside of rural areas. Once in Stuttgart. Once in Kaiserslatern (four there).
As for Still - Munich is a big city - just like Paris or Madrid. A lot of business people. English is the international language of business. Just sayin’. And if you knew anything about Germany - Bavaria is not part of Germany . At least that’s the joke among Bavarians.
FWIW - Have fun on your first div trips volt and Wind. Volt your wife will love it, Wind, so will your GF. My guess is that you both will love it. Be prepared for a kool-aid fest though. But I also know it won’t be what you expect.
[quote=voltmoie] [quote=TwoTour]
I wish I could have taken you on a few of my last few ‘company’ trips. They were a little longer than you may have wanted–a little over a year each. Twice to historic Iraq; did you know they have 7,000 years of civilization? Once for some lively time in Central America, and lets not forget Kosovo/Serbia.
I know there are a few on here who have actually done something. The rest of you are really hitting the whiney bitch stage. If I had you with me for 48 hours, I would have made your heart explode.
Get a life. Right now there is very little difference between you and a $20 hooker, with the exception of the price and no smile at the end when dealing with you.[/quote]
What are you babbling about? We have a volunteer military so you get my appreciation but not my sympathy.[/quote]
My thoughts exactly.
[quote=voltmoie]Still … How close did you come for qualifying for a trip?
… With respect to retention tools. Everything any company offers you including salary is a retention tool. Don’t think you uncovered a hidden secret. It’s also a production driver for multiple reasons.
[/quote]
Qualify for a trip???
as for retention…I thought I was pointing out the obvious.
[quote=Moraen]
As for Still - Munich is a big city - just like Paris or Madrid. A lot of business people. English is the international language of business. Just sayin’. And if you knew anything about Germany - Bavaria is not part of Germany . At least that’s the joke among Bavarians.
[/quote]
Oh, I wasn’t talking about geography…I was talking about beer! You know, it’s a weekend!
…maybe I will read up on Bavaria this afternoon with a nice cold Schneider Weisse.
[quote=Still@jones]
[quote=Moraen] [quote=voltmoie]
As for Still - Munich is a big city - just like Paris or Madrid. A lot of business people. English is the international language of business. Just sayin’. And if you knew anything about Germany - Bavaria is not part of Germany . At least that’s the joke among Bavarians.
[/quote]
Oh, I wasn’t talking about geography…I was talking about beer! You know, it’s a weekend!
…maybe I will read up on Bavaria this afternoon with a nice cold Schneider Weisse.
[/quote]
I don’t know how people drink that crap. Those European beers are gross…
[quote=SometimesNowhere]
[quote=Still@jones]
[quote=Moraen] [quote=voltmoie] As for Still - Munich is a big city - just like Paris or Madrid. A lot of business people. English is the international language of business. Just sayin’. And if you knew anything about Germany - Bavaria is not part of Germany . At least that’s the joke among Bavarians.
[/quote]Oh, I wasn’t talking about geography…I was talking about beer! You know, it’s a weekend!..maybe I will read up on Bavaria this afternoon with a nice cold Schneider Weisse.[/quote]I don’t know how people drink that crap. Those European beers are gross…[/quote]
Thats because American Beer is watered down crap, compared to German beer. Your just used to crap. It’s sorta like eating fast food all the time, then you start craving it, when in fact a nice home-cooked healthy meal actually taste SO MUCH BETTER.
Moraen - We’ll call it even. Don’t want to argue and I’m sure you know some stuff about Germany. The point is though, you can definitly have an idea of something, without actually doing it. I’m sure we will love the trip. I don’t mind pickin the GP’s brain when he/she takes us out to dinner (for our first div trip), but i’ll admit that I won’t be at every dinner. Just aint happenin. Besides, I’ve been told by about 10 different advisors that the “meetings” are a joke and the wholesalers are usually quick to get you out. If I was a wholesaler, I would be. Hell, their on vacation too.
[quote=Ronnie Dobbs] [quote=SometimesNowhere]
[quote=Still@jones]
[quote=Moraen] [quote=voltmoie] As for Still - Munich is a big city - just like Paris or Madrid. A lot of business people. English is the international language of business. Just sayin’. And if you knew anything about Germany - Bavaria is not part of Germany . At least that’s the joke among Bavarians.
[/quote]Oh, I wasn’t talking about geography…I was talking about beer! You know, it’s a weekend!..maybe I will read up on Bavaria this afternoon with a nice cold Schneider Weisse.[/quote]I don’t know how people drink that crap. Those European beers are gross…[/quote]
Thats because American Beer is watered down crap, compared to German beer. Your just used to crap. It’s sorta like eating fast food all the time, then you start craving it, when in fact a nice home-cooked healthy meal actually taste SO MUCH BETTER.
Moraen - We’ll call it even. Don’t want to argue and I’m sure you know some stuff about Germany. The point is though, you can definitly have an idea of something, without actually doing it. I’m sure we will love the trip. I don’t mind pickin the GP’s brain when he/she takes us out to dinner (for our first div trip), but i’ll admit that I won’t be at every dinner. Just aint happenin. Besides, I’ve been told by about 10 different advisors that the “meetings” are a joke and the wholesalers are usually quick to get you out. If I was a wholesaler, I would be. Hell, their on vacation too.[/quote]
I agree that the big “American” brewers are watered down crap, but there are a lot of great beers in that next tier down in terms of size. I am saying that there is a distinctive sweetness/filminess that some of those European beers have that a decent red ale just doesn’t. I just don’t understand why people like that, a matter of taste I suppose.
Oh, and for what it’s worth I wholeheartedly believe that the most beautiful women I have ever seen were dancing in the clubs in Munich.
lol…of the german women i’ve met, except for 1…Agreed…
The only time I’ve ever “drank” one of the “Big American” beers was while doing a hand-stand over a keg or when I had a few in the funnel. Other than that, I need a beer with some flavor.
[quote=bspears]Spiffy is drunk on koolaid. He’s the real idiot. Giving up 64% to rub elbows with people who he wants to be, but those people are fakes.
You are the idiot. Saying you get an extra 64% is like saying that you get all 100% of your paycheck every month. You can say the payouts better, but really all we are trading is the trip to the post office to hand that 60% over to the local bill collectors. While you are running around paying bills, or paying someone else MORE money to do it, were letting Jones do it.[/quote]
Windy, it is clear that you don’t understand much. It is true that at real low gross production levels, you will likely make out better at Jones, all things being equal. However, my “break-even” point with Jones vs. independent is about $180K gross. In other words, as I gross more than $180K, I would make out better financially by being independent. So, as has been said many times, Jones IS a great place to start, because they are subsidizing newbies and under-performers with an office and a BOA. But once you are producing any serious amount of money, Jones takes more, understandably, for their profit. Then it starts to equalize again at high production levels, like say 850K and above, depending on what type of business you run. Most indies that produce this much typically don’t have a “solo” model - they have staff, and a big office, and maybe multiple advisors or para-planners helping them, which puts strains on their margins. At Jones your margin actually goes up as you produce at higher levels like this because of profit bonuses. I would estimate that a 850K independent producer is probably netting 50-60%, which is similar to an identical producer at Jones. But again, it depends on what type of business you run, how many clients you serve, and the complexity of the services you offer.
Windy, I would suggest you spend a little less time bragging and talking about those things that you quite clearly don’t understand, and more time learning about the business.
BJ Windy - Owned
blah, blah…i just want to know who went to cairo this year and was it a great trip…
Ron did, but then he got a call that his drawer didn’t match up, so he had to come back.
Lmao! Dude's got a few good zingers every now and then.Ron did, but then he got a call that his drawer didn’t match up, so he had to come back.
[quote=B24] I would estimate that a 850K independent producer is probably netting 50-60%, which is similar to an identical producer at Jones. But again, it depends on what type of business you run, how many clients you serve, and the complexity of the services you offer.
[/quote]
You are smoking too much KoolAid! An indy $850K producer netting 50%. So, office expenses are $425K per year (or about $35K per month). I’d love to see your math.
I agree. I work in an independent office with a team of 4. Expenses run $300k per year give or take, and we live in a pretty high cost of living area. Say you have a team of 4, with 3 salaries totaling $120,000. Rent for 3 offices is $3,500/mo., so there's $42,000. Supplies run $6,000 for the year. Ticket charges run about $1,500 per month, so $18,000 for the year. Licenses, CE credits and other minutia should be $500 per year. Technology, compliance and E&O is probably $10,000-$15,000 per year. Then some advertising and out-of-pocket expenses (meeting clients out for lunch and picking up the tab) and you can probably add another $5,000 for the year. I'm sure I'm missing something, but that just came up to a little over $200,000. I don't quite see how someone producing $850 is only netting half of that, unless the cost of living in the area is enormous, they are heavy on advertising and don't really agree with wholesaler reimbursement, or the employee salaries are higher than average. Even so, that's only an extra $25,000 or so tops that you can add to that total.[quote=B24] I would estimate that a 850K independent producer is probably netting 50-60%, which is similar to an identical producer at Jones. But again, it depends on what type of business you run, how many clients you serve, and the complexity of the services you offer.
[/quote]
You are smoking too much KoolAid! An indy $850K producer netting 50%. So, office expenses are $425K per year (or about $35K per month). I’d love to see your math.
[quote=voltmoie] M … Living on a military base in germany is certainly not cultural immersion. (Have no idea if you lived on the base.) But I agree its difficult to understand a culture if you’ve never experinced it.
I know Navy guys that have been to dozens of ports and never go beyond the bar and the cheap $20 hooker.
The combat analogy does not fit at all - we’ve all driven cars at fast speeds. Its easy enough to make the leap of what it would feel to drive a performance vehicle in Germany.
Fun side note - my brother in law has a mini. It handles better than the Porche, I’ve driven that ugly ass car hard and fast down some crazy mountain roads. I’ve got an idea I’d like that div. trip ;)[/quote]
Volt- I no longer hold your advice in high regard. MINI, an ugly ass car? Pfft, the car that spawned the idea of the miniskirt? The car that has transcended cultural barriers, from rock stars and royalty to the blue collar workers and EDJ Financial Advisors?
Car of the Century
Who was the star of The Italian Job? That’s right, the minis, and in the remake, the MINIs.
What car can you purchase new, drive off the lot and be able to sell it for more than you paid?
What car actually grew sales last year? A lot.
I may give you the benefit of the doubt, though. I’m gonna guess you really love the MINI and just don’t want to admit it.
Hell, Dale Earnhardt Jr drives one. Shaq had a cabrio.
and I have large testicles. So what....
Hell, Dale Earnhardt Jr drives one. Shaq had a cabrio.
and I have large testicles. So what....[/quote] Doubtful[quote=MsBroker]
Hell, Dale Earnhardt Jr drives one. Shaq had a cabrio.
I agree. I work in an independent office with a team of 4. Expenses run $300k per year give or take, and we live in a pretty high cost of living area. Say you have a team of 4, with 3 salaries totaling $120,000. Rent for 3 offices is $3,500/mo., so there's $42,000. Supplies run $6,000 for the year. Ticket charges run about $1,500 per month, so $18,000 for the year. Licenses, CE credits and other minutia should be $500 per year. Technology, compliance and E&O is probably $10,000-$15,000 per year. Then some advertising and out-of-pocket expenses (meeting clients out for lunch and picking up the tab) and you can probably add another $5,000 for the year. I'm sure I'm missing something, but that just came up to a little over $200,000. I don't quite see how someone producing $850 is only netting half of that, unless the cost of living in the area is enormous, they are heavy on advertising and don't really agree with wholesaler reimbursement, or the employee salaries are higher than average. Even so, that's only an extra $25,000 or so tops that you can add to that total.[/quote][quote=Still@jones] [quote=B24] I would estimate that a 850K independent producer is probably netting 50-60%, which is similar to an identical producer at Jones. But again, it depends on what type of business you run, how many clients you serve, and the complexity of the services you offer.
[/quote]
You are smoking too much KoolAid! An indy $850K producer netting 50%. So, office expenses are $425K per year (or about $35K per month). I’d love to see your math.
Nice! That's better than I could have calculated.
Although, I hate to be the one to tell you, but I think some of your staff is stealing office supplies.
Dude, you don't even know what it's like to count the time to get on an airplane to PDP, SHUDDAP....
Nice! That’s better than I could have calculated.
Although, I hate to be the one to tell you, but I think some of your staff is stealing office supplies.
[quote=MsBroker] Hell, Dale Earnhardt Jr drives one. Shaq had a cabrio.
and I have large testicles. So what…[/quote]
You are so damn annoying. I thought Volt might think liking the MINI would call into question his masculinity.
And really, who gives a sh*t about testicle size?
Uh oh Ms Broker, he’s going to beat you over the head with how his numbers are so great… watch out!
Dude, you don't even know what it's like to count the time to get on an airplane to PDP, SHUDDAP...[/quote][quote=Still@jones]
Nice! That’s better than I could have calculated.
Although, I hate to be the one to tell you, but I think some of your staff is stealing office supplies.
That was random and stupid...I think it is time you put down the bottle.
Yeah, I'm probably off a bit. I was referring to someone that is a solo with a support staff, producing 850K themselves. I would assume to produce that in an indy world, you are generally going to have several staff people. I only say that based on a lot of the advisors I read about in various industry magazines. However, the point of my original post was that most indy advisors are going to net more than someone at Jones. I don't claim to know it all.[quote=B24] I would estimate that a 850K independent producer is probably netting 50-60%, which is similar to an identical producer at Jones. But again, it depends on what type of business you run, how many clients you serve, and the complexity of the services you offer.
[/quote]
You are smoking too much KoolAid! An indy $850K producer netting 50%. So, office expenses are $425K per year (or about $35K per month). I’d love to see your math.
Nah, no need. People don't beleive em anyway. I'm sure Volt would like her phone number though.Uh oh Ms Broker, he’s going to beat you over the head with how his numbers are so great… watch out!
Volt already has my number
True story....Volt already has my number
I don’t really want to debate it, because (1) I am not the expert, and (2) every situation is unique. Again, I am basing it on some of the “case studies” I see in articles in various industry magazines. I often read about indy firms with 40 or 50mm, that have 3 or 4 staff members. I am not saying that’s what you NEED, I am saying that’s what I’ve seen and heard. I can also refer back to an article/case study either in Reg Rep or some other mag a few months ago about margins at indy firms, and that they ran like 40-60% on average. Everyone on here was up in arms about it, but I am just saying, that’s what the article said.
I would highly doubt there are many solo indy firms doing 850K gross with one staff person or less. FWIW, many of the firms that are referrenced in these articles are often full-service wealth management firms, not just the solo guy running money for a few clients out of his house. So even if they don't have a ton of assets, they are running a model that requires more than just one guy.How the hell did this thread go from talking about how hot German chicks are to talking about…whatever it is you are talking about?
The same way a thread can go from talking about vacations to the size of Windy’s ba!!s
Touche.The same way a thread can go from talking about vacations to the size of Windy’s ba!!s
Lmao! Dude's got a few good zingers every now and then.[/quote] No he doesn't. It is a bank joke over and over. The first few were funny, now its just boring. He stole most of them from biofreeze anyways.[quote=Ronnie Dobbs]Ron did, but then he got a call that his drawer didn’t match up, so he had to come back.
so back to the cairo trip…anyone here go? if so was it a great time?
Lmao! Dude's got a few good zingers every now and then.[/quote] No he doesn't. It is a bank joke over and over. The first few were funny, now its just boring. He stole most of them from biofreeze anyways. [/quote] It's a bank joke because you work at a bank and you suck.[quote=3rdyrp2][quote=Ronnie Dobbs]Ron did, but then he got a call that his drawer didn’t match up, so he had to come back.
Beer....How the hell did this thread go from talking about how hot German chicks are to talking about…whatever it is you are talking about?
Lmao! Dude's got a few good zingers every now and then.[/quote] No he doesn't. It is a bank joke over and over. The first few were funny, now its just boring. He stole most of them from biofreeze anyways. [/quote] It's a bank joke because you work at a bank and you suck.[/quote] Oh is that why you tell banks jokes, because I work at a bank? Thanks for the explanation.[quote=Ron 14][quote=3rdyrp2][quote=Ronnie Dobbs]Ron did, but then he got a call that his drawer didn’t match up, so he had to come back.
It’s all jokes until Windy has to leave Jones because he filled out one too many switch letters and has to go work as Ron’s assistant.
That would be horrible, he’d put me in charge of lining up the 5 mile long rows that we all have to stand in line in. Walking through those always sucks, especially when there is noone there.
[quote=B24]I don’t really want to debate it, because (1) I am not the expert, and (2) every situation is unique. Again, I am basing it on some of the “case studies” I see in articles in various industry magazines. I often read about indy firms with 40 or 50mm, that have 3 or 4 staff members. I am not saying that’s what you NEED, I am saying that’s what I’ve seen and heard. I can also refer back to an article/case study either in Reg Rep or some other mag a few months ago about margins at indy firms, and that they ran like 40-60% on average. Everyone on here was up in arms about it, but I am just saying, that’s what the article said.
I would highly doubt there are many solo indy firms doing 850K gross with one staff person or less. FWIW, many of the firms that are referrenced in these articles are often full-service wealth management firms, not just the solo guy running money for a few clients out of his house. So even if they don't have a ton of assets, they are running a model that requires more than just one guy.[/quote]Sounds like something I heard at my Jones regional meeting...Actually, the numbers are probably almost right. I would estimate:
40% if you are trying to grow an office and you are hiring FA trainees.
60% if you hire people to do all the office work and you just do business golf, business dinners and business trips to Vegas.
80% you do everything yourself with one assistant. (like at Jones)
[quote=Still@jones]
[quote=B24]I don’t really want to debate it, because (1) I am not the expert, and (2) every situation is unique. Again, I am basing it on some of the “case studies” I see in articles in various industry magazines. I often read about indy firms with 40 or 50mm, that have 3 or 4 staff members. I am not saying that’s what you NEED, I am saying that’s what I’ve seen and heard. I can also refer back to an article/case study either in Reg Rep or some other mag a few months ago about margins at indy firms, and that they ran like 40-60% on average. Everyone on here was up in arms about it, but I am just saying, that’s what the article said.
FWIW, many of the firms that are referrenced in these articles are often full-service wealth management firms, not just the solo guy running money for a few clients out of his house. So even if they don’t have a ton of assets, they are running a model that requires more than just one guy.[/quote]Sounds like something I heard at my Jones regional meeting…Actually, the numbers are probably almost right. I would estimate:40% if you are trying to grow an office and you are hiring FA trainees.60% if you hire people to do all the office work and you just do business golf, business dinners and business trips to Vegas.80% you do everything yourself with one assistant. (like at Jones)[/quote]
It really bothers me that you haven’t even opened an account, got fired from Jones, lied to a prospect and you honestly come on here giving advice and participate in conversation. Thats like a guy who enrolls in college, gets kicked out before classes start, then goes home and talks about his “partying” days in college. WTF, seriously?
Really? Is it like the guy who has never been Indy knowing how much indy’s get paid?
But seriously, German chicks are hot.
[quote=Ronnie Dobbs] [quote=Still@jones]
[quote=B24]I don’t really want to debate it, because (1) I am not the expert, and (2) every situation is unique. Again, I am basing it on some of the “case studies” I see in articles in various industry magazines. I often read about indy firms with 40 or 50mm, that have 3 or 4 staff members. I am not saying that’s what you NEED, I am saying that’s what I’ve seen and heard. I can also refer back to an article/case study either in Reg Rep or some other mag a few months ago about margins at indy firms, and that they ran like 40-60% on average. Everyone on here was up in arms about it, but I am just saying, that’s what the article said.
FWIW, many of the firms that are referrenced in these articles are often full-service wealth management firms, not just the solo guy running money for a few clients out of his house. So even if they don't have a ton of assets, they are running a model that requires more than just one guy.[/quote]Sounds like something I heard at my Jones regional meeting...Actually, the numbers are probably almost right. I would estimate:40% if you are trying to grow an office and you are hiring FA trainees.60% if you hire people to do all the office work and you just do business golf, business dinners and business trips to Vegas.80% you do everything yourself with one assistant. (like at Jones)[/quote]
It really bothers me that you haven't even opened an account, got fired from Jones, lied to a prospect and you honestly come on here giving advice and participate in conversation. Thats like a guy who enrolls in college, gets kicked out before classes start, then goes home and talks about his "partying" days in college. WTF, seriously?[/quote] That's quite the analogy.
I never said i knew how much they got paid, just that i didn't think it could possibly be 100% or anywhere near after bills.Really? Is it like the guy who has never been Indy knowing how much indy’s get paid?
LOL ! Great call in thinking they don’t get 100% !! What ???
Some douche was saying something about Jones guys giving up 64%, like if we were Indy we would get 100%. Not what I said, just commenting off someone elses comment.LOL ! Great call in thinking they don’t get 100% !! What ???
No one in the history of this site has ever said Indy’s get 100% or anything close.
You are the idiot. Saying you get an extra 64% is like saying that you get all 100% of your paycheck every month. You can say the payouts better, but really all we are trading is the trip to the post office to hand that 60% over to the local bill collectors. While you are running around paying bills, or paying someone else MORE money to do it, were letting Jones do it.[/quote] You used the 100% number. YOU.[quote=bspears]Spiffy is drunk on koolaid. He’s the real idiot. Giving up 64% to rub elbows with people who he wants to be, but those people are fakes.
You are the idiot. Saying you get an extra 64% is like saying that you get all 100% of your paycheck every month. You can say the payouts better, but really all we are trading is the trip to the post office to hand that 60% over to the local bill collectors. While you are running around paying bills, or paying someone else MORE money to do it, were letting Jones do it.[/quote] You used the 100% number. YOU. [/quote] Buddy 36% and 64% is 100%. When someone says, "Jones guys give up 64%", they are saying Indy's are getting 100%. You don't have to literally say 100%, to mean that.[quote=Ronnie Dobbs][quote=bspears]Spiffy is drunk on koolaid. He’s the real idiot. Giving up 64% to rub elbows with people who he wants to be, but those people are fakes.
He isn’t saying he gets 100%. He isn’t saying he gets an extra 64% either. He was talking strictly about what you give up at Jones.
[quote=Ron 14][quote=Ronnie Dobbs]It’s not actually. Sure, you may get a bit more, but to come on here and brag that you get 100%, or even 60% after you pay all your bills is retarded.[/QUOTE]
He wasn't bragging about getting 100% dipsh*t. He was just referring to the 65% that Jones takes. [/quote] You don't think it is possible for Indy's to make 60%? Unbelievable.I do find that hard to believe, but thats my opinion. I’m not Indy, so I don’t know. Just doesn’t make sense to me thats all.
Gross $20,000 in a month -$2000 Rent -$500 Utilities -$1500 Assistant Pay -Supplies -Licenses, Fees, Ticket Charges & other expenses I'm just saying I know they make more, just hard to believe they make THAT much more.Once again, you have put your keen intellect to work and come up with the wrong conclusion.
Why is rent $2000? I’ll tell you why - Jones puts on your P & L a rent amount that they don’t pay. How do I know this? Well, for one I’m independent and actually sign the lease. The second reason is that while I was at Jones, I happen to ask the landlord (who became a client and still is after the move) what my rent was. Try a full $800 less than what was on the P & L.
I’ve posted how much it would cost for me to have a setup like Jones. 80%+ payout. It’s hard to believe because you’ve swallowed all of the kool-aid.
$500 for utilities?
Also, who needs a full-time assistant if you are just going to run a one person office.
License fees aren’t that much.
He swallows more than kool-aid
I'm not quoting it from my P & L. I've talked to the landlord and have a great relationship with them. In fact, when I was office searching prior, the rent was more than $2000 for the other space and thats the quote I received from the landlord. Not what Jones told me. It's not quoted any higher than what it is on my screen. I'm not sure what you are talking about.
Why is rent $2000? I’ll tell you why - Jones puts on your P & L a rent amount that they don’t pay. How do I know this? Well, for one I’m independent and actually sign the lease. The second reason is that while I was at Jones, I happen to ask the landlord (who became a client and still is after the move) what my rent was. Try a full $800 less than what was on the P & L.
Only my pride when I have to fork over a few bucks to the boyscouts standing in front of the bank. How much did you need for your webelos finance badge again?He swallows more than kool-aid
[quote=Ronnie Dobbs]I do find that hard to believe, but thats my opinion. I’m not Indy, so I don’t know. Just doesn’t make sense to me thats all.
Gross $20,000 in a month -$2000 Rent -$500 Utilities -$1500 Assistant Pay -Supplies -Licenses, Fees, Ticket Charges & other expenses I'm just saying I know they make more, just hard to believe they make THAT much more.[/quote] Using this math the amount would come out to exactly 60%. $20,000 gross minus the first three expenses leaves you with $16,000. Supplies and other fees probably run $2,000 a month tops depending on how many trades you do. If you're grossing only $20,000 then its probably not much. That leaves about $14,000 net. Subtract 10% of the original amount for indy haircut (estimation) and you're left w/exactly $12,000 of the original $20,000. And thats grossing only $240,000 for a year, which is pretty low for indy standards.Only my pride when I have to fork over a few bucks to the boyscouts standing in front of the bank. How much did you need for your webelos finance badge again?[/quote] It hurts your pride to give a few bucks to charity? You are a bigger jag off than I thought.[quote=Ron 14]He swallows more than kool-aid
No, I give plenty. It only hurts my pride when I have to give it to a grown ass man dressed up in a boyscout outfit outside the bank begging for money, pretending to be an advisor:).
I'm not quoting it from my P & L. I've talked to the landlord and have a great relationship with them. In fact, when I was office searching prior, the rent was more than $2000 for the other space and thats the quote I received from the landlord. Not what Jones told me. It's not quoted any higher than what it is on my screen. I'm not sure what you are talking about.[/quote] How big is your office? That seems like a lot for where your office is located... I'm not asking to be a prick, I am genuinely interested...[quote=Moraen]
Why is rent $2000? I’ll tell you why - Jones puts on your P & L a rent amount that they don’t pay. How do I know this? Well, for one I’m independent and actually sign the lease. The second reason is that while I was at Jones, I happen to ask the landlord (who became a client and still is after the move) what my rent was. Try a full $800 less than what was on the P & L.
[quote=Ronnie Dobbs][quote=Moraen]Why is rent $2000? I’ll tell you why - Jones puts on your P & L a rent amount that they don’t pay. How do I know this? Well, for one I’m independent and actually sign the lease. The second reason is that while I was at Jones, I happen to ask the landlord (who became a client and still is after the move) what my rent was. Try a full $800 less than what was on the P & L.
I’m not quoting it from my P & L. I’ve talked to the landlord and have a great relationship with them. In fact, when I was office searching prior, the rent was more than $2000 for the other space and thats the quote I received from the landlord. Not what Jones told me. It’s not quoted any higher than what it is on my screen. I’m not sure what you are talking about.[/quote]
How big is your office? That seems like a lot for where your office is located…
I’m not asking to be a prick, I am genuinely interested…[/quote]
I think so also. I know that area. My aunt and uncle live near there. I have another uncle who works probably 3 miles from Windy’s office. $2000 seems a little steep.
[quote=SometimesNowhere] [quote=Ronnie Dobbs][quote=Moraen]Why is rent $2000? I’ll tell you why - Jones puts on your P & L a rent amount that they don’t pay. How do I know this? Well, for one I’m independent and actually sign the lease. The second reason is that while I was at Jones, I happen to ask the landlord (who became a client and still is after the move) what my rent was. Try a full $800 less than what was on the P & L.
I'm not quoting it from my P & L. I've talked to the landlord and have a great relationship with them. In fact, when I was office searching prior, the rent was more than $2000 for the other space and thats the quote I received from the landlord. Not what Jones told me. It's not quoted any higher than what it is on my screen. I'm not sure what you are talking about.[/quote]
How big is your office? That seems like a lot for where your office is located..
I'm not asking to be a prick, I am genuinely interested...[/quote]
I think so also. I know that area. My aunt and uncle live near there. I have another uncle who works probably 3 miles from Windy's office. $2000 seems a little steep.[/quote] Here's a pretty good listing. 4 large offices, a kitchen and a lobby for only $1,400 per month? Sounds like quite a deal to me. http://oklahomacity.craigslist.org/off/1406928024.html
Why must EVERY thread turn into a ‘What Windy Pays in Rent’ thread???
3rd - That must be ghetto country. Any decent listing around here isn’t gonna be less than $1,800. My office is 1200 sqf. The listing for $2,300 was for 900 sqf. It depends on where your office is located. Mine’s right on a major road, as well as in the middle of alot of new business/residential construction.
Wow. The only way I am paying that much for any space that's not my house is if it's a Champagne Room in some establishment that has the word "Gentleman" in the name.3rd - That must be ghetto country. Any decent listing around here isn’t gonna be less than $1,800. My office is 1200 sqf. The listing for $2,300 was for 900 sqf. It depends on where your office is located. Mine’s right on a major road, as well as in the middle of alot of new business/residential construction.
[quote=SometimesNowhere]
Wow. The only way I am paying that much for any space that's not my house is if it's a Champagne Room in some establishment that has the word "Gentleman" in the name. [/quote][quote=Ronnie Dobbs]It really bothers me that you haven’t even opened an account, got fired from Jones, lied to a prospect and you honestly come on here giving advice and participate in conversation. Thats like a guy who enrolls in college, gets kicked out before classes start, then goes home and talks about his “partying” days in college. WTF, seriously?[/quote]
Based on the abuse you took, I’m beginning to believe my opinions are more respected than yours…although, I admit, that’s not saying much.
But, speaking of being ripped-off on your P&L, I’m curious how much Jones reps get hit on their P&L for the server/satellite system. A Jones office could be run on two $400 desktops with the BOA’s desktop acting as a server.
To put a server in a ventilated cabinet in a 2 person office is ridiculous. It is enough to support a 24+ person office.
[quote=Still@jones]
I’m beginning to believe my opinions are more respected than yours… [/quote]
I’m hated because i like to talk sh*t…You’re hated because you can’t keep a job, lie to your clients, and suck in general. There’s a difference.
BJ Windy 3 - You are hated because you give blowjobs, lie to your clients and suck in general. Not much of a difference.
BJ Windy 3 - You are hated because you give blowjobs, lie to your clients and suck in general. Not much of a difference.
You're an idiot.
Moraen, I agree with your assessment of Windy's clusterfu@k of an analysis. However, I don't think Jones does anything underhanded with the P&L. I have personally verified each and every number. I was somewhat involved in the rental process, and I am being charged on my P&L exactly what I was originally told by the landlord. Now, there is also CAM charges and RE taxes which add to it, but I have seen those bills also, because the landlord sends them to me sometimes. I am guessing there were probably items that you had not accounted for related to CAM charges or something. Jones can't pull stuff out of thin air to place on your P&L. Also, don't forget the buildout ammortization that gets charged over the first 5 years. Mine is like $500/mo. All-in, Rent, CAM, RE tax, all Utilities, and buildout ammortization, I am at $3,100/mo. Excluding payroll & benefits, and systems, everything else I get charged adds up to $5300/yr. (postage, phone, licenses, supplies, etc.). So again, Windy is clueless. The only enigma to me is the systems charge. They have all broken down on our P&L, but there is one line item that doesn't make sense. "Data Charge" is $700 of the $1250 we get charged. Honestly, the rest of it makes sense - as we basically have to pay for phones, 2 PC's, server, battery backups, color laser printer, fax/scanner/copy machine, video system, all of the outside software services we use (realtime quotes, historical cost basis service, the CRM system, the online training system, Bondnet, scanning software, infax system, check scanner system, etc.), as well as system-support people that come out to fix and install all our stuff for "free". SO the other $550 we pay for is fine. It's just this "Data Charge". I guess it's a catch-all. I don't know. The problem with big firms, is that everyone has to have the same exact setup, regardless of their needs. So everyone has to have a check scanner, and a server, and a video system, etc. Independants can do without a lot of the stuff we have. Hell, I could do without a lot of the stuff I have.Once again, you have put your keen intellect to work and come up with the wrong conclusion.
Why is rent $2000? I’ll tell you why - Jones puts on your P & L a rent amount that they don’t pay. How do I know this? Well, for one I’m independent and actually sign the lease. The second reason is that while I was at Jones, I happen to ask the landlord (who became a client and still is after the move) what my rent was. Try a full $800 less than what was on the P & L.
I’ve posted how much it would cost for me to have a setup like Jones. 80%+ payout. It’s hard to believe because you’ve swallowed all of the kool-aid.
$500 for utilities?
Also, who needs a full-time assistant if you are just going to run a one person office.
License fees aren’t that much.
Ronnie and Ron meet on stage.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9wK2hFmxT4
[quote=Moraen]Once again, you have put your keen intellect to work and come up with the wrong conclusion. Why is rent $2000? I’ll tell you why - Jones puts on your P & L a rent amount that they don’t pay. How do I know this? Well, for one I’m independent and actually sign the lease. The second reason is that while I was at Jones, I happen to ask the landlord (who became a client and still is after the move) what my rent was. Try a full $800 less than what was on the P & L. I’ve posted how much it would cost for me to have a setup like Jones. 80%+ payout. It’s hard to believe because you’ve swallowed all of the kool-aid. $500 for utilities? Also, who needs a full-time assistant if you are just going to run a one person office. License fees aren’t that much.
Moraen,
I agree with your assessment of Windy’s clusterfu@k of an analysis. However, I don’t think Jones does anything underhanded with the P&L. I have personally verified each and every number. I was somewhat involved in the rental process, and I am being charged on my P&L exactly what I was originally told by the landlord. Now, there is also CAM charges and RE taxes which add to it, but I have seen those bills also, because the landlord sends them to me sometimes. I am guessing there were probably items that you had not accounted for related to CAM charges or something. Jones can’t pull stuff out of thin air to place on your P&L. Also, don’t forget the buildout ammortization that gets charged over the first 5 years. Mine is like $500/mo.
All-in, Rent, CAM, RE tax, all Utilities, and buildout ammortization, I am at $3,100/mo.
Excluding payroll & benefits, and systems, everything else I get charged adds up to $5300/yr. (postage, phone, licenses, supplies, etc.). So again, Windy is clueless.
The only enigma to me is the systems charge. They have all broken down on our P&L, but there is one line item that doesn’t make sense. “Data Charge” is $700 of the $1250 we get charged. Honestly, the rest of it makes sense - as we basically have to pay for phones, 2 PC’s, server, battery backups, color laser printer, fax/scanner/copy machine, video system, all of the outside software services we use (realtime quotes, historical cost basis service, the CRM system, the online training system, Bondnet, scanning software, infax system, check scanner system, etc.), as well as system-support people that come out to fix and install all our stuff for “free”. SO the other $550 we pay for is fine. It’s just this “Data Charge”. I guess it’s a catch-all. I don’t know. The problem with big firms, is that everyone has to have the same exact setup, regardless of their needs. So everyone has to have a check scanner, and a server, and a video system, etc. Independants can do without a lot of the stuff we have. Hell, I could do without a lot of the stuff I have. [/quote]
Hey - I’m just telling you what happened to me. The rent was supposed to increase over five years and then reset. Problem is, they had the rent at the highest rate and then when it reset, there was no decrease on the P & L. I called Home Office and they said flat out that was what the landlord was billing them.
Hey Ken - which one is Ron - Danny?
Moraen, I agree with your assessment of Windy's clusterfu@k of an analysis. However, I don't think Jones does anything underhanded with the P&L. I have personally verified each and every number. I was somewhat involved in the rental process, and I am being charged on my P&L exactly what I was originally told by the landlord. Now, there is also CAM charges and RE taxes which add to it, but I have seen those bills also, because the landlord sends them to me sometimes. I am guessing there were probably items that you had not accounted for related to CAM charges or something. Jones can't pull stuff out of thin air to place on your P&L. Also, don't forget the buildout ammortization that gets charged over the first 5 years. Mine is like $500/mo. All-in, Rent, CAM, RE tax, all Utilities, and buildout ammortization, I am at $3,100/mo. Excluding payroll & benefits, and systems, everything else I get charged adds up to $5300/yr. (postage, phone, licenses, supplies, etc.). So again, Windy is clueless. The only enigma to me is the systems charge. They have all broken down on our P&L, but there is one line item that doesn't make sense. "Data Charge" is $700 of the $1250 we get charged. Honestly, the rest of it makes sense - as we basically have to pay for phones, 2 PC's, server, battery backups, color laser printer, fax/scanner/copy machine, video system, all of the outside software services we use (realtime quotes, historical cost basis service, the CRM system, the online training system, Bondnet, scanning software, infax system, check scanner system, etc.), as well as system-support people that come out to fix and install all our stuff for "free". SO the other $550 we pay for is fine. It's just this "Data Charge". I guess it's a catch-all. I don't know. The problem with big firms, is that everyone has to have the same exact setup, regardless of their needs. So everyone has to have a check scanner, and a server, and a video system, etc. Independants can do without a lot of the stuff we have. Hell, I could do without a lot of the stuff I have. [/quote] Wow, 3100 a month for rent. It makes profitability a big nut once you add in the other items. We had a guy that had a beautiful office and was running over 3600 a month for rent. He left for Ameriprise because he realized after awhile that a bonus was far far in his future.......[quote=Moraen]Once again, you have put your keen intellect to work and come up with the wrong conclusion.
Why is rent $2000? I’ll tell you why - Jones puts on your P & L a rent amount that they don’t pay. How do I know this? Well, for one I’m independent and actually sign the lease. The second reason is that while I was at Jones, I happen to ask the landlord (who became a client and still is after the move) what my rent was. Try a full $800 less than what was on the P & L.
I’ve posted how much it would cost for me to have a setup like Jones. 80%+ payout. It’s hard to believe because you’ve swallowed all of the kool-aid.
$500 for utilities?
Also, who needs a full-time assistant if you are just going to run a one person office.
License fees aren’t that much.
Some combination Our P&L shows my net commissions, minus this and that down to an operating expense at the branch level. Obviously, my BOA gets "paid" out of my net commissions. There are exceptions; notably printing expenses, telephone and postage, which come out pre-tax.I’m curious, when you EDJ guys say “you pay for X, Y, and Z.” Do you actually have to pay for those things? Or is EDJ just giving you a P&L report stating whether or not they are making money on your branch?
You got it. Most is not out of pocket. I am referring to the stuff that Jones pays for, and then charges to my branch P&L to show branch profitability.I’m curious, when you EDJ guys say “you pay for X, Y, and Z.” Do you actually have to pay for those things? Or is EDJ just giving you a P&L report stating whether or not they are making money on your branch?
[quote=noggin]
Wow, 3100 a month for rent. It makes profitability a big nut once you add in the other items. We had a guy that had a beautiful office and was running over 3600 a month for rent. He left for Ameriprise because he realized after awhile that a bonus was far far in his future.......[/quote] It is a lot. But keep in mind, I am including ALL utilities, common area charges, RE taxes, and the cost of the buildout. I also have about 1200 sq.ft. - more than I need, but I am also doing a Legacy plan, which credits my P&L. After 5 years, about $550/mo goes away (that was the buildout amortization). And in my area, $25/sq. ft. (all-in) is about normal. My straight rent is about $19/sq.ft.. I could have found a crappier place that was smaller, storefront, stripmall-type space. But I am in brand new class-A space on the water. I have all windows in my office. It is very nice. Of course Jones people think it's great (compared to their offices), but I get compliments from clients, friends, everything. To me it's worth it. I have almost no "Jonesie" stuff in my office, one little "Edward Jones" wooden sign outside the door. It's very nice. I think the impression it leaves can actually make the difference between getting some clients and not (if I compare to some of my colleagues' offices). Even with my rent, I am profitable at just under $14,000 gross/mo. And my profitability level will only go down over time, as my fee credits and asset holding credits get larger every month, and my buildout amortization goes away. My BOA only works about 30-35 hours per week, and doesn't need benefits. I am building a very simple business that will probably never require 2 BOA's, so my fixed expenses will only go up with rent increases, even at much higher production levels. I've got it all figured out - no worries here. But thanks for your concern .Some combination Our P&L shows my net commissions, minus this and that down to an operating expense at the branch level. Obviously, my BOA gets "paid" out of my net commissions. There are exceptions; notably printing expenses, telephone and postage, which come out pre-tax.[/quote] No she doesn't. She gets paid out of your gross commissions.[quote=iceco1d]I’m curious, when you EDJ guys say “you pay for X, Y, and Z.” Do you actually have to pay for those things? Or is EDJ just giving you a P&L report stating whether or not they are making money on your branch?
[quote=B24][quote=noggin]
Wow, 3100 a month for rent. It makes profitability a big nut once you add in the other items. We had a guy that had a beautiful office and was running over 3600 a month for rent. He left for Ameriprise because he realized after awhile that a bonus was far far in his future.......[/quote] It is a lot. But keep in mind, I am including ALL utilities, common area charges, RE taxes, and the cost of the buildout. I also have about 1200 sq.ft. - more than I need, but I am also doing a Legacy plan, which credits my P&L. After 5 years, about $550/mo goes away (that was the buildout amortization). And in my area, $25/sq. ft. (all-in) is about normal. My straight rent is about $19/sq.ft.. I could have found a crappier place that was smaller, storefront, stripmall-type space. But I am in brand new class-A space on the water. I have all windows in my office. It is very nice. Of course Jones people think it's great (compared to their offices), but I get compliments from clients, friends, everything. To me it's worth it. I have almost no "Jonesie" stuff in my office, one little "Edward Jones" wooden sign outside the door. It's very nice. I think the impression it leaves can actually make the difference between getting some clients and not (if I compare to some of my colleagues' offices). Even with my rent, I am profitable at just under $14,000 gross/mo. And my profitability level will only go down over time, as my fee credits and asset holding credits get larger every month, and my buildout amortization goes away. My BOA only works about 30-35 hours per week, and doesn't need benefits. I am building a very simple business that will probably never require 2 BOA's, so my fixed expenses will only go up with rent increases, even at much higher production levels. I've got it all figured out - no worries here. But thanks for your concern .[/quote] When I was at Jones, I was profitable at about 14,000 gross/mo level with much cheaper rent. It took me a while to realize what an effect those 2 things, i.e. rent and boa salary have on the P & L. The best thing that you can do for your p/l is hire a BOA that works in that 30-35 hrs a week and doesn't need or use the insurance. Mine worked 35 to 37.5 a week and used the insurance...... If your BOA worked fulltime and used insurance, your profitability number would be much higher!!! Good job.Source URL:https://www.wealthmanagement.com/forums/rookies-trainees/diversification-trips-0